Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice, Icons For Telegram Channels
Hi William, Thanks a lot for your input. In fact is has come to our (TDF staff team) attention as well that our logo is not well used and not easy to apply. The plan is to put the topic into a bigger picture and consider a full redesign/rebranding for 7.0. You are very welcome to join the discussion, I will start soon with some basics. Cheers, Heiko > Am 21.05.2019 um 16:59 schrieb William Gathoye : > > Hello everyone, > > Since no decision has been made yet and since what you had been > discussing is still pretty interesting from a marketing perspective, I'm > digging out this thread :) > > I wanted to enlarge the discussion to 2 topics: > > * the logos used by the NLP community accounts on social media. > * the name used on social media > > == Logos == > > Currently, some logos used tend to look a bit outdated/bad designed/or > use the LibreOffice logo in ways that are not permitted by the > logo/trademark guidelines. Lack of standardization (common denominator) > in the logo leads to communities whose link with LibreOffice is not very > clear.[1] > > In the end 2017, we took up the challenge to redeploy the LibreOfficeFR > Twitter account. After a few months, mid-2018, we decided it was time to > do some uplifting of the branding kit, e.g; for the logo: > > * Before: https://nextcloud.documentfoundation.org/s/TZqFk3jFw3f54AE > * After: https://nextcloud.documentfoundation.org/s/wGgRCSexT2iPq4y > > We used the default LibreOffice logo in order to comply with we the TDF > guidelines and, instead of a simple flag, we have just added the logo of > the French organization. Since we haven't been allowed to reuse it, we > customized it completely: the arc of circles have been replaced by a > pentagon, the color gradient lightly shifted and the order of color > reversed. > > Choosing flags seems a bit outdated and a bad choice for languages like > French, Spanish, etc. that are spoken in several countries. > > I like propositions made by Kristi because these two elements are > respected: some sort of standardization (increasing the link with the > LibreOffice project) and originality for the language specific stuff. > > However the LibreOffice logo is sometimes quite hard to read, do you > have something in mind to improve readability? > > Do you plan to have version for social media as well? > > When an agreement has been reached, would you mind declining your work > for the following communities? [2] > > == Names on social media == > > Finding a agreement with owner of the social media pages/groups, at > least those who are not TDF memeber yet, could be nice to have. That > way, we would be able to merge and make them adopt our new branding. > > I took the opportunity to add additional pages that weren't indexed > there [3]. > > > Regards, > > [1] https://twitter.com/LibreOfficeNL > > [2] > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Website/Web_Sites_services#Social_Media > > [3] > https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/index.php?title=Website%2FWeb_Sites_services=revision=178047=177324 > > -- > William Gathoye > > > > > -- > To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org > Problems? > https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ > Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette > List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ > Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice, Icons For Telegram Channels
Hello everyone, Since no decision has been made yet and since what you had been discussing is still pretty interesting from a marketing perspective, I'm digging out this thread :) I wanted to enlarge the discussion to 2 topics: * the logos used by the NLP community accounts on social media. * the name used on social media == Logos == Currently, some logos used tend to look a bit outdated/bad designed/or use the LibreOffice logo in ways that are not permitted by the logo/trademark guidelines. Lack of standardization (common denominator) in the logo leads to communities whose link with LibreOffice is not very clear.[1] In the end 2017, we took up the challenge to redeploy the LibreOfficeFR Twitter account. After a few months, mid-2018, we decided it was time to do some uplifting of the branding kit, e.g; for the logo: * Before: https://nextcloud.documentfoundation.org/s/TZqFk3jFw3f54AE * After: https://nextcloud.documentfoundation.org/s/wGgRCSexT2iPq4y We used the default LibreOffice logo in order to comply with we the TDF guidelines and, instead of a simple flag, we have just added the logo of the French organization. Since we haven't been allowed to reuse it, we customized it completely: the arc of circles have been replaced by a pentagon, the color gradient lightly shifted and the order of color reversed. Choosing flags seems a bit outdated and a bad choice for languages like French, Spanish, etc. that are spoken in several countries. I like propositions made by Kristi because these two elements are respected: some sort of standardization (increasing the link with the LibreOffice project) and originality for the language specific stuff. However the LibreOffice logo is sometimes quite hard to read, do you have something in mind to improve readability? Do you plan to have version for social media as well? When an agreement has been reached, would you mind declining your work for the following communities? [2] == Names on social media == Finding a agreement with owner of the social media pages/groups, at least those who are not TDF memeber yet, could be nice to have. That way, we would be able to merge and make them adopt our new branding. I took the opportunity to add additional pages that weren't indexed there [3]. Regards, [1] https://twitter.com/LibreOfficeNL [2] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Website/Web_Sites_services#Social_Media [3] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/index.php?title=Website%2FWeb_Sites_services=revision=178047=177324 -- William Gathoye -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice, Icons For Telegram Channels
