Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Sylvain Wallez wrote:
Don't want to rain on the party, but this is *summer* of code, meaning 2
months of work[2]. Expecting students to implement difficult things
(e.g. continuations serialization)
After skim reading the project proposals of other Apache projects and the other
OS projects I disagree that the level of continuations serialization and the
attribute based template engine is too high. 2 months of work means (at least in
Austria) 640 hours work time which is a lot. Of course, if you have to learn
Java first, the time won't be enough. And don't forget, IIRC it was a student
who founded our beloved Cocoon ;-)
From my personal experience over the last years I'm sure that there are many
clever students out there who are definitly able to implement the difficult
topics like Rhino scope and continuations serialization but they haven't had the
itch to scratch. $4500 could change their minds ;-).
And not to forget, continuation serialization in particular, is probably more a
Rhino topic than Cocoon topic. If the students get the serialization of Rhino
scopes and continuations working, we can tackle *together* the very
Cocoon-specific topics like Avalon components and the service manager.
In the worst case nobody will apply for the topic which would mean that sooner
or later we will have to do it ourselves ;-)
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Le 3 juin 05, à 08:26, Reinhard Poetz a écrit : ...From my personal experience over the last years I'm sure that there are many clever students out there who are definitly able to implement the difficult topics like Rhino scope and continuations serialization but they haven't had the itch to scratch. $4500 could change their minds ;-)... Agreed, and by selecting 200 students out of all those who apply (I guess there will be much more than 200 applications) means only the best ones will be selected. But the burden will be on us to evaluate whether the applying student has what it takes - like we'd do for an internship I guess. -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
On Thu, Jun 02, 2005 at 02:08:13PM +0200, Reinhard Poetz wrote: Leszek Gawron wrote: 1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. 2. cforms reusable widget repository... yes, I like both ideas! Who wants to mentor the projects? Tim, Leszek? While I would like to, I will not have enough time to be an offical mentor, due to buying a house and moving into it during this same timespan. However, I will gladly help unoffically with whatever time I end up having. About the reusable widget repository...there is already working code in whiteboard/forms, just needs to be reviewed to see what changes we may want and then updated to sync with svn trunk head. --Tim Larson
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
On Fri, Jun 03, 2005 at 02:28:36PM +0100, Tim Larson wrote: About the reusable widget repository...there is already working code in whiteboard/forms, just needs to be reviewed to see what changes we may want and then updated to sync with svn trunk head. I take part of that back...there is a good bit that still could be designed and coded with regard to extension and parameterization. --Tim Larson
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
Cocoonistas,
You might have noticed yesterday's announcement at
http://code.google.com/ about the Summer of Code initiative,
http://code.google.com/summerofcode.html
We should have more detailed info for the ASF communities in the next
few days (we're still ironing out the details about project sandboxes,
CLAs etc.), but as the initiative is public already, project
propositions are welcome at
http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005.
Each project needs to have at least one mentor (who must be a committer
AFAIK, but various models might be possible) to happen, so that students
are not lost in the dark.
I have entered a project at
http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc, and I'm
looking for at least one co-mentor, as I'll be partially offline in July
and August. If someone's available for this, please let me know.
Are we allowed to offer another project? I would like to propose
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=33324
(http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/FlowscriptAndSessionReplication).
I volunteer as mentor and as Betrand I'm looking for a co-mentor as I will be
offline for two or three weeks.
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
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Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Le 2 juin 05, à 11:56, Reinhard Poetz a écrit : ...Are we allowed to offer another project? I would like to propose http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=33324 (http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/FlowscriptAndSessionReplication)... Sure, there's no problem in having several Cocoon-related projects! -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
Le 2 juin 05, à 11:56, Reinhard Poetz a écrit :
...Are we allowed to offer another project? I would like to propose
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=33324
(http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/FlowscriptAndSessionReplication)...
Sure, there's no problem in having several Cocoon-related projects!
Fine! Any volonteers for the role of the second mentor?
---
One question to the role of the mentor: AFAIU it's about guiding him but I won't
be able to answer all questions in detail - if I could I would have done it
myself ;-)
Am I right here?
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Le 2 juin 05, à 12:22, Reinhard Poetz a écrit : ...One question to the role of the mentor: AFAIU it's about guiding him but I won't be able to answer all questions in detail - if I could I would have done it myself ;-).. That's how I understand it: the mentor is the contact person, can help about where to find the answers but does not necessarily know them. See also http://code.google.com/mentfaq.html under What is the role of a mentoring organization?. IMO all this will be the mentor's responsibility for the mentored projects. -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote: Bertrand Delacretaz wrote: Le 2 juin 05, à 11:56, Reinhard Poetz a écrit : ...Are we allowed to offer another project? I would like to propose http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=33324 (http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/FlowscriptAndSessionReplication)... Sure, there's no problem in having several Cocoon-related projects! Fine! Any volonteers for the role of the second mentor? --- One question to the role of the mentor: AFAIU it's about guiding him but I won't be able to answer all questions in detail - if I could I would have done it myself ;-) Am I right here? The way I see it is that the design discussion should occur through the normal develpoment channels, so the idea is they do some background work and come back to the community with a proposal or RT, once the design is complete they have to implement it. Again, problems are solved through the normal community channels. Ross
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Ross Gardler wrote:
Reinhard Poetz wrote:
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
Le 2 juin 05, à 11:56, Reinhard Poetz a écrit :
...Are we allowed to offer another project? I would like to propose
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=33324
(http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon/FlowscriptAndSessionReplication)...
