Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
On 1/2/13 9:05 PM, Drew Jensen wrote: Howdy Jürgen, Hmm - well, I had understood it was ALv2 specifically so that it would be available to the project here. Hopefully when the developers make a drop of the code it will be something that the devs here will want to utilize it, wasn't really fair to ask anyone to comment on something they haven't seen yet. I hope so too, on the other hand it is paid development work and the question is what does it mean to make it available in both projects ;-) I think in the long run support for the format is worthwhile, to be honest if Google would actually support ODF in and out for wp,ss,pr I would not care so much. That is true but Google is looking what their customers need or want which of course is natural. And OOXML was pushed with a lot of money in the market and into a standard. I personally lose trust in standards a little bit after this sad story but many people don't care too much about it. The label ISO standard is enough and the technical details are not interesting. But that is reality and I have stopped to think too idealistic ;-) That means it is important to have a good OOXML support as well in the future to continue the game. Juergen Thanks Drew On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 12:26 PM, Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.comwrote: On 12/25/12 5:50 AM, Drew Jensen wrote: Thanks for that - I knew of that initiative. Does the project intend to integrate their work? sure, OOXML can't be ignored and we are interested in the work. I think it was the main intention to make the paid work available in both AOO and LibreOffice and that's the reason for the chosen license ALv2. Unfortunately we haven't seen any line of code (or any patch) so far but we are in contact with the OSBA and will be informed as soon as the patches are available. We as project are open for any kind of collaboration on this topic and we would like to avoid duplicate work. Especially the OOXML export is currently missing in AOO and volunteers who are interested on this topic are welcome. From my point of view it makes much more sense to combine the resources we have instead of competing. Did I mention that I am personally not interested in competing with a derivative product based on the same code base. I am simply interested to continue the success of OpenOffice under the well known brand and I am happy if all the improvements of AOO will find their way in LO as well (and they do) and if they are identified or marked in a proper way ;-) Juergen On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 8:54 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton orc...@apache.org wrote: The slides are here: http://www.slideshare.net/nice/apache-eurocon2012-matthiasstuermer It appears that some of the milestone results, as Apache-licensed tarballs, should already be in the hands of the Open Source Business Alliance. Those should be available to anyone. This is probably a good place to watch for them (auf Deutsch): http://www.osb-alliance.de/working-groups/office-interoperability/. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 16:16 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google) Hello; The ASF is a non-profit organization, we don't pay for coding but concerning docx support there was a talk from Matthias Stürmer in ApacheConEU: http://www.apachecon.eu/schedule/presentation/46/ This effort, of course, predates the establishment of AOO as a TLP so we were not consulted. It is a well intended initiative but despite the funding it appears to have produced no results for OpenOffice so far. We had a chance to talk with Matthias and while I won't make any comments, I would think the organizers will make their own evaluation and will likely consider the results before engaging in future investments of this kind. Pedro. Da: Andrew Pitonyak and...@pitonyak.org A: dev@openoffice.apache.org Inviato: Domenica 23 Dicembre 2012 14:46 Oggetto: Re: AOO questions on Google No save as for docx is why libre is installed on a few machines i sometimes deal with. Sent from my Samsung Epic™ 4G F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: Since there is some interest in this particular topic, here are the 9 questions I categorized as MS Interoperability with the number of positive votes appended to each in parentheses. 1. I tryed to save my word processor file as a MS Word file only extensions listed in the drop down were for text or Open Office, no Word option. Help function said I should have had that option in the drop down under save as. version 3.4.1. Could you add a converter for format MS .docx as the actual converter for .doc does not work proper. It mix up text and drawings and make the whole page a mess. (1) 2. hello, How can i open openoffice file with microsoft office? Gr Sam
Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
Hi, if you're interested into including the changes into AOO then all parties involved are listed here (incl. email addresses): http://www.digitale-nachhaltigkeit.ch/2012/07/suse-und-lanedo-setzen-ooxml-verbesserungen-in-libreofficeopenoffice-org-fur-behorden-um/ Am 03.01.2013 10:22, schrieb Jürgen Schmidt: On 1/2/13 9:05 PM, Drew Jensen wrote: Howdy Jürgen, Hmm - well, I had understood it was ALv2 specifically so that it would be available to the project here. Hopefully when the developers make a drop of the code it will be something that the devs here will want to utilize it, wasn't really fair to ask anyone to comment on something they haven't seen yet. I hope so too, on the other hand it is paid development work and the question is what does it mean to make it available in both projects ;-) Kind regards, Joost
Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
LOl - well, I wouldn't make too much of the paid development part, Jurgen, it is what you do also, paid developement work for this project. On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Joost Andrae joost.and...@gmx.de wrote: Hi, if you're interested into including the changes into AOO then all parties involved are listed here (incl. email addresses): http://www.digitale-**nachhaltigkeit.ch/2012/07/** suse-und-lanedo-setzen-ooxml-**verbesserungen-in-** libreofficeopenoffice-org-fur-**behorden-um/http://www.digitale-nachhaltigkeit.ch/2012/07/suse-und-lanedo-setzen-ooxml-verbesserungen-in-libreofficeopenoffice-org-fur-behorden-um/ Am 03.01.2013 10:22, schrieb Jürgen Schmidt: On 1/2/13 9:05 PM, Drew Jensen wrote: Howdy Jürgen, Hmm - well, I had understood it was ALv2 specifically so that it would be available to the project here. Hopefully when the developers make a drop of the code it will be something that the devs here will want to utilize it, wasn't really fair to ask anyone to comment on something they haven't seen yet. I hope so too, on the other hand it is paid development work and the question is what does it mean to make it available in both projects ;-) Kind regards, Joost
Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
Well, it is easier to get funding for such things if both projects get benefits. Depending on the organizers, if things only go to one side now it is likely that such funding will not be available in the future or that it will be reduced considerably and then everyone loses. Pedro. Da: Drew Jensen LOl - well, I wouldn't make too much of the paid development part, Jurgen, it is what you do also, paid developement work for this project. On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Joost Andrae joost.and...@gmx.de wrote: Hi, if you're interested into including the changes into AOO then all parties involved are listed here (incl. email addresses): http://www.digitale-**nachhaltigkeit.ch/2012/07/** suse-und-lanedo-setzen-ooxml-**verbesserungen-in-** libreofficeopenoffice-org-fur-**behorden-um/http://www.digitale-nachhaltigkeit.ch/2012/07/suse-und-lanedo-setzen-ooxml-verbesserungen-in-libreofficeopenoffice-org-fur-behorden-um/ Am 03.01.2013 10:22, schrieb Jürgen Schmidt: On 1/2/13 9:05 PM, Drew Jensen wrote: Howdy Jürgen, Hmm - well, I had understood it was ALv2 specifically so that it would be available to the project here. Hopefully when the developers make a drop of the code it will be something that the devs here will want to utilize it, wasn't really fair to ask anyone to comment on something they haven't seen yet. I hope so too, on the other hand it is paid development work and the question is what does it mean to make it available in both projects ;-) Kind regards, Joost
Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
Howdy Jürgen, Hmm - well, I had understood it was ALv2 specifically so that it would be available to the project here. Hopefully when the developers make a drop of the code it will be something that the devs here will want to utilize it, wasn't really fair to ask anyone to comment on something they haven't seen yet. I think in the long run support for the format is worthwhile, to be honest if Google would actually support ODF in and out for wp,ss,pr I would not care so much. Thanks Drew On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 12:26 PM, Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.comwrote: On 12/25/12 5:50 AM, Drew Jensen wrote: Thanks for that - I knew of that initiative. Does the project intend to integrate their work? sure, OOXML can't be ignored and we are interested in the work. I think it was the main intention to make the paid work available in both AOO and LibreOffice and that's the reason for the chosen license ALv2. Unfortunately we haven't seen any line of code (or any patch) so far but we are in contact with the OSBA and will be informed as soon as the patches are available. We as project are open for any kind of collaboration on this topic and we would like to avoid duplicate work. Especially the OOXML export is currently missing in AOO and volunteers who are interested on this topic are welcome. From my point of view it makes much more sense to combine the resources we have instead of competing. Did I mention that I am personally not interested in competing with a derivative product based on the same code base. I am simply interested to continue the success of OpenOffice under the well known brand and I am happy if all the improvements of AOO will find their way in LO as well (and they do) and if they are identified or marked in a proper way ;-) Juergen On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 8:54 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton orc...@apache.org wrote: The slides are here: http://www.slideshare.net/nice/apache-eurocon2012-matthiasstuermer It appears that some of the milestone results, as Apache-licensed tarballs, should already be in the hands of the Open Source Business Alliance. Those should be available to anyone. This is probably a good place to watch for them (auf Deutsch): http://www.osb-alliance.de/working-groups/office-interoperability/. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 16:16 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google) Hello; The ASF is a non-profit organization, we don't pay for coding but concerning docx support there was a talk from Matthias Stürmer in ApacheConEU: http://www.apachecon.eu/schedule/presentation/46/ This effort, of course, predates the establishment of AOO as a TLP so we were not consulted. It is a well intended initiative but despite the funding it appears to have produced no results for OpenOffice so far. We had a chance to talk with Matthias and while I won't make any comments, I would think the organizers will make their own evaluation and will likely consider the results before engaging in future investments of this kind. Pedro. Da: Andrew Pitonyak and...@pitonyak.org A: dev@openoffice.apache.org Inviato: Domenica 23 Dicembre 2012 14:46 Oggetto: Re: AOO questions on Google No save as for docx is why libre is installed on a few machines i sometimes deal with. Sent from my Samsung Epic™ 4G F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: Since there is some interest in this particular topic, here are the 9 questions I categorized as MS Interoperability with the number of positive votes appended to each in parentheses. 1. I tryed to save my word processor file as a MS Word file only extensions listed in the drop down were for text or Open Office, no Word option. Help function said I should have had that option in the drop down under save as. version 3.4.1. Could you add a converter for format MS .docx as the actual converter for .doc does not work proper. It mix up text and drawings and make the whole page a mess. (1) 2. hello, How can i open openoffice file with microsoft office? Gr Sam Esman (5) 3. What kind of OOXML support is intended in AOO? Transitional (MS Word) version or ISO (does someone really implement it?). (3) 4. If save filter is implemented, don't you fear a weakening of the ODF then? (6) 5. allow open office to use ms office defaults (5) 6. can i install openoffice when i have microsoft office on my computer (4) 7. OpenOffice, should be able to open properly all 'Word office' files. (9) 8. Is open office compatible with Office 2010? (8) 9. Open Office doesn't handle tables in Word well - for example re-sizing of columns, keeping table rows together, inserting page breaks within tables. Could
Re: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
Thanks for that - I knew of that initiative. Does the project intend to integrate their work? On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 8:54 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton orc...@apache.orgwrote: The slides are here: http://www.slideshare.net/nice/apache-eurocon2012-matthiasstuermer It appears that some of the milestone results, as Apache-licensed tarballs, should already be in the hands of the Open Source Business Alliance. Those should be available to anyone. This is probably a good place to watch for them (auf Deutsch): http://www.osb-alliance.de/working-groups/office-interoperability/. - Dennis -Original Message- From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 16:16 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google) Hello; The ASF is a non-profit organization, we don't pay for coding but concerning docx support there was a talk from Matthias Stürmer in ApacheConEU: http://www.apachecon.eu/schedule/presentation/46/ This effort, of course, predates the establishment of AOO as a TLP so we were not consulted. It is a well intended initiative but despite the funding it appears to have produced no results for OpenOffice so far. We had a chance to talk with Matthias and while I won't make any comments, I would think the organizers will make their own evaluation and will likely consider the results before engaging in future investments of this kind. Pedro. Da: Andrew Pitonyak and...@pitonyak.org A: dev@openoffice.apache.org Inviato: Domenica 23 Dicembre 2012 14:46 Oggetto: Re: AOO questions on Google No save as for docx is why libre is installed on a few machines i sometimes deal with. Sent from my Samsung Epic™ 4G F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: Since there is some interest in this particular topic, here are the 9 questions I categorized as MS Interoperability with the number of positive votes appended to each in parentheses. 1. I tryed to save my word processor file as a MS Word file only extensions listed in the drop down were for text or Open Office, no Word option. Help function said I should have had that option in the drop down under save as. version 3.4.1. Could you add a converter for format MS .docx as the actual converter for .doc does not work proper. It mix up text and drawings and make the whole page a mess. (1) 2. hello, How can i open openoffice file with microsoft office? Gr Sam Esman (5) 3. What kind of OOXML support is intended in AOO? Transitional (MS Word) version or ISO (does someone really implement it?). (3) 4. If save filter is implemented, don't you fear a weakening of the ODF then? (6) 5. allow open office to use ms office defaults (5) 6. can i install openoffice when i have microsoft office on my computer (4) 7. OpenOffice, should be able to open properly all 'Word office' files. (9) 8. Is open office compatible with Office 2010? (8) 9. Open Office doesn't handle tables in Word well - for example re-sizing of columns, keeping table rows together, inserting page breaks within tables. Could OO development include a goal of fully matching MS Office functionality for tables? (13) On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 9:28 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Long time since I said anything and so how about, Happy Holidays, to start. Just to say that the #2 doesn't surprise me at all and yes I would strongly suspect it has lots to do with OOXML. Don't forget that this does not necessarily mean interoperability with MSO it also means interchangeability with GDocs as best as I can tell. Thanks On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 11:22 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton orc...