Hello everyone, InitiallyI would like to thank you for your feedback about the first draft of Telegram icons. I've gathered your comments for my first proposal and I've prepared a second draft. There you can find a second version for LibreOffice Mexico channel, a second version for LibreOffice French channel and a second version for LibreOffice Design channel. Also you can find three icon models: one for LibreOffice Albania channel, one for LibreOffice Portugal, and one for LibreOffice Sweden. Here is the link: https://cloud.collective68.tech/s/R9kQNYcYRRpZWJ5 If you want add new icons or want to improve the existing ones, please keep in mind: 1. The colors of palette should be from Marketing and Branding TDF Color Table (Color Table, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding),except the red color. The red (#FF0B23) which is used for icons is not from color table, since there was no red color in color table. 2. The new icons shouldn't be similar with the existing one due to the potential confusion that they might generate. For this reason, the new icons may contain the same colors with any existing icon, but the color composition (placement) should not be the same. 3. The logo should not be changed by adding additional graphic elements to the "Document Symbol" (Guidelines and Best Practices, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding) 4. For icons related to flags, the applied colors should be adjusted according to Marketing and Branding TDF Color Table (Color Table, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding) 5. keeping the same proportions for the icon size is quite important if we want to have a [more]consistent presence. Below you can find the comments you sent for my first draft, and my responses for respective comments. *Comment from Heiko Tietze:* /I like flat icons and your proposal definitly complies with the branding guideline. But what identifies design, for example, with black or dark grey/green? Just color is hard to understand- but admittely easy to distinguish later. And please keep in mind that Telegram makes everything round. After loading the image I've seen the tiny connector lines. Beautiful! But unfortunately you need a hires screen to perceive this unzoomed. The country icons are super funny when compared against each other. Love Hebrew/Israel. And Brasil :)/ *Respons**e**:* /Thank your for your feedback, Heiko! Indeed, the green connector lines are not obviously visible in a small scale of icons. For this reason, I made made some improvements, coloring the lines in ice blue (#63BBEE) from the brand guidelines. Now, I think they look clearly as connector lines. For more, please check out the second draft for icons! I saw that there is a new icon on the Telegram channel, so feel free to keep the one that you think does the job :)/ *Comment from Sophie Gautier:* /Just one thing about the icons for countries, we base our projects on language, not countries, so we should be very careful when using flag colors, on the FR channel for example, we welcome all people coming from French speaking countries, not only from France, hence the use of the Francophonie colors./ *Response:* /This is correct Sophie//,//and thanks for the feedback. I was wondering what happens to communities that want to identify themselves from the location and have a Teleram group? In any case the idea is to improve the actual visual presence of these Telegram groups gradually starting from the ones that are recognized from TDF. / *Comment from Fito:* /Hey Kristi, thank you for creating an icon for LibreOffice Mexico =) much appreciated. Have you looked at adding another visual element associable to countries/cultures beyond flat colors? (I’m thinking maybe a background texture — for Mexico, a Maya calendar- or eagle feather-themed motif would work, I guess). Especially since both Italy and Mexico use very similar colors for their flags, their resulting icons are not too representative of any country, I’m afraid. (BTW, @kristicunga: while personally I’m not a fan of absolute flat design *myself*, I’m pretty much on board with any effort towards a cohesive image for our social media channels/accounts)/ *Response:* /From a brief research I made, it's graphically impossible to add traditional Mexican elements (//https://thenounproject.com/search/?q=maya%20civilization)//, without touching the "Document Symbol" which is not allowed, according to guidelines (//https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding)//. For this reason I made an other version of the icon, inspired by the Mexican flag. Please, check out the second draft of Telegram icons! Thank you for your feedback, Fito!/ Thank you and lilooking forward to your comments, Bests, Kristi Çunga -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice, Icons For Telegram Channels
Hello everyone, InitiallyI would like to thank you for your feedback about the first draft of Telegram icons. I've gathered your comments for my first proposal and I've prepared a second draft. There you can find a second version for LibreOffice Mexico channel, a second version for LibreOffice French channel and a second version for LibreOffice Design channel. Also you can find three icon models: one for LibreOffice Albania channel, one for LibreOffice Portugal, and one for LibreOffice Sweden. Here is the link: https://cloud.collective68.tech/s/R9kQNYcYRRpZWJ5 If you want add new icons or want to improve the existing ones, please keep in mind: 1. The colors of palette should be from Marketing and Branding TDF Color Table (Color Table, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding),except the red color. The red (#FF0B23) which is used for icons is not from color table, since there was no red color in color table. 