Re: [Sugar-devel] Wacom Bamboo with XO?

2008-12-09 Thread Stanley Sokolow

I tried the new installation instructions on the wiki, first installing the
Colors activity, then running the new shell script as per the wiki:

wget http://dev.laptop.org/~wadeb/setupwacom.sh
sudo sh setupwacom.sh

It seemed to run ok without errors.  I restarted the XO.  Colors installed
ok and works with the mouse, but the Wacom Bamboo tablet does not work,
neither in Colors nor anywhere else.   Looking at the /dev/input directory,
I don't see the wacom device that should be there.   When I rerun the shell
script, it confirms that the linuxwacom package is already installed.The
X11 configuration file contains the Wacom devices, so it's the right conf
file.   I'm stuck.

Has anyone had success with the new instructions?

By the way, when I tried the old instructions yesterday, the repomd.xml file
was corrupted.   (Actually, it was a perl script, not an xml file.)  So, yum
wouldn't run.  Someone apparently fixed that problem.It's an xml file
now and yum seems to run ok using it.

Stan

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Wacom Bamboo with XO?

2008-12-09 Thread Stanley Sokolow




  


Wade, 

I tried: 
sudo depmod 
sudo modprobe wacom 

but all I got was an error from the modprobe: 
FATAL:nbsp; Module wacom not found. 

I then tried: 
sudo modprobe linuxwacom 
and got the same error. 

Stan 

- 

Wade Brainerd-2 (via Nabble) wrote:
Hi
Stan, 
  
Try a 'depmod' and then 'modprobe wacom' from the Terminal, and see if
that helps.nbsp; Feel free to grab me on IRC (as wadeb), I can help
troubleshoot it. 
  
-Wade 
  
  On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:34 AM, Stanley
Sokolow lt; [EMAIL PROTECTED] gt; wrote: 
  
I tried the new installation instructions on the wiki, first installing
the 
Colors activity, then running the new shell script as per the wiki: 

wget http://dev.laptop.org/~wadeb/setupwacom.sh 
sudo sh setupwacom.sh 

It seemed to run ok without errors. nbsp;I restarted the XO. nbsp;Colors
installed 
ok and works with the mouse, but the Wacom Bamboo tablet does not work, 
neither in Colors nor anywhere else. nbsp; Looking at the /dev/input
directory, 
I don't see the wacom device that should be there. nbsp; When I rerun the
shell 
script, it confirms that the linuxwacom package is already installed. nbsp;
nbsp;The 
X11 configuration file contains the Wacom devices, so it's the right
conf 
file. nbsp; I'm stuck. 

Has anyone had success with the new instructions? 

By the way, when I tried the old instructions yesterday, the repomd.xml
file 
was corrupted. nbsp; (Actually, it was a perl script, not an xml file.)
nbsp;So, yum 
wouldn't run. nbsp;Someone apparently fixed that problem. nbsp; nbsp;It's an 
xml
file 
now and yum seems to run ok using it. 

Stan 

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Problems with Adobe Flash player on the XO.

2009-01-01 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Hi,

I'm having problems:  Adobe FlashPlayer doesn't detect the XO's built-in 
webcam so it can't transmit video out to the Internet on Flash-enabled 
web sites, and the Adobe Flash player on the XO freezes the popup 
right-click control panel.   Gnash didn't work at all with a Flash-based 
web site we're interested in, so I went to the real FlashPlayer, latest 
version.

I've been lurking here watching the comments on Gnash versus Flash while 
I tried to get my wife's XO playing nicely with a Flash-based RIA (rich 
internet application) site called www.vyew.com .(That's pronounced 
like view.) Vyew is a collaborative whiteboard application with 
video, voice, and text chatting features in addition to the 
whiteboard.   By whiteboard, I mean that several users can connect to 
the same page and collaborate on drawing sketches and typing text on the 
same screen, which is visible to all of the connected people.They 
can also activate their camera and microphone (if they exist) to carry 
on two-way conversations like Skype.   She wants to use this for a 
remote tutoring activity where she interacts with students about math 
problems.We tried to get Paint and Colors activities to play nicely 
with various Sugar emulators (LiveCD, Sugar on Ubuntu, Sugar on Windows 
Vista) but they all had various problems seeing (presence detection) or 
collaborating.  So we found this web site, Vyew.   The Vyew site didn't 
load the Flash content on the web page with Browse and Gnash, so I 
installed the real Adobe Flash player on the XO.  We have been largely 
successful with Vyew and Adobe FlashPlayer on the XO.  Both computers 
can see each other's drawings collaboratively on the same page, but we 
ran into one problem that relates to Flash on the XO.  

The XO browser can see the webcam video stream from our Dell laptop 
running Vyew on the Dell's Vista browsers (MS IE  Firefox) and can hear 
the audio stream from the Dell, but I can't get Flash to activate the 
XO's camera.When I right-click on the Flash box in the web page, the 
Flash popup menu appears.   I click the settings item.  Adobe Flash 
Player control panel pops up as it should, but it is just frozen.   I 
can't get it to flip to the other tabs to set the camera  microphone 
permissions.   In fact, the panel won't even quit when I click the Close 
button.   Nothing gets rid of it except reloading or leaving the web 
page.   This was while running on the XO's Browse activity.   I thought 
that maybe Opera for the XO would do better.  No luck.   Opera as 
installed from the wiki.laptop.org/opera instructions does not even play 
the Flash on the Adobe web site: www.adobe.com/products/flash/about , 
nor any other Flash embedded in a web page.   All that Opera shows is a 
gray rectangle where the Flash should be, no text saying to click to 
play the Flash.   This is apparently a problem of Opera not interacting 
well with FlashPlayer, because the Opera plugin directories point to the 
very same plugin program file by symbolic linkage, so it's not a bad 
plugin file -- the Adobe plugin plays the Flash .swf embedded element 
with Browse, just not perfectly, but Opera doesn't play it at all.

