Re: new module decisions [was Re: gnome-screensaver]
On Thu, 2006-02-16 at 13:33 -0700, Elijah Newren wrote: For completeness, I should also note that there are two other big problems involved which I don't know how to solve on a short timescale (e.g. before 2.16): - Havoc's recent points about identifying our target audience is important in many ways; in relation to this email, it's hard to judge what should be part of the desktop when we don't have a defined target audience (some who are working on Gnome have a defined target audience, but I don't think all of those who do agree) The more I think about it, the more I have become convinced that our target audience, if not simply Linux/BSD/Solaris/Whatever Distributions should be People who HAVE to use GNOME. This basically means corporate workers stuck in cubicles staring at computers all day, I suppose. It also means that these end users are likely to have sysadmin support. So, for example, this tells us that the sysadmin and printing parts of GNOME are more important than the, say, cd-ripping or DVD playing parts. (hmm, maybe playing DVDs is important in corporations these days?) It also tells us that laptop, PDA and wireless support is more important than, say, gaming support. Another thing it tells us is that stability is more important than configurability. Etc., etc. What do you think? It makes sense to me, but I am not privy to the thoughts of the inner circle. ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Trying to reach consensus for the proposed modules
On Wed, 2006-01-11 at 22:47 +, Bastien Nocera wrote: + gnome-screensaver: people want this. I'd say we should go with it and I believe it's the general consensus, but maybe some people think it's not ready yet? Drop-in replacement for xscreensaver, but with a decent UI. I'm in. Kind of. On my Fedora Core 4 system, we have: rpm -e xscreensaver-base xscreensaver-extras error: Failed dependencies: xscreensaver is needed by (installed) control-center-2.12.2-1.1.fc4.nr.i386 xscreensaver-extras is needed by (installed) gnome-screensaver-0.0.24-1.1.fc4.nr.i386 ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: gnome-about-me
On Tue, 2005-08-02 at 19:52 -0700, Jeff Waugh wrote: There are many different sources of information we can use. We started by discussing passive information, such as popcon stats, ntp and web stats, etc. Having an active source will be very useful information though, even if as stat-cynics we don't think it will be ULTIMATELY AND COMPLETELY ACCURATE. You are right to be a stat-cynic, if by that you mean that much published research and estimates of percentages are unreliable. If, however, you mean that the science of statistics is useless (as opposed to mis-used), I beg to differ. I know I'm repeating myself, but here's what I think the only really useful and sane strategy is: Put a link in the About GNOME box to a stand up and be counted web page on wgo. Simple, effective, and you don't even have to find the feature in your desktop (because it will be exposed on the site too). Wouldn't it be more effective if it was in About Me? The only relevant issues I can see are: 1. We assume that more users will see About Me than will see About GNOME 2. We assume that (major) distros will modify About Me and not About GNOME. Can we get any comment on validity of assumption (1)? Can we get ANY HARD DATA on assumption (2)? Anyone lurking who works for a major distro? Bottom line: it probably is not worth arguing too much about the perfect place for this functionality. What really matters is that it happens. -- John Williams Research Analyst Department of Marketing, Otago University http://www.commerce.otago.ac.nz/marketing/staff/williamsj.html ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Modifying GNOME-About to count users
On Wed, 2005-07-06 at 16:48 -0400, Luis Villa wrote: Join Friends of GNOME and celebrate easy to use software for $OS! (email form) What question are we asking? :-) I *think* we're asking 'how many users of GNOME are there', not 'how many discovered gnome-about in their panel and then decided to fill out a form for an organization they know nothing about'. That is so true. However I believe there is no harm in pursuing both options right now. Imperfect numbers (that catch a less-than-100-percent proportion of GNOME users) have the redeeming feature of establishing a lower bound on the count, which is better than nothing. Whose toes would we be stepping on if we pushed this Friends of GNOME thing? I can not see any objection to it other than it is not ideal for counting GNOME users. So, if I can help in any way (I have (X)HTML/CSS skills and (ver) modest shell/perl/C/C++/java skills) please let me know. ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Modifying GNOME-About to count users