2. The new icons shouldn't be similar with the existing one due to the potential confusion that they might generate. For this reason, the new icons may contain the same colors with any existing icon, but the color composition (placement) should not be the same. 3. The logo should not be changed by adding additional graphic elements to the "Document Symbol" (Guidelines and Best Practices, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding) 4. For icons related to flags, the applied colors should be adjusted according to Marketing and Branding TDF Color Table (Color Table, https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding) 5. keeping the same proportions for the icon size is quite important if we want to have a [more]consistent presence. Below you can find the comments you sent for my first draft, and my responses for respective comments. *Comment from Heiko Tietze:* /I like flat icons and your proposal definitly complies with the branding guideline. But what identifies design, for example, with black or dark grey/green? Just color is hard to understand- but admittely easy to distinguish later. And please keep in mind that Telegram makes everything round. After loading the image I've seen the tiny connector lines. Beautiful! But unfortunately you need a hires screen to perceive this unzoomed. The country icons are super funny when compared against each other. Love Hebrew/Israel. And Brasil :)/ *Respons**e**:* /Thank your for your feedback, Heiko! Indeed, the green connector lines are not obviously visible in a small scale of icons. For this reason, I made made some improvements, coloring the lines in ice blue (#63BBEE) from the brand guidelines. Now, I think they look clearly as connector lines. For more, please check out the second draft for icons! I saw that there is a new icon on the Telegram channel, so feel free to keep the one that you think does the job :)/ *Comment from Sophie Gautier:* /Just one thing about the icons for countries, we base our projects on language, not countries, so we should be very careful when using flag colors, on the FR channel for example, we welcome all people coming from French speaking countries, not only from France, hence the use of the Francophonie colors./ *Response:* /This is correct Sophie//,//and thanks for the feedback. I was wondering what happens to communities that want to identify themselves from the location and have a Teleram group? In any case the idea is to improve the actual visual presence of these Telegram groups gradually starting from the ones that are recognized from TDF. / *Comment from Fito:* /Hey Kristi, thank you for creating an icon for LibreOffice Mexico =) much appreciated. Have you looked at adding another visual element associable to countries/cultures beyond flat colors? (I’m thinking maybe a background texture — for Mexico, a Maya calendar- or eagle feather-themed motif would work, I guess). Especially since both Italy and Mexico use very similar colors for their flags, their resulting icons are not too representative of any country, I’m afraid. (BTW, @kristicunga: while personally I’m not a fan of absolute flat design *myself*, I’m pretty much on board with any effort towards a cohesive image for our social media channels/accounts)/ *Response:* /From a brief research I made, it's graphically impossible to add traditional Mexican elements (//https://thenounproject.com/search/?q=maya%20civilization)//, without touching the "Document Symbol" which is not allowed, according to guidelines (//https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding)//. For this reason I made an other version of the icon, inspired by the Mexican flag. Please, check out the second draft of Telegram icons! Thank you for your feedback, Fito!/ Thank you and lilooking forward to your comments, Bests, Kristi Çunga // -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems?
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice, Icons For Telegram Channels
As replied on Telegram: + I like flat icons and your proposal definitely complies with the branding guideline. But what identifies design, for example, with black or dark grey/green? Just color is hard to understand- but admittedly easy to distinguish later. And please keep in mind that Telegram makes everything round. + After loading the image I've seen the tiny connector lines. Beautiful! + But unfortunately you need a hires screen to perceive this unzoomed. + The country icons are super funny when compared against each other. Love Hebrew/Israel. And Brasil On 08.01.19 20:58, Krist Çunga wrote: > Hello, > > My name is Kristi and I'm a designer based in Tirana, Albania. I was > introduced to the LibreOffice community before LibOCon Tirana 2018 where I > had the opportunity to work for the co-creation of LibOCon Tirana 2018 visual > ID. After the event I was searching for LibreOffice communities on Telegram > app and found out that there are different LibreOffice icons used for these > channels, or no icons at all at some cases. Here is an example on how > LibreOffice Telegram channel look from my app: > > > > > As you can see, it is quite confusing navigating through these channels if > you are part of many groups related to LibreOffice. > > I thought that it would make more sense to have the same look & feel of these > icons and create a more consistent look visually. After some research i found > out that there are two different groups of icons: > a. based on the country and language of the community; > b. based on the theme of the Telegram group (main channel, design channel, > localization,etc) > > My proposal is to replace the current icons with flat icons. Flat design is > standing for years as very usable for websites and iconsincluding the > onesrelated to Telegram app. The list of the icons is based on the The > Document Foundation Wiki > (https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Website/Web_Sites_services#Telegram). > The new icons' colors are from LibreOffice branding guidelines > (https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding), except the red one > (#FF0B23). > > Hopefully this will create more consistency for community members that are > navigating Telegram groups related to LibreOffice :) > > You can find the proposals here in two different folders for > countries/languages and different thematic: > https://cloud.collective68.tech/s/woaLKjDgNjjjxSK > > Best regards, > Kristi Çunga > > > -- Dr. Heiko Tietze UX designer Tel. +49 (0)179/1268509 -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: design+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/design/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Paulo, all, Paulo José Amaro schrieb: Hi, Sorry for replying too late. It's never too late ;-) I'm without internet access in home again, but at university, in the weekends, Im can use a little. :-) You have to go to university at the weekend? Shorting the discussion, we need higher versions to Tango and Galaxy mimetype icons, right? Ok, I think I can help on it. I'll look in the Bugzilla and see