I submitted a comment to the Opera programmer who maintains the Opera 
blog about the OLPC version, but that blog has had very little activity 
in the past year so I'm not hopeful of any results from the Opera 
people.Has anyone here tried to run a recent release of Opera on the 
XO, not the very old version that was customized for the XO according to 
our wiki?

For the record, here are the various versions I'm running:  XO has build 
767 of Sugar, the XO is one recently received from the G1G1 program 
through Amazon, the FlashPlayer is the one recommended on the 
wiki.laptop.org page: 
http://fpdownload.macromedia.com/get/flashplayer/current/flash-plugin-10.0.15.3-release.i386.rpm
 
, the about Flash page reports the correct release 10,0,15,3 and so 
does the README in the flash-plugin folder on the XO, and uname reports 
that my XO's Linux version is 2.6.25-20080925.1.olpc.f10b654367d7065.

Even without the 2-way video streaming, www.vyew.com is a nice 
application for collaboration over the Internet.  Try it.

Stan Sokolow


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[Fwd: Problems with Adobe Flash player on the XO.]

2009-01-01 Thread Stanley Sokolow




Regarding my prior message, I just found this bug report at Adobe
regarding camera not working with FlashPlayer on Linux, but it says
that FlashPlayer 10 should resolve the problem. Apparently it didn't
on the XO. 

https://bugs.adobe.com/jira/browse/FP-137

Stan

 Original Message 

  

  Subject: 
  Problems with Adobe Flash player on the XO.


  Date: 
  Thu, 01 Jan 2009 14:20:38 -0800


  From: 
  Stanley Sokolow overb...@earthlink.net


  To: 
  Nirbheek Chauhan nirbheek.chau...@gmail.com


  CC: 
  devel@lists.laptop.org


  References: 
  8b4c83ad0901010046rc055feaw7b82db5c1de2e...@mail.gmail.com

  



Hi,

I'm having problems:  Adobe FlashPlayer doesn't detect the XO's built-in 
webcam so it can't transmit video out to the Internet on Flash-enabled 
web sites, and the Adobe Flash player on the XO freezes the popup 
right-click control panel.   Gnash didn't work at all with a Flash-based 
web site we're interested in, so I went to the real FlashPlayer, latest 
version.

I've been lurking here watching the comments on Gnash versus Flash while 
I tried to get my wife's XO playing nicely with a Flash-based RIA (rich 
internet application) site called www.vyew.com .(That's pronounced 
like "view".) Vyew is a collaborative whiteboard application with 
video, voice, and text chatting features in addition to the 
whiteboard.   By whiteboard, I mean that several users can connect to 
the same page and collaborate on drawing sketches and typing text on the 
same screen, which is visible to all of the connected people.They 
can also activate their camera and microphone (if they exist) to carry 
on two-way conversations like Skype.   She wants to use this for a 
remote tutoring activity where she interacts with students about math 
problems.We tried to get Paint and Colors activities to play nicely 
with various Sugar emulators (LiveCD, Sugar on Ubuntu, Sugar on Windows 
Vista) but they all had various problems seeing (presence detection) or 
collaborating.  So we found this web site, Vyew.   The Vyew site didn't 
load the Flash content on the web page with Browse and Gnash, so I 
installed the real Adobe Flash player on the XO.  We have been largely 
successful with Vyew and Adobe FlashPlayer on the XO.  Both computers 
can see each other's drawings collaboratively on the same page, but we 
ran into one problem that relates to Flash on the XO.  

The XO browser can see the webcam video stream from our Dell laptop 
running Vyew on the Dell's Vista browsers (MS IE  Firefox) and can hear 
the audio stream from the Dell, but I can't get Flash to activate the 
XO's camera.When I right-click on the Flash box in the web page, the 
Flash popup menu appears.   I click the "settings" item.  Adobe Flash 
Player control panel pops up as it should, but it is just frozen.   I 
can't get it to flip to the other tabs to set the camera  microphone 
permissions.   In fact, the panel won't even quit when I click the Close 
button.   Nothing gets rid of it except reloading or leaving the web 
page.   This was while running on the XO's Browse activity.   I thought 
that maybe Opera for the XO would do better.  No luck.   Opera as 
installed from the wiki.laptop.org/opera instructions does not even play 
the Flash on the Adobe web site: www.adobe.com/products/flash/about , 
nor any other Flash embedded in a web page.   All that Opera shows is a 
gray rectangle where the Flash should be, no text saying to click to 
play the Flash.   This is apparently a problem of Opera not interacting 
well with FlashPlayer, because the Opera plugin directories point to the 
very same plugin program file by symbolic linkage, so it's not a bad 
plugin file -- the Adobe plugin plays the Flash .swf embedded element 
with Browse, just not perfectly, but Opera doesn't play it at all.

I submitted a comment to the Opera programmer who maintains the Opera 
blog about the OLPC version, but that blog has had very little activity 
in the past year so I'm not hopeful of any results from the Opera 
people.Has anyone here tried to run a recent release of Opera on the 
XO, not the very old version that was customized for the XO according to 
our wiki?

