[OSGeo-Discuss] Bruce Bannerman is out of the office.
I will be out of the office starting 14/05/2007 and will not return until 18/05/2007. I will respond to your message when I return. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Windows verse Linux
Hi Gary, IMO: I've been using: - Windows in its various forms for 17 years. - Unix in a variety of versions for 17 years. - Linux (Debian, Ubuntu and Redhat) for 6 years. - others e.g. MacOS, Mac OSX, VMS, DOS, etc for a number of years. My preference is Linux. - Debian on the servers (for stability). - Ubuntu on the desktop (for currency). Ubuntu is based on Debian with 6 monthly updates. Why? - The open source development model tends to lead to more secure code (many, many eyes looking for bugs). - Projects are normally Standards based. Therefore less susceptable to proprietry whims. - The pace of development over the last six years has been phenomenal. - Debian derived projects have an excellent package management system (apt-get) for keeping your systems current, upgrading etc. - Linux puts fun back into computing if you're willing to read the manuals occasionally. Bruce Gary Watry [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20/06/2007 04:56 AM Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Please respond to OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org To UMN-List-Serve * [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc Subject [OSGeo-Discuss] Windows verse Linux Hi everyone I need advice from the experts I am running Windows Server 2003 with Apache and Mapserver. I currently have 9 sites running Mapserver The Center wants to move to Linux from SGI I want to run Mapserver with dbox (Steve, dbox run on Linux?) Mapserver as WMS feed to MapBuilder. On the database side is it 1. PostGIS or PostgreSQL 2. PostGIS and PostgreSQL (think I have to run PostGIS as front to PostgreSQL). Question: What do I gain by going to Linux? What do I gain by staying in a Windows Environment? Any thoughts appreciated! The information transmitted is intended solely for the person or entity for which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from your computer. Gary L. Watry GIS Coordinator Center for Ocean-Atmospheric Prediction Studies FSU / COAPS Johnson Building, RM 215 2035 East Paul Dirac Drive Tallahassee, Florida 32306-2840 Phone (850) 645-7457 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Are there any thoughts on how organisations can work with OSGeo projects?
sorry for cross posting I have been involved in a number of discussions over the last year or so where people representing organisations have expressed an interest in extending Open Source spatial products and projects but are unsure or sceptical as to how it could be done. I'm interested in other people's thoughts on this. Overview: Typically in Government and other larger organisations, funding is Project based with a clear definition of business requirements, end deliverables and time frame. What I have seen of OS projects over the last seven years or so is that they are typically run by a group of committed individuals who have a desire for a particular type of product. Focus is often on delivering a quality product that is released 'when it is ready' rather than to a marketing department's timeframe. While there is often an end goal and a set of requirements for a release of a product, it is sometimes difficult to find people interested in spending their own time on the less exciting aspects of a project. For some context: #1 - I recently attended an workshop that contained representatives from a significant number of government departments from around Australia. There was a general consensus that we liked what we saw with GeoNetwork as a potential 'National' Metadata entry tool and Catalogue. There was also some discussion as to the types of features that we'd like to see developed longer term to support an 'Australian' metadata toolset. If this was to proceed we'd no doubt end up with a program of works that we'd like to see implemented. #2 - I have also been involved on the periphery of the GeoSciML efforts, part of which is a desire to use GeoServer to support GeoSciML and 'complex' objects. The GeoSciML work involves a number of Geological Survey organisations from around the world. This could also result in a program of works that people would like to see included into GeoServer. Some initial examples of issues that I can see (excluding funding) are: - Communication and liaison with the relevant open source community. We may have a block of work that we'd like to see developed, however this may potentially take a project in a direction that the community does not want to go in. How do we address this? - A shortage of developers with the required skills in a particular project. While we could put resources towards this problem, it will take time for the developers to get an understanding of the products and build the necessary credibility within the community. In the meantime, we have the problem of getting some early wins to ensure sufficient funding for the longer term. - Project based funding is typically focussed on a deliverable. The deliverable may well be an enhancement to an OSGeo project. How can a development team get that enhancement accepted into an OSGeo Project's code base in a timely manner? Can they be confident that the enhancement would not be removed at a later iteration of the OSGeo Project? - Where is the best place to discuss issues relating to a program of works that may span several OSGeo projects? + If the discussions were to take place on individual projects' development lists, then the overall 'Program' context may be lost. Also other OSGeo project developers may not be interested in the additional 'noise'. + In the first example above where it relates to a National program of works, it may be better to discuss these issues on the country's local chapter mailing list. At least this would still be visible to interested parties. + In the second example where it relates to an international program of works, perhaps a dedicated chapter could be established under OSGeo? + what would be the best way to coordinate the aims of a program of works and the aims of various OSGeo communities. I'm sure that others are thinking of these issues. They don't just relate to large programs of works, they also relate to smaller projects. Perhaps you would like to share your thoughts. Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Are there any thoughts on how organisations canwork with OSGeo projects?
