RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
So if a forged user from my domain sends a message to another IMAIL machine to a user that doesn't exist and then their Imail Machine rejects the message. I'm assuming that postmaster gets the entire message (virus included) based upon the forged domain. So I would get the message, even though no one on my domain sent it and Declude would stop the virus (that seems to be what it happening). And then the user won't get the message returned, right? But my users are getting occasional undeliverables and I'm assuming that these are generated by other mail servers. I just want to make sure that my server isn't returning messages to the forged users that contain the virus. Forgive me if this seems a bit circuitous as my brain feels like tapioca this Monday morning -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of R. Scott Perry Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2003 12:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread But since the subject that you are receiving is undeliverable : RE: Details isn't that his server is just returning the message Unless the virus has more subjects then the list of subjects that I am aware of. Comparing it to the headers generated by the copies of Sobig.F we've looked at, it appears that it was indeed a bounce message. However, the fact remains that there was a virus in the bounce message, so they were spreading the virus. Fortunately, IMail won't do this. If an E-mail is sent to an address that doesn't exist, IMail will reject the E-mail. It would then be up to the remote mailserver to generate the bounce message. -Scott --- Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers. Declude Virus: Catches known viruses and is the leader in mailserver vulnerability detection. Find out what you have been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
So if a forged user from my domain sends a message to another IMAIL machine to a user that doesn't exist and then their Imail Machine rejects the message. I'm assuming that postmaster gets the entire message (virus included) based upon the forged domain. Actually, you should be safe on either side. If someone sends you an E-mail to a non-existent account, IMail will reject the E-mail, so it won't get delivered on your server (assuming there is no nobody alias set up). If a user from your domain sends a virus to a non-existent account on another IMail server, that IMail server will reject the message, and your IMail server will generate a bounce. But, IMail truncates almost all of the E-mail when it generates a bounce message (I believe it only displays the first 2K, including headers). So I would get the message, even though no one on my domain sent it and Declude would stop the virus (that seems to be what it happening). And then the user won't get the message returned, right? But my users are getting occasional undeliverables and I'm assuming that these are generated by other mail servers. Correct. If someone sends out a virus with your return address on it, and they send it to a non-IMail server, then the E-mail may get bounced to you. If this happens, you are at the mercy of the mailserver receiving the virus as far as how much truncation is done. I just want to make sure that my server isn't returning messages to the forged users that contain the virus. No, it is not. -Scott --- Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers. Declude Virus: Catches known viruses and is the leader in mailserver vulnerability detection. Find out what you have been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
Um - I'm not sure, but I think he may be right. The declude virus catch looks like a bounce from his server, not sent through his server. As you said the e-mail address is forged - so if an infected computer has a user from your domain and a bad address from his, once his server can't deliver the mail to the bad address it returns the e-mail to the postmaster at what the server assumes is the domain from the forged address. I guess it is returning the whole message, virus included and then Declude it catching it and notifying you. I hope my server isn't doing that, bouncing infected messages from bad or expired address. If it is, is there a way to shut down? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Dodell Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 6:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread Here is a snipet of some on going email I'm having with a LAN administrator at a university hospital. I forwarded a copy of the Declude virus catch, to show them the IP #'s of the machine that sent the Sobig virus. I can't get it through his head that the headers are forged, and irrevelant. My last message to him pleaded to have him establish a telephone dialog with me so I could explain the message to him ... I politely told him if he wants to take the chance that a workstation is infected within their LAN based on the assumption that he might really be wrong, he was welcomed to the havoc it will cause. sigh David Dodell ===Original message text=== David, In looking at the header you sent Marcy, the subject of the message is Undeliverable: Re: Details which means our e-mail system was sending you a message back that it couldn't deliver a message from you. My best guess is that Sobig may be on your pc, and you have a contact somewhere to someone at uch that is no longer here or valid. Not too uncommon for we changed our domain last year. Furthermore, our e-mail system doesn't allow .pif or .scr attachments and will strip them if attempted whether infected or not. We appreciate the heads up, but based upon the header it looks like it was a bounced message from you that was infected and thus the hit by your antivirus. If you have any additional questions, comments, or concerns don't hesitate to let me know. -Original Message- This came from David who said this came from one of our computers. He said he was this stat technology. Marcy -Original Message- From: David Dodell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 2:22 PM To: left out to protect identity Subject: Fwd: Virus Notification ===Original message text=== Declude Virus v1.75i2 caught the following: Virus Name: W32/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Virus File: movie0045.pif From: [Forged] To : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 08/23/2003 13:06:35 Subject:Undeliverable: Re: Details Spool File: Dc94a00d300be355a.SMD RemoteIP: 168.200.2.37 SenderHost: Unknown Received: from guava.uch.edu [168.200.2.37] by stat.