[OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo Christmas card

[Jorge Gustavo Rocha]

Hi,

I really would like to have a OSGeo Christmas card, to send to our local 
chapter members and to add it to my email signature.


Since some of us can make such wonderful maps, maybe someone can create 
an OSGeo Christmas card. Any volunteer out there? Maybe Till can create 
one that includes FOSS4G 2006 :-)


Regards,

J. Gustavo
--
Jorge Gustavo Rocha
Departamento de Informática
Universidade do Minho
4710-057 Braga
Tel: +351 253604480
Fax: +351 253604471
Móvel: +351 910333888
skype: nabocudnosor
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[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: Re: [Board] Resignation [of Jeff McKenna as OSGeo president]

[Cameron Shorter]

For those who are not following the board email lists and hearing snippets:


 Forwarded Message 
Subject:Re: [Board] Resignation
Date:   Mon, 14 Dec 2015 19:13:42 +1100
From:   Cameron Shorter 
To: bo...@lists.osgeo.org, jeff_mckenna 



Hi Board, Jeff,
I suggest that should Jeff's resignation be accepted as he requests,
that it should be announced to the greater OSGeo community in order to
keep them in the loop.

I suggest that such an announcement be accompanied by an acknowledgement
of the many great things that Jeff has contributed to OSGeo over the
years. [Source material: https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Jeff_McKenna]

Ideally it should include a sentence or two from Jeff discussing the
decision to step down.

Jeff, do you have thoughts on this, and contents to contribute toward
such a notification?

Warm regards, Cameron

On 14/12/2015 9:06 am, Jeff McKenna wrote:

Hi Board,

I ask that you proceed with my resignation, and you find a replacement
for this spot on the board right away.  The OSGeo board has a great
community to choose from.  I've been trying for several years to get
Dirk Frigne onto the OSGeo Board, and I believe since he narrowly
missed this year's election, he would absolutely be a great addition.
I hope the OSGeo board agrees. It did occur to me how that works out
great.

I will not be attending the OSGeo Board Face2Face meeting.  I will be
cancelling my flight, and will send the reimbursement to the OSGeo
treasurer (I already looked into this and there is a cancellation fee
unfortunately).  I am sure the OSGeo community leaders will have a
great Face2Face meeting.

I really wish everyone across this world a good Christmas holiday with
their families, and that everyone has a happy 2016.

Yours,

-jeff




On 2015-12-10 12:17 PM, Jeff McKenna wrote:

Hi Board,

I hereby resign from the OSGeo Board of Directors.

I always tried my best to represent the OSGeo community, and bring the
FOSS4G spirit to every corner of this planet.

Thank you to everyone in this community.  I have tears now, not of
sadness, but for the community.  You each are special to me, and you are
doing good.

My laugh and smile will be at every FOSS4G, no matter how small or what
country, sharing the true spirit of FOSS4G.

I love both OSGeo and FOSS4G.  Nothing can ever change that.  I shared,
I learned, I made mistakes, I laughed, I cried, I thanked, I spoke, I
yelled, I met, I answered emails, I tried my hardest way beyond my
abilities and means, I gave my life and health, I spoke of "community"
around the world long before it became cool to do so, I, I tried to
always represent the community.  What I did most though, was listen. I
listened.

Which brings me back on topic.

Thank you everyone.

Love,

-jeff



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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Jody Garnett]

The board is aware of public perception and I trust it will be on the
agenda for f2f meeting.

I think we can do a bit better than a statement - in our last board meeting
Micheal Smith has volunteered to be our OSGeo representative to
LocationTech. OSGeo is a member of LocationTech and we have been remiss in
keeping communication going in an official capacity (by supplying a
representative). We can issue a press release to that effect to have a
publicly visible sign of communication/collaboration.

Thank you for reassurance on the selection process Jeroen - all three were
very strong bids.

--
Jody Garnett

On 16 December 2015 at 05:29, Jeroen Ticheler 
wrote:

> Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It is
> very much time to stop the negative sentiments around LocationTech, FOSS4G
> conference offers that had LocationTech as a partner and so forth.
> Constructive collaboration is all we need within OSGeo AND with others in
> the (geo-)community.
>
> I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection process. As
> a member of the Conference Committee I would like to state here that I am
> convinced the LocationTech issue was not as decisive for most members as
> people outside the committee seem to think. It was an aspect discussed
> thoroughly, as were other aspects of the proposals.
>
> I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board hosted
> in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from all angles. But
> at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to come forward with a
> statement that helps to unify the OSGeo community and give directions.
> There seems to be a vacuum in the leadership right now with Jeff’s sudden
> resignation that should be filled as soon as possible.
>
> Greetings,
> Jeroen
>
> 
> *Try GeoCat Bridge© *
> *An extension to ArcGIS© to instantly publish data and metadata on
> GeoServer, MapServer, PostGIS and GeoNetwork.*
> *See http://geocat.net  for more details. *
>
> Jeroen Ticheler
> GeoCat bv
> Veenderweg 13
> 6721 WD Bennekom
> The Netherlands
> Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572
> http://geocat.net
>
> 
> 
>
> On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards  wrote:
>
> *"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on"*
>
> This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely stop
> because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.
>
> We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has resigned his
> charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both in relation to how
> we've conducted ourselves in relation to other organisations in the
> community.  These internal losses are not due to there being other
> organisations in the geospatial world, nor how they are acting - but
> instead our losses are due to how we ourselves are thinking and behaving.
>
> OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial community
> including users, developers and also other organisations to the fullest and
> best of our ability.  By doing this we become stronger (instead of weaker)
> and will remain useful, relevant and of interest to the community who will
> continue to invest their energy and efforts with us and recognise our
> unique value and position.
>
> In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the entire
> Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and OpenOffice, or MariaDB
> and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community (encompassing both OSGeo and
> LocationTech) is not alone in facing this, and my hope is that OSGeo can
> once again be a beacon to the rest of the open source world and show how
> best to embrace these differences, understand the strengths and weakness in
> both camps, and work together for the positive benefit of our diverse
> community.
>
>
> --
> Ian Edwards
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> > On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel  wrote:
>> >
>> > If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days,
>> you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac
>> clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes,
>> removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they might
>> compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti
>> competitive practices")
>>
>> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very
>> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk
>> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
>>
>> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing
>> going on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a
>> fun, useful champion of free and 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] board f2f planning / prep

[Massimiliano Cannata]

Dear cameron
I'm very supportive of your suggestions.

