Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-28 Thread Kevin Kofler
Andrew Haley wrote: On 25/02/15 00:31, Kevin Kofler wrote: Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com IMHO, this is

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 02:54 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora == Detailed Description == This is no real work proposal. Stepping back, I’m not sure this has been

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 04:26 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Robert Marcano rob...@marcanoonline.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 5:20:04 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 02:51 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 10:34 AM, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 11:43:53 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/26/2015 02:51 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Severin Gehwolf
On Thu, 2015-02-26 at 15:46 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 02:46 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 10:13 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:23 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also,

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/27/2015 11:48 AM, Severin Gehwolf wrote: On Thu, 2015-02-26 at 15:46 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 02:46 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 10:13 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:23 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/27/2015 11:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 11:43:53 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/26

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 12:54:04 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
in Fedora - Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 12:54:04 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/27/2015 11:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 11:43:53 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Andrew Haley
On 02/27/2015 10:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If we want to be sure that this legacy jdk will not interfere with the system JDK let it not provide anything via alternatives. That way people that want it can use it by playing with PATH/JAVA_HOME (just like they do with other JVMs).

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Andrew Haley
On 02/27/2015 10:58 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: The problem with alternatives is they are system wide so if one changes the alternatives to point to the legacy JDK for their third party app this becomes the JDK system wide. Thus all Fedora packaged Java apps (Tomcat, Jetty, JBoss,

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Andrew Haley
On 26/02/15 14:59, Mario Torre wrote: In this case, it's about giving users one thing they asked, which is easy access to a previous version of Java. We can't afford maintaining it as Java Team, but this doesn't mean we will refuse to help people doing it. In fact, the exact existence of this

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Andrew Haley
On 25/02/15 00:31, Kevin Kofler wrote: Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com IMHO, this is not implementable for

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/27/2015 12:04 PM, Andrew Haley wrote: On 02/27/2015 10:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If we want to be sure that this legacy jdk will not interfere with the system JDK let it not provide anything via alternatives. That way people that want it can use it by playing with PATH/JAVA_HOME

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/27/2015 12:04 PM, Andrew Haley wrote: On 02/27/2015 10:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If we want to be sure that this legacy jdk will not interfere with the system JDK let it not provide anything

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 1:42:53 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/27/2015 12:04 PM, Andrew Haley wrote: On 02/27/2015 10:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If we want to be sure that this legacy jdk

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-27 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/27/2015 12:04 PM, Andrew Haley wrote: On 02/27/2015 10:47 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If we want to be sure that this legacy jdk will not interfere with the system JDK let it not provide anything via alternatives. That way people that want it can use it by playing with PATH/JAVA_HOME

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 09:43 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:39:35 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 10:13 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:23 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also, my proposal of introducing java metapackage (see my other post in this thread), which would always require

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mario Torre
On Thu, 2015-02-26 at 09:00 +0100, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 08:36 PM, Sumit Bhardwaj wrote: Hi All, I have been reading this mail chain for some time and there is something I wanted to say. It's kind of a long mail, I apologize for taking so much of your time but request you

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mario Torre
On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 18:22 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 05:21 PM, Mario Torre wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 15:37 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:15 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 02:51 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Small restart. Looking to the discussion, although many people claimed against any rules at the end it seems to me that everybody agree on some rules - even if it would be existence of metapackage or only removed virtual provides and priority

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Mario Torre neug...@redhat.com To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 4:59:35 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Robert Marcano rob...@marcanoonline.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 5:20:04 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/24/2015 05:04 AM, Jaroslav

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 02:46 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 10:13 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:23 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also, my proposal of introducing java metapackage (see my other post

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Robert Marcano
On 02/24/2015 05:04 AM, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently Fedora supports one main Java runtime and Java

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 04:20 PM, Robert Marcano wrote: On 02/24/2015 05:04 AM, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 10:34 AM, Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently Fedora supports one main Java runtime and Java

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Miloslav Trmač
= Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora == Detailed Description == This is no real work proposal. Stepping back, I’m not sure this has been said explicitly: this is really a packaging

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Przemek Klosowski
On 02/26/2015 09:46 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: If you really think that old JDK should be removed during update and insist on that I believe that at least on Windows apps, including browser apps, can request a specific version of Java runtime. Malware asks for versions that are vulnerable to

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 08:36 PM, Sumit Bhardwaj wrote: Hi All, I have been reading this mail chain for some time and there is something I wanted to say. It's kind of a long mail, I apologize for taking so much of your time but request you to please bear with me. I work as a technical consultant on IBM

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 06:22 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 05:21 PM, Mario Torre wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 15:37 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:15 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or policy for

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 09:16 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/25/2015 06:58 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: On 02/24/2015 06:41 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 09:23 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also, my proposal of introducing java metapackage (see my other post in this thread), which would always require the latest JDK, solves this problem in a

