Turning off the mesh to save battery power
hey guys, here in Nepal we are deciding whether or not to turn off the mesh on our custom XO build in order to save power. We will leave on regular wifi. Any ideas on how much power we will actually save? An extra hour of battery life would be worth it -- Bryan W. Berry Technology Director OLE Nepal, http://www.olenepal.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Notes from an impromptu 8.2.1 Release Mtg.
2009/1/27 S Page i...@skierpage.com: `sudo olpc-update staging-9` gives I don't think the requested build number exists. I get the same for staging-11, I guess we have to use the full .img (or olpc-update --usb) for now: http://xs-dev.laptop.org/~cscott/xo-1/streams/staging/build11/devel_jffs2/ Daniel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: multitouch + audio feedback linux dev - XO-2?
On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 11:57 PM, da...@lang.hm wrote: On Mon, 26 Jan 2009, Wade Brainerd wrote: Here's to staying focused, agreed, but I don't see how you can do a keyboard and not have some multi-touch stuff (shift keys to start with) I am in the group that has serious doubts about the current XO-2 design. I suspect that when push comes to shove the idea of the second screen being the keyboard will go the way of the crank in the XO-1 You've got a point about the keyboard, in my haste to rant I totally sidestepped that :) A piano keyboard would be pretty lame if it didn't support chords. That said, I was reacting to the idea that Multi-Pointer X was the way to handle the screen from a software standpoint. Instead, if the hardware supports multitouch, a custom API should be developed just for the keyboard based on instantaneous pressure. Multi-pointer would be overkill to a simple solution. -Wade ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
[Server-devel] Upgrade to 0.5.1
There seems to be a differing set of instructions on how to upgrade: from the wiki: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/XS_Installing_Software#Upgrading_from_XS_0.4_or_earlier If you are upgrading from XS 0.4 or earlier, the process is similar to a new installation, with some minor changes. In the menu shown right after booting, you should choose the (preselected) 'Install with kickstart' option, press the Tab key, and add 'upgradeany' to the boot configuration line. After adding that line, press enter twice. With this extra option, Anaconda will recognise the old installation and will offer to upgrade. the second from server-devel: http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/server-devel/2008-November/002493.html Just to make this clear, for the upgrade to work you need to select one of the top two options, hit tab and then append upgradeany. The default selection has the ks.cfg file which prevent the upgrade choice from appearing as an option in anaconda. (thinks it's the partitioning info being present) Passing upgradeany to the kickstart option does not work. Passing upgradeany to the top two options does work. Two questions: 1. Which should be used. 2. If you pass upgradeany to one of the top two options that does not use the kickstart, do you lose any functionalality? Thanks, Reuben http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Deployments_Support ___ Server-devel mailing list server-de...@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
Re: Problem running Sugar on openSUSE 11.0
Jigish, I am convinced that my installation of openSUSE 11.1 is messed up and my best option is to do a fresh install rather than an upgrade. David Fanning had asked me to do a ./sugar-jhbuild depscheck and the only way I could run that was to do a git-clone of sugar-jhbuild first. When I tried to do that I got a message saying that git-clone was not found, yet YAST and rpm -V both said that git-core (which YAST showed as containing that command) was installed. The file was definitely missing though. I'm guessing that something similar is happening with python-telepathy. I also find that neither of the DVD burning apps that come with the distro can recognize my DVD burner, but I have no trouble mounting DVDs on it. 11.0 also had some odd problems that I thought upgrading to 11.1 had fixed, but apparently some problems remain. Tonight I'll do the clean install and run your zypper commands again and I'll let you know how it went. Thanks, James Simmons ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Problem running Sugar on openSUSE 11.0
Tomeu, As I have described in a previous email, I think my openSUSE 11.1 upgrade is messed up. Several files seem to be missing even though YAST and rpm -V show the packages being installed. I plan to do a fresh install rather than an upgrade to see if that helps. I did run the command you asked to run last night. In case the results are still of interest, here they are: # installing zipimport hook import zipimport # builtin # installed zipimport hook # /usr/lib/python2.6/site.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/site.py import site # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/site.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/os.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/os.py import os # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/os.pyc import errno # builtin import posix # builtin # /usr/lib/python2.6/posixpath.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/posixpath.py import posixpath # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/posixpath.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/stat.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/stat.py import stat # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/stat.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/genericpath.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/genericpath.py import genericpath # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/genericpath.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/warnings.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/warnings.py import warnings # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/warnings.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/linecache.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/linecache.py import linecache # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/linecache.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/types.