Empowering the community is also one of my personal priority.

Maxi
Il 16/Dic/2015 21:07, "Cameron Shorter"  ha
scritto:

> OSGeo Board,
> For the Board Face to Face meeting, I suggest asking the OSGeo community
> for ideas to put on the OSGeo board agenda.
>
> One topic I think worth adding to [1] is:
>
> "Re-engaging with the OSGeo Community"
>
> My gut feeling is that over the years email activity and new ideas has
> gradually reduced on OSGeo-Discuss email list, and gradually increased on
> the OSGeo-Board email list. (I'd love to find some evidenced based research
> to confirm or deny this).
>
> If this is true, it would imply that OSGeo is moving from a grass roots,
> community empowered organisation, where the board's main role is validating
> community ideas, toward a hierachical organisation where the board is
> driving the OSGeo agenda.
>
> Personally, I think a grass roots organisation structure is more
> effective, and more in line with OSGeo's founding principles.
>
> I suggest a starting point could be to discuss ideas on OSGeo-Discuss by
> default, then move to the board list to vote.
> Another idea worth building upon is inviting the OSGeo Charter members to
> vote on key topics occasionally in order to help the board gauge community
> sentiment.
>
> Warm regards, Cameron Shorter
>
> On 16/12/2015 9:48 pm, Vasile Craciunescu wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Like Maxi, I don't see the need for an external facilitator. Anyway, the
>> meeting agenda is extremely important. Let's start working on that. The
>> wiki page for the meeting [1] already include the general topics. Please
>> add your specific topics and let's try to allocate a time frame for each
>> topic.
>>
>> Best,
>> Vasile
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Face_to_Face_Meeting_2016
>>
>> On 12/16/15 9:42 AM, Massimiliano Cannata wrote:
>>
>>> Dear all,
>>> personally i don't think we need any facilitator to have a F2F meeting
>>> between few people.
>>>
>>> Before taking any action in this direction I request to be discussed and
>>> eventually voted.
>>>
>>> best
>>> Maxi
>>>
>>> 2015-12-16 8:05 GMT+01:00 Jody Garnett >> >:
>>>
>>> I have not seen the agenda for f2f meeting yet.
>>>
>>> Personally I would prefer it focus on longer term strategy then our
>>> usual month to month IRC meetings.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jody Garnett
>>>
>>> On 15 December 2015 at 22:51, Gert-Jan van der Weijden - Stichting
>>> OSGeo.nl > wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Jody and others, 
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Actually I have had (informal) contact with 2 process
>>> facilitators, who might be willing to take this (paid) role.
>>>
>>> Some instant remarks on this:
>>>
>>> - do you need a facilitator just for the weekend or also for the
>>> preparations (to be honest, the f2f agenda so far seems to focus
>>> on practical issues, not on the agenda itself)
>>>
>>> - is the goal of the f2f to define a OSGeo strategy for the next
>>> few years, or about "how to run an not-for-profit organisation".
>>> 
>>>
>>> - or is it even -given Jeff's resigning- more about how to run a
>>> Board with different persons, cultures, ideas (which might
>>> require a more mediator-like facilitator)
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Or just someone who takes the notes, makes sure the coffee is at
>>> the right temperature etc.
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Kind regards, 
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Gert-Jan
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> *Van:*Board [mailto:board-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
>>> ] *Namens *Jody Garnett
>>> *Verzonden:* woensdag 16 december 2015 02:13
>>> *Aan:* bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
>>> *Onderwerp:* [Board] board f2f planning / prep
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> One interesting idea on the discuss list (from Gert-Jan) was
>>> inviting an external party to act as an "independant process
>>> facilitator". Given we have very few days and a lot to cover I
>>> would like to pursue this idea.
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> This is one of those things that is difficult to arrange from
>>> afar - do we have any contacts (say with the local OSGeo
>>> community) who would be in position to offer a recomendation?
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Jody Garnett
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Board mailing list
>>> bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/board

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Stephen Woodbridge]

I think there is another facet of communication that is being missed and 
is probably part of the current issue. I think the OSGeo member of 
LocationTech should also be responsible for keep the OSGeo membership 
more informed about what is happening between the two organizations.


I think it is natural for our members to react defensively when 
surprised by new information that seems to be detrimental to our 
organization. Keep members more informed on a regular basis would help.


I for one do not have time to read through all the minutes of the board 
meeting and various other committee meetings and would appreciate a 
summary getting posted to Discuss.


-Steve

On 12/16/2015 2:34 PM, Jody Garnett wrote:

The board is aware of public perception and I trust it will be on the
agenda for f2f meeting.

I think we can do a bit better than a statement - in our last board
meeting Micheal Smith has volunteered to be our OSGeo representative to
LocationTech. OSGeo is a member of LocationTech and we have been remiss
in keeping communication going in an official capacity (by supplying a
representative). We can issue a press release to that effect to have a
publicly visible sign of communication/collaboration.

Thank you for reassurance on the selection process Jeroen - all three
were very strong bids.

--
Jody Garnett

On 16 December 2015 at 05:29, Jeroen Ticheler
> wrote:

Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It
is very much time to stop the negative sentiments around
LocationTech, FOSS4G conference offers that had LocationTech as a
partner and so forth. Constructive collaboration is all we need
within OSGeo AND with others in the (geo-)community.

I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection
process. As a member of the Conference Committee I would like to
state here that I am convinced the LocationTech issue was not as
decisive for most members as people outside the committee seem to
think. It was an aspect discussed thoroughly, as were other aspects
of the proposals.

I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board
hosted in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from
all angles. But at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to
come forward with a statement that helps to unify the OSGeo
community and give directions. There seems to be a vacuum in the
leadership right now with Jeff’s sudden resignation that should be
filled as soon as possible.

Greetings,
Jeroen


**
**
***
*
*
*Try GeoCat*
*
*Bridge©
***
*
An extension to ArcGIS© to instantly publish data and metadata on
GeoServer, MapServer, PostGIS and GeoNetwork.
*
*
See http://geocat.net  for more details.
*

Jeroen Ticheler
GeoCat bv
Veenderweg 13
6721 WD Bennekom
The Netherlands
Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572 
http://geocat.net




On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards > wrote:

/"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on"/

This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely
stop because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.