For the record, here are the various versions I'm running:  XO has build 
767 of Sugar, the XO is one recently received from the G1G1 program 
through Amazon, the FlashPlayer is the one recommended on the 
wiki.laptop.org page: 
http://fpdownload.macromedia.com/get/flashplayer/current/flash-plugin-10.0.15.3-release.i386.rpm 
, the "about" Flash page reports the correct release 10,0,15,3 and so 
does the README in the flash-plugin folder on the XO, and uname reports 
that my XO's Linux version is 2.6.25-20080925.1.olpc.f10b654367d7065.

Even without the 2-way video streaming, www.vyew.com is a nice 
application for collaboration over the In

Re: [OT] Test run of 2009/05/25 image

2009-06-10 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Mikus,

I've been using the Ubuntu version customized for the XO for a couple of
days now.  (See www.olpcnews.com for info about Teapot's XO-customized
Ubuntu 8.10 release.)   It is a little slow compared with my other
computers, as expected for a computer running at less than .5 GHz, but much
more comfortable and responsive than running the standard Sugar/Fedora
system on the XO.  I personally can't stand some of the human interface
aspects of Sugar, such as the time delay before a menu appears instead of
right-clicking to get a popup menu in context and especially the annoyance
of the frame appearing when I get too close to the trigger point in the
upper left corner, not being able to use non-full-screen windowing to see
multiple programs at same time, etc..   All together the stripped down xfce4
based version of Ubuntu with Firefox, FlashPlayer10 plugin, OpenOffice
writer,impress, draw, and other utilities, occupies about 1.7 GB of a 2.0
GB SD chip in the XO's slot.  It is fast enough not to annoy me, unlike the
Sugar/Fedora system on the XO.  I can even do 2-way video and 2-way audio
web conferencing with whiteboard using www.vyew.com, a FlashPlayer-based web
application.  I could not do that with the XO's standard operating system.
This all fits on and runs well from a cheap (US$6) SD card that I got at my
local office supply store.

What the XO hardware has over the netbooks is its great screen -- high
resolution, color or monochrome reflective for outdoor viewing, with matte
finish instead of the highly glare-producing high-gloss screens that are
almost universal these days.

Personally, I feel it is a mistake for the OLPC project to continue with the
concept of the Sugar platform as its exclusive model for an educational
computer.The Sugar applications (activities) could just as well be run
from the Ubuntu desktop.   Then students would actually be learning in an
environment that can take them into the real-world that grown-ups occupy on
computers, when they are ready to go beyond the Sugar applications.   The
knowledge of the operating system's interface would be transferrable to
other Linux/Mac/Windows systems when they outgrow the XO.  A Linux desktop
is not harder to learn than Sugar and it's a heck of a lot more comfortable
to use.  Moreover, there isa lot of educational software available for it
that won't run in the Sugar environment.

Stan Sokolow

On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 6:37 AM, Mikus Grinbergs mi...@bga.com wrote:

 Disclaimer:  This post contains Off-Topic meta discussion


  Conclusion:
 
 fedora-olpc, to be a sucess, needs a much slimmer UI than that
 of GNOME.
 
  Success needs to be defined.  Seems to me the OLPC was envisioned
  mainly for a single-application environment.  Except for being slow at
  processing, I think it succeeds admirably.
 
  I'm not talking about the sugar interface, which is what you're talking
  about.
 
  Non-sugar interface is something I'm also interested.

 The reason for my enthusiasm:  I think the OLPC offers the bringing
 of technological assistance to economically disadvantaged locations.

 I think that people who focus on slimming the OLPC are missing the
 point.  What they end up with is a slow, small Linux system.  But if
 what they want is a small Linux system, today's 'netbooks' offer
 more capability (and as netbooks continue to be produced by the
 millions, I expect tomorrow's models to cost less than the OLPC).

 For those who are interested in using the OLPC to bring conventional
 applications to people who already have access to technology - why
 not work with a netbook instead?  For those who think the OLPC *is*
 suited to the environments in which it is being deployed - let's
 work on developing OLPC-scale applications to assist 'the things
 people do' wherever such computerization could improve matters.


 mikus

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Re: XO-3 official

2009-12-23 Thread Stanley Sokolow
My personal experience tells me that it wouldn't help to have this piece of
vaporware come into being.The limiting factor in bringing computing to
the poor masses on this planet is the high cost of connecting them to the
Internet.   Even wireless service is beyond the reach of rural villages
without massive government help, not likely to come about where it is needed
most.  Negroponte should now focus OLPC's attention on connectivity cost,
not on making claims (which I doubt will come to fruition) about ultra low
cost tablet devices.

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 9:11 AM, Sameer Verma sve...@sfsu.edu wrote:



 On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Benjamin M. Schwartz 
 bmsch...@fas.harvard.edu wrote:


 http://www.forbes.com/2009/12/22/tablet-computer-negroponte-technology-cio-network-olpc.html

 It aims to make its tablet PC highly durable, all plastic, waterproof,
 half the thickness of an iPhone and use less than a watt of power, despite
 an 8-gigaherz processor. The price: an unprecedented $75.

 Well, that's cool.

 Deciphering OLPC press releases sometimes feels like I'm playing chess
 with Picasso, and he keeps breaking the rules, and I can't tell whether
 this is some kind of art or he's just cheating.

 --Ben


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 More than anything I find this quote amusing:

 We don't necessarily need to build it, Negroponte told Forbes. We just
 need to threaten to build it.

 I suppose we could threaten to code the OS, threaten to support it,
 threaten to create content... :-)

 Hey, its Festivus. Air out the grievances!!!