Thanks to Frank, Puneet and Landon for your comments. Puneet I guess you might be meaning specifically governmental organizations -- specifying what you mean by an organization would be necessary. By organisation, I was inferring organisations that do not currently actively contribute. They could be public or private. Frank There is always the fallback option of a fork if plans are too divergent but that should be a last option. I think most projects are open to substantial new features that aren't the core teams priority if there is some assurance that the added parts will be maintained by the contributors, and are perhaps optional (plugins, etc). Ultimately though, if a direction is strongly opposed by the core team, it may be a bad idea to proceed. Agreed. Forking would not be desirable. Plugins are a good idea, provided that the project's architecture and desired change will allow them. If a proposal is strongly opposed, perhaps the communication attempt has failed. Regardless, it would not be a good idea to proceed. I'd like to see proposals embraced by the relevant core team as a desirable enhancement. Landon We are trying to hammer out a system of benchmarks that can be used to determine when an official release needs to be made. The Ubuntu team seem to be establishing a fairly good compromise of ~six monthly release cycles with ongoing security and critical bug fixes rolled out automatically as required (of course it helps that they are based on the Debian distribution ;-) ) Landon ... organization can always maintain there own build. Yes, though as a project progresses through iterative releases, this may be increasingly more difficult to maintain. I like Frank's idea of using a plugin approach, though this may not always be possible. Landon This would include things like minor bug fixes, documentation, user interface consistency, code testing... I think every open source project struggles with this. I can think of two solutions. Pay your own programmers to tackle the tasks or pay other programmers to do it for you. Often you will find you don't have to complete an entire task, just get the framework started and manage it. Good point. This is often overlooked when talking about OS development. Bruce wrote: - Project based funding is typically focused on a deliverable. The deliverable may well be an enhancement to an OSGeo project. How can a development team get that enhancement accepted into an OSGeo Project's code base in a timely manner? Can they be confident that the enhancement would not be removed at a later iteration of the OSGeo Project? Landon Here are some suggestions in this regard: - Avoid giving the impression that you are out to hijack control of the project. This is an excellent point. I would not like to see this occur. However it is a real danger that any OS project could face if enough developers with a specific agenda get involved. I would hope that OSGeo as an umbrella organisation would have a part to play to stamp out such undesirable activity. Does OSGeo have a redress process that can be used in such cases? Landon - Consider hiring a programmer already involved in the project to act as your liaison or ambassador. - Make it clear your enhancement or improvement is being donated to the community, that you are interested in maintaining it, and that you are really making an effort to serve the needs of the community while you meet you own needs or the needs of you client. Also good points. The requirement for maintenance is a prerequisite. Landon We could really do a better job of supporting third parties interested in contributing to open source software. Agreed. While people experienced with OS may have an idea as to where to start, it can be quite daunting for people in organisations used to traditional methodology to know where to start and have confidence that they will be able to get a result. Bruce. Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Re: [Aust-NZ] Geospatial Events Calendar?
