Re: [sugar] notes from the field - Mongolia

2008-10-11 Thread rihoward1
You can transfers files between systems,  (in the absence of an XS  
server), using a light weight web server such as boa

To install boa on the XO:
su -
yum install boa

If you want more details on how to configure boa let me know and I  
will post the instructions.

 I use boa to pull log files off my XO.

Similarly you get get files off a MS Windows system using IIS.

Another email in this thread mentions the scripts for copying files  
to and form the Sugar Journal.


/Robert H.



On Oct 10, 2008, at 1:48 PM, Deniz Kural wrote:

I see how my email wasn't so nice. Apologies for increasing the  
animosity level. I was merely trying show how USB transfer from:


1) Xo to Xo
2) Other platform to Xo
could be useful.

Marco, I'm glad to have provoked a laugh, I was indeed joking. I  
don't even know you.
I agree with Martin -- I thought he didn't write anything  
offensive. I will follow your advice, Edward, Tomeu.


So to stay on topic,

1) I understand that there is in fact an easy way to transfer files  
between XOs with a USB (which I believe is necessary per the  
conditions in Mongolia - people living in mobile yurts, even in the  
largest city and the capital etc. as explained). In the future, if  
one day the network is universal, and the mesh works etc. I can see  
why we wouldn't need it.


2) I understand that sugar might not have been intended to work  
with other OS's, and should be thought of as an educational tool  
meant for children instead of a general all-purpose laptop computer.


But I also think, since this is a significant investment for many  
people, referring to my original example of  a teacher  typing up a  
reading (from a book let's say, or a handout)  on a regular  
computer s/he already has back home, and being able to transfer  
files back and forth on an Xo so s/he can distribute it to his/her  
students.


Thus, to fulfill its educational mission, Sugar cannot be a closed  
box.


Deniz



On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 8:43 AM, Tomeu Vizoso  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

2008/10/10 Deniz Kural [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 This whole why would you need a USB in mongolia?  conversation  
shows how
 out of touch some people on this list are with the people the  
project is

 trying to reach.

Deniz,

this list if composed by people from all around the world, some of
which have had contact with some cultures, others with other cultures.
What we have in common is the desire to build a software platform that
others can use to learn themselves and to teach others.

As we have the wish that our work is universally used, we'll need to
teach each other how is life in every part of the world and how we can
better work so it serves best everywhere. Mikus hasn't been afraid of
showing his ignorance about how USB sticks are used in Mongolia and
you have kindly replied with an useful explanation.

I hope we can keep sharing experiences like this but with a bit less
of animosity.

Regards,

Tomeu

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Questions on activity signing and upgrade. (Some answers to follow later.)

2008-10-11 Thread Michael Stone
Dear devel@ and security@,

Scott asked me to spend some time thinking on the topic of activity
signing [1] in the context of activity upgrade [2, 3, 4]. Since I have
some previous thoughts on this subject already available [5, 6], I will
concentrate on new thoughts in this thread. Please enjoy my questions
and offer your own thoughts; I will offer more of my own as I succeed in
organizing them.

Purpose
---

We have constructed (part of) an isolation system [7] to segregate some
programs run by our human operator from that person's full digital
agency (power to commit side-effects). Unsurprisingly, it is
occasionally necessary or convenient to give programs a larger share of
the human operator's authority than they would be granted by default.
Therefore, given that such privileged programs are to be supported, it
makes sense to provide some mechanism for their convenient use and to
take some care that the need to distribute such programs does not
increase our operator's vulnerability to purposeful malice [8].

We are also generally concerned with the ability to authenticate
authors to interlocutors [9] though we take care not to conflate
authentication with authorization [10].

Questions
-

Conceptually speaking, there are several sorts of sensitive data around
which we might consider creating locks, for example:

   * UI-relevant identifiers like 'author' or 'package-name'
   * endowed permissions
   * private data of various sorts e.g. in the datastore or rainbow spool

How, precisely, should this be done? 

Concerning credentials and environments:

   * What credentials should be considered sufficient to open each of
 these potential locks? 
   
   * By what interaction might the operator forcefully open a lock?

   * Must be we able to guarantee access to sufficient credentials to
 laptop distributors and support organizations like OLPC?
   
   * If so, how might we do so? By key delegation? By escrow?

   * What conditions may be made necessary for the ability to generate
 credentials?

   * What conditions must taken to be sufficient for the ability to
 generate credentials?

   * What conditions may be made necessary for the ability to verify
 messages with given credentials?

   * What conditions must taken to be sufficient for the ability to
 verify messages with given credentials?

   * Is it good to try to aggregate credentials in some form of
 registry?

Concerning protocols:
   
   * Does the authorization+endowment protocol need to be versioned?
   
   * If so, how should we expect to respond to messages from older
 versions?

   * Does the authorization+endowment protocol implementation need to be
 exposed as a public API?
   
   * How should we respond to invalid protocol messages?
  
   * If a Debian-scale compromise occurred, what responses might be
 available?

   * Should software packages be able to 'pin' themselves (preventing
 the installation of other versions of the package until
 forcefully overridden, perhaps by preparatory uninstallation)?

   * Should privilege endowments be automatically transferred newly
 encountered versions of an existing thing?

   * If this could be done in multiple ways, which way should be
 chosen?
   
   * How about other sensitive things like 'instance-specific data'?

   * Are there existing models for this sort of thing (e.g. [11]) which
 can be reused in some way?

Concerning use via Sugar on XOs:

   * where might XO-user-owned credentials live?

   * how might the user request their use?

   * what would prevent other programs from using them without
 authorization?

   * how might authorization be granted to programs (e.g. Pippy) to which
 the user wants to offer some use of the credentials?

References
--

[1]: Bitfrost's directive on activity signing.
--  http://tinyurl.com/4zb6ux#l450

[2]: Ivan's writings on activity update.
--  http://tinyurl.com/3r4f2z

[3]: #5657 - Loophole'd activities.
--  http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/5657

[4]: Activity updater design document.
--  http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Software_update

[5]: First commentary on bundles and bundle versioning.
--  http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Mstone/Commentaries/Bundles_1

[6]: Second commentary on bundles and bundle versioning.
--  http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Mstone/Commentaries/Bundles_2

[7]: Foreword of the Rainbow design document.
--  http://tinyurl.com/4hlsn8#l40

[8]: Bitfrost's discussion of purposeful vs. circumstantial malice.
--  http://tinyurl.com/4zb6ux#l379

[9]: Definition of P_IDENT.
--  http://tinyurl.com/4zb6ux#l838

[10]: Knowing my interlocutor doesn't mean I trust their code.
--   http://tinyurl.com/4zb6ux#l497

[11]: Security and Permissions in Android
--   http://code.google.com/android/devel/security.html
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Re: [sugar] 0.84/9.1 planning.

2008-10-11 Thread Tomeu Vizoso
On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 9:33 PM, C. Scott Ananian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 3:23 PM, Marco Pesenti Gritti
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Just to clarify: like our mini-conferences in the past, the plan is
 to have at least three days full of talks and hacking, so that we all
 Are you proposing something like:

 17 - 21 Talks and hacking
 24 - 25 Concrete priorities and goals

 I think more like:
  Nov 17-20: talks and hacking
  Nov 21: priorities meeting, wrapup.