what I can to do. This would be great! Oxygen is described as non-existent, so this would be another task to work on. If you find a way to specify the differences between Tango, Galaxy and Oxygen, perhaps someone else could pick one of the themes and adapt shading, light sources and reflexion. I'm not quite sure if we need to follow the color styles of the different themes, because this would mean to reduce our consistency on different platforms and with different themes. There is no common color palette for Tango, Galaxy and Oxygen, so we don't have any chance to comply with all of them, if we want to stay consistent. A question not very related to, anyway (sorry if it was already replied): Why can't we use SVG files to icons, otherwise bitmap converted ones? I know Ubuntu support SVG icons and they don't lost quality on resizing. Would it because other operational systems? We can, but we can't use them inside LibreOffice. At least this is what I read from the Google Summer of Code proposal here: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/Gsoc/Ideas#Use_svg_for_LibreOffice_icons Another point I mentioned already in the bug report: I don't know an easy way to extract single SVG files for each icon from the central document. I don't want to copy and paste them manually every time when they have been updated... Best regards Bernhard [...] 2011/4/7 Bernhard Dippoldbernh...@familie-dippold.at Hi Christoph, all, Christoph Noack wrote: [...] Here is a link: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=33229 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Bernhard, hi Paulo! Just a few thoughts, although I really know that I didn't follow this topic very closely :-\ Am Montag, den 18.04.2011, 20:21 +0200 schrieb Bernhard Dippold: Hi Paulo, all, ... Paulo José Amaro schrieb: ... Shorting the discussion, we need higher versions to Tango and Galaxy mimetype icons, right? Ok, I think I can help on it. I'll look in the Bugzilla and see what I can to do. This would be great! Oxygen is described as non-existent, so this would be another task to work on. I'm sorry to appear a bit disruptive, but I'm unsure how much benefit we gain by adapting all the icons for all the themes. My very personal opinion is to - at least at the moment - should provide something that works good as a default (e.g. Tango on Linux, Galaxy on Windows, ??? on Mac). Again, this shows that we really need some reasonable strategy how we want to deal with the platforms. What do you think? For example, there might be more serious problems with Tango icon placeholders having an inaccurate metaphor for certain features. Or, we might start to develop the visual design for LibreOffice 3.5 - with motif and new graphic sizes and information dialogs. Or, we need some new icons for the StartCenter - currently we still use the Oracle branded ones (gray). ... I'm not quite sure if we need to follow the color styles of the different themes, because this would mean to reduce our consistency on different platforms and with different themes. There is no common color palette for Tango, Galaxy and Oxygen, so we don't have any chance to comply with all of them, if we want to stay consistent. As I said in another mail - do we want to align our branding with other FLOSS related projects? For example, if it fits, we might align with what the Gnome guys do ... and maybe we are able to save some effort with regard to standard icons and stuff. Just as an example, here is what the Gnome guys did ... http://jimmac.musichall.cz/log/?p=1145 Please consider this as an idea that might be valuable in the long-run if we address larger topics ... at the moment, we should still work on fixing what we have. A question not very related to, anyway (sorry if it was already replied): Why can't we use SVG files to icons, otherwise bitmap converted ones? I know Ubuntu support SVG icons and they don't lost quality on resizing. Would it because other operational systems? We can, but we can't use them inside LibreOffice. At least this is what I read from the Google Summer of Code proposal here: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/Gsoc/Ideas#Use_svg_for_LibreOffice_icons Another point I mentioned already in the bug report: I don't know an easy way to extract single SVG files for each icon from the central document. I don't want to copy and paste them manually every time when they have been updated... Same for me ... but we just want to change the colors, this should be easily doable via a script that searchesreplaces within the SVG file. Mmh, this mail raises more new questions than it might help to answer the old ones ... sorry. Cheers, Christoph -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Christoph, all, Christoph Noack wrote: Hi all, as you may know, LibreOffice still lacks complete support concerning the new MIME icons. Thus, I'd like to invite everybody who is interested in this topic (Paulo, Nik, ... ?) to subscribe to the corresponding bug. To me, it would be very desirable to get you updated automatically :-) And if you could have a look at the most recent comments. Here is a link: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=33229 One point to consider are the different themes in LibreOffice using the same iconset at the moment (or staying with a design without thight relation to LibreOffice). Some shading/shadowing (perhaps coloring) modifications need to be done in order to fit with the Oxygen Theme or Crystal Theme. For smaller sizes Paolo already worked on Tango Theme, but this need to be adapted for larger scales too. Another point is extraction of single SVG files from the source, even if this seems no longer to be necessary for Gnome 3 (using high resolution bitmaps). I can't spend time on this topic at the moment, but I don't want it to be forgotten, so I just mention it... Best regards Bernhard PS: When we finished the WWN work on the wiki and defined our work's structures, these topics should be added to the collection of work-to-be-done (easy / less easy design) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi all, as you may know, LibreOffice still lacks complete support concerning the new MIME icons. Thus, I'd like to invite everybody who is interested in this topic (Paulo, Nik, ... ?) to subscribe to the corresponding bug. To me, it would