@apache.org wrote: Concerning Microsoft Office interoperability, I suspect the absence of a way to save documents in OOXML formats is a detractor from Apache OpenOffice 3.4. There are the usual interchange fidelity issues as well, depending on which interchangeable formats are used. - Dennis -Original Message- From: janI [mailto:j...@apache.org] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 02:37 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: AOO questions on Google Thanks for the summary ! Personally I asumed that LO would be #1, but I am amazed about #2 (MS Office interoperability and Other formats) I thought that was one of our very strong sides. I might be worthwhile to look a bit deeper into that, and see if the cause for the questions is in lack of features, lack of documentation or someelse, to give a clue of what to do ? Maybe we can do something with 4.0. Jan I. On 23 December 2012 04:00, F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: [ ... ] MS Office interoperability54 Non-English15 Other formats54 [ ... ]
User initiative for improving OOXML (was Re: AOO questions on Google)
Hello; The ASF is a non-profit organization, we don't pay for coding but concerning docx support there was a talk from Matthias Stürmer in ApacheConEU: http://www.apachecon.eu/schedule/presentation/46/ This effort, of course, predates the establishment of AOO as a TLP so we were not consulted. It is a well intended initiative but despite the funding it appears to have produced no results for OpenOffice so far. We had a chance to talk with Matthias and while I won't make any comments, I would think the organizers will make their own evaluation and will likely consider the results before engaging in future investments of this kind. Pedro. Da: Andrew Pitonyak and...@pitonyak.org A: dev@openoffice.apache.org Inviato: Domenica 23 Dicembre 2012 14:46 Oggetto: Re: AOO questions on Google No save as for docx is why libre is installed on a few machines i sometimes deal with. Sent from my Samsung Epic™ 4G F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: Since there is some interest in this particular topic, here are the 9 questions I categorized as MS Interoperability with the number of positive votes appended to each in parentheses. 1. I tryed to save my word processor file as a MS Word file only extensions listed in the drop down were for text or Open Office, no Word option. Help function said I should have had that option in the drop down under save as. version 3.4.1. Could you add a converter for format MS .docx as the actual converter for .doc does not work proper. It mix up text and drawings and make the whole page a mess. (1) 2. hello, How can i open openoffice file with microsoft office? Gr Sam Esman (5) 3. What kind of OOXML support is intended in AOO? Transitional (MS Word) version or ISO (does someone really implement it?). (3) 4. If save filter is implemented, don't you fear a weakening of the ODF then? (6) 5. allow open office to use ms office defaults (5) 6. can i install openoffice when i have microsoft office on my computer (4) 7. OpenOffice, should be able to open properly all 'Word office' files. (9) 8. Is open office compatible with Office 2010? (8) 9. Open Office doesn't handle tables in Word well - for example re-sizing of columns, keeping table rows together, inserting page breaks within tables. Could OO development include a goal of fully matching MS Office functionality for tables? (13) On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 9:28 AM, Drew Jensen drewjensen.in...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, Long time since I said anything and so how about, Happy Holidays, to start. Just to say that the #2 doesn't surprise me at all and yes I would strongly suspect it has lots to do with OOXML. Don't forget that this does not necessarily mean interoperability with MSO it also means interchangeability with GDocs as best as I can tell. Thanks On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 11:22 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton orc...@apache.org wrote: Concerning Microsoft Office interoperability, I suspect the absence of a way to save documents in OOXML formats is a detractor from Apache OpenOffice 3.4. There are the usual interchange fidelity issues as well, depending on which interchangeable formats are used. - Dennis -Original Message- From: janI [mailto:j...@apache.org] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 02:37 To: dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: AOO questions on Google Thanks for the summary ! Personally I asumed that LO would be #1, but I am amazed about #2 (MS Office interoperability and Other formats) I thought that was one of our very strong sides. I might be worthwhile to look a bit deeper into that, and see if the cause for the questions is in lack of features, lack of documentation or someelse, to give a clue of what to do ? Maybe we can do something with 4.0. Jan I. On 23 December 2012 04:00, F C. Costero fjcc.apa...@gmail.com wrote: [ ... ] MS Office interoperability 54 Non-English 15 Other formats 54 [ ... ]