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.02) id A94AD300BE; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 13:06:34 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:33 -0600 Received: from uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt ([168.200.32.18]) by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Received: by uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id RLYYQK7T; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] from: System Administrator [EMAIL PROTECTED] to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: Undeliverable: Re: Details Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-MS-Embedded-Report: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=_=_NextPart_000_01C369B2.066CB0EC Return-Path: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Aug 2003 20:06:23.0921 (UTC) FILETIME=[07029210:01C369B2] End of original message text=== End of original message text=== --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
But since the subject that you are receiving is undeliverable : RE: Details isn't that his server is just returning the message Unless the virus has more subjects then the list of subjects that I am aware of. Looks like the original message had the virus attached and that was Declude detected when his server bounced it back to you. Maybe? I'm hoping someone else jumps in -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Dodell Sent: Sunday, August 24, 2003 11:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread Um - I'm not sure, but I think he may be right. The declude virus catch looks like a bounce from his server, not sent through his server. As you said the e-mail address is forged - so if an infected computer has a user from your domain and a bad address from his, once his server can't I don't think so. The only reason is there is another IP address showing received past his server, another IP from their block that shows that the message originated there. David -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Dodell Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 6:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread Here is a snipet of some on going email I'm having with a LAN administrator at a university hospital. I forwarded a copy of the Declude virus catch, to show them the IP #'s of the machine that sent the Sobig virus. I can't get it through his head that the headers are forged, and irrevelant. My last message to him pleaded to have him establish a telephone dialog with me so I could explain the message to him ... I politely told him if he wants to take the chance that a workstation is infected within their LAN based on the assumption that he might really be wrong, he was welcomed to the havoc it will cause. sigh David Dodell ===Original message text=== David, In looking at the header you sent Marcy, the subject of the message is Undeliverable: Re: Details which means our e-mail system was sending you a message back that it couldn't deliver a message from you. My best guess is that Sobig may be on your pc, and you have a contact somewhere to someone at uch that is no longer here or valid. Not too uncommon for we changed our domain last year. Furthermore, our e-mail system doesn't allow .pif or .scr attachments and will strip them if attempted whether infected or not. We appreciate the heads up, but based upon the header it looks like it was a bounced message from you that was infected and thus the hit by your antivirus. If you have any additional questions, comments, or concerns don't hesitate to let me know. -Original Message- This came from David who said this came from one of our computers. He said he was this stat technology. Marcy -Original Message- From: David Dodell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 2:22 PM To: left out to protect identity Subject: Fwd: Virus Notification ===Original message text=== Declude Virus v1.75i2 caught the following: Virus Name: W32/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Virus File: movie0045.pif From: [Forged] To : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 08/23/2003 13:06:35 Subject:Undeliverable: Re: Details Spool File: Dc94a00d300be355a.SMD RemoteIP: 168.200.2.37 SenderHost: Unknown Received: from guava.uch.edu [168.200.2.37] by stat.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.02) id A94AD300BE; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 13:06:34 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:33 -0600 Received: from uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt ([168.200.32.18]) by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Received: by uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id RLYYQK7T; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] from: System Administrator [EMAIL PROTECTED] to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: Undeliverable: Re: Details Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-MS-Embedded-Report: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=_=_NextPart_000_01C369B2.066CB0EC Return-Path: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Aug 2003 20:06:23.0921 (UTC) FILETIME=[07029210:01C369B2] End of original message text=== End of original message text=== --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses
RE: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
