Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-25 Thread Matthias Seidel
Hi Pedro,

Am 25.02.20 um 13:10 schrieb Pedro Lino:
> Hi Matthias
>
> (Brian in BCC again)
>
>> On February 25, 2020 11:02 AM Matthias Seidel  
>> wrote:
>> Am 25.02.20 um 11:57 schrieb Pedro Lino:
>>> Not exactly. The exe file was needed because it self unpacked to a folder 
>>> containing a MSVC++ Runtime installer the OpenOffice installer and in some 
>>> cases even a Java Runtime installer and then would execute these installers 
>>> sequentially. Since AOO is no longer including runtimes, creating a 
>>> intermediate folder is really unnecessary.
>> We still include MSVC runtimes (both 32-bit and 64-bit are needed) and
>> MSVCR100.DLL.
> You are right, my bad! They are indeed contained in the redist folder. It has 
> been so long that I have seen the MSVC launched that I assumed that it is no 
> longer used.
Once these runtimes are installed you will not see them launched again.
And msvcr100.dll is copied silently.
>
> If Windows 10 does not include the needed MSVC libraries (can anyone 
> confirm?) then unfortunately AOO still needs the initial unpack folder 
> (although it could be unpacked to a temp folder and deleted after install, as 
> you mention in
> https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628#c2 )

Windows 10 does not have these runtimes included. But it remains to be
investigated if they can somehow be packed into an MSI?

> Since the temp folder is only needed for first install (all msi files are 
> backed up by Windows) would it be possible to change the default command to 
> POSTREMOVE=ON ?

I can have a look into it. In principle the setup.exe is launched by
NSIS, so the command should be somewhere to find.

Regards,

   Matthias

>
> Regards,
> Pedro
>
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-25 Thread Pedro Lino
Hi Matthias

(Brian in BCC again)

> On February 25, 2020 11:02 AM Matthias Seidel  
> wrote:

> Am 25.02.20 um 11:57 schrieb Pedro Lino:

> > Not exactly. The exe file was needed because it self unpacked to a folder 
> > containing a MSVC++ Runtime installer the OpenOffice installer and in some 
> > cases even a Java Runtime installer and then would execute these installers 
> > sequentially. Since AOO is no longer including runtimes, creating a 
> > intermediate folder is really unnecessary.
> 
> We still include MSVC runtimes (both 32-bit and 64-bit are needed) and
> MSVCR100.DLL.

You are right, my bad! They are indeed contained in the redist folder. It has 
been so long that I have seen the MSVC launched that I assumed that it is no 
longer used.

If Windows 10 does not include the needed MSVC libraries (can anyone confirm?) 
then unfortunately AOO still needs the initial unpack folder (although it could 
be unpacked to a temp folder and deleted after install, as you mention in
https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628#c2 )

Since the temp folder is only needed for first install (all msi files are 
backed up by Windows) would it be possible to change the default command to 
POSTREMOVE=ON ?

Regards,
Pedro

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-25 Thread Matthias Seidel
Hi Pedro,

Am 25.02.20 um 11:57 schrieb Pedro Lino:
> Hi Brian, all
>
> (Brian is included in BCC)
>
>> On February 24, 2020 4:56 AM Brian Barker 
>>  wrote:
>>
>>  
>> At 14:01 23/02/2020 +0100, Peter Kovacs wrote:
>>> To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could 
>>> not double-click msi files. But Microsoft had fixed this for quite 
>>> some time and there is no real reason to keep the exe packaging.
> Not exactly. The exe file was needed because it self unpacked to a folder 
> containing a MSVC++ Runtime installer the OpenOffice installer and in some 
> cases even a Java Runtime installer and then would execute these installers 
> sequentially. Since AOO is no longer including runtimes, creating a 
> intermediate folder is really unnecessary.

We still include MSVC runtimes (both 32-bit and 64-bit are needed) and
MSVCR100.DLL.