 Sameer

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Re: XO-3 super-o-fficial

2009-12-24 Thread Stanley Sokolow
I'm with Bert.   What problems has Android solved that Sugar was created to
solve, in your opinion?

On Thu, Dec 24, 2009 at 6:04 AM, Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.dewrote:

 On 24.12.2009, at 12:59, NoiseEHC wrote:
 
  You know, Android OS solves exactly the same problems Sugar has
  been created to solve

 O RLY?




 - Bert -

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Re: [Sugar-devel] New release of F11 for the XO-1 - Build11

2010-01-10 Thread Stanley Sokolow
My thoughts about Firefox.   Even if it uses more resources than Midori,
it's worth the extra bytes.   I am running Xubuntu (Teapot edition) from a
2GB SD card in my XO, and I have Firefox on it.   I installed the ePubReader
plug-in for Firefox.   This runs nicely and allows you to view eBooks in
ePub format, which is the up-and-coming open format for books.   You can
get  free ePub eBooks from several free sites, including books.google.com,
www.feedbooks.com/publicdomain, and gutenberg.org.  Project Gutenberg plain
text files can be read on the XO in Sugar using the Read ETexts activity,
but that activity says Read Etexts is similar to the original Read
activity, but instead of PDFs this activity works with the plain text files
created for Project Gutenberg.Plain text versions are inferior to the
nicely formatted ePub books.  To get the ePubReader plugin, all you do is go
to Tools  Add-ons  Get Add-ons in Firefox and search for ePubReader.
It even updates itself when new releases of the plug-in come out.

Xubuntu doesn't use Gnome, but instead uses Xfce the light-weight window
manager.  I would rather give up Gnome's bulk than leave out Firefox.

One thing little annoying thing about using the ePubReader on my XO system
-- the directional buttons next to the screen don't work (aren't recognized)
so I can't turn the screen into tablet mode and still be able to navigate
page turns.   Does anyone know an easy way to map these keys into up, down,
forward, and backward keys?   It's been a long time since I played around
with keymapping in Linux.

Stan Sokolow



On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 5:14 PM, rihowa...@gmail.com rihowa...@gmail.comwrote:

 Some quick observations on  F11 for the XO-1 - Build11.

 ...

 stuff deleted here

 Gnome Desktop mode:
 In previous builds Midori was used as the web browser in gnome now Firefox
 is being pulled in.  Is this an intentional change or a side effect of
 changing the build system?  Midori is general considered to use less
 resources than Firefox.

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Re: [Sugar-devel] New release of F11 for the XO-1 - Build11

2010-01-11 Thread Stanley Sokolow
I've searched the activities at sugarlabs.org for anything about ePub.  The
only hit to epub is the Newberry activity, which says it requires
FBReader, but a search for FBReader comes up empty other than this
reference to it.  Where is a sugarized version of FBReader available for
easy installation?

Stan

==

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 6:36 AM, Stanley Sokolow overb...@earthlink.netwrote:

 I wasn't aware of that development effort to add ePub format to the
 capabilities of Read.   According to SugarLabs web site, Read does not yet
 support ePub:

 Read is an ebook reader based on Evince. It can display PDF and single
 page TIFF documents.

 The link you gave to a blog seems to show good progress, but more needing
 to be done.   Is the working still continuing?  Where can I get a beta
 version with ePub support to try?


 On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 12:57 AM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.orgwrote:

 ...

 Just for the record, it's the Read activity which supports ePub files.


 http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings/2009/06/18/read-and-epub-and-beyond/

 Regards,

 Tomeu




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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Sorry, guys, but I just don't see why the content is somehow corrupted or
limited by deployment on the Flash platform.The FlashPlayer implements a
virtual machine that is customized by Adobe to run on various hardware and
OSs.   They're extending it now to ARM-processor-based devices (cell
phones).   The concept is write-once-run-everywhere.  The FlashPlayer runs
inside browsers or stand-alone (AIR).  The programming language it supports
(ActionScript) is now a very capable language, has libraries (both free and
not-free) for lots of goodies including very rich graphical interfaces, has
a powerful declarative xml-based language (Flex MXML) for building the
interfaces and binding data to them, has an open-source free-to-use (from
Adobe) compiler, has a free-open-source IDE (FlashDevelop) from a community,
has a superb IDE from Adobe that only costs $249 for the standard version
which includes a visual drag-and-drop design view mode as well as text mode
of programming and lots of features lacking in the FOSS FlashDevelop, etc.

One can program and run Flash programs with free-to-use software.   I know
of a very capable interactive web site (www.vyew.com, try the demo and see)
that runs extremely nicely and was built with the open source IDE.
Vyew.com runs on my XO, but I had to install the Teapot distribution of
Xubuntu on an SD card and run Firefox with FlashPlayer plugin.It runs an
interactive whiteboard plus 2-way video and audio on my little XO-1, and it
supports plug-in extensions that users can build.  If the Vyew developers
can do this with free tools, why can't the OLPC community use Flash as a
platform?

So, please explain why constructionist educational models can't be
programmed and run on the Flash platform just as well or better than in
Python on Sugar on Fedora.



On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 8:31 AM, James Zaki james.z...@gmail.com wrote:

 I'm guilty of spending more time than I probably should at newgrounds.com,
 their slogan being Everything, by Everyone.
 Its a melting pot of free content, and what really impresses me are the
 absolute gems of creativity that one finds from time to time.