On Tue, 2005-07-05 at 16:49 -0700, Rob Adams wrote: If it's off by default we may as well not bother to include it, since it will be utterly useless in counting measures. We'd just as well have a web poll to track market share. Well, I'm not so sure. (But I take your point seriously.) The thinking is that GNOME users look at the about-gnome box at least once. If the option of enabling this function was presented right, a large proportion of users _may_ enable it. We have no real way of knowing how large a proportion at this stage, but we can do research in the future to determine this. We can avoid accusations of privacy violations through the very transparency under which we develop everything: The source code for the client and the server. I happen to agree with you, but I think many others would not. The question that remains to answer is: Are the statistics sufficiently valuable as to be useful? Yes, yes yes! I could not agree more. We have been agonising over this for some time. If you want to help, please visit http://live.gnome.org/CountingUsers read it, think about it then add your thoughts for doing things better. What do we compare them to to determine market share? The total number of computer users in the world. Publicly available information. If its just so we can have a counter on the home page, probably not worth it. To some people no, to others yes. I could be quite inspirational to some people to see that number increasing. Please read the wiki to find the rationale for all this. Then, I for one would really like to hear how we can improve the proposals we have considered so far. cheers, John http://live.gnome.org/JohnWilliams ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Modifying GNOME-About to count users
On Tue, 2005-07-05 at 20:33 -0400, Robert Love wrote: It is exactly the latter that we want to avoid, by making this toggle button off by default (as explained on the wiki page). The latter. It is slashdot. I don't think it matters if it is off by default and requires the spleen of a golden cheetah to enable it, the spin will be on in full force. Hmmm. Good point. Can you offer a better solution for the problems discussed on http://live.gnome.org/CountingUsers ? (I'm not trying to troll here. I know the currently proposed solution is not ideal, but I'm buggered if I can think of anything better. I would like people smarter than myself to help!) ciao, John ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Modifying GNOME-About to count users
On Wed, 2005-07-06 at 00:16 -0300, Steven Garrity wrote: This is especially true since we sure aren't going to be able to write any code that tells us how many *total* computers there are in the world - another key variable in determining market share. It's about counting users, not computers. That information is publicly available. Let's leave the market stats (both Gnome's and totals) to firms that specialize in it. Rough estimates are the best we'll ever be able to do on this anyhow. OK, how are we going to pay them to do it for us? If you can tell me in January of 2010 that we have somewhere between 8% and 12% of global desktops, but we can't be sure exactly how many, we should be too busy celebrating to worry about the exact numbers. How would we know this? ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Modifying GNOME-About to count users (OT)
On Wed, 2005-07-06 at 13:28 +1000, Jeff Waugh wrote: what if there was a level of the Friends of GNOME programme that did not require a donation? It would be like a users arm of the GNOME Foundation (non-voting). The gnome-about form could point to a join Friends of GNOME web page... I'm going to play with this idea a bit... on marketing-list (getting off-topic here). :-) Yes, most of the discussion has really belonged in the marketing list anyhow. If you have a strong opinion (devil's advocates are useful) please join the list and/or start hanging out in #marketing. ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Modifying GNOME-About to count users
Hello all We in the GNOME Marketing team (http://live.gnome.org/MarketingTeam) have been discussing ways to estimate the number of GNOME users worldwide. A summary of our discussions can be found at http://live.gnome.org/CountingUsers. Essentially we propose modifying the GNOME About box to include a toggle that indicate the user's permission to activate a program that would periodically contact a central GNOME server. Information that would be transmitted and recorded has not been decided yet, but the prime requirement is to record the number of current GNOME users (not installations) on a (say) monthly basis. Gathering further information, such as country, GNOME version, distribution, etc. is currently being mooted. Feel free to record your thoughts on the wiki. I am sending this message to this list on the advice of Vincent Untz. If anyone can suggest others who should be contacted, please let me know. cheers, John http://live.gnome.org/JohnWilliams ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
Re: Product specific guidelines for triaging bugs
On Wed, 2005-06-22 at 18:56 +0100, Bastien Nocera wrote: On Wed, 2005-06-22 at 00:46 +0200, Vincent Untz wrote: Hi, The Bugsquad uses a list of guidelines for triaging bugs. This is a good way for maintainers to tell the bugsquad people how they would like to see the bugs for their module triaged. Evolution and related modules seem to be missing from this list. Is there anyone willing to take on this task? -- John Williams Research Analyst Department of Marketing, Otago University http://www.commerce.otago.ac.nz/marketing/staff/williamsj.html ___ desktop-devel-list mailing list desktop-devel-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop-devel-list