Sure, there's no problem in having several Cocoon-related projects!
Fine! Any volonteers for the role of the second mentor?
---
One question to the role of the mentor: AFAIU it's about guiding him
but I won't be able to answer all questions in detail - if I could I
would have done it myself ;-)
Am I right here?
The way I see it is that the design discussion should occur through the
normal develpoment channels, so the idea is they do some background work
and come back to the community with a proposal or RT, once the design is
complete they have to implement it. Again, problems are solved through
the normal community channels.
Bertrand and Ross, thanks for your answers. Find the project description at
http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-flowscript-serialization.
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote:
http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc
http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-flowscript-serialization.
Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)?
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
RE: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? An effort to substancially reduce the number of open issues in bugzilla? Bye, Helma
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote: Reinhard Poetz wrote: http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-flowscript-serialization. Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? I posted the answer under wrong subthread: 1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. 2. cforms reusable widget repository... -- Leszek Gawron [EMAIL PROTECTED] IT Manager MobileBox sp. z o.o. +48 (61) 855 06 67 http://www.mobilebox.pl mobile: +48 (501) 720 812 fax: +48 (61) 853 29 65
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Linden H van der (MI) wrote:
Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms
features, etc.)?
An effort to substancially reduce the number of open issues in bugzilla?
I have thought about something similar too but it is difficult to set it up as
single project with a clearly defined project goal.
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Linden H van der (MI) wrote: Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? An effort to substancially reduce the number of open issues in bugzilla? we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. -- Leszek Gawron [EMAIL PROTECTED] IT Manager MobileBox sp. z o.o. +48 (61) 855 06 67 http://www.mobilebox.pl mobile: +48 (501) 720 812 fax: +48 (61) 853 29 65
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Leszek Gawron wrote:
1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template
language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till
the end of summer.
2. cforms reusable widget repository...
yes, I like both ideas! Who wants to mentor the projects? Tim, Leszek?
--
Reinhard Pötz Independent Consultant, Trainer (IT)-Coach
{Software Engineering, Open Source, Web Applications, Apache Cocoon}
web(log): http://www.poetz.cc
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote: Reinhard Poetz wrote: http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-flowscript-serialization. Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? Web service integration. It is a common user requirement and we have a number of implementations with various properties and also some variants within Cocoon. But we have nothing coherent yet. Also the Axis 2.0 architecture seem quite interesting. I'm interested enough to do some mentoring in the area but not enough to implement anything in the near future. /Daniel
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote: Leszek Gawron wrote: 1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. 2. cforms reusable widget repository... yes, I like both ideas! Who wants to mentor the projects? Tim, Leszek? I can at least be a co-mentor for the attribute driven templates. /Daniel
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Le 2 juin 05, à 13:51, Reinhard Poetz a écrit : ...Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? People with ideas are welcome to write them up at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005, even if no mentor is available yet. In that case, putting dev@cocoon.apache.org as the contact address and a note like we're still looking for a mentor would be ok. If some of us are thinking of mentoring one project but not more, it might help in doing a dynamic allocation of mentors to projects which actually happen. -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Reinhard Poetz wrote: Leszek Gawron wrote: 1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. 2. cforms reusable widget repository... yes, I like both ideas! Who wants to mentor the projects? Tim, Leszek? I propose that me and Daniel (as he already agreed in other post) co-mentor template project and Tim does the cforms (if he wants to of course). I would surely love to contribute in both areas. -- Leszek Gawron [EMAIL PROTECTED] IT Manager MobileBox sp. z o.o. +48 (61) 855 06 67 http://www.mobilebox.pl mobile: +48 (501) 720 812 fax: +48 (61) 853 29 65
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Linden H van der (MI) wrote: Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? An effort to substancially reduce the number of open issues in bugzilla? Unfortunately, the bugs in bugzilla are likely to require a level of knowledge of Cocoon that we are unlikely to meet in any of our students, which is a shame :-( We really need to think of interesting projects that they are likely to be attracted to, and that form clearly defined and measurable projects. Regards, Upayavira
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Linden H van der (MI) wrote: An effort to substancially reduce the number of open issues in bugzilla? IMO this would be more something for a FirstFriday if these are still happening. Jorg
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Leszek Gawron wrote: Reinhard Poetz wrote: Leszek Gawron wrote: 1. we still have not touched the subject of attribute driven template language. it would nicely suit as a project that could be finished till the end of summer. 2. cforms reusable widget repository... yes, I like both ideas! Who wants to mentor the projects? Tim, Leszek? I propose that me and Daniel (as he already agreed in other post) co-mentor template project and Tim does the cforms (if he wants to of course). I would surely love to contribute in both areas. Wrote a proposal for ATL: http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-atl Leszek, add your email and update the description if you want to change or add anything. /Daniel
