Re: Proposed policy change: reusability of tests by other browsers

2012-11-12 Thread Aryeh Gregor
On Sun, Nov 11, 2012 at 4:21 PM, Neil n...@parkwaycc.co.uk wrote: Why not simply verify that the list of actual fails equals the list of expected fails, and report items that are only in one of the two lists? That would be a bit more robust, yes, and it should be doable without much work. It

Re: Proposal: Not shipping prefixed APIs on the release channel

2012-11-12 Thread Henri Sivonen
On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 7:38 PM, Neil n...@parkwaycc.co.uk wrote: Is there any way we can make it so that the prefixed version doesn't work unless you attempt (and presumably fail) to detect the unprefixed version? What purpose would the prefix serve in such a scenario? -- Henri Sivonen

Re: Proposal: Not shipping prefixed APIs on the release channel

2012-11-12 Thread Henri Sivonen
On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 10:32 PM, Ehsan Akhgari ehsan.akhg...@gmail.com wrote: Sort of. Well, from time to time we add a new DOM API which breaks a website because they expect that name to be available as an expando property or something. Prefixing doesn't fix this problem. It only defers it,

Re: Proposed style guide modification: using declarations and nested namespaces

2012-11-12 Thread Zack Weinberg
On 2012-11-10 12:58 AM, Robert O'Callahan wrote: What exactly is the benefit here? As far as I know, using namespace A; using namespace B; where both A and B define Foo doesn't actually cause a compile error unless/until the code actually references Foo. The scenario I'm concerned with is

UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Gervase Markham
Hi everyone, Can we quickly revisit the question of whether to have one of Touch or Tablet in our UA string under some circumstances? We need to work out how Windows 8 Metro fits into our plans (bug 787786), plus the new pile of touch-enabled laptops and desktops that I see in the glossy ads

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Dirkjan Ochtman
On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 4:51 PM, Gervase Markham g...@mozilla.org wrote: Can we quickly revisit the question of whether to have one of Touch or Tablet in our UA string under some circumstances? We need to work out how Windows 8 Metro fits into our plans (bug 787786), plus the new pile of

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Gervase Markham
On 12/11/12 16:07, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: A) Use Touch to indicate has a touch-sensitive screen (and is not already marked 'Mobile'). This would lead to us using it on tablets, Windows 8 machines, and any other desktop PC with a touchscreen. It would not be removed if a keyboard was _also_

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread jim . mathies
I don’t see how this information will be of any use in deciding how to present content, and will likely be used in the wrong way which will break user experiences. We have a related situation with W3C touch event interfaces. Web authors are using their presence as a way to detect mobile

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Marcio Galli
Touch++, again. Same points I said in September. Gerv, do you have an online place that captures the discussion? The reason I ask this is my interest to really understand what is the current assumption nowadays on what UA stands for and the complexities involved in this discussion. Plus I wanted

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Kevin Brosnan
On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 8:12 AM, Gervase Markham g...@mozilla.org wrote: On 12/11/12 16:07, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: D) Use neither, like Chrome. UA sniffing is evil. Developers should use the presence of a touch API to detect touch capability, and use flexible layout to adapt to whatever

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread wjohnston2000
As Jim mentioned, we've seen problems with our current browser because, when we turn on touch event interfaces in the browser (i.e. document.createTouchEvent), sites start to assume that this is a touch enabled browser and only a touch enabled browser. i.e. users using a mouse on a touch

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Matt Brubeck
Here is my personal suggestion for how we should handle this in our Metro browser, and the reasoning behind my proposal. This is meant to be a minimal step to bring Firefox for Metro in line with other platforms, without making changes to any other products. It might need to be tweaked if we

Re: Proposed style guide modification: using declarations and nested namespaces

2012-11-12 Thread Robert O'Callahan
On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 9:37 AM, Zack Weinberg za...@panix.com wrote: The scenario I'm concerned with is when a .cpp file does 'using namespace A;' and then goes on to define a bunch of its *own* symbols; later someone adds a symbol to namespace A, and gets an unexpected break possibly miles

Migrating mozilla-central builds to the Windows 8 SDK

2012-11-12 Thread jim . mathies
Hey all, Windows 8 metro browser work continues to progress. Within the next couple of months we would like to finish up the process of merging elm over to mozilla-central so we can turn the metro browser bits on in mc nightlies. However before we can do this we'll need to add the latest

Re: XULRunner on OS X, Why is not supported?

2012-11-12 Thread Simon Kornblith
On Nov 8, 3:46 pm, richardson.balca...@gmail.com wrote: I was just reading the effort of installing open web apps locally, I'm assuming the strategy shift that I'm talking about is that Mozilla is betting on Firefox as their application framework, that would make sense not to support

Re: Proposed style guide modification: using declarations and nested namespaces

2012-11-12 Thread Zack Weinberg
On 2012-11-12 1:44 PM, Robert O'Callahan wrote: On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 9:37 AM, Zack Weinberg za...@panix.com wrote: The scenario I'm concerned with is when a .cpp file does 'using namespace A;' and then goes on to define a bunch of its *own* symbols; later someone adds a symbol to namespace

Re: UA string: Touch or Tablet again

2012-11-12 Thread Justin Dolske
On 11/12/12 7:51 AM, Gervase Markham wrote: Can we quickly revisit the question of whether to have one of Touch or Tablet in our UA string under some circumstances? We need to work out how Windows 8 Metro fits into our plans (bug 787786) N. :/ The UA is such a disaster. I wish

Re: Proposed style guide modification: using declarations and nested namespaces

2012-11-12 Thread Jeff Walden
On 11/12/2012 10:44 AM, Robert O'Callahan wrote: On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 9:37 AM, Zack Weinberg za...@panix.com wrote: The scenario I'm concerned with is when a .cpp file does 'using namespace A;' and then goes on to define a bunch of its *own* symbols; later someone adds a symbol to

Re: Proposal: Remove Linux PGO Testing

2012-11-12 Thread Mike Hommey
On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 03:47:32PM -0800, Alex Keybl wrote: Bug 799295 [1], the driver for this thread, is still an open issue for FF18 (shipping in 6 weeks). The JS team's recommendation remains to disable PGO on Linux. According to Taras, the major benefits of PGO on Linux are for a