Regards,

   Matthias

>
>> I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the .msi file is a 
>> database, required just as much during removal of any product as 
>> during installation. My impression is that products such as Microsoft 
>> Office quietly salt away a copy of the .msi file (or as much as is 
>> needed) and Windows uses this when the product is removed. Failing 
>> that, Windows remembers where the .msi file was during installation 
>> and seeks it out, asking for it if necessary. And all this applies 
>> when removal is effected by installing a later version, doesn't it?
> That is correct. At installation time Windows (at least since Windows XP) 
> stores a copy of the installer in C:\Windows\Installer, renames the file to a 
> 6 or 7 character name (e.g. 2dfbe4.msi, possibly to simplify information 
> storage in the registry) and it is this file that is executed when you 
> uninstall a program. 
> Therefore keeping the installer on the desktop (or on the same folder where 
> it was installed from) is no longer needed. When updating the new installer 
> will look for the version number of the same product and will install if the 
> version is newer and remove the older version.
>
>> Now the user may have thought (or even been told) that, once the 
>> product is installed, the downloaded files are no longer needed and 
>> may have deleted them. This used to result in a steady stream of 
>> requests to the Users list, asking how the new version can be 
>> installed when the process stalls at this point. Indeed, as recently 
>> as ten days ago, a user trying to install a current version reported 
>> to the Users list "Every time I try I get a message to insert the 
>> Open Office.org 3.2 disk". He must have installed the older version 
>> from a CD - which he may well no longer have.
> I just read the thread. When the installer mentions Disk it just means that 
> it is looking for the installer file in the same drive/path where it was 
> installed from (originally this actually meant a CD or even a Floppy disk)
> Maybe this user who is sticking to 3.2 (the last Sun branded release from 
> back in 2010!) is still using Windows 98 or 95?
> Nevertheless in some cases (especially when using registry cleaners) the 
> reference to the installer is lost. I believe the only option is to reinstall 
> the broken version and uninstall before installing a new version
> https://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html
>
> Hope this helps
> Pedro
>
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-25 Thread Pedro Lino
Hi Brian, all

(Brian is included in BCC)

> On February 24, 2020 4:56 AM Brian Barker  
> wrote:
> 
>  
> At 14:01 23/02/2020 +0100, Peter Kovacs wrote:
> >
> >To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could 
> >not double-click msi files. But Microsoft had fixed this for quite 
> >some time and there is no real reason to keep the exe packaging.

Not exactly. The exe file was needed because it self unpacked to a folder 
containing a MSVC++ Runtime installer the OpenOffice installer and in some 
cases even a Java Runtime installer and then would execute these installers 
sequentially. Since AOO is no longer including runtimes, creating a 
intermediate folder is really unnecessary.

> I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the .msi file is a 
> database, required just as much during removal of any product as 
> during installation. My impression is that products such as Microsoft 
> Office quietly salt away a copy of the .msi file (or as much as is 
> needed) and Windows uses this when the product is removed. Failing 
> that, Windows remembers where the .msi file was during installation 
> and seeks it out, asking for it if necessary. And all this applies 
> when removal is effected by installing a later version, doesn't it?

That is correct. At installation time Windows (at least since Windows XP) 
stores a copy of the installer in C:\Windows\Installer, renames the file to a 6 
or 7 character name (e.g. 2dfbe4.msi, possibly to simplify information storage 
in the registry) and it is this file that is executed when you uninstall a 
program. 
Therefore keeping the installer on the desktop (or on the same folder where it 
was installed from) is no longer needed. When updating the new installer will 
look for the version number of the same product and will install if the version 
is newer and remove the older version.

> Now the user may have thought (or even been told) that, once the 
> product is installed, the downloaded files are no longer needed and 
> may have deleted them. This used to result in a steady stream of 
> requests to the Users list, asking how the new version can be 
> installed when the process stalls at this point. Indeed, as recently 
> as ten days ago, a user trying to install a current version reported 
> to the Users list "Every time I try I get a message to insert the 
> Open Office.org 3.2 disk". He must have installed the older version 
> from a CD - which he may well no longer have.

I just read the thread. When the installer mentions Disk it just means that it 
is looking for the installer file in the same drive/path where it was installed 
from (originally this actually meant a CD or even a Floppy disk)
Maybe this user who is sticking to 3.2 (the last Sun branded release from back 
in 2010!) is still using Windows 98 or 95?
Nevertheless in some cases (especially when using registry cleaners) the 
reference to the installer is lost. I believe the only option is to reinstall 
the broken version and uninstall before installing a new version
https://www.openoffice.org/download/archive.html

Hope this helps
Pedro

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Peter Kovacs

I thought from a usage perspective.

But if your concern is only from Admin side, well then lets go for it.

Can you send an invite to my apache address?


Am 24.02.20 um 18:55 schrieb Matthias Seidel:

Am 24.02.20 um 18:51 schrieb Peter Kovacs:

For me it does not make sense atm. But as soon as I have a working
building environment I volunteer.

I am not sure if people really know what we are talking about:

https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/INFRA/Using+the+Digicert+code+signing+service

All I am asking for is a second person that can access this service. No
need to have a building environment.