 I dont see flash as the main XO education content maker, but can see the
 argument for popularity in the short term.

 James.



 2010/4/12 John Watlington w...@laptop.org


 On Apr 11, 2010, at 8:56 PM, James Cameron wrote:

  On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 08:51:01PM -0400, Martin Langhoff wrote:
  But hey. Flash developers want Flash in it. It's gotta be good for
  something.
 
  My guess is that it is handy for repurposing the system for
  entertainment usage.  (I don't have Flash enabled on my systems, so I
  don't really know what I'm missing).

 It's all the rage for games these days.   My kids constantly astound
 me with the rendering quality and interactiveness of flash games that
 they are able to find for free on the web.

 Deployments that have asked for Flash also point to games as the reason.

 wad

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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
You can see the Xubuntu system running on our XO-1 at:  Internet Math
Tutoring / OLPC Project
http://internetmathtutoring.com/olpc/static.php?page=static090711-100100.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 9:31 AM, Stanley Sokolow overb...@earthlink.netwrote:

 Sorry, guys, but I just don't see why the content is somehow corrupted or
 limited by deployment on the Flash platform.The FlashPlayer implements a
 virtual machine that is customized by Adobe to run on various hardware and
 OSs.   They're extending it now to ARM-processor-based devices (cell
 phones).   The concept is write-once-run-everywhere.  The FlashPlayer runs
 inside browsers or stand-alone (AIR).  The programming language it supports
 (ActionScript) is now a very capable language, has libraries (both free and
 not-free) for lots of goodies including very rich graphical interfaces, has
 a powerful declarative xml-based language (Flex MXML) for building the
 interfaces and binding data to them, has an open-source free-to-use (from
 Adobe) compiler, has a free-open-source IDE (FlashDevelop) from a community,
 has a superb IDE from Adobe that only costs $249 for the standard version
 which includes a visual drag-and-drop design view mode as well as text mode
 of programming and lots of features lacking in the FOSS FlashDevelop, etc.

 One can program and run Flash programs with free-to-use software.   I know
 of a very capable interactive web site (www.vyew.com, try the demo and
 see) that runs extremely nicely and was built with the open source IDE.
 Vyew.com runs on my XO, but I had to install the Teapot distribution of
 Xubuntu on an SD card and run Firefox with FlashPlayer plugin.It runs an
 interactive whiteboard plus 2-way video and audio on my little XO-1, and it
 supports plug-in extensions that users can build.  If the Vyew developers
 can do this with free tools, why can't the OLPC community use Flash as a
 platform?

 So, please explain why constructionist educational models can't be
 programmed and run on the Flash platform just as well or better than in
 Python on Sugar on Fedora.




 On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 8:31 AM, James Zaki james.z...@gmail.com wrote:

 I'm guilty of spending more time than I probably should at newgrounds.com,
 their slogan being Everything, by Everyone.
 Its a melting pot of free content, and what really impresses me are the
 absolute gems of creativity that one finds from time to time.

 I dont see flash as the main XO education content maker, but can see the
 argument for popularity in the short term.

 James.



 2010/4/12 John Watlington w...@laptop.org


 On Apr 11, 2010, at 8:56 PM, James Cameron wrote:

  On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 08:51:01PM -0400, Martin Langhoff wrote:
  But hey. Flash developers want Flash in it. It's gotta be good for
  something.
 
  My guess is that it is handy for repurposing the system for
  entertainment usage.  (I don't have Flash enabled on my systems, so I
  don't really know what I'm missing).

 It's all the rage for games these days.   My kids constantly astound
 me with the rendering quality and interactiveness of flash games that
 they are able to find for free on the web.

 Deployments that have asked for Flash also point to games as the reason.

 wad

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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
That page shows Vyew.com running on Xubuntu on the XO-1.   In my experience,
Vyew.com is something outstanding for learning
with low barriers of entry and no ceiling that Martin asked to see built
with Flash.  (Stanford University uses Vyew for its Stanford Engineering
Everywherehttp://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/permalink/?ndmViewId=news_viewnewsId=20080917005182newsLang=enplatform,
so Stanford agrees that Vyew is worthwhile for a learning/teaching
platform.)

The Xubuntu (or Fedora) system could be stripped further to make it
extremely austere (only the icons and menus you want the student to see),
much like Sugar.   The point is that a no ceiling application like Vyew,
which is a teaching and learning platform on which creative minds can build
interactive educational experiences, can be built in Flash to run on an XO.
I'm not suggesting that the OLPC developers try to recreate Vyew.  I'm
saying that Vyew shows how capable the Flash platform is, even using free
tools to build and deploy it.

From what I've been reading from OLPC contributors, there seems to be a
dichotomy between people who want to keep the system pure free-open-source
versus others who are more interested in getting something good built even
if it incorporates some free but not open source software.  I'm a
pragmatist.   Until FOSS can provide the tools I need to create what I want,
I'm not averse to using what I can get now and porting to FOSS later when it
catches up.

Stan


On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 10:22 AM, Paul Fox p...@laptop.org wrote:

 stanley wrote:
   You can see the Xubuntu system running on our XO-1 at:  Internet Math
   Tutoring / OLPC Project
   
 http://internetmathtutoring.com/olpc/static.php?page=static090711-100100.

 what does this have to do with flash?

  
   On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 9:31 AM, Stanley Sokolow 
 overb...@earthlink.netwrote:
  ...
interfaces and binding data to them, has an open-source free-to-use
 (from
Adobe) compiler, has a free-open-source IDE (FlashDevelop) from a
 community,

 does this run on the XO?

 paul
 =-
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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
I guess I don't understand constructionism.