 I'm not the planning committee, but this would be what I'd like to see.

Works for me. Should we be concerned that talk (or aguing) might
expand so much that there's little time to take actual decisions?
Perhaps a strict schedule may help with this?

Regards,

Tomeu
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Re: getting mp3 sound working w/ Gnash easily

2008-10-11 Thread Carlos Nazareno
Hey OLPC dev.

Yes please. Can we make step-by-step instructions getting mp3 sound
working with Gnash an urgent priority? An instruction for dummies, if
you will. Assume that the user trying to do this is not familiar with
linux, so step-by-step listing of commands to type at the terminal is
best.

We were having a discussion at the Gnash developer mailing list about
the absurdity of the situation where it was so difficult to get sound
working with Gnash on build 767 that the easy workaround to get sound
working with Flash content was to simply install the Adobe Flash
player. This completely defeats the philosophy with using Gnash in
lieu of Adobe Flash.

What I mean is that if it's going to take so much difficult jumping
through hoops to get sound working with Gnash on the OLPC, why not
just recommend that users install the Adobe Flash player which can be
done with a single wget-rpm combo and cause less of a support
nightmare?

It's a situation that's tooth-grittingly frustrating for the Gnash-dev team.

Also, is it possible that we ship the Gnash 0.8.4 RC with build 8.2.0
final instead of 0.8.3?

As I understand it from the Gnash dev team, Gnash 0.8.4 is very close
to release and so many bugs have been fixed in the current trunk. One
complaint with Gnash and OLPC ships is that the Gnash version that
ships with OLPC always ends up behind the current Gnash version.

And if we ship with 0.8.3, once Gnash 0.8.4 comes out (pretty close
enough from what I read from Gnash dev), G1G1 users are going to be
stuck with an older outdated version of Gnash for a long time.

Gnash dev, can we look at getting the latest version of Gnash 0.8.4
trunk to the OLPC dev guys asap?
AFAIK, the latest version of Gnash fixes so much more bugs than 0.8.3
stable that it's much more worth it to ship 0.8.4 release candidate
with the OLPC than 0.8.3 stable.

This is very similar to what Linux Mint
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_mint - a very popular derivative
of Ubuntu) did: they shipped with Adobe Flash 10 beta with their last
stable release, Elyssa or what Fedora 9 did, having shipped with
Firefox 3 release candidate 5 installed out of the box.

So is it possible to try to squeeze in Gnash 0.8.4 RC before we ship
OLPC build 8.2.0?

I've cc:ed the Gnash dev team.

Best regards,

-Naz

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 12:32 PM, Seth Woodworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 The way that I undertand it, OLPC's gstreamer is fairly custom, so the
 standard build of -ugly would have to be rebuilt for the XO.

 I suggest the Livna repo, mplayer and its assorted faad etc plugins
 instead.  Mplayer, mpd and wymypy as a sterieo-on-xo controlled over
 webbrowser works really well.

 Ian Daniher and I have a script that installs all of that (livna, mplayer
 etc), configure mpd, build a library, launch wymypy.py and even print your
 ip addr so you know what to connect to.

 One of us should get arround to finishing/uploading it Sunday?

 --Seth

 On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 4:31 PM, Carlos Nazareno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hey OLPC devel!

 I was wondering if you guys could help me get gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 installed.

 Can you guys walk me through this? (disclaimer - linux noob. just
 started tinkering w/ ubuntu this year)

 This is with regards to getting Gnash running with sound on the XO, build
 767.

 To get sound (mp3) running on my Fedora desktop, I just did yum
 gstreamer-ffmpeg and yum gstreamer-plugins-ugly.

 Okay, with the XO, first  installed the Fedora 9 Livna rpm from
 rpm.livna.org to get Livna added to my repositories.

 Then, I did a yum install gstreamer-ffmpeg, like I did on my desktop.

 Next:

 
 bash-3.2# yum install gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 Excluding Packages from Fedora 9 - i386
 Finished
 Excluding Packages from Fedora 9 - i386 - Updates Newkey
 Finished
 Excluding Packages from OLPC Development repo based off of Fedora 9
 Finished
 Excluding Packages from Fedora 9 - i386 - Updates
 Finished
 Setting up Install Process
 Parsing package install arguments
 Resolving Dependencies
 -- Running transaction check
 --- Package gstreamer-plugins-ugly.i386 0:0.10.8-1.lvn9 set to be updated
 -- Processing Dependency: libmpeg2.so.0 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libsidplay.so.1 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libdvdread.so.4 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libgstrtsp-0.10.so.0 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libgstsdp-0.10.so.0 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libmad.so.0 for package: gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Processing Dependency: libid3tag.so.0 for package:
 gstreamer-plugins-ugly
 -- Running transaction check
 --- Package libsidplay.i386 0:1.36.57-17 set to be updated
 --- Package mpeg2dec.i386 0:0.4.1-3.lvn8 set to be updated
 --- Package libdvdread.i386 0:4.1.2-3.fc9 set to be updated
 --- Package libmad.i386 0:0.15.1b-6.lvn9 set to be updated
 --- Package 

Re: [OLPC-Philippines] getting mp3 sound working w/ Gnash easily

2008-10-11 Thread Jerome Gotangco
On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Carlos Nazareno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Also, is it possible that we ship the Gnash 0.8.4 RC with build 8.2.0
 final instead of 0.8.3?

 As I understand it from the Gnash dev team, Gnash 0.8.4 is very close
 to release and so many bugs have been fixed in the current trunk. One
 complaint with Gnash and OLPC ships is that the Gnash version that
 ships with OLPC always ends up behind the current Gnash version.

 And if we ship with 0.8.3, once Gnash 0.8.4 comes out (pretty close
 enough from what I read from Gnash dev), G1G1 users are going to be
 stuck with an older outdated version of Gnash for a long time.

 Gnash dev, can we look at getting the latest version of Gnash 0.8.4
 trunk to the OLPC dev guys asap?
 AFAIK, the latest version of Gnash fixes so much more bugs than 0.8.3
 stable that it's much more worth it to ship 0.8.4 release candidate
 with the OLPC than 0.8.3 stable.


It would be great if its possible, but I fear that the time for code
freeze in OLPC has passed but the Gnash dev is about to release so its
an unfortunate timing for both camps.

What's possible for sure is that when the next version of Gnash comes
out, it can be pushed via Software Update.

I could be completely wrong though, but typical distribution releases
usually pick an upstream code freeze date, make necessary fixes, do
the testing for regression, then release with as few bugs as possible.
Then push for updates when fully tested.

-- 
Jerome G.

