Re: [libreoffice-design] New Whiteboard Proposal "Comments Ruler Control"
On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 11:54 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: > Hi Mirek, hi all! > > Am Freitag, den 08.06.2012, 23:33 +0200 schrieb Mirek M.: > > On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM, Christoph Noack >wrote: > ... > > > there has been some nice ruler rework recently [1], and so I got a > > > friendly ping about what had happened to the so called "Comments Ruler > > > Control" I've proposed years ago when working on the Writer notes [2]. > > > > > > I've started a (private) Whiteboard > ... > > > > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:ChristophNoack/Temporary_Work_Space/CommentsRulerControl > > > > The summary needs to present a simple goal the whiteboard should > > accomplish (such as "Make comments more accessible"). The summary should > be > > generic enough so that there are as few restrictions as possible for > > solving the underlying problem (that comments are hard to access) -- > there > > are ways to solve it without a button in the ruler area. > > The contents of the summary you currently present concerns your own > > proposal, and therefore should be presented under your proposal's section > > instead. > > Modified the whiteboard accordingly - although I find it a bit > superfluous, since the developers asked for a description of the > Comments Ruler Control. On the other hand, maybe it serves as an > inspiration for others to bring up great proposals ... let's see :-) > > Any further feedback? (Before moving the page?) > Looks good. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] New Whiteboard Proposal "Comments Ruler Control"
Hi Mirek, hi all! Am Freitag, den 08.06.2012, 23:33 +0200 schrieb Mirek M.: > On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: ... > > there has been some nice ruler rework recently [1], and so I got a > > friendly ping about what had happened to the so called "Comments Ruler > > Control" I've proposed years ago when working on the Writer notes [2]. > > > > I've started a (private) Whiteboard ... > > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:ChristophNoack/Temporary_Work_Space/CommentsRulerControl > The summary needs to present a simple goal the whiteboard should > accomplish (such as "Make comments more accessible"). The summary should be > generic enough so that there are as few restrictions as possible for > solving the underlying problem (that comments are hard to access) -- there > are ways to solve it without a button in the ruler area. > The contents of the summary you currently present concerns your own > proposal, and therefore should be presented under your proposal's section > instead. Modified the whiteboard accordingly - although I find it a bit superfluous, since the developers asked for a description of the Comments Ruler Control. On the other hand, maybe it serves as an inspiration for others to bring up great proposals ... let's see :-) Any further feedback? (Before moving the page?) Cheers, Christoph -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] New Whiteboard Proposal "Comments Ruler Control"
On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 9:10 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: > Hi everybody, > > there has been some nice ruler rework recently [1], and so I got a > friendly ping about what had happened to the so called "Comments Ruler > Control" I've proposed years ago when working on the Writer notes [2]. > > I've started a (private) Whiteboard and updated the description and > behavior to conform with the refreshed rulers - and the overall more > simplistic visual design in LibO: > > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:ChristophNoack/Temporary_Work_Space/CommentsRulerControl > > The summary needs to present a simple goal the whiteboard should accomplish (such as "Make comments more accessible"). The summary should be generic enough so that there are as few restrictions as possible for solving the underlying problem (that comments are hard to access) -- there are ways to solve it without a button in the ruler area. The contents of the summary you currently present concerns your own proposal, and therefore should be presented under your proposal's section instead. Question to the Design Team: Any objections to move that to the official > Whiteboard area? (The last time I've looked at the Whiteboards page it > mentioned: "Don't create a whiteboard without discussing it with the > design team first."). > Could you post a revised summary on your user page first? > > I did not follow the discussion too closely during the last weeks with > regard to the workflow - but I guess accepting the proposal starts the > "proposal phase", right? > Call for Proposals, yes. > > Cheers, > Christoph > > [1] > > http://artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~kendy/blog/archives/permalinks/2012-05-17T10_58_20.html > > [2] http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Notes2 > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 8:38 PM, Mike Linksvayer wrote: > Mirek M. gmail.com> writes: > > (Rather than spending time coding this, developers should be spending > time > > making LibO start faster so it doesn't need a splash.) > > 3.6 is there according to a comment on > https://www.libreoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46365 > > Why not eliminate the splash screen instead of designing a new one? > I don't think that the "~1 sec" statistic is accurate, at least for computers that don't have such great specs. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