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/types.py import types # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/types.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/UserDict.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/UserDict.py import UserDict # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/UserDict.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/_abcoll.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/_abcoll.py import _abcoll # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/_abcoll.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/abc.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/abc.py import abc # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/abc.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/copy_reg.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/copy_reg.py import copy_reg # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/copy_reg.pyc import encodings # directory /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings # /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/__init__.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/__init__.py import encodings # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/__init__.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/codecs.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/codecs.py import codecs # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/codecs.pyc import _codecs # builtin # /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/aliases.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/aliases.py import encodings.aliases # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/aliases.pyc # /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/utf_8.pyc matches /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/utf_8.py import encodings.utf_8 # precompiled from /usr/lib/python2.6/encodings/utf_8.pyc Python 2.6 (r26:66714, Dec 3 2008, 06:05:48) [GCC 4.3.2 [gcc-4_3-branch revision 141291]] on linux2 Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. Traceback (most recent call last): File string, line 1, in module ImportError: No module named telepathy # clear __builtin__._ # clear sys.path # clear sys.argv # clear sys.ps1 # clear sys.ps2 # clear sys.exitfunc # clear sys.exc_type # clear sys.exc_value # clear sys.exc_traceback # clear sys.last_type # clear sys.last_value # clear sys.last_traceback # clear sys.path_hooks # clear sys.path_importer_cache # clear sys.meta_path # clear sys.flags # clear sys.float_info # restore sys.stdin # restore sys.stdout # restore sys.stderr # cleanup __main__ # cleanup[1] encodings # cleanup[1] site # cleanup[1] abc # cleanup[1] _codecs # cleanup[1] _warnings # cleanup[1] zipimport # cleanup[1] encodings.utf_8 # cleanup[1] codecs # cleanup[1] signal # cleanup[1] posix # cleanup[1] encodings.aliases # cleanup[1] exceptions # cleanup[2] copy_reg # cleanup[2] posixpath # cleanup[2] errno # cleanup[2] _abcoll # cleanup[2] types # cleanup[2] genericpath # cleanup[2] stat # cleanup[2] warnings # cleanup[2] UserDict # cleanup[2] os.path # cleanup[2] linecache # cleanup[2] os # cleanup sys # cleanup __builtin__ # cleanup ints: 19 unfreed ints # cleanup floats Thanks, James Simmons Tomeu Vizoso wrote: Can you attach the output of: python -v -c 'import telepathy' Thanks, Tomeu ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
New staging build 13
http://xs-dev.laptop.org/~cscott/xo-1/streams/staging/build13 Changes in build 13 from build: 11 Size delta: 0.00M -sugar-journal 100-1.olpc3 +sugar-journal 101-1.olpc3 -- This mail was automatically generated See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/staging-pkgs.html for aggregate logs See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/joyride_vs_update1.html for a comparison ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
New staging build 13
http://xs-dev.laptop.org/~cscott/xo-1/streams/staging/build13 Changes in build 13 from build: 11 Size delta: 0.00M -sugar-journal 100-1.olpc3 +sugar-journal 101-1.olpc3 -- This mail was automatically generated See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/staging-pkgs.html for aggregate logs See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/joyride_vs_update1.html for a comparison ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
VIG Meeting Today at 4 PM EST
This is a reminder of the weekly VIG meeting at 4 PM EST in #olpc- admin on oftc. I have had a few things come up and I will be unable to attend or chair the meeting today. Henry has generously volunteered to serve as our secretary; if someone else would like to step in to chair today's meeting, please edit the draft agenda at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC:VIG Sorry for the short notice - thanks for all the VIG help - I guess this means I get all the job assignments this week g. - Ed ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
New staging build 15
http://xs-dev.laptop.org/~cscott/xo-1/streams/staging/build15 Changes in build 15 from build: 13 Size delta: 0.00M -olpc-utils 0.89-5.olpc3 +olpc-utils 0.89-6.olpc3 -libX11 1.1.4-3.olpc3 +libX11 1.1.4-4.olpc3 -xkeyboard-config 1.3-6.olpc3 +xkeyboard-config 1.3-7.olpc3 -- This mail was automatically generated See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/staging-pkgs.html for aggregate logs See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/joyride_vs_update1.html for a comparison ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Soas snapshot
You can download the iso here: http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/snapshots/1/Soas-200901271941.iso Instructions on how to install it are here: http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick I also made an experimental image for the XO. It's not signed, so you will need security disabled, if you want to try it. http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/xoimages/soas1.img http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/xoimages/soas1.crc Marco ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
AMD to stop working on Geodes
AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight Looks like AMD's going to be pulling out of the low-power computing space because of the economic crunch. This is completely wrong and low-power + efficiency is exactly where all computing should go. multicore GHz monsters should be sold to people who really need them and not to joe average who just needs to surf and do ms office work. sorry guys, lack sleep, thanks for all the pointers on multitouch audio feedback interface - I saw really amazing stuff and am tickled pink that the precise methods I just outlined are already being worked on :) will reply on all these when I get back. This latest piece of news has been an extremely frustrating development for me and goes completely against the grain of ubiquitous sustainable computing for everyone + bridging the digital divide. wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong see you guys later. -- Carlos Nazareno http://twitter.com/naz404 http://www.object404.com -- interactive media specialist zen graffiti studios http://www.zengraffiti.com -- User Group Manager Phlashers: Philippine Flash ActionScripters Adobe Flash/Flex User Group http://www.phlashers.com -- if you don't like the way the world is running, then change it instead of just complaining. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: e of the economic crunch. This is completely wrong and low-power + efficiency is exactly where all computing should go. multicore GHz monsters should be sold to people who really need them and not to joe average who just needs to surf and do ms office work. What makes you think that's all the average Joe does with his computer? This is a blindness that always amazes me when I see it. Does every single motherboard now come with a 3D chip to suf the web and do ms office work? Since the beginning of the microcomputer revolution people have SAID they were buyign the computer to word process, or do spreadsheets, but the number one selling pecie fo software, the one comaptability test every clone maker had tio pass, was running MS Flight Simualtor. People say they buy computers to work, but by and large they really buy them to play. And geodes wont run modern games so they aren't selling. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Soas snapshot
Hi Marco, On 27 Jan 2009, at 23:00, Marco Pesenti Gritti wrote: You can download the iso here: http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/snapshots/1/Soas-200901271941.iso Instructions on how to install it are here: http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick I also made an experimental image for the XO. It's not signed, so you will need security disabled, if you want to try it. http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/xoimages/soas1.img http://download.sugarlabs.org/soas/xoimages/soas1.crc Cool. Any tips as to what to do with these 2 on an XO? The only thing I've done with .img and .crc before is copy-nand from firmware – is it possible to run them from a usb stick without wiping nand or effecting the existing nand install (so we can encourage safe(er) testing of new code)? Regards, --Gary Marco ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
Hi. On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 11:14 PM, Jeffrey Kesselman jef...@gmail.comwrote: On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: e of the economic crunch. This is completely wrong and low-power + efficiency is exactly where all computing should go. multicore GHz monsters should be sold to people who really need them and not to joe average who just needs to surf and do ms office work. What makes you think that's all the average Joe does with his computer? This is a blindness that always amazes me when I see it. Does every single motherboard now come with a 3D chip to suf the web and do ms office work? Since the beginning of the microcomputer revolution people have SAID they were buyign the computer to word process, or do spreadsheets, but the number one selling pecie fo software, the one comaptability test every clone maker had tio pass, was running MS Flight Simualtor. People say they buy computers to work, but by and large they really buy them to play. And geodes wont run modern games so they aren't selling. Neither do Celerons ULV 900 and the current Intel Atom, just see how they are doing. Call them the Wii of personal computers, if you may. One of the problems with the Geode LX is that it doesn't run youtube quite right. As sales of the OLPC G1G1 came down to 7% of last year, it seems people didn't like to pay more for a netbook that doesn't do youtube how a $199 EEE does. That 93% less Geodes sold sure must help AMD to not look at the Geode the same way. A Geode shrunk to 45nm sure would help the XO, heck, even a 65nm one would. Perhaps time for a Get 4 Give 1 program? Where each XO sold to the public, 1/4 of it's value is for a donated XO. That could help bring mass production closer to the desired numbers, mass public availability sure has helped that darn Classmate. Just my 2 cents. Best regards, Tiago Marques ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight This has been relatively well known in the industry for a while. It means they'll keep cranking more Geodes if you want to buy them, but there will not be a next Geode chip. Maybe they'll come out with another low-power cpu line sometime in the future, maybe not. Intel and Via are the most interesting options right now in this space, and both seem to be working on a next chip. PCWorld and friends are for the consumer market, so they are about a year behind on the news I'd say... cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
it's the low power part that's very important here. it's the XO's incredibly low power consumption that really sets it apart from any other currently in production computer (excluding smartphones and pdas). I'm not really familiar with the new processors from Intel (silverthorne, diamondville) and Via's, but can they run at as low power consumption as the Geode and provide the same (and if not better) MHz bang for the consumption? Do ARM processors do these things better than anything else on the market right now? but then you lose the X86 compatibility and this probably breaks things for cross-platform upstream contributions for any deved/researched write-once-run-many apps/projects. (correct me if I'm wrong, am just speculating because I'm not a CE and as well-versed with computer architecture) I've always loved AMD's cool and quiet technology and am pretty much cursing the unrelenting power draw of my core2-quad desktop coz my UPS battery life has gone down the drain and electric bill has spiked so high since I replaced my lowly Sempron. (I do have the need for speed for rendering) As for games, can we just