Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] good article on open source considerations

2019-04-05 Thread Jonathan Moules

Hi Jody,
Thanks for sharing, interesting article.

For a "Discussion" mailing list, there's usually not much discussion on 
it, so here's my contribution:


> 1. A coherent vision requires centralized design

Seems like a tautology. Not to mention there are countless Open Source 
projects that have a coherent vision, even larger ones (a lot of Linux 
distros for example).


> 2. High-level languages need more design than low-level languages
> The core team for open-source language design is usually very small 
... Higher-level concepts are then delegated to the competing developers 
of libraries, who design independently of each other or the core 
language team.


Maybe, but it can work well for Open Source languages too. Python is a 
prime example - countless libraries in all manner of fields created by 
innumerable developers, most of which follow the "zen of Python" and are 
"Pythonic".


> 4. Hard cases and boring stuff need to get done too
True. This is one of the big weak areas of Open Source. Linux distro 
management is a prime example of a thankless job that seems to have 
quite a bit of burn-out. Bug fixing and doc writing tend to especially 
suffer from Open Source, though they can be rubbish from paid services too.



> 5. Crowd-sourced decisions can be bad for you
As compared to the HIPPO decision making process (the "HIghest Paid 
Person's Opinion")? Is there any actual research showing which is better 
(I'm sure there is somewhere...)? Otherwise this is just an unsupported 
supposition.


> 6. Our developers work for you, not just themselves
> Figuring out how other people want to use tools and creating 
workflows that are broadly useful is one of those long-tail development 
problems that open source typically leaves to the user to solve.

and
> 10. Paid software offers an open quid pro quo

QGIS seems to do this very well (as does GeoServer). By contrast, I've 
reported bugs/issues to ESRI on a number of occasions and got back all 
of the following over the years (paraphrased):
* "That's not what the standard says" (despite everyone else doing it 
the other way).

* "Yes it's a crash bug, no we're not fixing it"
* "We can't take your bug report because you're not a paying customer".

Paid-for developers don't work for us either, they work for their bosses 
who will almost certainly have different goals to us.



> 7. Unified computation requires unified design
> 8. Unified representation requires unified design
These seem like a re-hash of 1 and similarly tautological.

Ironically, a lot of those "unified" packages are usually glueing 
together lots of Open Source parts. FME has 43 PAGES of legal terms for 
all the component licenses - 
https://cdn.safe.com/resources/fme/FMEDesktop_Legal_Notices_2018.0.pdf - 
most of which are for Open Source licensed tools (Apache, BSD, MIT, GPL, 
etc). I can't find the ESRI equivalent, but I'd be surprised if it 
wasn't similar.



> 9. Open source doesn’t bring major tech innovation to market
Oh? Is Git not a "major tech innovation" that came to market? Blockchain 
more recently (to the extent it's a buzzword that everyone is trying to 
clamber onto despite it only being suited to a limited domain scope)? To 
name two that immediately pop into mind.


> 11. It takes steady income to sustain long-term R&D
An interesting point. There's a huge amount of Open Source software that 
was created as part of some academic project funded by public grants. 
But when the project ends and grant dries up, the project is left by the 
wayside. Sometimes though. the worthwhile ones get picked up by the 
community (i.e. GRASS).



> 12. Bad design is expensive
> Much has been written about how total cost of ownership of major 
commercial software is often lower than free open-source software, when 
you take into account productivity, support costs, training costs, etc.


Seems to be Begging The Question.
It's true there's a huge amount of literature on the subject, but the 
actual TCO depends on the project. Also, do Wolfram's TCO equations 
include the countless hours people have to spend on license management.


That said, I agree with the core premise that something that's badly 
designed can waste a lot of a user's time. The poor docs and lack of 
real QA in a lot of Open Source projects are particularly a problem that 
feeds into this.



Overall I think most of the arguments are somewhat specious, though 
there are some good points hidden away in there. Open Source and 
Proprietary both have their places, but there's a lot more overlap than 
the article suggests.
Sure ArcGIS is much slicker than QGIS and has all the great 
integration/uniformity etc that the article talks about, but for 
support, I'll pick QGIS every time. If you *really* want something 
fixed, you can still pay someone to do it (or do it yourself if you have 
the chops); you're not reliant on a corporate monolith's "aligned 
priorities".


Just my 2p.

Cheers,
Jonathan


On 2019-04-02 19:15, Jody 

[OSGeo-Discuss] Reminder - OSGeo Community Sprint in Minneapolis

2019-04-05 Thread Lime, Steve D (MNIT)
Hi all: Just a quick note to remind folks that the annual OSGeo Community 
Sprint in Minneapolis is only about 5 weeks out – May 14-17 and all projects 
are most welcome. We have a great venue at the University of Minnesota and the 
weather in Minnesota is finally looking up! Of course it really helps with 
planning if we have an idea of how many folks might attend. So if you’re 
thinking about it – even if you’re not 100% - we’d love to know about it. You 
can learn more and sign up at:

  https://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/OSGeo_Community_Sprint_2019

Of course events like this are impossible without the generous support of 
sponsors:

Gold Sponsors
- GeoCue (http://www.geocue.com/)
- Safe Software (https://www.safe.com/)
- Riegl (http://www.riegl.com/)

Silver Sponsors
- Hobu Inc (https://hobu.co/)
- EOX (http://eox.at)
- Tydac (http://www.tydac.ch/)
- crunchy data (http://www.crunchydata.com/)

Bronze Sponsors
- Coordinate Solutions (http://www.coordinatesolutions.com/)
- SharedGeo (https://www.sharedgeo.org/)
- Greenwood Mapping (https://greenwoodmap.com/)
- Azavea (https://www.azavea.com/)
- Bohannan Huston (https://www.bhinc.com/)
- Extensis (https://www.extensis.com/)

Please contact me with any questions. Many thanks!

--Steve

Steve Lime
OSGeo Community Sprint 2019
Local Organizing Committee
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