We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has
resigned his charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both
in relation to how we've conducted ourselves in relation to other
organisations in the community.  These internal losses are not due
to there being other organisations in the geospatial world, nor
how they are acting - but instead our losses are due to how we
ourselves are thinking and behaving.

OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial
community including users, developers and also other organisations
to the fullest and best of our ability.  By doing this we become
stronger (instead of weaker) and will remain useful, relevant and
of interest to the community who will continue to invest their
energy and efforts with us and recognise our unique value and
position.

In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the
entire Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and
OpenOffice, or MariaDB and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community
(encompassing both OSGeo and LocationTech) is not alone in facing
this, and my hope is that OSGeo can once again be a beacon to the
rest of the open source world and show how best to embrace these
differences, understand the strengths and weakness in both camps,
and work together for the positive benefit 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Arnulf Christl]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Paul, Daniel,
thanks.

+1

Arnulf (OSGeo President Emeritus)

On 16.12.2015 18:16, Paul Ramsey wrote:
> Agree w/ Daniel in all ways. We want our events to succeed, no? So we
> use marketing techniques to do so. Emails and so on. And we track who
> opens them so we can get better at marketing. Like any other business
> trying to succeed. Mail chimp is currently convenient, in the past
> other technologies were convenient (I spammed people in 2007 using a
> custom perl script, because I am a God Among Men), in the future
> different technologies will be convenient. But they are all going
> towards making a good event.
> 
> Naturally the first targets of marketing the event will be people who
> have attended past events under the same/similar umbrella. I provided
> the 2007 attendance list to foss4g events for a number of years until
> it had grown entirely stale. I felt good about it. I revelled in the
> goodness of it.
> 
> I have spammed. I will spam again, in the service of a good cause.
> That is my weakness. That is my strength.
> 
> P.
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 7:20 AM, Daniel Morissette
>  wrote:
>> On 2015-12-16 10:00 AM, Venkatesh Raghavan wrote:
>>>
>>> On 2015/12/16 18:37, Pat Tressel wrote:

 MailChimp is a very popular product. If you have a provable accusat
ion
 against them -- that they were acting **independently of the accoun
t
 administrator** to alter lists, then that would be significant. As 
Rob
 has stated, MailChimp did not do something by itself. The list was
 aggregated from previous lists and events in which people participa
ted.
>>>
>>>
>>> I have also received a similar unsolicited mail. I would like to kno
w
>>> who has authorized
>>> the aggregation and usage of email address from "previous lists and
>>> events in which
>>> people participated". I think every event has a privacy policy and
>>> e-mail address provided
>>> are only to be used for communicating about the specific event and n
ot
>>> for aggregating for
>>> future use.
>>>
>>
>>
>> For the record, the use of such mailing services for FOSS4G promotion
 is not
>> new. Even FOSS4G 2015 (Seoul) used MailChimp in a very similar way, I
 still
>> have some of their mails in my archives, and I'm sure other past even
ts did
>> as well but I didn't bother digging any further.
>>
>> How can you realistically expect to do outreach to new people if you 
only
>> announce your event on osgeo-discuss?
>>
>> This anti-anything-locationtech-does drama is becoming boring, please
 let's
>> get over it.
>>
>> --
>> Daniel Morissette
>> http://www.mapgears.com/
>> T: +1 418-696-5056 #201
>>
>> http://evouala.com/ - Location Intelligence Made Easy
>>
>> ___
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 


- -- 
Arnulf Christl (Director)
The metaspatial Institute Certification:
Open Source - Open Data - Open Standards
http://www.metaspatial.net/en/institute
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Arnulf Christl]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Ian, Jeroen,
thanks.

+1

Arnulf (OSGeo President Emeritus)

On 16.12.2015 14:29, Jeroen Ticheler wrote:
> Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It
> is very much time to stop the negative sentiments around
> LocationTech, FOSS4G conference offers that had LocationTech as a
> partner and so forth. Constructive collaboration is all we need
> within OSGeo AND with others in the (geo-)community.
> 
> I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection
> process. As a member of the Conference Committee I would like to
> state here that I am convinced the LocationTech issue was not as
> decisive for most members as people outside the committee seem to
> think. It was an aspect discussed thoroughly, as were other aspects
> of the proposals.
> 
> I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board
> hosted in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from
> all angles. But at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to
> come forward with a statement that helps to unify the OSGeo community
> and give directions. There seems to be a vacuum in the leadership
> right now with Jeff’s sudden resignation that should be filled as
> soon as possible.
> 
> Greetings, Jeroen
> 
>  ** ** *** * * 
> *Try GeoCat* * * Bridge© *** * An extension to ArcGIS© to instantly
> publish data and metadata on GeoServer, MapServer, PostGIS and
> GeoNetwork. * * See http://geocat.net  for more
> details. *
> 
> Jeroen Ticheler GeoCat bv Veenderweg 13 6721 WD Bennekom The
> Netherlands Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572 http://geocat.net
> 
>  
> 
>> On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards > > wrote:
>> 
>> /"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going
>> on"/
>> 
>> This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely
>> stop because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.
>> 
>> We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has
>> resigned his charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both
>> in relation to how we've conducted ourselves in relation to other
>> organisations in the community.  These internal losses are not due
>> to there being other organisations in the geospatial world, nor how
>> they are acting - but instead our losses are due to how we
>> ourselves are thinking and behaving.
>> 
>> OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial 
>> community including users, developers and also other organisations
>> to the fullest and best of our ability.  By doing this we become
>> stronger (instead of weaker) and will remain useful, relevant and
>> of interest to the community who will continue to invest their
>> energy and efforts with us and recognise our unique value and
>> position.
>> 
>> In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the 
>> entire Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and
>> OpenOffice, or MariaDB and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community
>> (encompassing both OSGeo and LocationTech) is not alone in facing
>> this, and my hope is that OSGeo can once again be a beacon to the
>> rest of the open source world and show how best to embrace these
>> differences, understand the strengths and weakness in both camps,
>> and work together for the positive benefit of our diverse
>> community.
>> 
>> 
>> -- Ian Edwards
>> 
>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these
>>> days, you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling
>>> licenses for Mac clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on
>>> getting apps on iTunes, removing fitness tracker products from
>>> their stores because they might compete with the Apple Watch,
>>> etc. -- do a search for "apple anti competitive practices")
>> 
>> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed 
>> very relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of
>> knee-jerk accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
>> 
>> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech 
>> bashing going on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to 
>> keeping OSGeo a fun, useful champion of free and open geospatial 
>> without becoming anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly
>> irrelevant.
>> 
>> -- Puneet Kishor Just Another Creative Commoner 
>> ___ Discuss mailing
>> list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org  
>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>> 
>> 
>> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Pat Tressel]

Puneet --

> If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days,
> you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac
> clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes,
> removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they might
> compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti
> competitive practices")
>
> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very
> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk
> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
>

A valid point -- I should have left that out (and almost did delete it) and
kept it positive.


> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing
> going on, and it is getting to be tiring.


Ah, yes.


> Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a fun, useful champion of free and open
> geospatial without becoming anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly
> irrelevant.
>

^^ This ^^  ;-)

Massimiliano --

You misunderstood or probably i didn't explained myself.

I'm not against any proprietary software or company. I use google and agree
> to accept their term of use.
>
Ok.  It sounded like accusations against those companies.  The main point
was that MailChimp did not do anything mysterious or underhanded.
Suggestion for future:  Just ask "how did I get on these lists" (or
whatever), and you'll get the answer without the Sturm und Drang.  :D

-- Pat
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] NSA - Someone is swatting you :-o

[Arnulf Christl]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Jorge,
go back coding. Ignorance is bliss.

Regarding "what we did to him" Jeff did not really explain. This is all
he said:
https://lists.osgeo.org/pipermail/board/2015-December/013714.html

This must suffice.

Let's move on.


Regarding the noise on the Discuss list? Yes, it is distracting. Some
even say it is destructive. But most of it is irrelevant.


Have fun again,
7even

On 16.12.2015 16:36, Jorge Gustavo Rocha wrote:
> Hi Jeroen,
> 
> Thanks for your constructive message. Ian was very constructive also.
> 
> Maybe I spend too much time coding and I miss a few emails. Did Jeff
> resign? What have we done to upset him so much?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Jorge Gustavo
> 
> Às 13:29 de 16-12-2015, Jeroen Ticheler escreveu:
>> Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It i
s
>> very much time to stop the negative sentiments around LocationTech,
>> FOSS4G conference offers that had LocationTech as a partner and so
>> forth. Constructive collaboration is all we need within OSGeo AND wit
h
>> others in the (geo-)community.
>>
>> I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection proces
s.
>> As a member of the Conference Committee I would like to state here th
at
>> I am convinced the LocationTech issue was not as decisive for most
>> members as people outside the committee seem to think. It was an aspe
ct
>> discussed thoroughly, as were other aspects of the proposals.
>>
>> I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board hos
ted
>> in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from all angle
s.
>> But at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to come forward wi
th
>> a statement that helps to unify the OSGeo community and give directio
ns.
>> There seems to be a vacuum in the leadership right now with Jeff’s
>> sudden resignation that should be filled as soon as possible.
>>
>> Greetings,
>> Jeroen
>>
>> 
>> **
>> **
>> ***
>> *
>> *
>> *Try GeoCat*
>> *
>> *Bridge©
>> ***
>> *
>> An extension to ArcGIS© to instantly publish data and metadata on
>> GeoServer, MapServer, PostGIS and GeoNetwork.
>> *
>> *
>> See http://geocat.net  for more details.
>> *
>>
>> Jeroen Ticheler
>> GeoCat bv
>> Veenderweg 13
>> 6721 WD Bennekom
>> The Netherlands
>> Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572
>> http://geocat.net
>>
>> 
>> 
>>> On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> /"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on
"/
>>>
>>> This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely sto
p
>>> because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.
>>>
>>> We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has resigne
d
>>> his charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both in relation
>>> to how we've conducted ourselves in relation to other organisations 
in
>>> the community.  These internal losses are not due to there being oth
er
>>> organisations in the geospatial world, nor how they are acting - but
>>> instead our losses are due to how we ourselves are thinking and
>>> behaving.
>>>
>>> OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial
>>> community including users, developers and also other organisations t
o
>>> the fullest and best of our ability.  By doing this we become strong
er
>>> (instead of weaker) and will remain useful, relevant and of interest
>>> to the community who will continue to invest their energy and effort
s
>>> with us and recognise our unique value and position.
>>>
>>> In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the
>>> entire Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and OpenOffice,
>>> or MariaDB and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community (encompassing
>>> both OSGeo and LocationTech) is not alone in facing this, and my hop
e
>>> is that OSGeo can once again be a beacon to the rest of the open
>>> source world and show how best to embrace these differences,
>>> understand the strengths and weakness in both camps, and work togeth
er
>>> for the positive benefit of our diverse community.
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Ian Edwards
>>>
>>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor >> > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel >> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire
>>> these days, you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling
>>> licenses for Mac clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on gettin
g
>>> apps on iTunes, removing fitness tracker products from their stores
>>> because they might compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search
>>> for "apple anti competitive practices")
>>>
>>>

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Paul Ramsey]

Agree w/ Daniel in all ways. We want our events to succeed, no? So we
use marketing techniques to do so. Emails and so on. And we track who
opens them so we can get better at marketing. Like any other business
trying to succeed. Mail chimp is currently convenient, in the past
other technologies were convenient (I spammed people in 2007 using a
custom perl script, because I am a God Among Men), in the future
different technologies will be convenient. But they are all going
towards making a good event.

Naturally the first targets of marketing the event will be people who
have attended past events under the same/similar umbrella. I provided
the 2007 attendance list to foss4g events for a number of years until
it had grown entirely stale. I felt good about it. I revelled in the
goodness of it.

I have spammed. I will spam again, in the service of a good cause.
That is my weakness. That is my strength.

P.