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/25/2015 06:58 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: On 02/24/2015 06:41 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently java-1.8.0-openjdk. This could be easily changed as

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 08:45 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: I'm not really proposing as I haven't thought about this much yet, but the idea was about be adding a few empty binary packages java, java-devel, java-headless and so on (they could be subpackages of javapackages-tools). Existing provides with the same

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:16:26 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/25/2015 06:58 PM, Miloslav Trmač

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 09:31 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:16:26 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:39:35 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/26/2015 09:31 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: Development discussions related to Fedora devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 9:52:42 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also, my proposal of introducing java metapackage (see my other post in this thread), which would always require the latest JDK, solves this problem in a different way, without modifying ordinary Java packages at all. May you be more exact with the

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/26/2015 09:20 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/26/2015 08:42 AM, Jiri Vanek wrote: Also, my proposal of introducing java metapackage (see my other post in this thread), which would always require the latest JDK, solves this problem in a different way, without modifying ordinary Java

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-26 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/26/2015 09:31 AM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: If no volunteer shows up for maintenance of old JDK then it would be deprecated and obsoleted, as it's was done with previous JDK packages. How would that work _exactly_? 1) JDK maintainers announce deprecation in advance and call for

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Miloslav Trmač
On 02/24/2015 06:41 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently java-1.8.0-openjdk. This could be easily changed as default JRE changes. The same is for other

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 12:58:17 -0500, Miloslav Trmač m...@redhat.com wrote: 1. JDK-(N+1) is first shipped. The maintainer of JDK-N intends not to package it, so JDK-(N+1) includes Obsoletes:JDK-N from the start. 2. Someone revives JDK-N. Oops, it cannot be installed because JDK-(N+1)

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 04:36 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 10:12]: On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 05:04 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 04:36 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 10:12]: On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 05:21 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 04:59 PM, Pete Travis wrote: On Feb 24, 2015 8:32 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:17 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: I would much rather live without any legacy jdk, and if so then without any

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:14:35 AM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Jiri Vanek

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Hedayat Vatankhah
/*Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com*/ wrote on Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:07:28 +0100: On 02/25/2015 06:39 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: However, if there are JAR files which are useful for a developer, they can have a -legacy version too! There is no technical reason to suffix anything - you can

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/25/2015 10:55 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: /*Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com*/ wrote on Wed, 25 Feb 2015 10:07:28 +0100: On 02/25/2015 06:39 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: However, if there are JAR files which are useful for a developer, they can have a -legacy version too! There

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/25/2015 06:39 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: However, if there are JAR files which are useful for a developer, they can have a -legacy version too! There is no technical reason to suffix anything - you can put JARs that depend on old version of JDK in /usr/{share,lib}/java-x.y.z, for

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 04:03 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 03:51 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: 2.) Ensure dist upgrades remove old JDK package (which may no longer get security updates). Firstly, as I understand upgrade isn't supposed to remove

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 06:41 PM, Miloslav Trmač wrote: Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently java-1.8.0-openjdk. This could be easily changed as default JRE changes. The same is for other

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/25/2015 10:07 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/25/2015 06:39 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: However, if there are JAR files which are useful for a developer, they can have a -legacy version too! There is no technical reason to suffix anything - you can put JARs that depend on old version

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-25 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/25/2015 06:39 AM, Hedayat Vatankhah wrote: /*Kevin Kofler*/ wrote on Wed, 25 Feb 2015 01:31:59 +0100: Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s):

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Sumit Bhardwaj
Hi All, I have been reading this mail chain for some time and there is something I wanted to say. It's kind of a long mail, I apologize for taking so much of your time but request you to please bear with me. I work as a technical consultant on IBM WebSphere, IBM BPM, Java/J2EE and Python

F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jaroslav Reznik
= Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently Fedora supports one main Java runtime and Java Development Kit (JDK) and from time to time

F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jaroslav Reznik
= Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com Currently Fedora supports one main Java runtime and Java Development Kit (JDK) and from time to time

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
I am against official guidelines or policy for legacy JDK packages. I don't think that any such policy is needed and it would only encourage adoption of old packages for which there might be no security updates. Of course package maintainers can agree on specific rules that apply to their

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski
On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 13:34, Severin Gehwolf wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 12:43 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: [...] option one - introducing new packages - preferred 1. main jdk is proclaimed as dead as it was until now. The new jdk is derived as new package

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 01:34 PM, Severin Gehwolf wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 12:43 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: [...] option one - introducing new packages - preferred 1. main jdk is proclaimed as dead as it was until now. The new jdk is derived as new package prviousName-legacy Fedora

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Severin Gehwolf
On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 12:43 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: [...] option one - introducing new packages - preferred 1. main jdk is proclaimed as dead as it was until now. The new jdk is derived as new package prviousName-legacy Fedora already supports multiple JDKs

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
Package maintainers are responsible for their packages. If maintainer of main JDK is also maintaining legacy JDK then (s)he should be responsible for both of them. I don't see why any special rule should be defined. You missed very important point. The maintainer will never be same. We (people

