Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Hi, Am 07.01.2013 22:53, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Joost Andrae wrote: If somebody has a problem with linked images within stored files then he/she can easily break these links by using /edit/links... Yes, this is the answer to the preservation hazard: just break links; and there are several macros and perhaps extensions around that just add a Break all links button to embed all images instead of linking to them. That said, I think it would be quite reasonable (if there are no UX problems or major development problems) to do the opposite in OpenOffice 4.0 and break links by default, since this happens to be the standard expectation many users have. For the record, the relevant issue is https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=37652 +1 but there should be a toggle to revert this behavior for those who know what they're doing... Kind regards, Joost
A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Well, looks like it is not so easy to say that is wrong. Tried this again, except instead of using Linux, using AOO 3.5 on Windows and IE for the browser. With writer it just craps out and you get nothing usable. But with draw, yes the image is linked not embedded and I am absolutely sure I did a copy (image) not copy (address). //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.comwrote: Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Well, looks like it is not so easy to say that is wrong. Tried this again, except instead of using Linux, using AOO 3.5 on Windows and IE for the browser. There is no AOO 3.5. What exactly are you running? It should be listed in the Help/About box. With writer it just craps out and you get nothing usable. But with draw, yes the image is linked not embedded and I am absolutely sure I did a copy (image) not copy (address). //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.comwrote: Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Frick - daily builds and yes it says 3.5 and yes I know that is really going to release as 4.0. On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:10 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Well, looks like it is not so easy to say that is wrong. Tried this again, except instead of using Linux, using AOO 3.5 on Windows and IE for the browser. There is no AOO 3.5. What exactly are you running? It should be listed in the Help/About box. With writer it just craps out and you get nothing usable. But with draw, yes the image is linked not embedded and I am absolutely sure I did a copy (image) not copy (address). //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:19 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Frick - daily builds and yes it says 3.5 and yes I know that is really going to release as 4.0. OK. So generally speaking, when attempting to verify behavior that a user sees, I wouldn't say that the issue does not exist on the basis of testing done with unreleased code. Certainly Gary was using a released version of OpenOffice. It is possible that it worked one way in OOo 3.3.0 or AOO 3.4.x, and now works differently. -Rob On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:10 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Well, looks like it is not so easy to say that is wrong. Tried this again, except instead of using Linux, using AOO 3.5 on Windows and IE for the browser. There is no AOO 3.5. What exactly are you running? It should be listed in the Help/About box. With writer it just craps out and you get nothing usable. But with draw, yes the image is linked not embedded and I am absolutely sure I did a copy (image) not copy (address). //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Alright Rob. back to the issue - it appears to be platform specific. Checking again, w/ AOO (daily), under windows and using Chrome there is one difference. Copy/Paste to a writer document works - and it is linked, unless you select copy special and then select bitmap. Otherwise - I'll check the issue tracker about the win/ie/writer problem I ran into and if it is not noted yet ad a issue. Best wishes, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:25 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:19 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Frick - daily builds and yes it says 3.5 and yes I know that is really going to release as 4.0. OK. So generally speaking, when attempting to verify behavior that a user sees, I wouldn't say that the issue does not exist on the basis of testing done with unreleased code. Certainly Gary was using a released version of OpenOffice. It is possible that it worked one way in OOo 3.3.0 or AOO 3.4.x, and now works differently. -Rob On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:10 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Well, looks like it is not so easy to say that is wrong. Tried this again, except instead of using Linux, using AOO 3.5 on Windows and IE for the browser. There is no AOO 3.5. What exactly are you running? It should be listed in the Help/About box. With writer it just craps out and you get nothing usable. But with draw, yes the image is linked not embedded and I am absolutely sure I did a copy (image) not copy (address). //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Just read the article. The article does not sound correct, if memory serves, checked using AOO 3.5. Sure enough, copy an image from a web site and paste into a writer document, the document has an embedded image, as I thought. My guess is that the author did not copy the image, he copied the location - common mistake. As for AOO, hard to expect it not to do what the user told it to do. Finally, checking for external links - isn't there already an extension that does that, I know there was lots of talk about creating one ... didn't find it with a quick search however. Ciao, //drew On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/ ??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case. It might be worth having a web page, or a document, about best practices for creating documents in OpenOffice that are free of such external dependencies. Could probably also use the ODF Toolkit to scan documents to identify such issues in a document. Regards, -Rob
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
BTW - updated the windows vm to the latest snapshot build and the ie/writer problem went away ;) On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 12:07 PM, Joost Andrae joost.and...@gmx.de wrote: Hi, this is a great feature to be able to use linked images within documents eg. by dragging it from a browser into a document by using shift+ctrl. I answered this within the blog. If somebody has a problem with linked images within stored files then he/she can easily break these links by using /edit/links... Kind regards, Joost Am 07.01.2013 14:49, schrieb Rob Weir: Have you seen this: http://fileformats.wordpress.** com/2012/12/30/openoffice/http://fileformats.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/openoffice/??? (I'm cc'ing the author of that blog post, Gary McGrath) This is from the perspective of a person interested in long-term preservation/archiving of documents. This looks like a feature that is working as designed, although it does obscure the fact that the image is linked, not embedded in this case.
Re: A preservation hazard in OpenOffice
Joost Andrae wrote: If somebody has a problem with linked images within stored files then he/she can easily break these links by using /edit/links... Yes, this is the answer to the preservation hazard: just break links; and there are several macros and perhaps extensions around that just add a Break all links button to embed all images instead of linking to them. That said, I think it would be quite reasonable (if there are no UX problems or major development problems) to do the opposite in OpenOffice 4.0 and break links by default, since this happens to be the standard expectation many users have. For the record, the relevant issue is https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=37652 Regards, Andrea.