On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 7:20 AM, Daniel Morissette
 wrote:
> On 2015-12-16 10:00 AM, Venkatesh Raghavan wrote:
>>
>> On 2015/12/16 18:37, Pat Tressel wrote:
>>>
>>> MailChimp is a very popular product. If you have a provable accusation
>>> against them -- that they were acting **independently of the account
>>> administrator** to alter lists, then that would be significant. As Rob
>>> has stated, MailChimp did not do something by itself. The list was
>>> aggregated from previous lists and events in which people participated.
>>
>>
>> I have also received a similar unsolicited mail. I would like to know
>> who has authorized
>> the aggregation and usage of email address from "previous lists and
>> events in which
>> people participated". I think every event has a privacy policy and
>> e-mail address provided
>> are only to be used for communicating about the specific event and not
>> for aggregating for
>> future use.
>>
>
>
> For the record, the use of such mailing services for FOSS4G promotion is not
> new. Even FOSS4G 2015 (Seoul) used MailChimp in a very similar way, I still
> have some of their mails in my archives, and I'm sure other past events did
> as well but I didn't bother digging any further.
>
> How can you realistically expect to do outreach to new people if you only
> announce your event on osgeo-discuss?
>
> This anti-anything-locationtech-does drama is becoming boring, please let's
> get over it.
>
> --
> Daniel Morissette
> http://www.mapgears.com/
> T: +1 418-696-5056 #201
>
> http://evouala.com/ - Location Intelligence Made Easy
>
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Jody Garnett]

I can provide an update - but I am not sure what is interesting. Most of
the things LocationTech does are advertised here on the discussion list (if
they are an event ) or via twitter
(for news ).

Most communication in LocationTech (just like with OSGeo) is focused on
projects and committers. There is a monthly meeting of project leads for
example. This is where I am involved personally, with the primary goal of
getting some official project releases made. LocationTech has a few new
members this year (which is great but I am more interested in what projects
they bring to the table).

LocationTech has been doing a good job of outreach activities. LocationTech
participates in a number of conferences, sometimes as an organizer
sometimes as an attendee. They key event is the "LocationTech Tour" which
visits a number of cities and always has a mix of OSGeo and LocationTech
content.

I guess you are asking about what is happening between OSGeo and
LocationTech:

* There was a code sprint in Philadelphia with a mix of OSGeo and
LocationTech projects
* The LocationTech Tour has been well attended. We had a great event here
in Victoria highlighting GeoServer, PostGIS, Torque, QGIS, GeoGig. It was
for some students there first non ESRI experience with mapping software. I
wrote a blog post
 on that one
* FOSS4G NA 2015 was a joint conference earlier in the year - this was well
covered by blogs
* Other than that there is lots of casual collaboration between projects,
but nothing official (but I hope to fix that next year)

When wrote up what I wanted to do as an OSGeo board member one of my goals
is to improve collaborations (such as this one with LocationTech) so we can
better make use of our resources as a community.

I have done a couple of talks comparing
 the two
organizations - but the real message there is advocating for responsible
open source development (OSGeo and LocationTech are just a couple of the
organizations available to help projects play safe on the internet).

I guess I am not quite sure what you are looking for Steve?


--
Jody Garnett

On 16 December 2015 at 13:01, Stephen Woodbridge 
wrote:

> I think there is another facet of communication that is being missed and
> is probably part of the current issue. I think the OSGeo member of
> LocationTech should also be responsible for keep the OSGeo membership more
> informed about what is happening between the two organizations.
>
> I think it is natural for our members to react defensively when surprised
> by new information that seems to be detrimental to our organization. Keep
> members more informed on a regular basis would help.
>
> I for one do not have time to read through all the minutes of the board
> meeting and various other committee meetings and would appreciate a summary
> getting posted to Discuss.
>
> -Steve
>
> On 12/16/2015 2:34 PM, Jody Garnett wrote:
>
>> The board is aware of public perception and I trust it will be on the
>> agenda for f2f meeting.
>>
>> I think we can do a bit better than a statement - in our last board
>> meeting Micheal Smith has volunteered to be our OSGeo representative to
>> LocationTech. OSGeo is a member of LocationTech and we have been remiss
>> in keeping communication going in an official capacity (by supplying a
>> representative). We can issue a press release to that effect to have a
>> publicly visible sign of communication/collaboration.
>>
>> Thank you for reassurance on the selection process Jeroen - all three
>> were very strong bids.
>>
>> --
>> Jody Garnett
>>
>> On 16 December 2015 at 05:29, Jeroen Ticheler
>> > wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It
>> is very much time to stop the negative sentiments around
>> LocationTech, FOSS4G conference offers that had LocationTech as a
>> partner and so forth. Constructive collaboration is all we need
>> within OSGeo AND with others in the (geo-)community.
>>
>> I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection
>> process. As a member of the Conference Committee I would like to
>> state here that I am convinced the LocationTech issue was not as
>> decisive for most members as people outside the committee seem to
>> think. It was an aspect discussed thoroughly, as were other aspects
>> of the proposals.
>>
>> I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board
>> hosted in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from
>> all angles. But at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to
>> come forward with a statement that helps to unify the OSGeo
>> community and give directions. There seems to be a vacuum in the
>> 

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] [Board] board f2f planning / prep

[Jody Garnett]

Cameron:

I like the approach with email lists from a social dynamic point of view.

As a community member / project lead I moved to the board list several
years ago to cut down on the noise. It was important to safe
guard my time and board offered a higher signal to noise ratio.

Still steering discussion to discuss and voting to the board lists is a
solid idea :)

--
Jody Garnett

On 16 December 2015 at 12:07, Cameron Shorter 
wrote:

> OSGeo Board,
> For the Board Face to Face meeting, I suggest asking the OSGeo community
> for ideas to put on the OSGeo board agenda.
>
> One topic I think worth adding to [1] is:
>
> "Re-engaging with the OSGeo Community"
>
> My gut feeling is that over the years email activity and new ideas has
> gradually reduced on OSGeo-Discuss email list, and gradually increased on
> the OSGeo-Board email list. (I'd love to find some evidenced based research
> to confirm or deny this).
>
> If this is true, it would imply that OSGeo is moving from a grass roots,
> community empowered organisation, where the board's main role is validating
> community ideas, toward a hierachical organisation where the board is
> driving the OSGeo agenda.
>
> Personally, I think a grass roots organisation structure is more
> effective, and more in line with OSGeo's founding principles.
>
> I suggest a starting point could be to discuss ideas on OSGeo-Discuss by
> default, then move to the board list to vote.
> Another idea worth building upon is inviting the OSGeo Charter members to
> vote on key topics occasionally in order to help the board gauge community
> sentiment.
>
> Warm regards, Cameron Shorter
>
>
> On 16/12/2015 9:48 pm, Vasile Craciunescu wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> Like Maxi, I don't see the need for an external facilitator. Anyway, the
>> meeting agenda is extremely important. Let's start working on that. The
>> wiki page for the meeting [1] already include the general topics. Please
>> add your specific topics and let's try to allocate a time frame for each
>> topic.
>>
>> Best,
>> Vasile
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Face_to_Face_Meeting_2016
>>
>> On 12/16/15 9:42 AM, Massimiliano Cannata wrote:
>>
>>> Dear all,
>>> personally i don't think we need any facilitator to have a F2F meeting
>>> between few people.
>>>
>>> Before taking any action in this direction I request to be discussed and
>>> eventually voted.
>>>
>>> best
>>> Maxi
>>>
>>> 2015-12-16 8:05 GMT+01:00 Jody Garnett >> >:
>>>
>>> I have not seen the agenda for f2f meeting yet.
>>>
>>> Personally I would prefer it focus on longer term strategy then our
>>> usual month to month IRC meetings.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jody Garnett
>>>
>>> On 15 December 2015 at 22:51, Gert-Jan van der Weijden - Stichting
>>> OSGeo.nl > wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Jody and others, 
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Actually I have had (informal) contact with 2 process
>>> facilitators, who might be willing to take this (paid) role.
>>>
>>> Some instant remarks on this:
>>>
>>> - do you need a facilitator just for the weekend or also for the
>>> preparations (to be honest, the f2f agenda so far seems to focus
>>> on practical issues, not on the agenda itself)
>>>
>>> - is the goal of the f2f to define a OSGeo strategy for the next
>>> few years, or about "how to run an not-for-profit organisation".
>>> 
>>>
>>> - or is it even -given Jeff's resigning- more about how to run a
>>> Board with different persons, cultures, ideas (which might
>>> require a more mediator-like facilitator)
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Or just someone who takes the notes, makes sure the coffee is at
>>> the right temperature etc.
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Kind regards, 
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> Gert-Jan
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> *Van:*Board [mailto:board-boun...@lists.osgeo.org
>>> ] *Namens *Jody Garnett
>>> *Verzonden:* woensdag 16 december 2015 02:13
>>> *Aan:* bo...@lists.osgeo.org 
>>> *Onderwerp:* [Board] board f2f planning / prep
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> One interesting idea on the discuss list (from Gert-Jan) was
>>> inviting an external party to act as an "independant process
>>> facilitator". Given we have very few days and a lot to cover I
>>> would like to pursue this idea.
>>>
>>> __ __
>>>
>>> This is one of those things that is difficult to arrange from
>>> afar - do we have any contacts (say with the local OSGeo
>>> community) who would be in position to offer a recomendation?

Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Jeroen Ticheler]

Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It is very 
much time to stop the negative sentiments around LocationTech, FOSS4G 
conference offers that had LocationTech as a partner and so forth. Constructive 
collaboration is all we need within OSGeo AND with others in the 
(geo-)community.

I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection process. As a 
member of the Conference Committee I would like to state here that I am 
convinced the LocationTech issue was not as decisive for most members as people 
outside the committee seem to think. It was an aspect discussed thoroughly, as 
were other aspects of the proposals.

I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board hosted in our 
GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from all angles. But at this 
stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to come forward with a statement that 
helps to unify the OSGeo community and give directions. There seems to be a 
vacuum in the leadership right now with Jeff’s sudden resignation that should 
be filled as soon as possible.

Greetings,
Jeroen


Try GeoCat Bridge© 
An extension to ArcGIS© to instantly publish data and metadata on GeoServer, 
MapServer, PostGIS and GeoNetwork.
See http://geocat.net  for more details. 

Jeroen Ticheler
GeoCat bv
Veenderweg 13
6721 WD Bennekom
The Netherlands
Tel: +31 (0)6 81286572
http://geocat.net

 
 
> On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards  wrote:
> 
> "there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on"
> 
> This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely stop because 
> it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.
> 
> We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has resigned his 
> charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both in relation to how we've 
> conducted ourselves in relation to other organisations in the community.  
> These internal losses are not due to there being other organisations in the 
> geospatial world, nor how they are acting - but instead our losses are due to 
> how we ourselves are thinking and behaving.
> 
> OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial community 
> including users, developers and also other organisations to the fullest and 
> best of our ability.  By doing this we become stronger (instead of weaker) 
> and will remain useful, relevant and of interest to the community who will 
> continue to invest their energy and efforts with us and recognise our unique 
> value and position.
> 
> In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the entire Open 
> Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and OpenOffice, or MariaDB and 
> MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community (encompassing both OSGeo and 
> LocationTech) is not alone in facing this, and my hope is that OSGeo can once 
> again be a beacon to the rest of the open source world and show how best to 
> embrace these differences, understand the strengths and weakness in both 
> camps, and work together for the positive benefit of our diverse community.
> 
> 
> --
> Ian Edwards
> 
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor  > wrote:
> 
> 
> > On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel  > > wrote:
> >
> > If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days, 
> > you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac 
> > clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes, 
> > removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they might 
> > compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti 
> > competitive practices")
> 
> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very 
> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk 
> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
> 
> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going 
> on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a fun, 
> useful champion of free and open geospatial without becoming 
> anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly irrelevant.
> 
> --
> Puneet Kishor
> Just Another Creative Commoner
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org 
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss 
> 
> 
> ___
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> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss

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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Massimiliano Cannata]

Pat
You misunderstood or probably i didn't explained myself.

I'm not against any proprietary software or company. I use google and agree
to accept their term of use.

I don't think there is any evil around, just people taking care of their
interests.

My point is that i didn't agreed to be included in any list and i don't
want anyone to trak and link my actions while looking at a foss4g website
withou advise it.
Can I say this or not?

I believe that on open source community thay care of their open principle
should particularly take care of this aspects.
Can I say this or not?

Puneet,
You may think I'm working against LocationTech but is not true. I have no
interest at all in this. I'm fully open for any collaboration with anyone
when it leads to reciprocal benfits.