Cameron, The GSDI people maintain a list of conferences at: http://www.gsdi.org/events/upcnf.asp This may help. Bruce Cameron Shorter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 15/10/2007 01:16 PM To OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org cc Aust-NZ OSGeo [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject [Aust-NZ] Geospatial Events Calendar? Has anyone set up (and maintaining) a Geospatial Events Calendar? Ideally one that I can import into my Google Calendar. It would be useful for picking future OSGeo conference dates that don't clash. -- Cameron Shorter Systems Architect, http://lisasoft.com.au Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050 Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254 ___ Aust-NZ mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/aust-nz Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Board Proposal: Statement of OSGeo Legal Support
IMO Good call Cameron. In this day and age it would pay to be proactive on these types of issues. It's been a while since I last looked at this. From memory, a number of large companies have pledged resources to help defend FOSS. I'm not sure where this is at currently. I think that its with the Linux Foundation - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Linux_Foundation (formed in 2007 from The Open Source Development Labs and the Free Standards Group). You may also want to look at the Software Freedom Law Centre founded by Eben Moglen. I understand that they provide pro-bono legal services to protect and advance Free and Open Source Software: http://www.softwarefreedom.org/technology/ Bruce Cameron Shorter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 31/10/07 09:30 AM Please respond to OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org To OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org cc Subject Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Board Proposal: Statement of OSGeo Legal Support Good processes + no money is an acceptable strategy so long as we have consciously made this decision and everyone is aware of the strategy. Allan Doyle wrote: On Oct 30, 2007, at 15:09 , Michael P. Gerlek wrote: Way back on that cold day in Chicago, I'm not sure anyone ever really thought about what it would mean when we said we'd offer legal protection. Does it imply/lead-to/entail some sort of indemnification? Ouch, that would be pricey... How does the Apache gang, et al, handle this? My recollection is that the Apache gang carefully keeps their coffers empty and makes sure the code all legally belongs to the Apache Foundation. Thus there's not enough of a pot of gold to win in a suit. However, I'm guessing that this strategy depends on a pretty well-defined process to ensure there are no loopholes. Allan -mpg -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Landon Blake Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 7:56 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Board Proposal: Statement of OSGeo Legal Support Cameron, I think this is an excellent idea, and a lawyer should definitely be consulted. I wonder if the legal staff at the Software Freedom Conservancy could assist. Landon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Cameron Shorter Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 3:56 AM To: OSGeo-Board Cc: OSGeo Discussions; Adrian Custer Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Board Proposal: Statement of OSGeo Legal Support OSGeo Board, (CC to OSGeo Discuss), During the founding of OSGeo, it was often noted that OSGeo projects would benefit from OSGeo legal protection. Now, as Geotools wrestles with graduation criteria and how to handle license assignment, the nature and level of legal protection offered by OSGeo is unclear. Also unclear is the level of legal review available (as tested by Geotools crafting of a Copywrite Assignment document). Consequently, geotools is having difficulty deciding whether it is wise to assign copywrite to OSGeo. I suspect a large part of the problem is that board members (like myself) are not lawyers and don't have a clear understanding of the options, the value of each of the options to OSGeo and the projects (how much protection is given), and the cost both in time and financially. Key questions to answer for each option are: * What level of support is given to contributors and license reviewers (individuals and companies) * What level of support is given to OSGeo users? * What level of support is given to projects? Will OSGeo fight a license infringer on behalf of a project? * What level of support is given to the OSGeo Foundation? *Proposal* That the board makes a clear statement on their website about nature and level of support offered by OSGeo to OSGeo projects and Individuals. This statement needs to be backed up with a budget item addressing financial implications related to the statement. Implementation: I suggest the steps to achieve the above would be: 1. Board approves budget to have a lawyer, or volunteer with legal review, to draw up a list of options and their financial implications. Adrian Custer's review provides an excellent basis for a lawyer to start from. http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOTOOLS/Geotools+Legal+Review 2. Board votes to select best option. 3. OSGeo financial sponsors are given opportunity to contribute to decision. 4. OSGeo budgets for decision 5. OSGeo records the legal stance publicly (on a webpage). -- Cameron Shorter Geospatial Systems Architect Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050 Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254 Think Globally, Fix Locally Commercial Support for Geospatial Open Source Software http://www.lisasoft.com/LISAsoft/SupportedProducts.html ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: FOSS4GIS business models