classify the XO in the same class as current-gen smartphones horsepower wise and not market it as anything other than that? That's pretty much how we're running the Flash Dev for the XO project because that's exactly how the XO performs (and it's a hell of a lot better than any smartphone in the market for heavier mobile computing and education!) On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 8:01 AM, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight This has been relatively well known in the industry for a while. It means they'll keep cranking more Geodes if you want to buy them, but there will not be a next Geode chip. Maybe they'll come out with another low-power cpu line sometime in the future, maybe not. Intel and Via are the most interesting options right now in this space, and both seem to be working on a next chip. PCWorld and friends are for the consumer market, so they are about a year behind on the news I'd say... cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff -- Carlos Nazareno http://twitter.com/naz404 http://www.object404.com -- interactive media specialist zen graffiti studios http://www.zengraffiti.com -- User Group Manager Phlashers: Philippine Flash ActionScripters Adobe Flash/Flex User Group http://www.phlashers.com -- if you don't like the way the world is running, then change it instead of just complaining. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:35 AM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.comwrote: it's the low power part that's very important here. it's the XO's incredibly low power consumption that really sets it apart from any other currently in production computer (excluding smartphones and pdas). Of course! But, I was quite disapointed when I knew that the 0.9W they announce for the Geode LX is only the idle power, on typical usage it's more like: LX 8...@0.9 W: clock speed: 500 MHz, with power consumption: 1.8 watts. (*TDP 3.6 W*) Borrowed this line from wikipedia. Now take a look at this one: Atom Z500, 800 MHz, 512 KiB, 0.80 - 1.1V, *0.65 W TDP, 160 mW* *idle* - $20 As much as I don't really like Intel for the Classmate, this is miles ahead of the Geode LX. And it's not what I'd call expensive, although I don't have an ideia of how much the Geode in the XO costs. I'm not really familiar with the new processors from Intel (silverthorne, diamondville) and Via's, but can they run at as low power consumption as the Geode and provide the same (and if not better) MHz bang for the consumption? Do ARM processors do these things better than anything else on the market right now? but then you lose the X86 compatibility and this probably breaks things for cross-platform upstream contributions for any deved/researched write-once-run-many apps/projects. (correct me if I'm wrong, am just speculating because I'm not a CE and as well-versed with computer architecture) Some laptop manufacturers are designing hybrid laptops with a regular x86 processor and an ARM to boot a small linux distribution from flash, so it must not be that bad. AFAIK, ARM and Canonical will be doing a push for ARM Linux in the coming months. I've always loved AMD's cool and quiet technology and am pretty much cursing the unrelenting power draw of my core2-quad desktop coz my UPS battery life has gone down the drain and electric bill has spiked so high since I replaced my lowly Sempron. (I do have the need for speed for rendering) Pretty much all of Intel's power management sucks, even in laptops. Mostly they don't allow the CPU to clock too low, for whatever reason, while AMD can clock down to 800-1GHz almost all CPUs. Also, do you know one thing that Celeron Ms lack is power management? Unbelievable, given their target market. As for games, can we just classify the XO in the same class as current-gen smartphones horsepower wise and not market it as anything other than that? That's pretty much how we're running the Flash Dev for the XO project because that's exactly how the XO performs (and it's a hell of a lot better than any smartphone in the market for heavier mobile computing and education!) Right you are, I love this little piece of hardware. Best regards, Tiago Marques On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 8:01 AM, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight This has been relatively well known in the industry for a while. It means they'll keep cranking more Geodes if you want to buy them, but there will not be a next Geode chip. Maybe they'll come out with another low-power cpu line sometime in the future, maybe not. Intel and Via are the most interesting options right now in this space, and both seem to be working on a next chip. PCWorld and friends are for the consumer market, so they are about a year behind on the news I'd say... cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff -- Carlos Nazareno http://twitter.com/naz404 http://www.object404.com -- interactive media specialist zen graffiti studios http://www.zengraffiti.com -- User Group Manager Phlashers: Philippine Flash ActionScripters Adobe Flash/Flex User Group http://www.phlashers.com -- if you don't like the way the world is running, then change it instead of just complaining. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes (Carlos Nazareno)
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight The cost of developing and supporting a processor family is staggering. AMD bought the Geode business from another company. Often, when a company buys a business unit, that unit withers on the vine. The new kids on the block have a difficult time establishing a strong place within the established pecking order, so in the competition for resources, the new group often comes up short. When there is an economic downturn, the new group is often the first to go. AMD barely has the resources to maintain a competitive stance in the part of the market that has traditionally been their core, especially now that the economy is bad. I'm sure that AMD would be very happy if they had enough money to go after the low power market, but they just don't. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 7:04 AM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: Looks like AMD's going to be pulling out of the low-power computing space because of the economic crunch. At least they're not completely shutting down the fabrication of existing technologies that would still need Geode-type of components. They (AMD) have been struggling for quite some time, and I guess the other players have been doing their share of improvements into low power computing (Freescale, VIA, etc.) -- Jerome G. Blog: http://gotangco.blogspot.com ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Small DNS questions.