be very desirable to get you updated automatically :-) And if you could have a look at the most recent comments. Here is a link: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=33229 Here is some information on the issue tracker itself ... http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/BugTriage Just to make that sure - please keep less specific discussion on our mailing list. That helps to keep the issue history clean - which is really helpful for the developers working on that issue (they don't need to browse all comments). Cheers, Christoph Am Freitag, den 11.03.2011, 02:20 -0300 schrieb Paulo José: Correct link to comparison image: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons-comparison.png (force reload) On 11-03-2011 02:13, Paulo José wrote: [...] Here it's another comparison between the old and new Tango icons (from your linked source file and LibreOffice's version) and the Galaxy icons. http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-htnB3ln0AyY/TXmvHpBHEZI/Adc/Y4INmuU74KE/s1600/Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons-comparison-2.png [...] -- Paulo José O. Amaro Computer Science Student Federal University of São João del-Rei WebDesigner / Linked Empresa Júnior Blogger / casatwain.com -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Paulo, all, thanks for keeping this running! Paulo José schrieb: Hi all! I have been away from these discussions, just reading and not participating, but here is one more contribution. http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons.svg These are the Tango-inspired version of the Mimetype icons for toolbar usage. I'd like to know your opinion/criticism/suggestions.. :-) We discussed the shadow during the first few iterations and came to the conclusion not to use it. I don't remember the reason exactly, but I think that some OS add their own shadow to the icons on the desktop? And we didn't want to waste precious pixel... About size, they are 24px + 2px (1px empty border) = 26px. I don't know if it's the only needed size... Can anyone talk more about it? And also, are more icons needed? What I read from Thorsten is in the mail you attached: [...] On 10-02-2011 05:20, Christoph Noack wrote: [...] Am Donnerstag, den 10.02.2011, 08:15 +0100 schrieb Thorsten Behrens: Christoph Noack wrote: But, here comes the question to a new toto item - Thorsten: Kendy mentioned yesterday that some icons might be missing. Is it right that we lack toolbar icons for (e.g.) the File-New-Dropdown? If yes, what size is required here? Nope, we have those. Phew. :-) According to the Galaxy icon set page, it should be 26x26 - can you confirm? http://ui.openoffice.org/VisualDesign/OOo_galaxy.html Heh, no friggin' idea - but yeah, that page says: small size (16 x 16 pixel), large size (26 x 26 pixel), high contrast version of all icons. ;) [...] Large: 48×48 Medium: 32x32 Small: 22×22 pixels - blow up to 24×24 by adding a 1 pixel empty space on all sides Extra Small: 16×16 pixels So if I understand it correctly, we need 24x24 px icons already including one empty pixel at every side. This might be dependent on operating system and distribution, otherwise I don't know why Galaxy mentions 26x26, but perhaps Thorsten can enlighten us Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi all, I just perceived my LibreOffice version's icons are actually 26px large (and different from this [1] screenshoot), so I made a 26px version without shadow: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons-26px.svg And a version with the same 1px bottom from the other icons of the toolbar: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons-25px-shadow.svg Here you can see a comparison between the three proposals: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Toolbar-Mimetype-Icons-comparison.png What's your opinions? See you, guys! ~Paulo [1] - http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:2011-02-15_LibreOfficeInitialIcons_ToolbarIssue.png -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Mike, Christoph, all, Mike Houben schrieb: Am 10.02.2011 um 08:20 schrieb Christoph Noack: I can join the campaign I miss a Mac - so if anybody here (but you Thorsten, you have to care about other things *g*) has a Mac, it would be great to see a screenshot - just for fun. Here some screenshots from the new RC :) It looks nice but I think somebody compressed the icons a little bit to much. Their pixalated, which looks awefull. http://cl.ly/1j3p0M1T0N0C1C2H3b04 http://cl.ly/2N3e2v1E2J0r1g422B1Y http://cl.ly/391u2V3C0W1Z2M0Q1j2q http://cl.ly/1V3Z3C1H2D3B19352L0r Looking at the screenshots it seems that the logo text is pixelated, while the icons are ok - as they stem from different resources, it might be important to find out. Can you have a look again, please? Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
hi thanks for the inkscape palette, very useful;) but still didn't understand what's going on about tango. will this palette be replaced by the tango palette? greetings tobias Am Mittwoch, den 09.02.2011, 22:54 +0100 schrieb Christoph Noack: Hi Tobias! A quick reply ... Am Mittwoch, den 09.02.2011, 19:33 +0100 schrieb Tobias Bernard: hi colored border: i think that the chosen colors for draw and impress simply don't look good. the problem with yellow and orange ist, that, if the color is light, there's not enough contrast on light backgrounds. so, for generally appliable icons a dark border is needed. but since some colors, when made dark look weird, maybe a general border is the best way to go. We discussed that some time ago, but we came to the conclusion that colored icons will work. Especially, since we have to keep in mind that we have quite some icons that need proper differentiation. that's why i think a black border for all icons would be best. if that's not possible, i would at least change the colors for draw and impress a bit. Okay, proposals are welcome of course. But at the moment, I feel bound to these colors, since they are defined within our branding guidelines and are re-used in several places. The colors have been developed in several iterations, so I think we are close to a good result. pictograms: in my opinion, too complex symbols should be avoided, even for the big icons. i'm thinking of a logo for any application, a monochromatic