IMO. Gilberto, In 2003, I did a F00S4G market survey and published the results as a chapter of a US National Academy of Sciences book: Open Source GIS Software: Myths and Realities www.dpi.inpe.br/gilberto/papers/camara_open_source_myths.pdf. We analysed 70 FOSS4G software projects taken from the FreeGIS list, and divided them into three categories: networked products (e.g. GRASS), corporate products (e.g., PostGIS) and individual products (e.g., CAVOR). From each product, we assessed its maturity, level of support and functionality. This is an interesting read. Are you aware of any follow up work? I'm particularly interested in perceptions of the impact that OSGeo may be having as an umbrella organisation. wrt Government involvement: - as Frank suggests, I suspect that governments would have more impact supporting a central group of applications rather than each one rolling their own. The problem is assessing and picking the appropriate applications and projects to support. - governments often have a tender process that they need to follow when implementing new systems. If OS products aren't proposed or well supported, they often don't get looked at. - many governments also have a large investment (in time, training, money, processes and data) in existing proprietary products and can't easily switch arbitrarily to a new product. - Having said this, I'm aware of many organisations that are disatisfied with the status quo and looking to the longer term to reduce vendor lock-in. One way that people are looking to do this is to specify support for Open Standards (e.g. ISO 19100 series and OGC) as a key requirement. Currently OSGeo projects offer some of the better support for these standards. I hope that this continues (though I have noticed some derisive comments about standards w). wrt the Brazillian TerraLib toolkit mentioned in your paper: - I've had a quick look at the web site. The product appears to be quite mature and functional. - Has anyone from this list had a technical look at the products and like to share their observations? Can they be integrated with OSGeo apps? Do they support OGC standards etc? Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Finding Data Sets
Erik A place to start may be the Global Spatial Data Infrastructure (GSDI) registry: http://registry.gsdi.org/browse.php?order=title Bruce Bannerman Australia [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 24/01/2008 08:22:38 AM: A friend of mine is building a website and wants to add a map of India. He asked me today where he could find some good map data on India and I had to reply that I have no clue. I know that this list is not the appropriate venue for this sort of question, but I am hoping that maybe someone on this list would know and could point me in the right direction? Cholmes sort of unconvincingly suggested [EMAIL PROTECTED] Does anyone else have a thought? Thanks, Erik ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Job Postings / Job Wanted
Frank, IMO: This is a good idea. I'd prefer to see a separate mailing list though. The list could help foster a growing industry. Bruce Bannerman Frank Warmerdam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 25/01/08 08:12 AM Please respond to OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org To OSGeo discuss@lists.osgeo.org cc Subject [OSGeo-Discuss] Job Postings / Job Wanted Folks, The OSGeo Service Provider Directory was implemented in response to frequent questions I have received from folks trying to find a consultant or integrator they could contact for implementing foss4g solutions. Today (and certainly not for the first time) I received an email from someone trying to find potential employees with skills in a variety of OSGeo projects. My question is whether there is something we can do to address this need - and the corresponding need for folks who would like to find potential jobs that would take advantage of their foss4g knowledge and interest. Would it be acceptable to have job postings on this list? Should we try and setup a job postings / job wanted mailing list? Would it be likely to get enough subscribers and postings to make this worth while? I think of this as closely related to the recent issue about announcing foss4g related products and services. There are folks who want to know and folks who need to get their message out. But how do we put them together in a way that is likely to get a critical mass? Basically - it helps our goal of foss4g uptake to ensure that folks can make these commercial / employment contacts. Best regards, -- ---+-- I set the clouds in motion - turn up | Frank Warmerdam, [EMAIL PROTECTED] light and sound - activate the windows | http://pobox.com/~warmerdam and watch the world go round - Rush| President OSGeo, http://osgeo.org ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Does Open Source need a supervisory government body?
IMO: Sorry for the inflamatory subject heading. I'm hoping to get a few bites with my fishing... I'm currently reviewing a high level government strategy paper (in draft) and intend submitting a formal response. I'd like to see some discussion on the subject by my respected colleagues prior to making the submission. The gist of the comment in the draft strategy is something like: Open Source approaches to software development will be most effective if some form of central authority undertakes the role of verifying contributions and providing quality control. My initial reaction and response to this is something like: This is a misreading of how Open Source works. Successful Open Source Projects typically have software of superior quality. This is usually due to there being many developers who have access to the software for QA purposes. Any attempt to impose a central authority from outside of Open Source projects would be rebuffed vigorously and result in a probably irrepairable relationship between that party and the project(s) involved. The most successful centralised Open Source authority is probably the Apache Foundation (http://www.apache.org/) which is behind a wide range of projects including the Apache Web Server, probably the most widely used Web Server on the Internet. The Foundation pioneered the concept of 'Meritocracy', where people earn respect and are given greater responsibility for projects based on their past contributions and 'merit'. The Foundation grew from within the Project. It was not imposed on the Project. They have developed an enviable reputation for spawning, incubating and fostering robust Open Source Projects that routinely produce high quality software. Nearly two years ago, an organisation called the Open Source Geospatial Foundation (OSGEO, http://www.osgeo.org/) was formed based on the Apache ethos, to provide similar support for Open Source Spatial applications. They currently have a number of prominent spatial projects in Incubation with a number of other equally capable projects waiting for the next vacancy for incubation. OK, over to you. I'm interested in all points of view on this issue. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Does Open Source need a supervisory government body?
