Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Tue, Jun 29, 2021 at 09:12:51AM -, Paweł Marciniak wrote: > > I submitted a pull request that mashes your patch, Colin Walter's > > earlier pull reuqest, and some stuff I had worked on before into > > https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/20047. > > Ok. Thanks, but you meant https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/20058 :) Indeed. So the pull request has been merged. Unless there are objections, I'll change the default to StatusUnitFormat=combined, i.e. something like this: [ OK ] Created slice system-getty.slice - Slice /system/getty. [ OK ] Created slice system-modprobe.slice - Slice /system/modprobe. [ OK ] Created slice system-sshd\x2dkeygen.slice - Slice /system/sshd-keygen. [ OK ] Created slice user.slice - User and Session Slice. [ OK ] Started systemd-ask-password-console.path - Dispatch Password Requests to Console Directory Watch. [ OK ] Started systemd-ask-password-wall.path - Forward Password Requests to Wall Directory Watch. [ OK ] Reached target cryptsetup.target - Local Encrypted Volumes. [ OK ] Reached target paths.target - Path Units. [ OK ] Reached target remote-cryptsetup.target - Remote Encrypted Volumes. [ OK ] Reached target remote-fs.target - Remote File Systems. [ OK ] Reached target slices.target - Slice Units. [ OK ] Reached target swap.target - Swaps. Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
> I submitted a pull request that mashes your patch, Colin Walter's > earlier pull reuqest, and some stuff I had worked on before into > https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/20047. Ok. Thanks, but you meant https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/20058 :) ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Sat, Jun 26, 2021 at 04:39:16PM -, Paweł Marciniak wrote: > I've written a code heavily based on the above-mentioned PR:15957 but I've > added some missing code (new option StatusUnitFormat=combined). > > Now you can set StatusUnitFormat=combined in the configuration file or as a > kernel command line argument systemd.status_unit_format=combined > The output format is unit_name (unit description) > > Live system examples: > > combined: > Jun 26 18:24:19 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld.service (firewalld - > dynamic firewall daemon)... > Jun 26 18:24:20 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld.service (firewalld - > dynamic firewall daemon). > > name: > Jun 26 18:31:06 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld.service... > Jun 26 18:31:06 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld.service. > > description: > Jun 26 18:32:04 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld - dynamic firewall > daemon... > Jun 26 18:32:04 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld - dynamic firewall > daemon. > > The code: > https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0 > https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0.diff > https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0.patch Thanks! I submitted a pull request that mashes your patch, Colin Walter's earlier pull reuqest, and some stuff I had worked on before into https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/20047. Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Mon, Jun 28, 2021 at 10:31:09AM -, Paweł Marciniak wrote: > > What log analysis tools is this change likely to break? > If you set StatusUnitFormat to "name" or "description", then nothing will > change and it will work as always. Also, you can't base "analysis tools" on the Description strings… They change all the time! Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
> What log analysis tools is this change likely to break? If you set StatusUnitFormat to "name" or "description", then nothing will change and it will work as always. ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
What log analysis tools is this change likely to break? Not breaking tools that already exist in userland is fairly important to API changes. ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
I've written a code heavily based on the above-mentioned PR:15957 but I've added some missing code (new option StatusUnitFormat=combined). Now you can set StatusUnitFormat=combined in the configuration file or as a kernel command line argument systemd.status_unit_format=combined The output format is unit_name (unit description) Live system examples: combined: Jun 26 18:24:19 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld.service (firewalld - dynamic firewall daemon)... Jun 26 18:24:20 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld.service (firewalld - dynamic firewall daemon). name: Jun 26 18:31:06 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld.service... Jun 26 18:31:06 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld.service. description: Jun 26 18:32:04 fedora systemd[1]: Starting firewalld - dynamic firewall daemon... Jun 26 18:32:04 fedora systemd[1]: Started firewalld - dynamic firewall daemon. The code: https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0 https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0.diff https://github.com/sunwire/systemd/commit/07cd929872c1cd6809e2e17085d703ea2eeb6ea0.patch ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
* Colin Walters: > On Fri, Jun 25, 2021, at 6:21 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: >> Hi, >> >> systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= >> / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the >> Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > I meant to get back to https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/15957 > which I still think is the best. Is the unit ID already logged as LOG_UNIT_ID? Maybe users can be offered a choice when they invoke journalctl? Thanks, Florian ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 12:52:48PM -0400, Colin Walters wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2021, at 6:21 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > Hi, > > > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > I meant to get back to https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/15957 > which I still think is the best. I forgot about that pull request. So yeah, maybe that'd be an option. Then you'd get the Description at once, and the short identifier afterwards. On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 06:49:32PM +0200, Aleksandra Fedorova wrote: > I would vote for unit-names over description, as I can use them to > search information in the logs or in docs. > > But I wonder why don't we consider having both unit name and description > > Could something like > >Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Starting systemd-udevd.service - > Rule-based Manager for Device Events... >Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > be an option? > > You mention brevity, but do we really need to save space here? For log messages, the longer form is fine. But on the console, it's likely not fit in 80 characters. And there's more to this, which I didn't mention so far: I want to propagate the starting/stopping information from the user managers to the system manager. So the system manager can show on the console: "Stopping user@1000.service (stopping gvfs-daemon.service)" [formatting details to be figured out…]. This should work with unit names, but with unit descriptions there is no way to meaningfully fit this on one line. Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 05:23:08PM +0100, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote: > On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 10:21:05AM +, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > Hi, > > > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > > > - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device > > Events and Files. > > + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > > > I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on > > a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for > > further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with > > the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name > > actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and > > the name is at least as informative… > > IIUC, the descriptions are not translated / localized. So perhaps > the unit file names are more meaningful for non-english speakers > too ? Logs are not localized in general, because they are "global", shared between all users. This is a valid point: I'm pretty sure that 99% of people will immediately have a rough idea what lighttppd.service is. But "Lightning Fast Webserver With Light System Requirements"? This baroque description will be even more confusing to non-native speakers. Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021, at 6:21 AM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > Hi, > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: I meant to get back to https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/15957 which I still think is the best. ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
Hi, On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 12:21 PM Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > Hi, > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device > Events and Files. > + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on > a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for > further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with > the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name > actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and > the name is at least as informative… I would vote for unit-names over description, as I can use them to search information in the logs or in docs. But I wonder why don't we consider having both unit name and description Could something like Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Starting systemd-udevd.service - Rule-based Manager for Device Events... Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. be an option? You mention brevity, but do we really need to save space here? > Would people be opposed to making this the default (setting > -Dstatus-unit-format-default=name in build options)? People who like > the old default could set StatusUnitFormat=description in systemd.conf > > Zbyszek > ___ > devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: > https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure -- Aleksandra Fedorova bookwar on Libera Chat ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 10:21:05AM +, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > Hi, > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device > Events and Files. > + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on > a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for > further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with > the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name > actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and > the name is at least as informative… IIUC, the descriptions are not translated / localized. So perhaps the unit file names are more meaningful for non-english speakers too ? Regards, Daniel -- |: https://berrange.com -o-https://www.flickr.com/photos/dberrange :| |: https://libvirt.org -o-https://fstop138.berrange.com :| |: https://entangle-photo.org-o-https://www.instagram.com/dberrange :| ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On 6/25/21 7:19 AM, Neal Gompa wrote: I personally prefer the description myself, actually. Many unit names are more meaningless than the descriptions. One point ... It's far easier to get the description from the unit name than vice versa. -- In Soviet Russia, Google searches you! ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 6:21 AM Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > Hi, > > systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= > / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the > Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: > > - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device > Events and Files. > + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on > a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for > further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with > the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name > actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and > the name is at least as informative… > > Would people be opposed to making this the default (setting > -Dstatus-unit-format-default=name in build options)? People who like > the old default could set StatusUnitFormat=description in systemd.conf > I personally prefer the description myself, actually. Many unit names are more meaningless than the descriptions. It is nice that it is configurable though. Now we just need a verbose mode for systemctl to print that output when you call it to start/stop/restart services. :) -- 真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth! ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2021 at 10:21:05AM +, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device Events and Files. + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and the name is at least as informative… I agree with this preference. You could consider both. Would people be opposed to making this the default (setting -Dstatus-unit-format-default=name in build options)? People who like the old default could set StatusUnitFormat=description in systemd.conf I think Fedora should stick to upstream defaults in most places. Especially with systemd it's nice if all distros align (which is one of the big benefits of systemd over sysvinit IMHO). What does upstream think about this change? What do other distros think about this change? ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
Re: use unit names in systemd output by default?
Hi, On Fri, 2021-06-25 at 10:21 +, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device > Events and Files. > + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. > > [SNIP] > > Would people be opposed to making this the default (setting > -Dstatus-unit-format-default=name in build options)? People who like > the old default could set StatusUnitFormat=description in > systemd.conf I am in favour of that change. In my view it is also improves consistency, as other log messages such as the ones emitted using LOG_UNIT_MESSAGE will use the unit name rather than the description. Benjamin signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
use unit names in systemd output by default?
Hi, systemd has systemd.status_unit_format= / [Manager].StatusUnitFormat= / -Dstatus-unit-format-default= option to use unit names instead of the Description in messages on the kernel console and in logs: - Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started Rule-based Manager for Device Events and Files. + Jun 20 22:04:48 krowka systemd[1]: Started systemd-udevd.service. I find this more convenient because it's briefer, so it fits better on a terminal, but primarily because I can select the unit name for further lookup. When Description is used, and I'm not familiar with the unit, I'll often use grep first to figure out what the unit name actually is. Finally, unit Descriptions are often not very good, and the name is at least as informative… Would people be opposed to making this the default (setting -Dstatus-unit-format-default=name in build options)? People who like the old default could set StatusUnitFormat=description in systemd.conf Zbyszek ___ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