Website: http://www.gotangco.com
Blog: http://engage.wordpress.com
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Re: getting mp3 sound working w/ Gnash easily

2008-10-11 Thread Rob Savoye
On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 04:13:22PM +0800, Carlos Nazareno wrote:
 
 We were having a discussion at the Gnash developer mailing list about
 the absurdity of the situation where it was so difficult to get sound
 working with Gnash on build 767 that the easy workaround to get sound
 
  I have Gnash with working sound and full YouTube video support on 767, and
it wasn't even hard.

 What I mean is that if it's going to take so much difficult jumping
 through hoops to get sound working with Gnash on the OLPC, why not
 just recommend that users install the Adobe Flash player which can be
 done with a single wget-rpm combo and cause less of a support
 nightmare?

  Persovnally, the only way to fix this problem is to get political, and start
lobbying for the end of software patents. It's the *legal* issues here
around codecs and software patents that is the problem, not any technical
issue.

  btw, this attitude is why I've personally given up on the OLPC project. It's
been very upsetting to me to see such a great project slowly slide into
the proprietary software world. Oh that's right, Nicholas says I'm a free
software fundamentalist, holding back the OLPC project... Ship whatever you
want... I give up again.
  
 And if we ship with 0.8.3, once Gnash 0.8.4 comes out (pretty close
 enough from what I read from Gnash dev), G1G1 users are going to be
 stuck with an older outdated version of Gnash for a long time.
 
 Which won't work, then everyone will say Linux/Gnash sucks, and give me XP
and Adobe. Sigh...

- rob -

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Re: journal is hard + sugar and the digital age

2008-10-11 Thread Tomeu Vizoso
2008/10/9 Carol Hussein Lerche [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 I think a lot of the frustration around the journal could be abated by
 publishing a roadmap with actual projected times when each feature is
 planned to be available for testing in a joyride and then projected release
 number.  Many of the experiments and research-type proposals have sounded
 excellent as fixes or at least mitigations for the journal's underlying
 problems.  But from the outside perspective what I see reading conversations
 about this on the list is a sense that there are true believers inside the
 olpc and sugar development team that hold to a belief that a great day is
 coming for the journal, but without a concrete roadmap making that belief
 real to those only experiencing the difficulty in dealing with what is there
 right now, they sometimes sound a bit delusional.  (Not saying that they
 are...it's just a big mismatch between pie-in-the-sky pictures of a cloudy
 goal and no visible stepping stones to that goal).

 One thing that might help is a wiki FAQ about the journal collecting a
 roadmap and pointers to the work that has taken place already in one place.

I agree with your analysis and with the solution you propose, now we
just need to find people that helps us put this information in the
right format.

Some related pointers regarding roadmaps:

http://sugarlabs.org/go/ReleaseTeam/Roadmap/0.84#Goals
http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/0.84/Reliability#Datastore_rework
http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/0.84/Ideas#Journal

Thanks,

Tomeu

 On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Michael Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 12:55:43PM -0400, Erik Garrison wrote:
 You acknowledge that the system is not functioning as well as it should
 be in its curren state.  Please stop saying we are going to do this

 Instead, please stop saying we are going to do this and just do it and
 be done with it!

 and look for the simplest way to achieve a usable system for our usesr.

 Your arguments are impassioned but not persuasive. Please accept the
 fact that a cadre of People Who Have Shipped Software believe that
 making a good Journal is worth attempting one more time. If their choice
 proves faulty over the next six months, then you will be in a stronger
 position to argue your case; if not, then I believe the issue will be
 moot.

 I will gladly help in this endeavor, but I am concerned by our security
 system and the frequent implications that we are holding to old designs
 that my ideas and motivation have no place in this effort.

 Either cite specific concerns or desist from raising this issue.

 I don't think we can incorporate the concept of memory and forgetting
 into the Journal in a programmatic way.  Forgetting is as much a learned
 skill as remembering, and attempting to replicate it in software seems
 like a very difficult, if impossible, task.

 Attendees of the previous Journal Summit: please write down the
 algorithm you constructed for forgetting so that Erik can evaluate it.

 Erik: in the mean time, please tender opinions on [1] since this topic
 has been dealt with before by others.

 [1]: http://www.cs.ubc.ca/~feeley/papers/1999-4.pdf

 I feel that we are tilting at windmills if we believe we can reliably
 produce something so incredible in any conceivable timeframe.

 I believe that we have already produced something incredible, including
 but not limited to shipping or making available

   * power management capable of yielding 10-hour battery life
   * essentially all activities filesystem-isolated by default
   * a bandwidth-efficient atomic update system w/ rollback
   * a first-boot activation and passive-kill system which still permits
 the laptops to be fully unlocked at user request
   * a document-centric paradigm which was sufficiently compelling to
 inspire a document-centric GNOME summit
   * a distribution with a deep commitment and impressive support for
 multi-locale usage and for usage by illiterate users.
   * an implementation of the 802.11(s) draft spec

 to an installed user base on the order of 500K users.

 We have also constructed but not yet shipped or shipped demo-quality
 implementations of:

   * demo-quality networked collaboration software good enough to spur
 real interest
   * a revised Journal,
   * an indexed versioned content-addressed filesystem,
   * network isolation,
   * efficient multicast wireless data and presence transport,
   * server-side jabber event filtering and searching

 Finally, we have substantial design and requirements documents waiting
 for implementation in each of security, networking, and the UI.

 In conclusion, given how far we've come in the past two years, I
 sincerely hope that we continue to attempt the same task for the next
 two years. Where is your evidence that we're taking on too much?

 I am furthermore frustrated by the tight integration of the Journal into
 the window manager.

 Please point to the 

Re: journal is hard + sugar and the digital age

2008-10-11 Thread Tomeu Vizoso
On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 6:55 PM, Erik Garrison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 12:13:02PM -0400, Eben Eliason wrote:
 On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 10:15 AM, Carlos Nazareno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Hi Tomeu. Some personal feedback:
 
  3) Basically - The journal is really hard for people/ kids to use over
  a longer period of time. Kids and teachers can't find things that they
  did unless it was done within the last 30 minutes.
 Could you please elaborate on the difficulties that people have when
 using the journal?
 
  I've experienced the same problem. Items tend to clutter up in the
  journal over time, it's like viewing your entire web browsing history.
  Its current implementation simply leads to information overload with
  the accumulating number of entries.
 
  IMHO, the philosophy of nothing gets forgotten with the journal is a
  bit flawed because as people we don't even naturally do that. We
  selectively choose which information to remember and mark as important
  and discard the rest because that's just information overload.

 You're right on with this comment.  Of course, I don't think nothing
 gets forgotten is really what we're aiming for; in fact, we aim for
 much the opposite.  However, as it's currently implemented, you're
 right!  The Journal is actually supposed to retain everything you've
 done *quite recently* so that you can always go back and find, remix,
 resume, etc.  Experimentation is encouraged.

 However, the very principles the Journal was designed around include
 the concept of memory, and particularly the fading thereof.  Over
 time, less used, unstarred, unimportant files will eventually be
 backed up and then removed (probably after confirmation, but perhaps
 you can opt out of the confirmation step) by the system, so that the
 further back in time you look, the less you have left, but the more
 relevant the remaining items are to your history with the laptop.

