Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-22 Thread Paweł Paprota
Andy, And what I can tell you is that people in OSM (I mean admins here) are very supportive and open to changes. I'm glad to hear that! Many people say they have a different experience, but we try to be helpful. Well, I don't know about other people, but I got everything I needed (and

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Florian Lohoff
On Mon, May 20, 2013 at 09:32:30PM -0400, Jason Remillard wrote: Hi, schema). This would allow the site to scale more incrementally, and potentially scale to larger loads than putting all of our eggs into two monster servers. For the money we planning on spending on the big server, we could

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Andy Allan
On 21 May 2013 02:32, Jason Remillard remillard.ja...@gmail.com wrote: The server that we are planning on purchasing is monster. Very complicated and expensive. I am concerned that this might not be the best way to go. Indeed, it might not be the best way to go, and any thoughts and

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Serge Wroclawski
Jason, You're not at all wrong about the issues with the server design. This is something that's been well known and understood for several years: As the project grows, the cost of scaling on a single system will not scale accordingly. What I mean by that is, that it's not a linerar cost to

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Richard Fairhurst
Serge Wroclawski wrote: So why doesn't this happen? Frankly, because I think the project doesn't have anyone who can act in the kind of technical leadership role this would require. Define can. The project has plenty of people capable of doing this. But IME the main barrier between capable

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 05/21/13 16:08, Serge Wroclawski wrote: So why doesn't this happen? Frankly, because I think the project doesn't have anyone who can act in the kind of technical leadership role this would require. Knee-jerk call for authority? Never worked well. It's not something anyone can do,

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Simon Poole
I normally stay out of the tech bike-shedding discussions, however I do want to point out - we are aeons away from requiring and running cutting/bleeding edge hardware (and having to pay for such) - in the grand scheme of things we are not spending a lot of money on hardware (on the one hand

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Ian Dees
Can someone add more information about when and how the OWG meets? The wiki page is pretty bare on how one might help: http://www.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Operations_Working_Group On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 10:07 AM, Simon Poole si...@poole.ch wrote: I normally stay out of the tech bike-shedding

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Paweł Paprota
On 05/21/2013 04:08 PM, Serge Wroclawski wrote: This is why the org needs a structural change, to give someone the authority and resources to oversee projects like this. Without this, the OWG is stuck ordering more hardware. Reluctant +1 from me though I am sure this is not a popular view (we

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Andy Allan
On 21 May 2013 18:50, Paweł Paprota ppa...@fastmail.fm wrote: And what I can tell you is that people in OSM (I mean admins here) are very supportive and open to changes. I'm glad to hear that! Many people say they have a different experience, but we try to be helpful. Sadly, I simply don't

Re: [OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-21 Thread Jason Remillard
Hi Andy, Thank you for the detailed reply. I have no issues with how the money is being handled, nor spending this kind of money on hardware. OSM growth is pretty amazing right now. Over the lifetime of this server we should be planning for at least 15x/20x more traffic. If this server can

[OSM-dev] New database server

2013-05-20 Thread Jason Remillard
Hi, I could not find a discussion on the new database server. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/New_server_and_fund_raising_drive_2013 The server that we are planning on purchasing is monster. Very complicated and expensive. I am concerned that this might not be the best way to go. We have a