Best
Maxi
Il 16/Dic/2015 10:56, "Puneet Kishor"  ha scritto:

>
>
> > On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel  wrote:
> >
> > If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days,
> you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac
> clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes,
> removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they might
> compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti
> competitive practices")
>
> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very
> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk
> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
>
> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing
> going on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a
> fun, useful champion of free and open geospatial without becoming
> anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly irrelevant.
>
> --
> Puneet Kishor
> Just Another Creative Commoner
> ___
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Venkatesh Raghavan]

On 2015/12/16 18:37, Pat Tressel wrote:
MailChimp is a very popular product. If you have a provable accusation 
against them -- that they were acting **independently of the account 
administrator** to alter lists, then that would be significant. As Rob 
has stated, MailChimp did not do something by itself. The list was 
aggregated from previous lists and events in which people participated.


I have also received a similar unsolicited mail. I would like to know 
who has authorized
the aggregation and usage of email address from "previous lists and 
events in which
people participated". I think every event has a privacy policy and 
e-mail address provided
are only to be used for communicating about the specific event and not 
for aggregating for

future use.

Venka
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Daniel Morissette]

On 2015-12-16 10:00 AM, Venkatesh Raghavan wrote:

On 2015/12/16 18:37, Pat Tressel wrote:

MailChimp is a very popular product. If you have a provable accusation
against them -- that they were acting **independently of the account
administrator** to alter lists, then that would be significant. As Rob
has stated, MailChimp did not do something by itself. The list was
aggregated from previous lists and events in which people participated.


I have also received a similar unsolicited mail. I would like to know
who has authorized
the aggregation and usage of email address from "previous lists and
events in which
people participated". I think every event has a privacy policy and
e-mail address provided
are only to be used for communicating about the specific event and not
for aggregating for
future use.




For the record, the use of such mailing services for FOSS4G promotion is 
not new. Even FOSS4G 2015 (Seoul) used MailChimp in a very similar way, 
I still have some of their mails in my archives, and I'm sure other past 
events did as well but I didn't bother digging any further.


How can you realistically expect to do outreach to new people if you 
only announce your event on osgeo-discuss?


This anti-anything-locationtech-does drama is becoming boring, please 
let's get over it.


--
Daniel Morissette
http://www.mapgears.com/
T: +1 418-696-5056 #201

http://evouala.com/ - Location Intelligence Made Easy
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Dave Patton]

On 2015/12/16 07:00, Venkatesh Raghavan wrote:

On 2015/12/16 18:37, Pat Tressel wrote:

MailChimp is a very popular product. If you have a provable
accusation against them -- that they were acting **independently of
the account administrator** to alter lists, then that would be
significant. As Rob has stated, MailChimp did not do something by
itself. The list was aggregated from previous lists and events in
which people participated.


I have also received a similar unsolicited mail. I would like to know
 who has authorized the aggregation and usage of email address from
"previous lists and events in which people participated". I think
every event has a privacy policy and e-mail address provided are only
to be used for communicating about the specific event and not for
aggregating for future use.


I too received the unsolicited email.

Presumably it was because I was involved with
the organization of FOSS4G2007.

I have already used the (tracked) Unsubscribe link,
and provided the feedback option that I unsubscribed
because I never opted in.

My suggestions:
1)
It may need to be clarified, or explicitly stated
(e.g. anywhere OSGeo/FOSS4g-related that collects
an email address), but I would suggest that it is
acceptable to utilize "collected email addresses"
for "1-time announcement" emails.

2)
When sending a "1-time announcement" email:
- do not utilize any form of "tracking"
- make it clear that this is a "1-time" email
  (i.e. in this case, for FOSS4GNA)
- provide multiple methods in the email (such
  as links and a "reply with  in the subject"
  email mechanism) so that the recipient can
  "opt in"
- provide a clear (untracked) method so that the
  recipient can "opt out" of any further "1-time"
  emails (i.e. in this case, for FOSS4GNA)

--
Dave Patton
Victoria, B.C.

Degree Confluence Project:
Canadian Coordinator
Technical Coordinator
http://www.confluence.org/

Personal website:
http://members.shaw.ca/davepatton/
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Jorge Gustavo Rocha]

Hi Jeroen,

Thanks for your constructive message. Ian was very constructive also.

Maybe I spend too much time coding and I miss a few emails. Did Jeff 
resign? What have we done to upset him so much?


Regards,

Jorge Gustavo

Às 13:29 de 16-12-2015, Jeroen Ticheler escreveu:

Thanks Ian for this email! I fully support what you are writing. It is
very much time to stop the negative sentiments around LocationTech,
FOSS4G conference offers that had LocationTech as a partner and so
forth. Constructive collaboration is all we need within OSGeo AND with
others in the (geo-)community.

I’ve heard negative sentiments about the FOSS4G 2017 selection process.
As a member of the Conference Committee I would like to state here that
I am convinced the LocationTech issue was not as decisive for most
members as people outside the committee seem to think. It was an aspect
discussed thoroughly, as were other aspects of the proposals.

I hope the Face to Face meeting end of January by the OSGeo board hosted
in our GeoCat office will be constructive and positive from all angles.
But at this stage I also call upon the OSGeo Board to come forward with
a statement that helps to unify the OSGeo community and give directions.
There seems to be a vacuum in the leadership right now with Jeff’s
sudden resignation that should be filled as soon as possible.

Greetings,
Jeroen


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http://geocat.net




On 16 dec. 2015, at 12:29, Ian Edwards > wrote:

/"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on"/

This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely stop
because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.

We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has resigned
his charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both in relation
to how we've conducted ourselves in relation to other organisations in
the community.  These internal losses are not due to there being other
organisations in the geospatial world, nor how they are acting - but
instead our losses are due to how we ourselves are thinking and behaving.

OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial
community including users, developers and also other organisations to
the fullest and best of our ability.  By doing this we become stronger
(instead of weaker) and will remain useful, relevant and of interest
to the community who will continue to invest their energy and efforts
with us and recognise our unique value and position.

In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the
entire Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and OpenOffice,
or MariaDB and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community (encompassing
both OSGeo and LocationTech) is not alone in facing this, and my hope
is that OSGeo can once again be a beacon to the rest of the open
source world and show how best to embrace these differences,
understand the strengths and weakness in both camps, and work together
for the positive benefit of our diverse community.