 This is a very important aspect of the Journal that just hasn't had
 time to happen, yet.


 You acknowledge that the system is not functioning as well as it should
 be in its curren state.  Please stop saying we are going to do this
 and look for the simplest way to achieve a usable system for our usesr.
 I will gladly help in this endeavor, but I am concerned by our security
 system and the frequent implications that we are holding to old designs
 that my ideas and motivation have no place in this effort.

No idea about what security has to do here.

The journal development has stalled because a fundamental part of it
(the datastore) hasn't had resources assigned to it. Don't ask me why.

You're continually mixing implementation and design issues, which
makes this discussion much more difficult than it already is.

I don't think there's much interest in discussing that the current
implementation sucks, we all agree here. What we would like to discuss
and would welcome your contributions, is how the design can be
improved in such a way that a much better implementation can happen
soonish. Several people are contributing usefully to this discussion,
why do you think you are not able to?

 I don't think we can incorporate the concept of memory and forgetting
 into the Journal in a programmatic way.  Forgetting is as much a learned
 skill as remembering, and attempting to replicate it in software seems
 like a very difficult, if impossible, task.  I feel that we are tilting
 at windmills if we believe we can reliably produce something so
 incredible in any conceivable timeframe.

I don't think we aim to actually replicate any brain function. We
just want to give the user tools that assist him in better managing
his data in a space with restricted capacity.

 I positively advocate a simplification of our expectations about what
 the Journal will do.  Just a system which consistently suggests (but
 does not enforce) default, intelligent organizations for things in a
 traditional filesystem, provides manual and automatic tagging support,
 and indexes the text of written documents will be a giant step forward
 in terms of reliability and interoperability with the outside world.
 With metadata about files stashed in a database, such as time, date,
 text (for indexing and search), tags, creating application, etc. we can
 do everything the Journal is intended to do, but no sacrifice the
 simplicity and reliability of the default filesystem in the process of
 developing the Journal to its full capacity.

 For this we only need to work on three sets of components:

  1) Journal -- a file browsing application which provides numerous views
 onto the corpus of data the user creates and handles; views being
 time-ordered, filtered, hierarchical (traditional), tag-based, etc.
 Allowing other applications to manage files will let contributors create
 or port existing systems to the Sugar environment to fulfill these
 functions as well.

  2) Indexer -- a simple filesystem crawler that walks across the set of
 

Re: Gnash/Flash video support - Philippine CyberEd program

2008-10-11 Thread Sebastien Adgnot
Hi Carlos,

For delivering video on the web, you can also create an account on
http://www.dailymotion.com, a video sharing web site available in many
languages, upload your videos, add them to the group OLPC and they will
become available in .ogg, Theora + Vorbis, for the XO. You can already watch
videos on http://olpc.dailymotion.com, using the default embedded video
player Totem in the browser. If you're using the release 8.2-767, you will
even be able to watch them in full screen, which is great!

We are looking for educational videos for the kids, so if you need more
information, please don't hesitate to ask.

Thanks.

Sebastien

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Carlos Nazareno [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 Hi guys. Can we try to get a little more support for Gnash + sound on
 the OLPC for the purpose of Flash Video? Flash video is now the
 de-facto platform for delivering video on the web, and the following
 piece of news from the Philippines might be of interest. It's about
 the Philippine Cyber Education program, and it also aims to deliver a
 lot of video lecture content to public schools via web.

 

 (UPDATE) Arroyo: CyberEd project to push through

 http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/breakingnews/infotech/view_article.php?article_id=93359

 By Lira Dalangin-Fernandez
 INQUIRER.net
 First Posted 11:28am (Mla time) 10/09/2007

 MANILA, Philippines -- Despite heavy criticism, President Gloria
 Macapagal-Arroyo said Tuesday that the government would push through
 with the $460-million Cyber Education project and was planning to tap
 the academe to ensure the project would suit the needs of the
 students.

 In her opening statement at the Cabinet meeting of the National
 Security Council and the National Economic Development Authority,
 Arroyo stressed that investments and infrastructure projects should
 not be hindered by controversies.

 Hindi dapat mahinto ang imprastraktura at investment dahil sa mga
 batikos [Infrastructure and investment should not stop because of
 criticisms], she said.

 On September 22, Arroyo suspended the implementation of the Cyber
 Education and the $329-million National Broadband Network projects,
 blaming the political noise for her decision.

 Last week, Trade Secretary Peter Favila said the broadband project
 with China's ZTE Corporation would no longer be implemented, but that
 the rest of the projects signed in China in April, including the Cyber
 Education project, were merely suspended.

 Asked to clarify if the President's statement's meant that she has
 lifted the suspension on the project, Press Secretary Ignacio Bunye
 said Arroyo has given the go-signal for the review of the project.

 The review of the project could eventually lead to the project's
 implementation, Bunye added.

 Arroyo said she has ordered the China Projects Oversight Panel under
 Favila to ensure that the very important project of Cyber Education
 would push through for the benefit of the millions of students.

 Kokonsultahin nila rito ang Education Task Force sa ilalim ni Father
 Ben Nebres ng Ateneo, upang matiyak na sa alinsunod sa pangangailangan
 ng edukasyon ang proyekto [They will consult the Education Task Force
 under Father Ben Nebres of the Ateneo to ensure that the project will
 meet the students' needs], she said.

 Arroyo also tapped the Procurement Transparency Group together with
 the Civil Society for Procurement Reform to see to it that the
 processes in completing the project would be open and transparent.

 The Cyber Education project, to be undertaken in cooperation with a
 Chinese firm, aims to bridge the learning gap between urban and rural
 schools by using satellite technology to beam televised lectures to
 students and teachers in far-flung areas.

 The satellite-based distance learning program is capable of
 broadcasting lectures by the best teachers from DepEd model schools to
 other public schools nationwide.

 The program, which targets a total of 37,794 public schools in the
 next three years with an annual coverage of 13.6 million students, is
 the best thing to happen to Philippine education, according to
 Education Secretary Jesli Lapus.
 Originally posted at 11:29am

 --
 Carlos Nazareno
 http://www.object404.com

 interactive media specialist
 zen graffiti studios
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Gnash/Flash video support - Philippine CyberEd program

2008-10-11 Thread Carlos Nazareno
Hi guys. Can we try to get a little more support for Gnash + sound on
the OLPC for the purpose of Flash Video? Flash video is now the
de-facto platform for delivering video on the web, and the following
piece of news from the Philippines might be of interest. It's about
the Philippine Cyber Education program, and it also aims to deliver a
lot of video lecture content to public schools via web.



(UPDATE) Arroyo: CyberEd project to push through
http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/breakingnews/infotech/view_article.php?article_id=93359

By Lira Dalangin-Fernandez
INQUIRER.net
First Posted 11:28am (Mla time) 10/09/2007

MANILA, Philippines -- Despite heavy criticism, President Gloria
Macapagal-Arroyo said Tuesday that the government would push through
with the $460-million Cyber Education project and was planning to tap
the academe to ensure the project would suit the needs of the
students.