Need some time thought.


Am 24.02.20 um 18:34 schrieb Matthias Seidel:

Hi Andrea,

Am 24.02.20 um 18:26 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

Matthias Seidel wrote:

That said, I am the only one from our project with access to the Code
Signing Service (Jims account is still pending).
But I see that you have an inactive account. Would you still be
interested?

Honestly I'm not interested, as Windows is not definitely the platform
I am most familiar with.

OK, but we must remember that the project should never rely on a single
person. We should always have a "fallback".
Anyway, I asked several times now, nobody was interested...


My account was created back at the time because they were creating one
account per project and assigning it to the Chair (who happened to be
me at the time).

Yes, that's what I see...

Regards,

     Matthias


Regards,
    Andrea.

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Matthias Seidel
Am 24.02.20 um 18:51 schrieb Peter Kovacs:
> For me it does not make sense atm. But as soon as I have a working
> building environment I volunteer.

I am not sure if people really know what we are talking about:

https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/INFRA/Using+the+Digicert+code+signing+service

All I am asking for is a second person that can access this service. No
need to have a building environment.

>
> Need some time thought.
>
>
> Am 24.02.20 um 18:34 schrieb Matthias Seidel:
>> Hi Andrea,
>>
>> Am 24.02.20 um 18:26 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>> Matthias Seidel wrote:
 That said, I am the only one from our project with access to the Code
 Signing Service (Jims account is still pending).
 But I see that you have an inactive account. Would you still be
 interested?
>>> Honestly I'm not interested, as Windows is not definitely the platform
>>> I am most familiar with.
>> OK, but we must remember that the project should never rely on a single
>> person. We should always have a "fallback".
>> Anyway, I asked several times now, nobody was interested...
>>
>>> My account was created back at the time because they were creating one
>>> account per project and assigning it to the Chair (who happened to be
>>> me at the time).
>> Yes, that's what I see...
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>     Matthias
>>
>>> Regards,
>>>    Andrea.
>>>
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
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>>>
>
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Peter Kovacs
For me it does not make sense atm. But as soon as I have a working 
building environment I volunteer.


Need some time thought.


Am 24.02.20 um 18:34 schrieb Matthias Seidel:

Hi Andrea,

Am 24.02.20 um 18:26 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

Matthias Seidel wrote:

That said, I am the only one from our project with access to the Code
Signing Service (Jims account is still pending).
But I see that you have an inactive account. Would you still be
interested?

Honestly I'm not interested, as Windows is not definitely the platform
I am most familiar with.

OK, but we must remember that the project should never rely on a single
person. We should always have a "fallback".
Anyway, I asked several times now, nobody was interested...


My account was created back at the time because they were creating one
account per project and assigning it to the Chair (who happened to be
me at the time).

Yes, that's what I see...

Regards,

    Matthias


Regards,
   Andrea.

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Matthias Seidel
Hi Andrea,

Am 24.02.20 um 18:26 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> Matthias Seidel wrote:
>> That said, I am the only one from our project with access to the Code
>> Signing Service (Jims account is still pending).
>> But I see that you have an inactive account. Would you still be
>> interested?
>
> Honestly I'm not interested, as Windows is not definitely the platform
> I am most familiar with.

OK, but we must remember that the project should never rely on a single
person. We should always have a "fallback".
Anyway, I asked several times now, nobody was interested...

>
> My account was created back at the time because they were creating one
> account per project and assigning it to the Chair (who happened to be
> me at the time).

Yes, that's what I see...

Regards,

   Matthias

>
> Regards,
>   Andrea.
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>



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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Andrea Pescetti

Matthias Seidel wrote:

That said, I am the only one from our project with access to the Code
Signing Service (Jims account is still pending).
But I see that you have an inactive account. Would you still be interested?


Honestly I'm not interested, as Windows is not definitely the platform I 
am most familiar with.


My account was created back at the time because they were creating one 
account per project and assigning it to the Chair (who happened to be me 
at the time).


Regards,
  Andrea.

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-24 Thread Peter Kovacs
I m not an expert but maybe the installer on a bought OpenOffice 3.2 CD from 
3rd party distributors is the cause for this.

I think this is a different, unrelated issue towards the exe file or the 
translation.
I am not sure if we can tweak our installer to be able to handle these cases.