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Sylvain Wallez wrote: Ralph Goers wrote: Reinhard Poetz wrote: Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? What about some ajax stylings for cforms? Some I'd love to have are: - cocoon suggests ajax styling for cforms fields providing autocompletion of inputs, - reorderable repeaters [1] 1. Convert all poolable gnerators, and transformers to be thread safe. +1 2. Modify the build process to use maven. ... or rewrite the ant builds to use the library task and without generating the blocks build file with XSLT. Don't want to rain on the party, but this is *summer* of code, meaning 2 months of work[2]. Expecting students to implement difficult things (e.g. continuations serialization) or cleaning up the bugzilla, even all this is badly needed, seem too complicated to me for a student discovering our code base. So subjects that have a chance to be successful in terms of candidates and result are those that don't need to much in-depth knowledge of the core and have a clear functionnal scope. Agreed. However, before creating proposals it would also be nice to know that there is buy-in from the committers that a proposal should be made. I wouldn't want to propose something that other committers would object to. Sylvain [1] http://tool-man.org/examples/edit-in-place.html#listExamples [2] http://code.google.com/summfaq.html Ralph
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
On Jue, 2 de Junio de 2005, 16:50, Sylvain Wallez dijo: Ralph Goers wrote: Reinhard Poetz wrote: Do we have something else on our wishlists (some fancy cforms features, etc.)? What about some ajax stylings for cforms? Some I'd love to have are: - cocoon suggests ajax styling for cforms fields providing autocompletion of inputs, - reorderable repeaters [1] What about the XUL interface for cforms? I will like to add this project. First I want to know what you think about this 2 months task? http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=25295 Best Regards, Antonio Gallardo
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote: Cocoonistas, You might have noticed yesterday's announcement at http://code.google.com/ about the Summer of Code initiative, http://code.google.com/summerofcode.html We should have more detailed info for the ASF communities in the next few days (we're still ironing out the details about project sandboxes, CLAs etc.), but as the initiative is public already, project propositions are welcome at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005. Each project needs to have at least one mentor (who must be a committer AFAIK, but various models might be possible) to happen, so that students are not lost in the dark. I have entered a project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc, and I'm looking for at least one co-mentor, as I'll be partially offline in July and August. If someone's available for this, please let me know. Bertrand, I will be willing to be a second mentor on this, although we will have to compare dates in July as I will be away for a week around ApacheCon. Also, I'm not a committer here at Cocoon only at Forrest so I'm not sure howthat affects your comment must be a committer AFAIK, but various models might be possible I've also added a Forrest project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#forrest-voice Ross
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Hi Ross, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote: I have entered a project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc, and I'm looking for at least one co-mentor, as I'll be partially offline in July and August. If someone's available for this, please let me know. Bertrand, I will be willing to be a second mentor on this, although we will have to compare dates in July as I will be away for a week around ApacheCon. Great! I'll be mostly online during ApacheCon, so between us two we should be able to cover the whole period. I've added you as a second mentor. ...Also, I'm not a committer here at Cocoon only at Forrest so I'm not sure howthat affects your comment must be a committer AFAIK, but various models might be possible.. I don't think this will be a problem, and IIUC the plan is to have students work in dedicated sandboxes anyway. We'll sort it out in due time I think. ...I've also added a Forrest project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#forrest-voice.. Sounds good (or will sound good ;-) -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
I have entered a project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc An excellent proposal! I'll be around during that period and am keen to offer my 2p also. Mark
Re: Google Summer of Code - projects and mentors wanted
Le 1 juin 05, à 13:51, Mark Leicester a écrit : I have entered a project at http://wiki.apache.org/general/SummerOfCode2005#cocoon-refdoc An excellent proposal! I'll be around during that period and am keen to offer my 2p also. Thanks! Of course, all technical discussions about these projects will happen on the respective mailing lists, so you'll be more than welcome to give feedback and/or help the students. IIUC the role of the mentors is more a committment to the student (and to Google) that someone will be here to assist them and assess their work, but actual work is meant to happen right here, in collaboration with all community members as usual. The ASF still has to clarify how to allow the students to contribute their code easily, as they won't be given full commit access unless they're committers already, but we want them to get acquainted with the actual process that we're using. We might use SVN sandboxes or branches with different access rights, but this hasn't been formally decided yet. I think it's like having an intern work at your company: you want them to have the tools but not to use the really sharp ones on their own. -Bertrand smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