In her opening statement at the Cabinet meeting of the National
Security Council and the National Economic Development Authority,
Arroyo stressed that investments and infrastructure projects should
not be hindered by controversies.

Hindi dapat mahinto ang imprastraktura at investment dahil sa mga
batikos [Infrastructure and investment should not stop because of
criticisms], she said.

On September 22, Arroyo suspended the implementation of the Cyber
Education and the $329-million National Broadband Network projects,
blaming the political noise for her decision.

Last week, Trade Secretary Peter Favila said the broadband project
with China's ZTE Corporation would no longer be implemented, but that
the rest of the projects signed in China in April, including the Cyber
Education project, were merely suspended.

Asked to clarify if the President's statement's meant that she has
lifted the suspension on the project, Press Secretary Ignacio Bunye
said Arroyo has given the go-signal for the review of the project.

The review of the project could eventually lead to the project's
implementation, Bunye added.

Arroyo said she has ordered the China Projects Oversight Panel under
Favila to ensure that the very important project of Cyber Education
would push through for the benefit of the millions of students.

Kokonsultahin nila rito ang Education Task Force sa ilalim ni Father
Ben Nebres ng Ateneo, upang matiyak na sa alinsunod sa pangangailangan
ng edukasyon ang proyekto [They will consult the Education Task Force
under Father Ben Nebres of the Ateneo to ensure that the project will
meet the students' needs], she said.

Arroyo also tapped the Procurement Transparency Group together with
the Civil Society for Procurement Reform to see to it that the
processes in completing the project would be open and transparent.

The Cyber Education project, to be undertaken in cooperation with a
Chinese firm, aims to bridge the learning gap between urban and rural
schools by using satellite technology to beam televised lectures to
students and teachers in far-flung areas.

The satellite-based distance learning program is capable of
broadcasting lectures by the best teachers from DepEd model schools to
other public schools nationwide.

The program, which targets a total of 37,794 public schools in the
next three years with an annual coverage of 13.6 million students, is
the best thing to happen to Philippine education, according to
Education Secretary Jesli Lapus.
Originally posted at 11:29am

-- 
Carlos Nazareno
http://www.object404.com

interactive media specialist
zen graffiti studios
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: journal is hard + sugar and the digital age

2008-10-11 Thread Tomeu Vizoso
On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 4:15 PM, Carlos Nazareno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi Tomeu. Some personal feedback:

 3) Basically - The journal is really hard for people/ kids to use over
 a longer period of time. Kids and teachers can't find things that they
 did unless it was done within the last 30 minutes.
Could you please elaborate on the difficulties that people have when
using the journal?

 I've experienced the same problem. Items tend to clutter up in the
 journal over time, it's like viewing your entire web browsing history.
 Its current implementation simply leads to information overload with
 the accumulating number of entries.

I can understand that if you expect to be able to deal with all the
items in the list view, you will find it unbearable after you reach
some dozens of entries. We don't have an archive button that can
take items from that list, so it keeps growing and growing.

But I don't think that's how the journal is expected to be used. We
don't have small, _fixed_ boxes in which you can deal with its
contents in just one go. Rather, we give ways for the user to create
those boxes dynamically. I think we have reached consensus that for
the journal concept to go forward, we need to improve the tools that
the user has to create those boxes in ways it makes sense to her.

As an illustration, I have several thousands of emails in my GMail
inbox, I never use Archive and only delete very, very occasionally
(not even once per day). I _never_ try to navigate through the list of
emails in inbox, and only use it to read the most recent emails (first
page only). Of course I would feel overloaded if I tried!

The other ways I use to find the information I want is to
automatically tag email as they come, I have the following filter
rules:

- One rule per big mailing list: Devel, Sugar, Bugs (trac mail), Localization.

- One rule that tags bug emails from Trac that matches some keywords
important for my work, because I stopped reading all bugmail some
months ago.

- One rule for the rest of the mailing lists I'm subscribed to (lower
traffic): Olpc-sur, Olpc-library, Testing, IAEP, etc

- One rule for tagging email from members of my family.

And that's all. The tags subdivide the biggest box in smaller boxes,
but still too big to be dealt directly. So I can search by sender,
receiver, full text, etc

Sugar already has some very primitive automatic tagging. Activities
set metadata based on the content of the activity and, hopefully, in
terms of how the user would describe (and thus search for) the entry.
We can do much better here, and have already plans to improve this
further.

And I'm very happy that I stopped using Evolution and thus struggling
to keep my inbox clean, now I have more time to code and write emails.
;)

 IMHO, the philosophy of nothing gets forgotten with the journal is a
 bit flawed because as people we don't even naturally do that. We
 selectively choose which information to remember and mark as important
 and discard the rest because that's just information overload.

We actually aim to forget:

http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Human_Interface_Guidelines/The_Laptop_Experience/The_Journal

 Think about it from a browser paradigm. You bookmark important items
 that you want to reuse later on. On the other hand, viewing your
 browser history over a prolonged period of time gets pretty unwieldy.

I guess that's why FF has a search facility in its history browser.

 Another problem I've had is that I tried to offload some programs onto
 an SD card due to the XO's limited internal storage. This can lead to
 hundreds to thousands of files when opening up the SD card in the
 journal. The flat heirarchy makes navigation extremely difficult when
 you have this many files.

How is this different from the main journal? If only that the SD card
is potentially used to interchange files with other OSs, then I agree
that presenting the same view as in other OSs makes sense. Now we only
need to find someone who implements it...

 Sure, there's search, but that presupposes that you know the names of
 the files you're looking for. What if you stick in something that has
 hundreds of files and you were looking for an image file or something
 that you didn't know the name of?

Well, that's why we have other means to aid in finding. You can for
example filter by the Image type and reduce the list to only images.
I'm sure we can improve here, what do you suggest? Perhaps considering
path components as tags and allowing the user to browse the device by
tags (Scott's proposal, I think)?

 Hmm. I think one improvement that can be added to the journal is to
 improve the display filters?

Sure.

 Like for example, the ability to filter by delineated date? It would
 be a little better if users could browse the journal from a date
 range, like the range of 2 weeks to 3 weeks ago only because that's
 when the user remembers the activity that was used.

 Another one is the ability to view journal entries by name
 

Re: getting mp3 sound working w/ Gnash easily

2008-10-11 Thread Walter Bender
Perhaps we could add a section on installing Gnash in the Flossmanual
for Sugar??? It may be that the it belongs in the Running GNU/Linux
applications chapter of the Extending Sugar section, or maybe we
should have a chapter devoted to Extending/Enhancing the Sugar
Environment??

-walter

---
Walter Bender
Sugar Labs
http://www.sugarlabs.org
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Re: [Server-devel] physical security of the XS and XO-as-XS

2008-10-11 Thread Bryan Berry
I have been discussing these issues off-list w/ Greg Smith. I will
summarize some of our discussion and then reply to Sameer about physical
security for the XS and to the general suggestion that the XO can serve
as an XS. I have paraphrased Greg's question, don't blame him if I have
bastardized his phrasings. 