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 8:06 AM, Michael Stone mich...@laptop.org wrote: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Network_principles#Name_resolution Even if we were to do all sorts of DNS smartypants stuff - the only protocol where we can play games is http. The protocol is highly proxy-able, redirect-able and nimble, and most importantly, all the _clients_ are specially adept and handling odd bait-and-switch abuse. For example, the kind of behaviour that you see when connecting to commercial Wifi hotspots -- these days they mostly do the right thing (unless your initial connection was https), but they used to muck with DNS. Badly. Every other (useful) protocol I can see in my /etc/services breaks if you try this stuff. Maybe some limited interactions work -- like with SMTP -- but overall, it just doesn't work. We can muck with HTTP with a transparent proxy that allows us to serve some remote URLs locally. I want to avoid it, but if we have to do it, we will. Every other protocol - I plan to leave alone :-) cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
Carlos Nazareno wrote: Do ARM processors do these things better than anything else on the market right now? but then you lose the X86 compatibility and this probably breaks things for cross-platform upstream contributions for any deved/researched write-once-run-many apps/projects. (correct me if I'm wrong, am just speculating because I'm not a CE and as well-versed with computer architecture) Sugar has been tested on both x86 and ARM [1]. I expect it would run perfectly on MIPS, PPC, SPARC, Itanium, Alpha... Linux runs on just about every major architecture, and I expect the same of just about any Linux-based system. I'm not too worried about upstream support. Our Activities are mostly written in Python or portable C, and the underlying operating system is typically based on Fedora, Debian[2], Gentoo[3]... which already support all of the above architectures. It's true that you lose the ability to run arbitrary binaries from other platforms, but this is only important if you care about closed-source code. Most important open source programs are easily recompiled for any architecture. --Ben [1] http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardSugar [2] http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/installmanual [3] http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/index.xml#doc_chap4 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Turning off the mesh to save battery power
hey guys, here in Nepal we are deciding whether or not to turn off the mesh on our custom XO build in order to save power. We will leave on regular wifi. Any ideas on how much power we will actually save? An extra hour of battery life would be worth it (1) Try it and see, that's probably the easiest way. Every laptop has an instrument in the battery that you can measure its power draw with. See: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/XO_power_draw When I measured it on 2008-09-12, I got about 0.2w difference between a WiFi access point and mesh. It probably matters how busy your mesh is, since transmitting uses more power than just sitting there waiting to receive. (2) The big win in 8.2.0 from turning mesh off is that the entire WiFi chip can be powered down when the laptop is closed and suspends. This stretches the suspend time from about 8 hours to at least 48 hours, meaning the kids can just close the lid rather than power-off. Then the laptop will be instantly available whenever they open it (e.g. at home). If the mesh is still on, the WiFi chip needs power to do its packet-forwarding job. (3) If you want an extra hour of battery life, work on the screen dimming algorithm, or teach kids to turn down their brightness to increase battery life. Summary from my results: Normal power consumption of about 6 watts. By dimming the screen, you can save up to a watt. By turning the screen all the way off, you can save another 0.5 watt (total 1.5 watts for screen). By turning the WiFi chip off, you can save up to a watt. John ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Problem running Sugar on openSUSE 11.0
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 8:49 PM, James Simmons jim.simm...@walgreens.com wrote: Jigish, I am convinced that my installation of openSUSE 11.1 is messed up and my best option is to do a fresh install rather than an upgrade. David Fanning had asked me to do a ./sugar-jhbuild depscheck and the only way I could run that was to do a git-clone of sugar-jhbuild first. When I tried to do that I got a message saying that git-clone was not found, yet YAST and rpm -V both said that git-core (which YAST showed as containing that command) was installed. The file was definitely missing though. I'm guessing that No, new git uses git clone instead of git-clone something similar is happening with python-telepathy. I also find that neither of the DVD burning apps that come with the distro can recognize my DVD burner, but I have no trouble mounting DVDs on it. 11.0 also had some odd problems that I thought upgrading to 11.1 had fixed, but apparently some problems remain. For DVD burning the issue is known, add your user to disk group. Tonight I'll do the clean install and run your zypper commands again and I'll let you know how it went. Thanks, OK, as I said, running the commands listed on the wiki got sugar running here. Use sugar-emulator command instead of Xephyr commands I posted before. You can always drop in IRC Freenode #sugar if you need help, that would probably be faster. Good luck -J ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes (Carlos Nazareno)