Am 24. Februar 2020 05:56:13 MEZ schrieb Brian Barker 
:
>At 14:01 23/02/2020 +0100, Peter Kovacs wrote:
>>We are discussing from time to time, that it might be worth to 
>>remove the packaging to the exe completely.
>>
>>To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could 
>>not doubleclick msi files. But Microsoft had fixed this for quite 
>>some time and there is no real reason to keep the exe packaging.
>>
>>So any objections?
>
>I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the .msi file is a 
>database, required just as much during removal of any product as 
>during installation. My impression is that products such as Microsoft 
>Office quietly salt away a copy of the .msi file (or as much as is 
>needed) and Windows uses this when the product is removed. Failing 
>that, Windows remembers where the .msi file was during installation 
>and seeks it out, asking for it if necessary. And all this applies 
>when removal is effected by installing a later version, doesn't it?
>
>Now the user may have thought (or even been told) that, once the 
>product is installed, the downloaded files are no longer needed and 
>may have deleted them. This used to result in a steady stream of 
>requests to the Users list, asking how the new version can be 
>installed when the process stalls at this point. Indeed, as recently 
>as ten days ago, a user trying to install a current version reported 
>to the Users list "Every time I try I get a message to insert the 
>Open Office.org 3.2 disk". He must have installed the older version 
>from a CD - which he may well no longer have.
>
>Will distributing .msi files result in the same problem to occur 
>again? Or is OpenOffice now prepared similarly to salt away the 
>necessary parts of the installation database? If not, what was (and 
>is) the cause of the problem, please?
>
>Brian Barker  
>
>
>-
>To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Brian Barker

At 14:01 23/02/2020 +0100, Peter Kovacs wrote:
We are discussing from time to time, that it might be worth to 
remove the packaging to the exe completely.


To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could 
not doubleclick msi files. But Microsoft had fixed this for quite 
some time and there is no real reason to keep the exe packaging.


So any objections?


I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the .msi file is a 
database, required just as much during removal of any product as 
during installation. My impression is that products such as Microsoft 
Office quietly salt away a copy of the .msi file (or as much as is 
needed) and Windows uses this when the product is removed. Failing 
that, Windows remembers where the .msi file was during installation 
and seeks it out, asking for it if necessary. And all this applies 
when removal is effected by installing a later version, doesn't it?


Now the user may have thought (or even been told) that, once the 
product is installed, the downloaded files are no longer needed and 
may have deleted them. This used to result in a steady stream of 
requests to the Users list, asking how the new version can be 
installed when the process stalls at this point. Indeed, as recently 
as ten days ago, a user trying to install a current version reported 
to the Users list "Every time I try I get a message to insert the 
Open Office.org 3.2 disk". He must have installed the older version 
from a CD - which he may well no longer have.


Will distributing .msi files result in the same problem to occur 
again? Or is OpenOffice now prepared similarly to salt away the 
necessary parts of the installation database? If not, what was (and 
is) the cause of the problem, please?


Brian Barker  



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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Pedro Lino
Hi Peter, all

> On February 23, 2020 1:01 PM Peter Kovacs  wrote:
> 
>  
> We are discussing from time to time, that it might be worth to remove the 
> packaging to the exe completely.
> 
> To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could not 
> doubleclick msi files.
> But Microsoft had fixed this for quite some time and there is no real reason 
> to keep the exe packaging.
> 
> So any objections?

None at all!

This would solve the confusing message on the installer, the messy temporary 
folder on desktop and the msi files are more secure than exe files, plus it 
would require signing only one less binary per language (as Andrea mentioned)

If voting is needed, +1

Kind regards,
Pedro

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Andrea Pescetti

Peter Kovacs wrote:

To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could not 
doubleclick msi files.
But Microsoft had fixed this for quite some time and there is no real reason to 
keep the exe packaging.
So any objections?


No objections at all on my side, provided we continue to offer the same 
user experience to Windows users who start the installation.


As discussed at FOSDEM, this has the additional advantage that, if one 
wants to sign binaries and installation files, there is one less file to 
sign.


Of course, as usual someone has to do the work and time is scarce...

Regards,
  Andrea.

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Peter Kovacs
We are discussing from time to time, that it might be worth to remove the 
packaging to the exe completely.

To my knowledge in the past we did create an exe because you could not 
doubleclick msi files.
But Microsoft had fixed this for quite some time and there is no real reason to 
keep the exe packaging.

So any objections?