--
Ian Edwards

On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor > wrote:



> On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel > wrote:
>
> If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days, you'd be 
more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac clones, suicides at Foxconn, 
restrictions on getting apps on iTunes, removing fitness tracker products from their stores 
because they might compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti 
competitive practices")

You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed
very relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead
of knee-jerk accusations (until the above assertions, of course).

The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech
bashing going on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to
keeping OSGeo a fun, useful champion of free and open geospatial
without becoming anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly irrelevant.

--
Puneet Kishor
Just Another Creative Commoner
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Ian Edwards]

*"there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going on"*

This negative "bashing" of other organisations has to completely stop
because it is having a massive negative impact on OSGeo.

We've recently lost a respected former board member (who has resigned his
charter member status) and the OSGeo president, both in relation to how
we've conducted ourselves in relation to other organisations in the
community.  These internal losses are not due to there being other
organisations in the geospatial world, nor how they are acting - but
instead our losses are due to how we ourselves are thinking and behaving.

OSGeo should positively support all elements of the geospatial community
including users, developers and also other organisations to the fullest and
best of our ability.  By doing this we become stronger (instead of weaker)
and will remain useful, relevant and of interest to the community who will
continue to invest their energy and efforts with us and recognise our
unique value and position.

In relation to LocationTech - similar divisions exist across the entire
Open Source world (take a look at LibreOffice and OpenOffice, or MariaDB
and MySQL).  The broard "FOSS4G" community (encompassing both OSGeo and
LocationTech) is not alone in facing this, and my hope is that OSGeo can
once again be a beacon to the rest of the open source world and show how
best to embrace these differences, understand the strengths and weakness in
both camps, and work together for the positive benefit of our diverse
community.


--
Ian Edwards

On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Puneet Kishor  wrote:

>
>
> > On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel  wrote:
> >
> > If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days,
> you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac
> clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes,
> removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they might
> compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti
> competitive practices")
>
> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very
> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk
> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
>
> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing
> going on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a
> fun, useful champion of free and open geospatial without becoming
> anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly irrelevant.
>
> --
> Puneet Kishor
> Just Another Creative Commoner
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Marc Vloemans]

Puneet +1


Vriendelijke groet,
Marc Vloemans


> Op 16 dec. 2015 om 17:56 heeft Puneet Kishor  het 
> volgende geschreven:
> 
> 
> 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:07 PM, Pat Tressel  wrote:
>> 
>> If you want to point at a company as being the Evil Empire these days, you'd 
>> be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling licenses for Mac clones, 
>> suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps on iTunes, removing 
>> fitness tracker products from their stores because they might compete with 
>> the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti competitive practices")
> 
> You were doing fine until above. The rest of your post is indeed very 
> relevant and useful and argues correctly for sanity instead of knee-jerk 
> accusations (until the above assertions, of course).
> 
> The point is, there seems to be a fairly strident Location Tech bashing going 
> on, and it is getting to be tiring. Let's stick to keeping OSGeo a fun, 
> useful champion of free and open geospatial without becoming 
> anti-anything-free, partisan and possibly irrelevant.
> 
> --
> Puneet Kishor
> Just Another Creative Commoner
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Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4GNA - Someone is watching you :-o

[Pat Tressel]

I'm concerned about the vague accusations without evidence.  They also
don't seem relevant to the discussion about how one's name got on various
mailing lists.

I don't know if MailChimp is a "standard" for some type of companies but
> certainly I don't want it to be for communicating with OSGeo community.
>

MailChimp is a very popular product.  If you have a provable accusation
against them -- that they were acting **independently of the account
administrator** to alter lists, then that would be significant.  As Rob has
stated, MailChimp did not do something by itself.  The list was aggregated
from previous lists and events in which people participated.

OSGeo and FOSS4G is for the community and should be adherent to the OPEN
> (sorry but i want to be loud here) principle and to me this is not only in
> the licence you choose.
>

Does that mean you don't want to use any commercial tools, or only use
open-source products?  That's difficult.  For instance, I don't know any
non-commercial, open-source ISPs or domain registrars.  Or hosting
services, though one could run one's own servers.  Don't see how you'd get
around the need for a domain registrar though...use bare IP addresses?

How many time I have hear that Google spy you, and Microsoft without
> explicitly inform you collect information on your behavior while Linux do
> not do this kind of things?
>

Sorry, can't let that one stand...  You may have heard things but that does
not make things true.  Be careful what you believe or assume -- question
the rumors you hear.  Also, things change.  An opinion that might have been
valid once may not be any longer.

Google and Microsoft are companies.  Linux is not a company, it is an
open-source project.  A *company* that *provides a Linux distro* might do
marketing to you.  If you buy RedHat Enterprise Linux, you will likely get
on their mailing list.  (If I bought RHEL, they had *better* tell me what's
going on...)  You can likely opt out of most of their communications.

Google's *business* is making recommendations.  They provide personalized
advertising recommendation services.  If you use their free services then
you *opt in* to having them use your web searches to select ads for sites
that use Google advertising services.  If retailers use Google services to
place ads, and you shop on those retailers' sites, then they may show you
ads relating to your purchases.  This is just how personalized online
advertising works.  Frankly, I'd rather see ads for something I'm
interested in.  Google has repeatedly fought requests by governments to
divulge personal information.

Once Upon a Time, Microsoft earned its reputation as the Evil Empire,
mainly based on pressuring PC manufacturers to ship products with Windows
installed, and encouraging an argumentative employee culture.  However,
Microsoft has changed.  If you want to point at a company as being the Evil
Empire these days, you'd be more accurate pointing at Apple (cancelling
licenses for Mac clones, suicides at Foxconn, restrictions on getting apps
on iTunes, removing fitness tracker products from their stores because they
might compete with the Apple Watch, etc. -- do a search for "apple anti
competitive practices").  Microsoft now has significant open-source
programs.  They are also in the forefront among tech companies in reforming
their employee culture.  They *cancelled stack ranking*.  I don't know if I
can convey just how important and significant that is.  Most other tech
companies still do it in spite of research showing how it hurts performance
and employee morale.  Their new CEO, Satya Nadella, is an actual nice
person.  So, times change.

-- Pat
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