But since the subject that you are receiving is undeliverable : RE: Details isn't that his server is just returning the message Unless the virus has more subjects then the list of subjects that I am aware of. Comparing it to the headers generated by the copies of Sobig.F we've looked at, it appears that it was indeed a bounce message. However, the fact remains that there was a virus in the bounce message, so they were spreading the virus. Fortunately, IMail won't do this. If an E-mail is sent to an address that doesn't exist, IMail will reject the E-mail. It would then be up to the remote mailserver to generate the bounce message. -Scott --- Declude JunkMail: The advanced anti-spam solution for IMail mailservers. Declude Virus: Catches known viruses and is the leader in mailserver vulnerability detection. Find out what you have been missing: Ask for a free 30-day evaluation. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
[Declude.Virus] RE:No wonder viruses spread
-- Original Message -- From: R. Scott Perry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Comparing it to the headers generated by the copies of Sobig.F we've looked at, it appears that it was indeed a bounce message. Then I'm confused .. to me it appeared from the headers that it was received from another internal IP number, then sent to their exchange server ... am I missing something when I see the two IP numbers in the header? David --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
Received: from guava.uch.edu [168.200.2.37] by stat.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.02) id A94AD300BE; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 13:06:34 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:33 -0600 Received: from uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt ([168.200.32.18]) by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Received: by uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) I understand everyone's logic that this might indeed be a bounce, however, this is the part that keeps confusing me ... The header shows 168.200.2.27 sent it to me, but guava.uch.edu (which is their SMTP machine MX) got it from 168.200.32.18 about 11 seconds earlier (if their clocks are accurate). 168.200.32.18 is in their block too, so I'm assuming that is the machine that originate the message. If 168.200.2.27 is their inbound SMTP server, wouldn't you just see that as the only IP number, and not the second IP number? David --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
[Declude.Virus] No wonder viruses spread
Here is a snipet of some on going email I'm having with a LAN administrator at a university hospital. I forwarded a copy of the Declude virus catch, to show them the IP #'s of the machine that sent the Sobig virus. I can't get it through his head that the headers are forged, and irrevelant. My last message to him pleaded to have him establish a telephone dialog with me so I could explain the message to him ... I politely told him if he wants to take the chance that a workstation is infected within their LAN based on the assumption that he might really be wrong, he was welcomed to the havoc it will cause. sigh David Dodell ===Original message text=== David, In looking at the header you sent Marcy, the subject of the message is Undeliverable: Re: Details which means our e-mail system was sending you a message back that it couldn't deliver a message from you. My best guess is that Sobig may be on your pc, and you have a contact somewhere to someone at uch that is no longer here or valid. Not too uncommon for we changed our domain last year. Furthermore, our e-mail system doesn't allow .pif or .scr attachments and will strip them if attempted whether infected or not. We appreciate the heads up, but based upon the header it looks like it was a bounced message from you that was infected and thus the hit by your antivirus. If you have any additional questions, comments, or concerns don't hesitate to let me know. -Original Message- This came from David who said this came from one of our computers. He said he was this stat technology. Marcy -Original Message- From: David Dodell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 2:22 PM To: left out to protect identity Subject: Fwd: Virus Notification ===Original message text=== Declude Virus v1.75i2 caught the following: Virus Name: W32/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Virus File: movie0045.pif From: [Forged] To : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 08/23/2003 13:06:35 Subject:Undeliverable: Re: Details Spool File: Dc94a00d300be355a.SMD RemoteIP: 168.200.2.37 SenderHost: Unknown Received: from guava.uch.edu [168.200.2.37] by stat.com with ESMTP (SMTPD32-8.02) id A94AD300BE; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 13:06:34 -0700 Received: from mail pickup service by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:33 -0600 Received: from uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt ([168.200.32.18]) by guava.uch.edu with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Received: by uchaex2.uch.ad.pvt with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id RLYYQK7T; Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:23 -0600 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] from: System Administrator [EMAIL PROTECTED] to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: Undeliverable: Re: Details Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2003 14:06:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) X-MS-Embedded-Report: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary=_=_NextPart_000_01C369B2.066CB0EC Return-Path: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Aug 2003 20:06:23.0921 (UTC) FILETIME=[07029210:01C369B2] End of original message text=== End of original message text=== --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.Virus mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.Virus.The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