Is it reasonable to require that the development system run on the target
machine?If Apple had this requirement, all of the iPhone/iPod/iPad
applications would be gone.   We wouldn't have any of the millions of
devices (mp3 players, routers, modems, fax machines, cell phones, etc.) that
have embedded processors not capable of running their development tools.
The XO is the target machine.   It's unreasonable to restrict development to
tools that run on the XO.   The FlashPlayer runs on the XO (with appropriate
OS underlying it).   That's more than sufficient to build rich educational
interactive constructionist applications.This is an education project,
after all.Developers in countries where the XO is targeted can surely
get a little netbook to run the Flash IDE as a development tool.Even as
the hardware moves on to better, faster, bigger guts, even with radically
different processor architectures, the developed applications will still run
once the Flash player is ported to the new computers.

Stan

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Chris Ball c...@laptop.org wrote:

 Hi,

has a free-open-source IDE (FlashDevelop) from a community,

does this run on the XO?

 Nope.  We're to believe that Flash is appropriate for constructionism
 on the XO even though it doesn't allow XO users to construct anything.

 - Chris.
 --
 Chris Ball   c...@laptop.org
 One Laptop Per Child

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Fwd: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
-- Forwarded message --
From: Stanley Sokolow overb...@earthlink.net
Date: Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 12:02 PM
Subject: Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC
To: Paul Fox p...@laptop.org


Sorry, Paul,  I just can't accept the idea that the target audience of the
OLPC projects must necessarily include kids who are capable and interested
in re-programming the software activities they're using.Moreover, would
you want to modify and re-compile your application software (for example,
Firefox) just to change the way it behaves with respect to which home page,
web site filters, cookies, etc. etc.?   That's what configuration options
are for.   Even if you want more versatility, the application can implement
rules in xml or an application-specific mini-language or whatever.
Rebuilding an application in Python should be a last resort and not even for
the 99.% of target users of the system.

How do you define constructionism in this context?

Stan


On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 11:31 AM, Paul Fox p...@laptop.org wrote:

 stanley wrote:
   I guess I don't understand constructionism.

 i think that's right.

  
   Is it reasonable to require that the development system run on the
 target
   machine?

 yes.  it's one of the reasons most activities, and many of the
 system, is coded in python.

   If Apple had this requirement, all of the iPhone/iPod/iPad
   applications would be gone.   We wouldn't have any of the millions of
   devices (mp3 players, routers, modems, fax machines, cell phones, etc.)
 that

 of course.  but i don't think any of those would be considered
 educational tools, let alone embodiments of constructionism.  (and
 nor would you, i'd guess.)

   have embedded processors not capable of running their development tools.
   The XO is the target machine.   It's unreasonable to restrict
 development to
   tools that run on the XO.

 it's not that unreasonable.  kids learn by doing, and exploring.
 that's kind of the whole point of constructionism.  if you give
 someone a game written using python and pygame, they can (in
 principle) modify that game to change the playing rules.  if you
 give them that same game written in flash, they can't.  it's
 really as simple as that.

 whether one agrees with the notion that this is important will vary,
 of course.

 paul
 =-
  paul fox, p...@laptop.org
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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
AIR (Adobe Integrated Runtime) is a desktop application that runs the
FlashPlayer virtual machine outside of a browser.   You know that Flash is
usually thought of as a plug-in to run Flash content inside of a web page
being displayed on a browser.   To maintain web security, the Flash plug-in
enforces restrictions on the Flash programs.   For example, a Flash program
running within a browser is not allowed to access files on the user's
computer, only files that come from the same domain as the Flash program
came from off of the web.  With AIR, the Flash Player runs as a stand-alone
application outside of and independent of any browser.   This allows rich
Flash interfaces to run just like any application installed on the user's
computer.  The AIR application is given more freedom -- for example, it can
access local files.   When a program is being compiled by the IDE, one of
the settings the developer chooses is whether to compile it for AIR or for
the FlashPlayer plugin.But for the most part, the program will run the
same on either platform.This lets developers use the rich Internet
application tools to create desktop applications.  AIR handles things like
the installation, checking for updates, installing updates, automatically
without the programmer having to build those services.  Go to
http://www.adobe.com/products/air/ for examples of AIR applications you can
download and run.



On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 1:13 PM, Mikus Grinbergs mi...@bga.com wrote:

 There's been all this discussion of AIR.  I am unfamiliar with AIR.
 My question :  Why would I (as an user) __need__ AIR ?

 I do not mind using a browser, nor do I mind installing a
 special-purpose plugin into my browser in order to access particular
 material.  But what does AIR provide that for instance the combination
 of latest Firefox plus latest Adobe Flash plugin would not provide ?

 Thanks,  mikus


 p.s.  People keep showing various Linux platforms (e.g., Ubuntu, Debian,
 etc) running on the XO.  As far as I am concerned, if these people
 *want* to run Ubuntu, Debian, etc., then buying a modern netbook for
 that purpose will give them better performance than using the XO.

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Fwd: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Sorry, I keep forgetting to put the list manager in my addresses.   Here's
my latest message:

-- Forwarded message --
From: Stanley Sokolow overb...@earthlink.net
Date: Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 4:05 PM
Subject: Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC
To: mi...@bga.com


I forgot to answer your statement below about Linux on the XO:

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 1:13 PM, Mikus Grinbergs mi...@bga.com wrote:

 ...

 p.s.  People keep showing various Linux platforms (e.g., Ubuntu, Debian,
 etc) running on the XO.  As far as I am concerned, if these people
 *want* to run Ubuntu, Debian, etc., then buying a modern netbook for
 that purpose will give them better performance than using the XO.