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Mitch Bradley w...@laptop.org wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight The cost of developing and supporting a processor family is staggering. AMD bought the Geode business from another company. Often, when a company buys a business unit, that unit withers on the vine. The new kids on the block have a difficult time establishing a strong place within the established pecking order, so in the competition for resources, the new group often comes up short. When there is an economic downturn, the new group is often the first to go. AMD barely has the resources to maintain a competitive stance in the part of the market that has traditionally been their core, especially now that the economy is bad. I'm sure that AMD would be very happy if they had enough money to go after the low power market, but they just don't. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel Somebody on Slashdot (yeah!) has a good write-up pointing to the fact that AMD isn't halting production. Its just not going to develop Geode further. http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1105799cid=26623857 From the comment: begin quote AMD is NOT halting production of the Geode. They are not leaving the market (RTFM!). They have decided that it serves it's niche AS IS and will be kept AS IS. That's a very different statement. They're saying that it is a mature product (a rare thing in IT). Currently, the Geode is good enough for many applications and would be a step up for others. The embedded world tends away from the shiny object model of upgrades. If it worked last year, it works this year, and it'll work next year. Changes in the product are considered undesirable. AMD's statement doesn't even mean there won't be a die shrink or even a faster Geode in the future, just that they won't be updating it's architecture. It's not a bad decision either. There is a significant niche for the Geode between the Atom (too hot, too power hungry) and things like the Dragon Ball and mips (not enough power). Geode isn't in trouble until Intel comes out with an x86 that doesn't need a heatsink (or at least doesn't need a fan). end quote I've seen the Geode in action in Soekris boards (http://www.soekris.com/) when I was doing fun Wi-Fi stuff, and used to wonder what it would be like if we had a Geode machine running a laptop...well that wish came true with the XO :-) I'll also point out (peripherally) to a comment made by Jeff Bezos in a BusinessWeek article (http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_17/b4081064880218.htm), where he says that frugality leads to innovation (necessity being the mother of invention, etc.) and I think the frugality of XO's design has definitely lead to many innovations. I for one would *not* have thought that I would be using a 433MHz x86 laptop with 256MB RAM as my favorite machine :-) Hats off to the Geode! cheers, Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
New staging build 21
http://xs-dev.laptop.org/~cscott/xo-1/streams/staging/build21 Changes in build 21 from build: 15 Size delta: 0.00M -libX11 1.1.4-4.olpc3 +libX11 1.1.4-5.olpc3 -- This mail was automatically generated See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/staging-pkgs.html for aggregate logs See http://dev.laptop.org/~rwh/announcer/joyride_vs_update1.html for a comparison ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
XS-0.5.1 is all go.
It's a bit of a non-event, the code has been there for quite a while. So I am just making it official: 0.5.1 is the XS image to use. Grab it at http://xs-dev.laptop.org/xs/ It fixes the issues outlined in https://dev.laptop.org/query?group=milestonemilestone=xs-0.5.1order=prioritycol=idcol=summarycol=typecol=statuscol=priorityrow=description - and it also has a proper embedded checksum so checkisomd5 is happy (and therefore, mkisomd5 is happy too!). Fixed the 'upgrade' wikipage, quick brush-up of release notes, and latest version wikibox-thing. cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes (Carlos Nazareno)
On Jan 27, 2009, at 8:14 PM, Mitch Bradley wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low- power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/ amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight The cost of developing and supporting a processor family is staggering. AMD bought the Geode business from another company. Often, when a company buys a business unit, that unit withers on the vine. The new kids on the block have a difficult time establishing a strong place within the established pecking order, so in the competition for resources, the new group often comes up short. When there is an economic downturn, the new group is often the first to go. Much worse, as AMD bought Geode from National, who had obtained it six years earlier through acquiring Cyrix. wad ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes (Carlos Nazareno)
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 8:39 PM, Sameer Verma sve...@sfsu.edu wrote: On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Mitch Bradley w...@laptop.org wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Carlos Nazareno object...@gmail.com wrote: AMD sees no Geode chip replacement in sight AMD on Monday said it has no replacement for the aging Geode low-power chips that are used in netbooks and set-top boxes. http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/274414/amd_sees_no_geode_chip_replacement_sight The cost of developing and supporting a processor family is staggering. AMD bought the Geode business from another company. National Semiconductor, which bought the line from Cyrix. I edited several of the pin- and register-level manuals for various chips for them more than ten years ago, and updates of my work are still online on the AMD Web site. OLPC has educated AMD on how to use the power-management registers to do things that nobody previously knew were possible. Often, when a company buys a business unit, that unit withers on the vine. The new kids on the block have a difficult time establishing a strong place within the established pecking order, so in the competition for resources, the new group often comes up short. When there is an economic downturn, the new group is often the first to go. AMD barely has the resources to maintain a competitive stance in the part of the market that has traditionally been their core, especially now that the economy is bad. I'm sure that AMD would be very happy if they had enough money to go after the low power market, but they just don't. I am delighted that this premature obituary also turns out to be greatly exaggerated. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel Somebody on Slashdot (yeah!) has a good write-up pointing to the fact that AMD isn't halting production. Its just not going to develop Geode further. http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1105799cid=26623857 From the comment: begin quote AMD is NOT halting production of the Geode. They are not leaving the market (RTFM!). They have decided that it serves it's niche AS IS and will be kept AS IS. That's a very different statement. They're saying that it is a mature product (a rare thing in IT). Currently, the Geode is good enough for many applications and would be a step up for others. The embedded world tends away from the shiny object model of upgrades. If it worked last year, it works this year, and it'll work next year. Changes in the product are considered undesirable. AMD's statement doesn't even mean there won't be a die shrink or even a faster Geode in the future, just that they won't be updating it's architecture. It's not a bad decision either. There is a significant niche for the Geode between the Atom (too hot, too power hungry) and things like the Dragon Ball and mips (not enough power). Geode isn't in trouble until Intel comes out with an x86 that doesn't need a heatsink (or at least doesn't need a fan). end quote Marvell has bought XScale from Intel. That may be the principal alternative. The Encore Mobilis being bought by Brazil for its schools uses an XScale processor and MontaVista Linux, so Sugar Labs should be working on an XScale port of Sugar soon. I've seen the Geode in action in Soekris boards (http://www.soekris.com/) when I was doing fun Wi-Fi stuff, and used to wonder what it would be like if we had a Geode machine running a laptop...well that wish came true with the XO :-) I'll also point out (peripherally) to a comment made by Jeff Bezos in a BusinessWeek article (http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_17/b4081064880218.htm), where he says that frugality leads to innovation (necessity being the mother of invention, etc.) and I think the frugality of XO's design has definitely lead to many innovations. I for one would *not* have thought that I would be using a 433MHz x86 laptop with 256MB RAM as my favorite machine :-) Alan Kay loves to ask how Doug Engelbart and his team managed to shoehorn all of the Online System (NLS) in The Mother of All Demos into 192K in 1968.This included realtime videoconferencing and instantaneous, seamless crash recovery. People come up with all sorts of technical theories, but Alan's answer is, Because they wanted to badly enough. Hats off to the Geode! cheers, Sameer -- Dr. Sameer Verma, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Information Systems San Francisco State University San Francisco CA 94132 USA http://verma.sfsu.edu/ http://opensource.sfsu.edu/ ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- Silent Thunder (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name And Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai (Ed Cherlin)
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes (Carlos Nazareno)
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:32 PM, Edward Cherlin echer...@gmail.com wrote: AMD bought the Geode business from another company. National Semiconductor, which bought the line from Cyrix. I edited several of the pin- and register-level manuals for various chips for them more than ten years ago, For National Semiconductor, that is. -- Silent Thunder (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name And Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai (Ed Cherlin) ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: AMD to stop working on Geodes
2009/1/27 Benjamin M. Schwartz bmsch...@fas.harvard.edu: Carlos Nazareno wrote: Do ARM processors do these things better than anything else on the market right now? but then you lose the X86 compatibility and this probably breaks things for cross-platform upstream contributions for any deved/researched write-once-run-many apps/projects. (correct me if I'm wrong, am just speculating because I'm not a CE and as well-versed with computer architecture) Sugar has been tested on both x86 and ARM [1]. How about the XScale version of the ARM architecture? Is anybody working on that? We need it for the Encore Mobilis port, on Montavista Linux. It would be hilarious to me if the XO-2 had an XScale processor, and Microsoft suddenly had to port Windows XP to it in order to stay in th game. :-Þ I expect it would run perfectly on MIPS, PPC, SPARC, Itanium, Alpha... Linux runs on just about every major architecture, and I expect the same of just about any Linux-based system. None of the Geode-specific power management code would work, of course, but that's kernel-level stuff. It doesn't go into the .xo bundles or the distro-specific packages. I'm not too worried about upstream support. Our Activities are mostly written in Python or portable C, and the underlying operating system is typically based on Fedora, Debian[2], Gentoo[3]... which already support all of the above architectures. It's true that you lose the ability to run arbitrary binaries from other platforms, but this is only important if you care about closed-source code. That means, for us, Flash and drivers. There are Open Source BIOS equivalents for some of these architectures. Most important open source programs are easily recompiled for any architecture. --Ben [1] http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardSugar [2] http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/installmanual [3] http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/index.xml#doc_chap4 ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- Silent Thunder (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name And Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai (Ed Cherlin) ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Turning off the mesh to save battery power
On Tue, 2009-01-27 at 19:26 -0800, John Gilmore wrote: hey guys, here in Nepal we are deciding whether or not to turn off the mesh on our custom XO build in order to save power. We will leave on regular wifi. Any ideas on how much power we will actually save? An extra hour of battery life would be worth it (1) Try it and see, that's probably the easiest way. Every laptop has an instrument in the battery that you can measure its power draw with. See: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/XO_power_draw Thanks gnu, this is really helpful -- Bryan W. Berry Technology Director OLE Nepal, http://www.olenepal.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Notes from an impromptu 8.2.1 Release Mtg.