Here is the quick gist, 1) a lot of poor schools can gather the funds to
take care of the XS if shown the potential benefits and 2) IMHO using
the XO as XS is not a good idea.

Q: Are most of your target schools likely to have Internet and
money/power to have a server?

A: If the schools can afford to pay for the electricity to charge the
XO's, then they can easily afford a server.

Q: How did it go putting a server in schools and making sure they don't
get stolen?

A: This is true, it is hard to secure a server, but if a school can't
provide a secure place for the server then they can't secure their
copper electrical wiring, a wireless router, or any other kind
networking equipment. If the school can't afford electricity, then the
students who attend probably don't have electricity at home. Our
requirement for working w/ a school is that the school already has
electricity.

A hosted solution can work as long as their is a really consistent
Internet connection to the school. That can be hard in __a lot__ of
developing countries. Frankly, I think it is much, much easier to secure
the XS than provide a stable Internet connection to a remote school.

Q: Perhaps we should focus on the poorest countries. Therefore no
Internet and no server. The server can  actually still add value even
with no Internet but there is concern its hard to secure.

A: Easy. If the school can't keep their electrical wiring from getting
stolen, they can't keep the server safe. The copper in electrical wiring
is quite valuable as thieves could easily repurpose it for home wiring.

Q: What are some possible benefits to using a regular tower pc as XS?

Virtually every Dept of Ed will want to put much more content on the XS
than can fit on an XO. You can add external USB hard drives until it
becomes one big kludge. 

Additionally, I am convinced that school administrators would see the
XO-as-XS as a spare XO and distribute to kids who don't have XO's at
their school or take it home to their own child.

We can add a lot of value to the OLPC initiative through the XS, for
relatively low investment of time and effort, but only if the XS
hardware can be upgraded. The XO obviously can't be upgraded.

A few examples:
1) e-mail for the teachers hosted on the XS. This gives teachers a
bigger stake in OLPC deployments and in the making sure their Internet
connection stays up. BTW, gmail is wy too slow across a slow
Internet connection.
2) VoIP connection to the Dept of Ed., so the Dept of Ed can call the
school, and vice versa. A great incentive to the school and Dept to
maintain and fund that Internet connection. 
3) Offline wikipedia, moodle courses, local copies of indigenous art and
music resources, I could go on forever.

There are drawbacks to the PC-as-XS, most notably power. However, you
will have to to set up power backup anyways to maintain the Internet
connection.

There are some scenarios where an XS may not be feasible at all, but we
must have a baseline requirement here for an XO deployment: the majority
of the kids OR the school must have consistent electricity. Here in
Nepal our base requirement is that a pilot school must already have
electricity. 


-- 
Bryan W. Berry
Technology Director
OLE Nepal, http://www.olenepal.org

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Re: Panorama activity

2008-10-11 Thread Nirav Patel
My roomate and I wrote an auto-stitching Panorama Activity during the
Yahoo Hack Day at CMU yesterday (ended up winning the Hack for Good
award).  I'll be posting it in the wiki at some point today.  It needs
a whole lot of polishing, since it was written in 24 hours.

I ran into the same problem that Ben did with autowhitebalance and
autoexposure.  I looked through the ov7670 driver, and it seems
changing V4L2_CID_BRIGHTNESS should flip the auto exposure control
(AEC) bit in one of the registers.  I added support for changing
brightness to the camera module in Pygame, but either disabling AEC
doesn't work, or it just makes auto gain control and auto white
balance work even harder to change the image.  Other than that, the
stitching seems to work ok.  I'm going to pyramidize it at some point
to make it faster, and do something to improve the accuracy.  The
slowness of stitching doesn't effect the user experience much though,
because it only stitches after the user is done taking the pictures.

The Activity we wrote uses the Flickr API for an upload to Flickr
button.  I feel that this is the most important part.  There is
support for saving the stitched images as Journal entries, but it
would be wonderful if a kid anywhere in the world could see panoramas
taken by other kids elsewhere.  Flickr is far from ideal for this.
Beyond not really being designed for viewing panoramas, it is
currently set up to just upload every picture to my personal Flickr
account.  My API key, secret key, and an authentication token are
prerecorded in the activity, so anyone could potentially use those
values to edit existing photos and upload whatever to my Flickr
account:  http://flickr.com/photos/nrpatel/

It seems Gigapan doesn't have an upload API.  gigapan.org works in
Browse on my os767 XO, but panning around an image is pretty slow.
Anyone have ideas on this?  A better way to Flickr, ideas for
designing a new site, getting Gigapan to add an upload API, etc?

The other issue we ran into is integrating OLPCGames with pyGTK stuff.
 We used OLPCGames to take advantage of capturing the images as SDL
surfaces, but we also wanted pyGTK to pop up a Dialog box when the
user hits Save, asking for a Title, Tags, and a Description of the
panorama.  We hacked together something that does pop up the box and
saves correctly, but fails to ever destroy the box.  It then just sits
with the box open, preventing the user from using or exiting the
Activity.  Is it possible to use pyGTK beyond the toolbox while still
using OLPCGames?

Nirav

On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 6:41 PM, Jeff Keller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yeah -- I sent my loaner unit off to Burning Man, but I should get it
 back soon, and I'd be delighted to talk about stitchers.  Randy
 Sargent and I wrote our own for GigaPan last summer because nothing
 else was up to the task.  It relies on a model of the GigaPan device's
 behavior to do rough placement, but it can auto-stitch 1000+ images
 with  10 pixels rms displacement error, and it should be open-sourced
 one of these days.  Of course, it uses much more storage, RAM, and CPU
 than an XO has, but nothing inappropriate to what it does, and there
 are some nice improvements in the works.  Oh, and my office is down
 the block from OLPC's.
 --Jeff

 On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 12:38 PM, Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Speaking of which, Jeff Keller has been trying to get OLPC folks to
 learn more about using his gigapan group's cameras (and perhaps to
 borrow one to bring them into a country for weeks) for a while.  Jeff,
 Ben Schwartz and Nirav are really interested in large-scale image
 splicing...

 SJ
 ---
 617 529 4266


 On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 2:08 AM, Brian Jordan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 *bump*

 http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Panorama_camera_activity

 (code? Nirav is interested in doing something similar!)

 Brian

 On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 11:56 PM, Benjamin M. Schwartz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 The XO happens to be perfect for shooting stitched panoramic photographs, 
 due to
 the swivel design.  I tested it out in the OLPCHQ lobby. Then, I wrote a 
 simple
 panorama stitcher in 50 lines of Python.  It runs in 3.4 seconds on my 
 Core Duo,
 producing this output:

 http://people.fas.harvard.edu/~bmschwar/lobby_ugly.jpg

 The results aren't too bad.  I also tried stitching this scene with Hugin, 
 the
 most powerful panorama stitcher I know of.  Hugin required significant user
 intervention and half an hour of computing time, producing this output:

 http://people.fas.harvard.edu/~bmschwar/lobby_pretty.jpg

 This scene is unusually difficult because of the huge indoor-outdoor 
 contrast.
 Given this positive result, I would like to work on a panorama-making 
 activity,
 possibly inside Capture.  I know that at age 10, I loved making panoramas 
 out of
 photographs.  Panoramas provide an immersive way for children to 
 communicate
 their environments to each other and to the 

Hosting request for GCompris

2008-10-11 Thread Bruno Coudoin
1. Project name : GCompris
2. Existing website, if any : http://gcompris.net
3. One-line description : Educational Suite

4. Longer description   : GCompris is an educational software suite 
comprising
: of numerous activities for children aged 2 to 10.
: Some of the activities are game orientated, but 
nonetheless 
: still educational.