Mirek M. gmail.com> writes: > (Rather than spending time coding this, developers should be spending time > making LibO start faster so it doesn't need a splash.) 3.6 is there according to a comment on https://www.libreoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46365 Why not eliminate the splash screen instead of designing a new one? Mike -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] New Whiteboard Proposal "Comments Ruler Control"
Hi everybody, there has been some nice ruler rework recently [1], and so I got a friendly ping about what had happened to the so called "Comments Ruler Control" I've proposed years ago when working on the Writer notes [2]. I've started a (private) Whiteboard and updated the description and behavior to conform with the refreshed rulers - and the overall more simplistic visual design in LibO: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/User:ChristophNoack/Temporary_Work_Space/CommentsRulerControl Question to the Design Team: Any objections to move that to the official Whiteboard area? (The last time I've looked at the Whiteboards page it mentioned: "Don't create a whiteboard without discussing it with the design team first."). I did not follow the discussion too closely during the last weeks with regard to the workflow - but I guess accepting the proposal starts the "proposal phase", right? Cheers, Christoph [1] http://artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~kendy/blog/archives/permalinks/2012-05-17T10_58_20.html [2] http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Notes2 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
2012/6/8 Mirek M. > On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Kévin PEIGNOT >wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > I updated the Wiki Page to add a proposal : A color coded splash screen > > (based on "Minty" proposal by Astron) : > > - Progress bar use the color of the launched app: > > - Blue progress bar for Writer > > - Red progress bar for Impress > > - Yellow progress bar for Draw > > - ... > > - Grey progress bar for general LibO launch (LibO main window) > > - On Unofficial builds (Community builds), as with Astron's proposal, do > > not display "The Document Foundation", and make the triangles grey. > > > > Excuse me for the designs, they aren't beautiful, but I used Inkscape for > > the first time (and I'm at work I don't have a long time) > > > > What do you think of : > > > > -Having a few differences whether we launch Writer, Calc, Main window... > > > > That would probably take a while to code, so we probably wouldn't implement > it that way. > (Rather than spending time coding this, developers should be spending time > making LibO start faster so it doesn't need a splash.) > > > > -This design ? > > > > I like it, though I still prefer my own. :) > Usually I love mono-colored designs, but For a splash screen I must admit I prefer a colored one ^^ > > -- > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org > Problems? > http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be > deleted > > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Kévin PEIGNOT wrote: > Hi all > > I updated the Wiki Page to add a proposal : A color coded splash screen > (based on "Minty" proposal by Astron) : > - Progress bar use the color of the launched app: > - Blue progress bar for Writer > - Red progress bar for Impress > - Yellow progress bar for Draw > - ... > - Grey progress bar for general LibO launch (LibO main window) > - On Unofficial builds (Community builds), as with Astron's proposal, do > not display "The Document Foundation", and make the triangles grey. > > Excuse me for the designs, they aren't beautiful, but I used Inkscape for > the first time (and I'm at work I don't have a long time) > > What do you think of : > > -Having a few differences whether we launch Writer, Calc, Main window... > That would probably take a while to code, so we probably wouldn't implement it that way. (Rather than spending time coding this, developers should be spending time making LibO start faster so it doesn't need a splash.) > -This design ? > I like it, though I still prefer my own. :) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
Hi all I updated the Wiki Page to add a proposal : A color coded splash screen (based on "Minty" proposal by Astron) : - Progress bar use the color of the launched app: - Blue progress bar for Writer - Red progress bar for Impress - Yellow progress bar for Draw - ... - Grey progress bar for general LibO launch (LibO main window) - On Unofficial builds (Community builds), as with Astron's proposal, do not display "The Document Foundation", and make the triangles grey. Excuse me for the designs, they aren't beautiful, but I used Inkscape for the first time (and I'm at work I don't have a long time) What do you think of : -Having a few differences whether we launch Writer, Calc, Main window... -This design ? Kévin 2012/6/8 Adolfo Jayme Barrientos > Nevermind, I’ve redone my design in SVG and uploaded the Inkscape source > file. > > On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 3:55 AM, Adolfo Jayme Barrientos > wrote: > > I’ve submitted my first draft, but I made it in GIMP. Why is SVG > > required, if not to make raster images from it? I can upload my source > > .xcf, though, and later I can redo it in Inkscape. > > > > -- > > Fitoschido > > -- > Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org > Problems? > http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ > Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette > List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ > All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be > deleted > > -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Design ethos