All the best
Peter

Am 23. Februar 2020 12:55:10 MEZ schrieb Pedro Lino :
>Hi Matthias
>
>Thank you for the fast answer!
>
>> See:
>> https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628
>> 
>> I am pretty sure I wrote with you about that longer ago...
>
>I'm well aware of that bug. I commented on it in 2018...
>Ideally this should be fixed first but since I'm not a developer, I can
>only help with what I can do.
>
>> What you probably see in the first part of the installation are now
>> strings from NSIS.
>
>There are mistakes/inconsistencies also in the AOO specific texts.
>
>> Of course you can try to correct this at the NSIS project. [1]
>
>I downloaded the source and yes, there is plenty of translation work
>there too...
> 
>> But normally you should not see them at all, because they are
>replaced
>> with the strings from Pootle.
>
>Can we mark that bug as a blocker for 4.2? Does anyone currently
>working on AOO have the time/skills to fix this?
>
>> I would rather vote for fixing this old bug! ;-)
>
>+1
>
>Kind regards,
>Pedro
>
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Matthias Seidel
Hi Pedro,

Am 23.02.20 um 12:55 schrieb Pedro Lino:
> Hi Matthias
>
> Thank you for the fast answer!
>
>> See:
>> https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628
>>
>> I am pretty sure I wrote with you about that longer ago...
> I'm well aware of that bug. I commented on it in 2018...
> Ideally this should be fixed first but since I'm not a developer, I can only 
> help with what I can do.

I am also no developer ;-)

But I tried to look into it and if I could do it it would have been
fixed long ago.

>
>> What you probably see in the first part of the installation are now
>> strings from NSIS.
> There are mistakes/inconsistencies also in the AOO specific texts.

Then fix it in Pootle?

All texts should be there. If not, please point me to the missing parts.

>
>> Of course you can try to correct this at the NSIS project. [1]
> I downloaded the source and yes, there is plenty of translation work there 
> too...
>  
>> But normally you should not see them at all, because they are replaced
>> with the strings from Pootle.
> Can we mark that bug as a blocker for 4.2? Does anyone currently working on 
> AOO have the time/skills to fix this?

Everyone can ask for release blocker flag in Bugzilla.

But this is no serious bug and we obviously have no developer to fix it.

>
>> I would rather vote for fixing this old bug! ;-)
> +1

Why don't you put your vote in Bugzilla? ;-)

Regards,

   Matthias

>
> Kind regards,
> Pedro
>
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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-23 Thread Pedro Lino
Hi Matthias

Thank you for the fast answer!

> See:
> https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628
> 
> I am pretty sure I wrote with you about that longer ago...

I'm well aware of that bug. I commented on it in 2018...
Ideally this should be fixed first but since I'm not a developer, I can only 
help with what I can do.

> What you probably see in the first part of the installation are now
> strings from NSIS.

There are mistakes/inconsistencies also in the AOO specific texts.

> Of course you can try to correct this at the NSIS project. [1]

I downloaded the source and yes, there is plenty of translation work there 
too...
 
> But normally you should not see them at all, because they are replaced
> with the strings from Pootle.

Can we mark that bug as a blocker for 4.2? Does anyone currently working on AOO 
have the time/skills to fix this?

> I would rather vote for fixing this old bug! ;-)

+1

Kind regards,
Pedro

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Re: Windows Installer translation

2020-02-22 Thread Matthias Seidel
Hi Pedro,

Am 22.02.20 um 21:48 schrieb Pedro Lino:
> Hi all
>
> After running the latest AOO 4.2 Windows installer in  Portuguese, compiled 
> by Matthias, we (Pedro Albuquerque and myself) noticed some inconsistencies 
> and typos in the messages.

See:

https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127628

I am pretty sure I wrote with you about that longer ago...

What you probably see in the first part of the installation are now
strings from NSIS.
Of course you can try to correct this at the NSIS project. [1]

But normally you should not see them at all, because they are replaced
with the strings from Pootle.

I would rather vote for fixing this old bug! ;-)

Regards,

   Matthias

[1] https://nsis.sourceforge.io/Main_Page

>
> Would it be possible to have this translation process included in Pootle?
>
> If not, is there another link/site/tool that we can use to fix this?
>
> Kind regards,
> Pedro
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
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Windows Installer translation

2020-02-22 Thread Pedro Lino
Hi all

After running the latest AOO 4.2 Windows installer in  Portuguese, compiled by 
Matthias, we (Pedro Albuquerque and myself) noticed some inconsistencies and 
typos in the messages.

Would it be possible to have this translation process included in Pootle?

If not, is there another link/site/tool that we can use to fix this?

Kind regards,
Pedro

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