5. URLs of similar projects :

6. Committer list 

  Username   Full name SSH2 key URLE-mail
     - --
   #1 bdoin  Bruno Coudoin http://gcompris.net/bdoin_ssh_key.asc [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]

   If any developers don't have their SSH2 keys on the web, please attach them 
   to the application e-mail.

7. Preferred development model

   I don't need a git account. The project is under cvs, hosted by gnome at:
   http://svn.gnome.org/svn/gcompris/

8. Set up a project mailing list:

   [X] No

9. Commit notifications

   [X] No commit notifications, please

10. Shell accounts

   As a general rule, we don't provide shell accounts to developers unless 
   there's a demonstrated need. If you have one, please explain here, and
   list the usernames of the committers above needing shell access.

11. Translation
   [ ] Set up the laptop.org Pootle server to allow translation commits to be 
made
   [X] Translation arrangements have already been made by the gnome translation 
teams

12. Notes/comments:

  What is most important for me is a file space. I am currently hosting
  bundles under gcompris.net but it creates way too much traffic for us.


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Re: Read bug hit in Rwanda

2008-10-11 Thread Sayamindu Dasgupta
Hi,

On Thu, Oct 9, 2008 at 2:29 AM, Greg Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi Sayamindu,

 Are you maintaining Read now or is Morgan?

 I got a ping from Brian who is in Rwanda and he confirmed that this bug:
 http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/7090

 was actually seen by kids there. Just as cjl predicted in Trac, it was
 hit by kids on first exposure to the XO.

 Can we get some attention on that one? Especially if it can be fixed in
 the activity, I would like to have a new version in place when we try to
 upgrade Rwanda 8.2.0 later this year.



Morgan is maintaining Read, but I'm helping him with the work,
especially in the UI and features segment  (Read needs a lot of love
:-). I'll look into the problem, and if no other quick solution is
found, as Brian suggests, I'll restrict the upper zoom limit of Read
so that at least it would not crash.
I noticed that even in Evince, the maximum amount of allowed zoom is a
factor of 4 (400%) - so probably they are also restricting the maximum
zoom.
Thanks,
Sayamindu

-- 
Sayamindu Dasgupta
[http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings]
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Re: getting mp3 sound working w/ Gnash easily

2008-10-11 Thread Seth Woodworth
Rob,

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 5:44 AM, Rob Savoye [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 04:13:22PM +0800, Carlos Nazareno wrote:

  We were having a discussion at the Gnash developer mailing list about
  the absurdity of the situation where it was so difficult to get sound
  working with Gnash on build 767 that the easy workaround to get sound

   I have Gnash with working sound and full YouTube video support on 767,
 and
 it wasn't even hard.







  What I mean is that if it's going to take so much difficult jumping
  through hoops to get sound working with Gnash on the OLPC, why not
  just recommend that users install the Adobe Flash player which can be
  done with a single wget-rpm combo and cause less of a support
  nightmare?

   Persovnally, the only way to fix this problem is to get political, and
 start
 lobbying for the end of software patents. It's the *legal* issues here
 around codecs and software patents that is the problem, not any technical
 issue.

  btw, this attitude is why I've personally given up on the OLPC project.
 It's
 been very upsetting to me to see such a great project slowly slide into
 the proprietary software world. Oh that's right, Nicholas says I'm a free
 software fundamentalist, holding back the OLPC project... Ship whatever you
 want... I give up again.



The only deployment that I know is shipping proprietary stuff (flash/java)
is the Birmingham deployment which has a lot of legacy proprietary ties to
discovery-kids videos and other legacy closed-locked-in education websites.

SJ and I were/are working with some people at DailyMotion to serve up videos
embeded as OGG and using only free formats.  I really *want* people to be
able to use ONLY free formats on their XO.  I *want* them to know what
installing proprietary codecs mean before they try to install adobe flash.





  And if we ship with 0.8.3, once Gnash 0.8.4 comes out (pretty close
  enough from what I read from Gnash dev), G1G1 users are going to be
  stuck with an older outdated version of Gnash for a long time.

  Which won't work, then everyone will say Linux/Gnash sucks, and give me XP
 and Adobe. Sigh...

- rob -





This is the second time that I've heard from you that you've had gnash
running on/in sugar better than OLPC is, but I haven't seen any of your
packages.  Is there a permission or access you require that is stopping the
publication of your work upstream?

If you're not happy with OLPC, is there something stopping you from
contributing directly to Sugarlabs?

Even if you give up on OLPC, satisfy your own politics by educating the 10's
of thousdands of people in the US with XO's about Gnash and codec's.
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Re: Panorama activity

2008-10-11 Thread Brian Jordan
On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 10:26 PM, Nirav Patel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 My roomate and I wrote an auto-stitching Panorama Activity during the
 Yahoo Hack Day at CMU yesterday (ended up winning the Hack for Good
 award).  I'll be posting it in the wiki at some point today.  It needs
 a whole lot of polishing, since it was written in 24 hours.

 I ran into the same problem that Ben did with autowhitebalance and
 autoexposure.  I looked through the ov7670 driver, and it seems
 changing V4L2_CID_BRIGHTNESS should flip the auto exposure control
 (AEC) bit in one of the registers.  I added support for changing
 brightness to the camera module in Pygame, but either disabling AEC
 doesn't work, or it just makes auto gain control and auto white
 balance work even harder to change the image.  Other than that, the
 stitching seems to work ok.  I'm going to pyramidize it at some point
 to make it faster, and do something to improve the accuracy.  The
 slowness of stitching doesn't effect the user experience much though,
 because it only stitches after the user is done taking the pictures.


So cool -- can't wait to try.

 The Activity we wrote uses the Flickr API for an upload to Flickr
 button.  I feel that this is the most important part.  There is
 support for saving the stitched images as Journal entries, but it
 would be wonderful if a kid anywhere in the world could see panoramas
 taken by other kids elsewhere.  Flickr is far from ideal for this.
 Beyond not really being designed for viewing panoramas, it is
 currently set up to just upload every picture to my personal Flickr
 account.  My API key, secret key, and an authentication token are
 prerecorded in the activity, so anyone could potentially use those
 values to edit existing photos and upload whatever to my Flickr
 account:  http://flickr.com/photos/nrpatel/


Awesome! :-D

Maybe one could set up a one-way upload script for this on dev (or
some appropriate
community-developed-web-services-server-of-the-future)? This script,
then, could handle the uploading via flickr API securely.