Hi Björn, On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 8:45 PM, Björn Balazs wrote: > Hi Mirek, > > Am Mittwoch, 6. Juni 2012, 19:46:09 schrieb Mirek M.: > > Hi Björn, > > The principles I put on the whiteboard was just me spitballing. The > initial > > idea was that the community would suggest design principles and we'd > refine > > them until we got something well-defined and something that we could all > > agree on. > > The new proposal is to take Mozilla's design principles as our basic > > guidelines, as those have worked well for them, and work off of those. > As I > > believe that is a better approach, I'll simply address your concerns with > > that. > > Ok, I understand that now. It usually is a good idea to build upon proven > things. We will use those to demonstrate the problems. Just as a forword - > despite of what I write now, it might be ok to use these principles - it > simply depends on the goal we have. Let me quote from the article: > > "Developers encountering these keywords likely won't have any additional > interface design training, so it is important that each heuristic is very > clearly defined with specific examples and detailed explanations. > Additionally, allowing developers to view all of the bugs in the software > marked as the same type of issue, both current and resolved, serves as an > effective way for them to further learn about the heuristic." > > Therefor I understand these principles as guidelines for developers to > become > aware of UX, perhaps learn a tiny bit. Opposite I do understand something > like > the design ethos as rules for us - experienced designers and UX > professionals. > So, I think the sugested rules are good for teaching developers, but I > think > this is not what we want to do - ?questionmark? > On the contrary. These are simple principles that should guide all designs, whether they come from developers or designers, and would be the basis under which all designs would be judged. (Much like basic arithmetic is applicable for both first-graders and adult mathematicians.) On top of these principles, though, we'd have a HIG for specific situations, such as desktop integration (e.g. requiring a "Close" button on dialogs, as Gnome 3 and Mac OS feature modal dialogs without title bars). > > > On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 6:50 PM, Björn Balazs wrote: > > > I think this is a general problem with general guidelines as they are > > > outlined > > > in the mentioned article as well. Either they are so abstract that > nobody > > > would reject them - but then it is also hard to derive any consequence > out > > > of > > > them --- Or they are specific but exceptions are the rule. > > > > With the ideal design principles, exceptions would never be allowed. > > Mozilla's principles may not be perfect, but they're quite good and we > > could fix their bugs as we encounter them. > > Could you point out specific points that you don't feel good about? > > No problem: > > ux-feedback >Interfaces should provide feedback about their current status. Users > should never wonder what state the system is in. [Source: Nielsen] > > -> How would you solve the save-icon discussion of the last weeks with this > rule? (BTW: the rule is absolutely right, but hard to derive consequences > out > of it) > Easy. The "Save" icon should be active if there is anything to save and inactive if there is nothing to save. As we have determined that it is useful to be able to save view settings, the "Save" icon should become active even if only the view settings change. (I don't think it makes sense to disable the icon if we think saving view settings is genuinely useful.) And, in that respect, the Save icon would indicate saved status, as it is meant to. If we also want to indicate whether the document's contents were edited (above the dialog that asks the user whether he'd like to save the edits he made to the document, which doesn't apply to view options), we could have a special "Save view edits" icon for when only view options were edited and contents were left intact. (I'll post this to that thread now.) > > ux-implementation-level >Interfaces should not be organized around the underlying implementation > and technology in ways that are illogical, or require the user to have > access > to additional information that is not found in the interface itself. > [Source: > Nielsen, Cooper] > > -> I do not even understand this one. > I agree that the wording of this one is confusing. As I understand it, the UI shouldn't be based on the underlying code in a way that's illogical to the user. You can see the relevant bugs at https://mevootserv.appspot.com/bugzilla.mozilla.org/buglist.cgi?keywords=ux-implementation-level For example, if you take https://mevootserv.appspot.com/bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=615306, the behavior of the back button is based on some code that tells the browser to go back to the previous site, which isn't always friendly to the user, as it doesn't take into account redirec
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
Nevermind, I’ve redone my design in SVG and uploaded the Inkscape source file. On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 3:55 AM, Adolfo Jayme Barrientos wrote: > I’ve submitted my first draft, but I made it in GIMP. Why is SVG > required, if not to make raster images from it? I can upload my source > .xcf, though, and later I can redo it in Inkscape. > > -- > Fitoschido -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Looking for a new splash screen
I’ve submitted my first draft, but I made it in GIMP. Why is SVG required, if not to make raster images from it? I can upload my source .xcf, though, and later I can redo it in Inkscape. -- Fitoschido -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