symbol that can be used for both small and big icons. this would make the symbols more recognizable. just as an example for such icons: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/3/31/LibO_icons_draft.png Well, that was one of the starting points - Bernhard was (of course) part of the icon activity, and (I hope it's okay to say that) he also drive the symbolism / methaphor discussion. And again, we have to keep in mind that there are several human interface guidelines (e.g. Windows, Mac OS X) that require different icons. And our current style even comes not close to their requirements - they would require even more detail and color. So please consider also external requirements ... so, i'll maybe make a suggestion for the icons within the next days. we'll see;) yes, i'm intersted to join the design team, but i've yet not read everything about it in the wiki^^ maybe in the next few days... Okay, that would be great. Maybe then it's easier to understand what we've done so far - here is the link to the icon summary: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Kick-Off/CurrentWorkStatus#LibreOffice_Icons And to also answer the question in your other mail - the currently valid color palette for the icons and other marketing material can be found here (including palettes for Inkscape and The Gimp, see resources): http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding#Colors greetings tobias Kind regards, Christoph Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 22:15 +0100 schrieb Christoph Noack: Hi Tobias! Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 16:37 +0100 schrieb Tobias Bernard: hi first of all, i'd like to say that i love libreoffice and would like to help you guys in some way. Great! And we love people who like to help us ;-) these days, i've read that the new libreoffice icons are going to look like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_9MZR46ZEuS8/TURcYGZPRkI/AuE/si2R_93DT_M/s1600/New256pxIcons.png More or less, since these show only the huge icons - that are only used in special cases (e.g. Mac OS X dock, Windows XP Preview, Windows 7). i don't know if the icons will remain that way, but personally, i don't like how they are now. In my opinion, the main problems are: - the colored border: it's fine for blue and green, but yellow and orange look really bad Mmh, in what way - are they less distinctive, or do you think the chosen color looks weird, or reminds of something? - the pictograms inside the sheets: too comlex, too many colors that don't go with the border color That depends on the complexity. According to the wiki page, we decided Note: Basic symbolism will be used for 16px and (partly) 32 px icons. If the icons are larger, then decoration elements can be added to make them more pleasing. For example: * Calc: Shows a diagram that is re-used for the Chart icon to show the diagram in full size. The colors adapt the (currently used) Sun Branding colors from within the chart dialog. I adapted them to use the LibreOffice branding palette. That means, that the colors are consistent to both the object, and the behavior within LibreOffice. * Draw: The green handle grips mimic the ones in Draw - also green. If you look at the smaller icons, there
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Tobias! A quick reply ... Am Mittwoch, den 09.02.2011, 19:33 +0100 schrieb Tobias Bernard: hi colored border: i think that the chosen colors for draw and impress simply don't look good. the problem with yellow and orange ist, that, if the color is light, there's not enough contrast on light backgrounds. so, for generally appliable icons a dark border is needed. but since some colors, when made dark look weird, maybe a general border is the best way to go. We discussed that some time ago, but we came to the conclusion that colored icons will work. Especially, since we have to keep in mind that we have quite some icons that need proper differentiation. that's why i think a black border for all icons would be best. if that's not possible, i would at least change the colors for draw and impress a bit. Okay, proposals are welcome of course. But at the moment, I feel bound to these colors, since they are defined within our branding guidelines and are re-used in several places. The colors have been developed in several iterations, so I think we are close to a good result. pictograms: in my opinion, too complex symbols should be avoided, even for the big icons. i'm thinking of a logo for any application, a monochromatic symbol that can be used for both small and big icons. this would make the symbols more recognizable. just as an example for such icons: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/3/31/LibO_icons_draft.png Well, that was one of the starting points - Bernhard was (of course) part of the icon activity, and (I hope it's okay to say that) he also drive the symbolism / methaphor discussion. And again, we have to keep in mind that there are several human interface guidelines (e.g. Windows, Mac OS X) that require different icons. And our current style even comes not close to their requirements - they would require even more detail and color. So please consider also external requirements ... so, i'll maybe make a suggestion for the icons within the next days. we'll see;) yes, i'm intersted to join the design team, but i've yet not read everything about it in the wiki^^ maybe in the next few days... Okay, that would be great. Maybe then it's easier to understand what we've done so far - here is the link to the icon summary: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Kick-Off/CurrentWorkStatus#LibreOffice_Icons And to also answer the question in your other mail - the currently valid color palette for the icons and other marketing material can be found here (including palettes for Inkscape and The Gimp, see resources): http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding#Colors greetings tobias Kind regards, Christoph Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 22:15 +0100 schrieb Christoph Noack: Hi Tobias! Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 16:37 +0100 schrieb Tobias Bernard: hi first of all, i'd like to say that i love libreoffice and would like to help you guys in some way. Great! And we love people who like to help us ;-) these days, i've read that the new libreoffice icons are going to look like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_9MZR46ZEuS8/TURcYGZPRkI/AuE/si2R_93DT_M/s1600/New256pxIcons.png More or less, since these show only the huge icons - that are only used in special cases (e.g. Mac OS X dock, Windows XP Preview, Windows 7). i don't know if the icons will remain that way, but personally, i don't like how they are now. In my opinion, the main problems are: - the colored border: it's fine for blue and green, but yellow and orange look really bad Mmh, in what way - are they less distinctive, or do you think the chosen color looks weird, or reminds of something? - the pictograms inside the sheets: too comlex, too many colors that don't go with the border color That depends on the complexity. According to the wiki page, we decided Note: Basic symbolism will be used for 16px and (partly) 32 px icons. If the icons are larger, then decoration elements can be added to make them more pleasing. For example: * Calc: Shows a diagram that is re-used for the Chart icon to show the diagram in full size. The colors adapt the (currently used) Sun Branding colors from within the chart dialog. I adapted them to use the LibreOffice branding palette. That means, that the colors are consistent to both the object, and the behavior within LibreOffice. * Draw: The green handle grips mimic the ones in Draw - also green. If you look at the smaller icons, there is less detail. Here is an (outdated) example: http://luxate.blogspot.com/2011/01/libreoffice-initial-icons-milestone.html so, my major suggestions are: - leave the border black/grey for all the icons We decided to go for the color, to better distinguish the main applications from the important applications. I think, initially we had
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Thorsten! Am Donnerstag, den 10.02.2011, 08:15 +0100 schrieb Thorsten Behrens: Christoph Noack wrote: But, here comes the question to a new toto item - Thorsten: Kendy mentioned yesterday that some icons might be missing. Is it right that we lack toolbar icons for (e.g.) the File-New-Dropdown? If yes, what size is required here? Nope, we have those. Phew. :-) According to the Galaxy icon set page, it should be 26x26 - can you confirm? http://ui.openoffice.org/VisualDesign/OOo_galaxy.html Heh, no friggin' idea - but yeah, that page says: small size (16 x 16 pixel), large size (26 x 26 pixel), high contrast version of all icons. ;) More importantly, as prompted by Kendy, the Tango icon set has the following style guide (excerpt from http://tango.freedesktop.org/Tango_Icon_Theme_Guidelines - that has many more info for keeping a homogeneous design): That's true, and I regularly work with the Tango Icons. The question is, whether Tango will be the choice for us, since it still lacks a lot of specialized icons (Galaxy works better here). And, if we are sure that it works well on all platforms ... if yes, then we might go for that style atm. And, it can be guessed some the Tango icons (a fraction) will change soon, since they are currently re-done with a new styling. Large: 48×48 Medium: 32x32 Small: 22×22 pixels - blow up to 24×24 by adding a 1 pixel empty space on all sides Extra Small: 16×16 pixels (A RC1 preview download for Mac, with the new icons, is available here: http://download.go-oo.org/thb/libreoffice/mac/LibO_3.3.1rc1_MacOS_x86_install_en-US.dmg) I can join the campaign I miss a Mac - so if anybody here (but you Thorsten, you have to care about other things *g*) has a Mac, it would be great to see a screenshot - just for fun. Cheers, -- Thorsten Have a nice day! Christoph -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Tobias! First I want to wish you a warm welcome! I'm sure you'll have too many good experiences and learnings as I'm having since I recently became part of this group. :D About change the mimetype icons, I believe that Christoph's words already expressed all my thinking about it. If you have a look in the past wiki archives, you'll find many proposals and different ideas that came from all community and they grew up and evolved to the current icons. But, as everything in the open source world, propose new and refreshing ideas is ever welcome; since they add improvements based in past experiences. Personally, I'm a fan of Faenza icon set and i'm using it under Ubuntu there are some months already. But I think the Faenza's don't fit very well with others icon sets, since they have its own look and feel (seems a lot like IPhone icons...). And we must to keep the most of nativeness in every platforms. So I think the choice for using the symbol from The Document Foundation is a accurate decision to stay on. And I think it include to keep the borders around the document symbol. On your other suggestions, I personally think pictograms are really great in small icons, when you need say something accurate in a small space. But in the big icons they seems a bit out of place, giving much less information than they could/should. The fine artistic details are one of the best things I see in the Faenza icons. But I agree with your third suggestion. Some color (maybe less saturated than your first proposal [1]) would make the icons more vivid and friendly. These days I'm back to my work, so I'm unable to try this, so if you could, it would be great. :) I hope to see you doing more suggestions, showing more proposals and helping us like you're doing. :D Thank you for your interest! ~Paulo [1] - http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/3/31/LibO_icons_draft.png On 08-02-2011 13:37, Tobias Bernard wrote: hi first of all, i'd like to say that i love libreoffice and would like to help you guys in some way. these days, i've read that the new libreoffice icons are going to look like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_9MZR46ZEuS8/TURcYGZPRkI/AuE/si2R_93DT_M/s1600/New256pxIcons.png i don't know if the icons will remain that way, but personally, i don't like how they are now. In my opinion, the main problems are: - the colored border: it's fine for blue and green, but yellow and orange look really bad - the pictograms inside the sheets: too comlex, too many colors that don't go with the border color so, my major suggestions are: - leave the border black/grey for all the icons - choose some simple, monochromatic pictograms for the single programs - maybe color the inner part of the sheet, instead of the border i did these faenza-inspired libreoffice icons, because i didn't like to see the openoffice faenza icons on my gnome-desktop. When you see them, you'll have an idea of what I mean. http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=138257 if that's possible, I'd like to help improving the icons, which i think don't have yet the style they deserve. i work with inkscape and gimp on ubuntu maverick. greetings tobias bernard -- Paulo José O. Amaro Computer Science Student Federal University of São João del-Rei WebDesigner / Linked Empresa Júnior Blogger / casatwain.com -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Tobias! Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 16:37 +0100 schrieb Tobias Bernard: hi first of all, i'd like to say that i love libreoffice and would like to help you guys in some way. Great! And we love people who like to help us ;-) these days, i've read that the new libreoffice icons are going to look like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_9MZR46ZEuS8/TURcYGZPRkI/AuE/si2R_93DT_M/s1600/New256pxIcons.png More or less, since these show only the huge icons - that are only used in special cases (e.g. Mac OS X dock, Windows XP Preview, Windows 7). i don't know if the icons will remain that way, but personally, i don't like how they are now. In my opinion, the main problems are: - the colored border: it's fine for blue and green, but yellow and orange look really bad Mmh, in what way - are they less distinctive, or do you think the chosen color looks weird, or reminds of something? - the pictograms inside the sheets: too comlex, too many colors that don't go with the border color That depends on the complexity. According to the wiki page, we decided Note: Basic symbolism will be used for 16px and (partly) 32 px icons. If the icons are larger, then decoration elements can be added to make them more pleasing. For example: * Calc: Shows a diagram that is re-used for the Chart icon to show the diagram in full size. The colors adapt the (currently used) Sun Branding colors from within the chart dialog. I adapted them to use the LibreOffice branding palette. That means, that the colors are consistent to both the object, and the behavior within LibreOffice. * Draw: The green handle grips mimic the ones in Draw - also green. If you look at the smaller icons, there is less detail. Here is an (outdated) example: http://luxate.blogspot.com/2011/01/libreoffice-initial-icons-milestone.html so, my major suggestions are: - leave the border black/grey for all the icons We decided to go for the color, to better distinguish the main applications from the important applications. I think, initially we had the black/gray. By the way, we also decided (as the wiki page states, implicitly) to re-use our document symbol for marketing reasons - instead of using a standard document. Once LibreOffice and TDF is more known, we may roll back to more default icons. - choose some simple, monochromatic pictograms for the single programs See above please, the smaller icons work that way. - maybe color the inner part of the sheet, instead of the border :-) I initially did that, and Nik proposed to change that, to better mimic the idea of real paper pages for the document icons (currently document icons and applications icons are the same). The team decided to go that way ... Here is an old version with color: http://luxate.blogspot.com/2011/01/icon-as-con-i-can-2.html i did these faenza-inspired libreoffice icons, because i didn't like to see the openoffice faenza icons on my gnome-desktop. When you see them, you'll have an idea of what I mean. http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=138257 Cool, thanks for sharing. But here we have to somehow consider the guidelines of the other platforms as well. I think the current approach fits somehow (even if not perfectly) on most of the platforms. What do the others think? Personally, I'm currently perfectly happy with what we've achieved so far and would like to address the many other work items still left untouched ... maybe you can jump in here as well? if that's possible, I'd like to help improving the icons, which i think don't have yet the style they deserve. Help is always appreciated, but as I said, I'm fine with the current ones for the next few releases of LibreOffice. But if you want to improve them, I propose to touch only a few ... that helps us to discuss that within the team. But - maybe this might be even better - I'd like you to have a look at the general Design Team stuff. We are currently kicking of our team, so you might be interested - are you? Here is some starting point: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Kick-Off i work with inkscape and gimp on ubuntu maverick. Great, at least these are my favorite FLOSS tools as well. greetings tobias bernard Tobias, did that help somehow? Do you like to know more? Do the others want to share their thoughts? Cheers, Christoph -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice Icons
Hi Christoph, all, Christoph Noack schrieb: [...] Am Dienstag, den 08.02.2011, 18:05 +0100 schrieb Jan Holesovsky: [...] The svg source lives at: http://users.freedesktop.org/~thorsten/LibreOffice_Initial_Icons.svg @ Bernhard (assuming that you're reading this thread): What is the most recent version - is this one already available on the Initial Icons wiki page? Thorsten's file has not been integrated in the wiki, but the present source file there contains the same graphics: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibreOffice_Initial_Icons-pre_final.svg The main difference is that Thorsten added labels to the single icons allowing to export single bitmap files from each icon via a script. Thorsten mentioned here on the list, that his modifications to the file are licensed under our triple license CC-by-sa, LGPL 3+ and MPL, so it could be uploaded to the wiki. I'd prefer him to upload it and add the licenses instead of someone else doing it with reference to the mail. Does this help? Best regards Bernhard PS: Sorry - no comment on the topic (improving Tango Icons) by now: It needs a bit more time to evaluate... -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