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 01:50 PM, Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski wrote: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 13:34, Severin Gehwolf wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 12:43 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: [...] option one - introducing new packages - preferred 1. main jdk is proclaimed as dead as it was

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or policy for legacy JDK packages. I don't think that any such policy is needed and it would only encourage adoption of old packages for which there might be no security updates. Well thats the point - people are

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 01:34 PM, Severin Gehwolf wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 12:43 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: [...] option one - introducing new packages - preferred 1. main jdk is proclaimed as dead as it was until now. The new jdk is derived as new package prviousName-legacy

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 04:03 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 03:51 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: 2.) Ensure dist upgrades remove old JDK package (which may no longer get security updates). Firstly, as I understand upgrade isn't supposed to remove packages by default, unless they are

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Deepak Bhole
* Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:29]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:29]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 02:17 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: I would much rather live without any legacy jdk, and if so then without any rules. But not setting them will bring chaos for majority of users. I have a question: Is there anybody that stepped in to maintain the legacy jdk? If there is

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Deepak Bhole
* Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 10:12]: On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:29]: On

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 03:51 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: 2.) Ensure dist upgrades remove old JDK package (which may no longer get security updates). Firstly, as I understand upgrade isn't supposed to remove packages by default, unless they are obsoleted or conflict with something. Are you saying

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:29]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:04]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski
On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in past like can you please support jdk 7,6...in newer fedoras and we always told no. When come speech about do it on your own suddenly many questions marks raised up. The last open bug is:

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski
On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:04]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in past like can you please support jdk 7,6...in newer

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 02:58 PM, Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski wrote: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in past like can you please support jdk 7,6...in newer fedoras and we always told no. When come speech about do it on your own suddenly many

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 02:15 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or policy for legacy JDK packages. I don't think that any such policy is needed and it would only encourage adoption of old packages for which there might be no security

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Aleksandar Kurtakov
- Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 3:02:38 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/24/2015 01:50 PM, Dominik 'Rathann

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 02:17 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: - Original Message - From: Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com To: devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 3:02:38 PM Subject: Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora On 02/24

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Deepak Bhole
* Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:04]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in past like can you please support jdk 7,6...in newer fedoras and we always told no. When come speech about do it on your

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Deepak Bhole
* Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:29]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:04]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Jiri Vanek
On 02/24/2015 03:11 PM, Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski wrote: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 15:09, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski domi...@greysector.net [2015-02-24 09:04]: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mario Torre
On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 15:19 +0100, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:58 PM, Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski wrote: On Tuesday, 24 February 2015 at 14:28, Jiri Vanek wrote: [...] There were several attempts in past like can you please support jdk 7,6...in newer fedoras and we always told

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Pete Travis
On Feb 24, 2015 8:32 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:17 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: I would much rather live without any legacy jdk, and if so then without any rules. But not setting them will bring chaos for majority of users. I have a question: Is

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 04:59 PM, Pete Travis wrote: On Feb 24, 2015 8:32 AM, Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:17 PM, Aleksandar Kurtakov wrote: I would much rather live without any legacy jdk, and if so then without any rules. But not setting them will bring chaos for

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 04:36 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 10:12]: On 02/24/2015 04:06 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Mikolaj Izdebski mizde...@redhat.com [2015-02-24 09:58]: On 02/24/2015 03:32 PM, Deepak Bhole wrote: * Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mario Torre
On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 15:37 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:15 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or policy for legacy JDK packages. I don't think that any such policy is needed and it would only encourage

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Miloslav Trmač
Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently java-1.8.0-openjdk. This could be easily changed as default JRE changes. The same is for other binary subpackages of java, respectively. All

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Mikolaj Izdebski
On 02/24/2015 05:21 PM, Mario Torre wrote: On Tue, 2015-02-24 at 15:37 +0100, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: On 02/24/2015 02:15 PM, Jiri Vanek wrote: On 02/24/2015 12:43 PM, Mikolaj Izdebski wrote: I am against official guidelines or policy for legacy JDK packages. I don't think that any such

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Hedayat Vatankhah
/*Kevin Kofler*/ wrote on Wed, 25 Feb 2015 01:31:59 +0100: Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com IMHO, this is not

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Kevin Kofler
Jaroslav Reznik wrote: = Proposed System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora = https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/LegacyJDKsInFedora Change owner(s): Jiri Vanek jva...@redhat.com IMHO, this is not implementable for a simple practical reason: All the JARs

Re: F22 System Wide Change: Legacy implementations of the Java platform in Fedora

2015-02-24 Thread Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 12:41:45PM -0500, Miloslav Trmač wrote: Hello, java would be the preferred JRE in Fedora. The package would have no content, but it would have Requires on preferred Fedora JRE, currently java-1.8.0-openjdk. This could be easily changed as default JRE changes. The