IMO: Thanks for the comments Michael, As I said in my post, I was being deliberately provocative with choice of subject heading. Yes it is certainly possible that I've missed the intent of the author's comments. It is only a small portion of an excellent document. However, I also have a very good feel for how 'the gist' of the comments may be interpreted by some readers. My intent is to avoid a situation where well intention people may damage relationships between Government and FOSS. Bruce Without having seen the sentences on either side of the one you quote, I think I'd argue that the author is not wrong in his statement: is not what we here call a PSC, and indeed the OSGeo Foundation itself, an embodiment of some form of central authority? ..which is not to say your own arguments are wrong, obviously -- it just may be that you're reading something stronger into what the author actually had in mind? -mpg Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Case studies for migrating to Geospatial FOSS?
IMO: Cameron, An alternative is that an organisation specialising in translation type services (e.g. SBS in Australia) might be approached if we can find the funding. Bruce Bannerman Do you think there would be any chance of encouraging the responsible departments to translate to English? Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] OS Spatial environment 'sizing'
IMO: Hello everyone, I'm trying to get a feel for server 'sizing' for a **hypothetical** Corporate environment to support OS Spatial apps. Assume that: - this is a dedicated environment to allow the use of OS Spatial applications to serve Corporate OGC Services. - the applications of interest are GeoServer, Deegree, GeoNetwork, MapServer, MapGuide and Postgres/PostGIS. - the environment may need to scale relatively quickly. - it will be required to serve in the vicinty of 5 to 10 TB of data initially (WMS, WFS, WCS). Can anyone shed some light on the following questions please? - I'm assuming a Linux installation (SLES, Redhat or Debian) or possibly Intel Solaris. Has anyone experienced any issues in these (or other) environments that they'd like to share? - Are there any recommendations as to dedicated network bandwidth that should be allocated? - Has anyone done any work with load balancing and would like to share their experiences? - Of the above OS Spatial products, which ones could co-exist on the same server (excluding Postgres/PostGIS)? Any thoughts are appreciated. Bruce Bannerman Australia Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] OS Spatial environment 'sizing' + Image Management
IMO: Hi Randy, Thank you for your informative post. It has given me a lot to follow up on and think about. I can see an immediate need that this type of solution could well be used for. I like it. I suspect that in many larger corporate types of environments, it could well be used effectively for 'pilot' and 'pre-production' type tasks. For 'production' type environments, there would be issues of integrating an external service hosting spatial data with internal services hosting corporate aspatial data sources and applications. with regards to storing imagery in a database: rant (and not directed at you) I've also seen a lot of reports suggesting that image management should be file based. My personal preference is to use a database if possible, so that I can take advantage of corporate data management facilities, backups, point in time restores etc. I've managed 70 GB orthophoto mosaics in ArcSDE / Oracle before with minimal problems. I found performance and response times to be comparable with other image web server options on the market that use file based solutions for storing data. Ideally, I'm looking to manage state wide mosaics with a consistant look and feel that can be treated as a single 'layer' by client GIS / Remote Sensing applications (data integrity issues allowing). One potential use is 'best available' data mosaics could undergo regular updates as more imagery is flown or captured. A database makes it easier to manage and deliver such data. My definition of 'imagery' goes beyond aerial photographs and includes multi or hyper-spectral imagery; various geophysics data sources such as aeromagnetics, gravity, radiometrics; radar data etc. Typically this data is required for digital image analysis purposes using a remote sensing application, so the integrity of 'the numbers' that make up the image is very important. Many of today's image based solutions use a (lossy) wavelet compression that can corrupt the integrity of 'the numbers' describing the radiometric data in the image. When we consider the big picture issues facing us today, such as Climate Change, I think that it is important to protect our definitive image libraries from such corruption as they will be invaluable sources of data for future multi-temporal analysis. That said, if the end use is just for a picture, then a wavelet compression is a good option. Just protect the source data for future use. /rant So, does anyone know of a good open source spatial solution for storing and accessing (multi and hyperspectral) imagery in a database?;-) WMS 1.3 and WCS are showing promise for serving imagery, including multi and hyperspectral data. Bruce Bannerman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 20/02/2008 10:09:28 AM: Hi Ivan, The most common advice I've seen says to leave raster out of the DB. Of course footprints and meta data could be there, but you would want to point Geoserver coverage to the image/image pyramid url somewhere in the directory hierarchy. Brent has a nice writeup here: http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOSDOC/Load+NASA+Blue+Marble+Data In an AWS sense my idea is to