When I started helping my wife develop an interactive math tutoring
capability for the XO we bought from the 2008 G1G1 campaign, I looked at and
tried the Sugar activities.None of them were capable of her necessary
features:  2-way interactive whiteboard and 2-way interactive video and
audio communications.Sure, some activities were in development trying to
achieve these capabilities, but they weren't real yet.   We tried a web
services approach -- looked at various things like Go to Meeting.When
we found www.Vyew.com, we saw what we needed.   It worked on our PCs.
Turning to the XO, the Browse activity with Gnash just couldn't run Vyew.
When I installed the version of FlashPlayer that the laptop.org wiki
recommended, it didn't work the XOs camera and microphone and didn't even
operate the Flash settings dialog properly.Doing more searching, I found
a version of Ubuntu that had been adapted to the XO by a user who called
himself Teapot on the forum.   It's a stripped down, lightweight version
that uses Xfce as the window manager (hence it's called a Xubuntu
distribution) and incorporates the same kernel that olpc used in the version
of Fedora that came on our XO beneath Sugar, so it knows about the XO's
unique hardware.After some work, I got it running from an SD card so I
didn't have to trash the native operating system.I didn't do this
because I wanted to run Linux -- I have other Linux machines -- but rather
because it would let me get the job done, the system built with the features
necessary for the tutoring project.   If the XO comes up to that capability
with Browse and Gnash, I'd run the native system.But it's not there,
yet.  We also tried to use Skype on the native Sugar/Fedora OS, but at that
time, you had to do so many hokey work-arounds to fool the software into
running Skype, it just wasn't feasible for a deployment with low entry
threshold.

The 6 to 12 year-old kids that are the prime target of the olpc mission
don't care what platform is behind the screen.   Just as in the Wizard of
Oz, Don't pay any attention to that man behind the curtain.   As the
laptop.org mission statement says, It’s not a laptop project. It’s an
education project.   To me that says that the mission is not to empower
kids to write programs or tinker inside the system, but rather to use the XO
as an educational tool to learn about the world and life and such, to
collaborate with each other across the room and around the globe, to explore
the depth of knowledge on the Internet, etc.

Stan
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Re: Flash + AIR on OLPC

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
So, I guess you don't install any software that you download and run, like
Firefox or OpenOffice.org or Google Earth?  An AIR program doesn't just
sneak itself onto your system -- the user decides to buy it, or trust the
source of it, downloads it, and runs the installer.  The point about AIR is
that it lets the developer use the same tools to develop rich Internet
applications and desktop applications with attractive rich user
interfaces.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 4:30 PM, Mikus Grinbergs mi...@bga.com wrote:

  The AIR application is given more freedom -- for example, it can
  access local files.

 Back when Netscape first came out, I was bitten when a selfish plugin
 changed my system's defaults without me realizing it.  Ever since, I do
 NOT want a remotely acquired program to be able to access the local
 files in my system.  [The nobody user was invented to limit access.]

 I'm willing to mess with my local files myself.  But if a program from
 who-knows-where might mess with my local files -- I'd rather deny myself
 whatever experience that program is supposed to bring -- rather than
 chance having that program change how I have set up my system to run.

  Go to http://www.adobe.com/products/air/ for examples of AIR
  applications you can download and run.

 I did.  Nothing there looks like something I can't live without.

 mikus



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Re: using XO for Internet Math Tutoring

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Martin,

Sonya wanted me to reply on her behalf.   I have written a brief explanation
of our attempts to just install Flash on the XO with the ex-factory, that
is, the factory installed, operating system.   I just sent it to the
developers' list.What someone like Sonya needs is an OS on the XO that
has Adobe FlashPlayer installed ex-factory, or easily added by downloading
it, but the story of Flash on the XO is not so simple.  Since OPLC's
developers seem to want nothing to do with the proprietary, but free to use,
FlashPlayer, and since Gnash isn't even running a close second place to
FlashPlayer, someone who wants to use Flash-based web applications is stuck
unless he/she knows enough about computers to go around Sugar and get
FlashPlayer and a browser that plays nicely with it.  She was hoping to
create a tutoring capability that works within Sugar, but building it from
scratch using Python and Sugar just isn't feasible nor cost-effective when
web apps already exist to do what she needs, just not within Sugar.

I'm hoping that when the new version of Fedora for XO-1.5 is released, a
backport to XO-1 will also be released, and that it will support
FlashPlayer, the real one from Adobe, without requiring the user to be an IT
expert.

Stan

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 1:37 PM, Martin Langhoff
martin.langh...@gmail.comwrote:

 Hi -

 just install Flash. You don't need anything from me or OLPC.

 kind regards,


 martin

 On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 3:39 PM, Sonya Sokolow sonyasoko...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  4/12/10 12:40pm CA time
 
  Hi Martin,
 
  I am Sonya Sokolow, PhD, owner of Internet Math Tutoring (IMT):
  http://www.internetmathtutoring.com .  I also maintain the blog about
 using
  XO's in Africa and India for IMT:
 http://www.internetmathtutoring.com/olpc
  .
 