We are definitely recommending that they stop using MPP mode (at least an automatic one.) On Jan 23, 2009, at 7:11 AM, Martin Langhoff wrote: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Michael Stone mich...@laptop.org wrote: http://dev.laptop.org/report/38 A quick side-note here - reviewing the bugs listed there, I see we have a fix for dnsmasq in MPP mode, presumably for Uy. Are we recommending Uy that they stop using MPP mode? I think that there is fairly good consensus on that matter -- the reports of very bad RF saturation have been diagnosed to be cause by _all_ the laptops being in MPP mode. The RF saturation problems block any connectivity that you could hope to extend via MPP... cheers, martin -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Server-devel] updates
On Mon, 2009-01-26 at 17:08 -0500, Martin Langhoff wrote: On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 12:19 PM, Jerry Vonau jvo...@shaw.ca wrote: latest re-roll of anaconda, srpms, rpms and patch used, updated mkusbinstall for the XO at: http://members.shaw.ca/jvonau/pub/anaconda/ That's such good news. It's a bit broken, that addition to the anaconda file is unneeded, but it uncovered the same bug that you ran into with kickstart on a fat filesystem. 18:12:36 INFO: moving (1) to step writeksconfig 18:12:36 INFO: Writing autokickstart file 18:12:39 INFO: Running kickstart %%traceback script(s) 18:12:39 INFO: All kickstart %%traceback script(s) have been run 18:12:39 CRITICAL: anaconda 11.4.0.83 exception report Traceback (most recent call first): File /tmp/updates/anaconda, line 593, in writeMethodstr partition = isys.getDeviceByToken(LABEL, partition[6:]) File /usr/lib/anaconda/instdata.py, line 238, in writeKS self.anaconda.writeMethodstr(f) File /usr/lib/anaconda/packages.py, line 77, in writeKSConfiguration anaconda.id.writeKS(fn) File /usr/lib/anaconda/dispatch.py, line 208, in moveStep rc = stepFunc(self.anaconda) File /usr/lib/anaconda/dispatch.py, line 131, in gotoNext self.moveStep() File /usr/lib/anaconda/text.py, line 702, in run anaconda.dispatch.gotoNext() File /tmp/updates/anaconda, line 1070, in module anaconda.intf.run(anaconda) AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'getDeviceByToken' 18:12:39 INFO: in run, screen = snack.SnackScreen instance at 0xb7a0d34c 18:54:44 DEBUG : adding drive sda to disk list 18:54:44 DEBUG : adding drive sdb to disk list 18:54:45 CRITICAL: parted exception: Bug: Assertion (ped_partition_is_active (part)) at disk.c:1186 in function ped_partition_get_flag() failed. 18:54:54 CRITICAL: parted exception: Bug: Assertion (part-disk_specific != NULL) at dos.c:1423 in function msdos_partition_get_flag() failed. Not sure what to file this one against, looks like parted to me, as one of the booty functions import parted. - finds kickstart file without asking where it is... Good - does that depend on labelling the partition too? Do we have to change mkusbinstall to label it appropriately? - loader doesn't copy stage2 to RAM Cool - - fix compile error re: MD_NEW_SIZE_BLOCKS(size) - added support for method=hd:LABEL=XSRepo at the boot prompt This allows us not to ask where the install media if the usbdrive is labeled as XSRepo and passed the above string. - added support for mmc cards (for the XO) in loader. This is incomplete, loader now finds the CF card on the XO but is unavailable to partition and thus install to it. F10 has the same behavior, I filed BZ# 481441. Hope they fix the issue before I have to dig it up I've CC'd myself on the bug. The actual number is - BZ 481431 - Fat fingered that, sorry. - updated mkusbinstall added the labeling of the usbdrive for the above method and creation of /boot/olpc.fth for the XO. Ah, that's what I was alluding to earlier. Is it possible to workaround the SD card issue by building an installer image with an older kernel? From what you said it's a regression with 2.6.27.x right? No, the issue is that anaconda, for F9, doesn't have the kernel modules in the initrd, F10 does. Both fail to add the CF card to the partitioning screen, thus making them unavailable as install targets. I'm wondering if we can craft a just-installed image that can be dd'd to SD cards. That seems do-able, I'll try on the weekend to work something up. I guess I'll explore this tomorrow -- I'm on the road today, so limited in my hacking ;-) Jerry ___ Server-devel mailing list Server-devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
Re: [Server-devel] Upgrade to 0.5.1
2009/1/28 Reuben K. Caron reu...@laptop.org: 1. Which should be used. Good spotting. Initially I thought kickstart could drive upgrades. It cannot. So it's the one of the top options path that actually works. I'll fix the wiki... And at some point when we get a chance to improve the sysconfig menu, we should replace those wonky menu options with ones that make sense for us, including onecalled upgrade from 0.4 or vanilla fedora, which of course includes the 'upgradeany' magic word. 2. If you pass upgradeany to one of the top two options that does not use the kickstart, do you lose any functionalality? You don't lose functionality. The 0.4 install has the two key pkgs, xs-config and xs-pkgs. Anaconda upgrades both, and those bring in everything that makes an XS. cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Server-devel mailing list Server-devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