Regards
Brian

 It seems Gigapan doesn't have an upload API.  gigapan.org works in
 Browse on my os767 XO, but panning around an image is pretty slow.
 Anyone have ideas on this?  A better way to Flickr, ideas for
 designing a new site, getting Gigapan to add an upload API, etc?

 The other issue we ran into is integrating OLPCGames with pyGTK stuff.
  We used OLPCGames to take advantage of capturing the images as SDL
 surfaces, but we also wanted pyGTK to pop up a Dialog box when the
 user hits Save, asking for a Title, Tags, and a Description of the
 panorama.  We hacked together something that does pop up the box and
 saves correctly, but fails to ever destroy the box.  It then just sits
 with the box open, preventing the user from using or exiting the
 Activity.  Is it possible to use pyGTK beyond the toolbox while still
 using OLPCGames?

 Nirav

 On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 6:41 PM, Jeff Keller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Yeah -- I sent my loaner unit off to Burning Man, but I should get it
 back soon, and I'd be delighted to talk about stitchers.  Randy
 Sargent and I wrote our own for GigaPan last summer because nothing
 else was up to the task.  It relies on a model of the GigaPan device's
 behavior to do rough placement, but it can auto-stitch 1000+ images
 with  10 pixels rms displacement error, and it should be open-sourced
 one of these days.  Of course, it uses much more storage, RAM, and CPU
 than an XO has, but nothing inappropriate to what it does, and there
 are some nice improvements in the works.  Oh, and my office is down
 the block from OLPC's.
 --Jeff

 On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 12:38 PM, Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Speaking of which, Jeff Keller has been trying to get OLPC folks to
 learn more about using his gigapan group's cameras (and perhaps to
 borrow one to bring them into a country for weeks) for a while.  Jeff,
 Ben Schwartz and Nirav are really interested in large-scale image
 splicing...

 SJ
 ---
 617 529 4266


 On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 2:08 AM, Brian Jordan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 *bump*

 http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Panorama_camera_activity

 (code? Nirav is interested in doing something similar!)

 Brian

 On Wed, Jun 20, 2007 at 11:56 PM, Benjamin M. Schwartz [EMAIL 
 PROTECTED] wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 The XO happens to be perfect for shooting stitched panoramic photographs, 
 due to
 the swivel design.  I tested it out in the OLPCHQ lobby. Then, I wrote a 
 simple
 panorama stitcher in 50 lines of Python.  It runs in 3.4 seconds on my 
 Core Duo,
 producing this output:

 http://people.fas.harvard.edu/~bmschwar/lobby_ugly.jpg

 The results aren't too bad.  I also tried stitching this scene with 
 Hugin, the
 most powerful panorama stitcher I know of.  Hugin required significant 
 user
 intervention and half an hour of computing time, producing this output:

 

Re: [Server-devel] physical security of the XS and XO-as-XS

2008-10-11 Thread Martin Langhoff
On Sun, Oct 12, 2008 at 3:43 AM, Bryan Berry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 2) IMHO using
 the XO as XS is not a good idea.

Nothing explains your post why it's a bad idea. If you are going to
setup a safe cabinet of some sort, it's not very different to make
an XO safe from making a tower pc safe.

Your points about other bits of infra are valuable too. But I have to
tell you _deployment countries_ are asking us whether the XOs can be
used in the XS role. People on the ground there are asking for it.

I see some reasons for this:

 - Procurement process is complex. Once they have the govt OK to get
XOs, it's relatively easier to request extra XOs for the role. Getting
other hw for the XS can take months if not years.

 - Very few hw makers are offering machines that are solid state,
heat/dust/humidity resistant. The XO has all of that and is cheap. The
few hw makers I've seen offering similar features are rather
expensive.

 Additionally, I am convinced that school administrators would see the
 XO-as-XS as a spare XO and distribute to kids who don't have XO's at
 their school or take it home to their own child.

It won't even boot to Sugar, and user education call take a part here
-- I don't think the confusion will last very long.

You may not want it for the Nepal deployment, but we cannot argue with
the fact that there is intense interest.

There are also other use cases where it's useful to be able to run the
XS sw on an XO - for example, the warehouse scenarios where you take 1
XO and use it as the server that will update all the other XOs.

The issue of theft is real, but is not limited to the XO hw -- and in
fact, a normal tower pc is in some cases more desirable - as it's a
general purpose machine. Uruguay has -- I believe -- done some
interesting work in securing their school servers, though I don't know
the details.

This is work that needs to happen for a long list of reasons. Within
the constraints we have, I aim for flexibility: give the local teams a
range of options, and this is a _very_ valuable one, one that is
within reach now that a vanilla Fedora boots on the XO.

cheers,



m
-- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- School Server Architect
 - ask interesting questions
 - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
 - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff
___
Server-devel mailing list
Server-devel@lists.laptop.org
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[Server-devel] physical security of the XS and XO-as-XS

2008-10-11 Thread Martin Langhoff
[Note: this is a resend - with some better editing - the earlier email
got sent prematurely...]

On Sun, Oct 12, 2008 at 3:43 AM, Bryan Berry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 2) IMHO using
 the XO as XS is not a good idea.

Nothing explains in your post why it's a bad idea. If you are going to
setup a safe cabinet of some sort for the server, it's not very
different to make an XO safe from making a tower pc safe.

Your points about other bits of infra are very valuable. Cable theft,
antenna theft are also important. Interstingly, _deployment countries_
are asking us whether the XOs can be used in the XS role. People on
the ground there are asking for it.

I see some reasons for this:

 - Procurement process is complex. Once they have the govt OK to get
XOs, it's relatively easier to request extra XOs for the role. Getting
other hw for the XS can take months if not years.

 - Very few hw makers are offering machines that are solid state,
heat/dust/humidity resistant. The XO has all of that and is cheap. The
few hw makers I've seen offering similar features are rather
expensive.

 Additionally, I am convinced that school administrators would see the
 XO-as-XS as a spare XO and distribute to kids who don't have XO's at
 their school or take it home to their own child.

It won't even boot to Sugar, and user education call take a part here
-- I don't think the confusion will last very long.

You may not want it for the Nepal deployment, but we cannot argue with
the fact that there is intense interest.

There are also other use cases where it's useful to be able to run the
XS sw on an XO - for example, the warehouse scenarios where you take 1
XO and use it as the server that will update all the other XOs.

The issue of theft is real, but is not limited to the XO hw -- and in
fact, a normal tower pc is in some cases more desirable - as it's a
general purpose machine. Uruguay has -- I believe -- done some
interesting work in securing their school servers, though I don't know
the details.

This is work that needs to happen for a long list of reasons. Within
the constraints we have, I aim for flexibility: give the local teams a
range of options, and this is a _very_ valuable one, one that is
within reach now that a vanilla Fedora boots on the XO.

cheers,



m
--
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- School Server Architect
 - ask interesting questions
 - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
 - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff



-- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- School Server Architect
 - ask interesting questions
 - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
 - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff
___
Server-devel mailing list
Server-devel@lists.laptop.org
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