   In my experience, having a web cam and an interactive white board as
 tools
  for internet math tutoring make the teaching very much more effective
 than
  having only type chat or delayed email responses.  I use
 http://www.Vyew.com
  as an interactive whiteboard.  It is flash-based.  I use an SD card on
 the
  XO  which my husband Stanley Sokolow made for me.  I hope that soon in
 the
  future I won't have to use the SD card  anymore.  That is, I am hoping
 that
  the XO's will become compatible with Flash.
 



 --
  martin.langh...@gmail.com
  mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect
  - ask interesting questions
  - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
  - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff

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Updating my prior comments about FlashPlayer on the XO-1

2010-04-12 Thread Stanley Sokolow
After writing my explanation of why I turned to a Xubuntu system last year
to get FlashPlayer going on my XO for my wife's Internet Math Tutoring
project, I thought I ought to see what improvements have been made since
that decision.I see on the Wiki that there are Sugarized activities now
for Opera  Firefox  FlashPlayer.I'll give them a try.   Maybe I can
quit using the SD-card-installed Xubuntu system and get back to Sugar as the
tutoring platform.
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Re: using XO for Internet Math Tutoring

2010-04-13 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Hi, Martin,

Thanks for your reply.  When you said to just install Flash, your brevity
actually was helpful.   It made me think that maybe getting FlashPlayer to
run correctly on Sugar is a non-issue by now.  I plan to retry the Flash and
browser downloads from the wiki.  They seem to have been improved since I
first started working on this last year.

In any case, I've said my thoughts about Flash on the XO, and probably
didn't change anyone's mind about anything.   'Nuf said.

You're right about my role.  Sonya's the educator.  I'm the geek.

Let's all get back to making things work, rather than just talking about
them.

Stan

===

On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 8:28 PM, Martin Langhoff
martin.langh...@gmail.comwrote:

 Hi,

 sorry I'm brief (to the unfortunate point of rudeness) -- I am working
 30hr days in a 60K deployment. Which happens to want to use Flash. In
 fact I just helped the local team find adobe.com and we are adding the
 relevant rpm to the build.

 I find it puzzling that there is so much over the top drama. Situation
 is simple.

 Mainstream users get their XO from a deployment -- it's up to the
 deployment team to define the OS (inc Flash), and they have no prob
 rolling it into the image.

 Other users (those that get OLPC's images) are usually developers...
 who can hopefully rpm -i MyFaveRuntime-1.2.4.rpm with no problem.
 Sonya has you as resident geek I can guess, so it is up to you to do
 the rpm magic -- I have similar duties at home as the resident geek.

 There is the G1G1 crowd as a 3rd group. If you care about them, get a
 Flash enthusiasts gang and spin an image with Flash (get Adobe's ok,
 of course).

 There is no drama to justify these huge discussions. Let's see the end
 of this thread.




 m
 --
  martin.langh...@gmail.com
  mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect
  - ask interesting questions
  - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
  - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff

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Re: tap-to-click feedback

2010-04-15 Thread Stanley Sokolow
I have an old HP laptop with tap-to-click turned on by default when there's
no external mouse.   It is annoying to be typing text and have your thumb
accidentally brush the touchpad and suddenly you're typing in a totally
different location in the text, wherever the mouse pointer happened to be
aimed.Perhaps adding a touchpad lockout delay that momentarily disables
tap-to-click for 1 second, or whatever, after a keyboard key is pressed
would help, something like debouncing a switch contact in a driver.  A
control-panel parameter should be provided to adjust the lockout period --
some kids might need more than a 1 second lockout.


On Thu, Apr 15, 2010 at 7:40 AM, Martin Langhoff
martin.langh...@gmail.comwrote:

 On Thu, Apr 15, 2010 at 11:34 AM, Sebastian Silva
 sebast...@fuentelibre.org wrote:
  BTW how do you disable it?

 Yeah -- can we disable it easily on F11 builds?



 m
 --
  martin.langh...@gmail.com
  mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect
  - ask interesting questions
  - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
  - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff
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Re: Uruguay violates GPL by deleting root on OLPCs

2010-07-07 Thread Stanley Sokolow
Please explain your statement that lack of root violates GPLv3.   Couldn't
the owner of the system insert a SD card with a developer's version of
Linux, mount the internal drive of the XO, and tinker with the installed
packages as root from the external OS?  Does GPLv3 expressly mention root
access?

I think Ubuntu disables root logins, but allows sudo access for root
permissions.   Is that a violation of the GPLv3?



On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 2:32 AM, John Gilmore g...@toad.com wrote:

   Ignoring the fact that some deployments ship without root access.
 
  Is the practice of completely locking-down the laptops something we'd
  even want to encourage?

 Shipping the laptops TiVoized like Uruguay does has put them into serious
 legal trouble.  OLPC should definitely not encourage anybody else to do
 this.
 Why bankrupt your project by losing a copyright enforcement lawsuit?

 Shipping the laptops without root access is a direct violation of the
 GPLv3 license on a dozen packages (probably 50+ packages in later
 Fedoras).  They have shipped binaries, while using technological means
 to deny the recipient the practical ability to upgrade or replace them
 with versions modified or chosen by the recipient.

 Only an idiot would distribute hundreds of thousands of units while
 setting themselves up to pay the Free Software Foundation any amount
 of money they demand.  (Given the way OLPC and Uruguay have
 ignored the notice that they're in violation, for years, I do hope FSF
 extracts both future compliance, and its next ten years of operating
 expenses, from these scofflaws.)

 Or does Uruguay think, Sue us for copyright violation in our own
 courts -- we'll make sure you lose??  In other words, do they
 just brazenly steal the GNU Project's software, knowing it's wrong?

John Gilmore

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