Java proxy the Geoserver Coverage Data URL to S3 buckets and park the imagery over on the S3 side to take advantage of stability and replication. Performance, though, might not be as good as a local directory. Maybe a one time cache to a local directory would work better. Note: Amazon doesn't charge for inside AWS data transfers. So in theory: PostGIS holds the footprint geometry + metadata EC2 Geoserver WFS handles footprint queries into an Svg/Xaml client, just stick it on top of something like JPL BMNG. Once a user picks a coverage switch to the Geoserver WMS/WCS service for zooming around in the selected image pyramid S3 buckets contain the tiffs, pyramids ... EC2 Geoserver handles WMS/WCS service EC2 proxy pulls the imagery from the S3 side as needed Sorry I haven't had time to try this so it is just theoretical. Of course you can go traditional and just keep the coverage imagery files on the local instance avoiding the S3 proxy idea. The reason I don't like that idea is the imagery has to be loaded with every instance creation while an S3 approach would need only one copy. randy -Original Message- From: Lucena, Ivan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 2:59 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] OS Spatial environment 'sizing' Hi Randy, Bruce, That is a nice piece of advise Randy. I am sorry to intrude the conversation but I would like to ask how that heavy raster manipulation would be treated by PostgreSQL/PostGIS, managed or unmanaged? Best regards, Ivan Randy George wrote: Hi Bruce, On the scale relatively quickly front, you should look at Amazon's EC2/S3 services. I've recently worked
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')
IMO: Hi Randy, Ivan and Arnulf, I seem to have spawned another thread, moving away from my original post and Randy's excellent response. Sorry. I've renamed this thread accordingly. more below... [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 21/02/2008 02:38:13 AM: Hi Ivan and Bruce, I am curious to know what advantage an arcSDE/Oracle stack would provide on image storage. I had understood imagery was simply stored as large blob fields and streamed in and out of the DB where it is processed/viewed etc. The original state I had understood was unchanged (lossy, wavelet, pk or otherwise happening outside the DB), just residing in the DB directory rather than the disk hierarchy. Other than possible table corruption issues I imagined that the overhead for streaming a blob into an image object was the only real concern on DB storage. The ArcSDE storage of imagery solution that I described in my earlier post was at a previous place of employment. They still utilise the solution effectively. While the storage of imagery using ArcSDE can technically utilise multiple bands of radiometric data, it is mainly using a set of blob records as Randy identified. This limits the usefulness of the product when you want a flexible tool to manage multi or hyper spectral data. This is also one of the reasons that I'm looking for alternate RDBMS based solutions. Having said that I found ArcSDE to be quite effective for orthophoto mosaics of aerial photography as I described earlier. The data that we used was: aerial photography: - approx 500 individual images from around fifteen runs of photography - approx 140 panelled ground control points and airbourne GPS - photography was scanned and aerotriangulated - imagery was then mosaiced, orthorectified and colour balanced - imagery then diced into around 70 RGB TIFF6 files, each around 1 GB, ~6 cm ground resolution. - imagery loaded into Oracle/ArcSDE - positional accuracy determined (~0.1m) using stats and spread of error viewed usinging krieging techniques. In short ESRI's approach with ArcSDE (as I understand it) is: - images broken down into small blobs (we used 128k x 128k tiles, LZ77 compressed TIFF) and loaded with one 128k blob per database record. - statistics calculated on imagery - 7 pyramid layers created This gave us the ability to: - store a relatively large amount imagery and utilise it as a single entity (e.g. a layer). - only retrieve the records (tiles) required for the geographic area being viewed. That is we did not need to load the entire mosaic into memory, just stream the records required. - only utilised an appropriate image sample for the viewing scale utilised via the pyramid layers (a common technique used by RS products). - if required, add additional data to the mosaic. - take advantage of corporate data management techniques as discussed previously. As Arnulf correctly identified, there is a black box behind the data storage. But this is equally true for the majority of spatial data that is under active management around the world. Ideally we would utilise an open format for storage and an open format for delivery. Also for Arnulf: - I think that the user requirement is there for storing raster data in a DB. We have had two uses identified by myself and by Ivan. - When you consider the complexities that Google must be facing with GE in trying to manage 256x256k tiles of imagery over the entire world, at multiple pyramid layers and with constant revision of imagery, you can soon see that a file based approach would lead to a major headache. - I personally think that the case for raster in a DB has been made. Now what I'd ideally like to find is a good solution for managing multi and hyper spectral data in an RDB with the ability to serve whatever band combination that a **user** requires via an appropriate standard (possibly via WMS 1.3+ or WCS). Does anyone know of any solutions, preferrably OS? I do recall a product that came out of a German Uni around 2003. There was some talk on GIS-L at the time, however it has slipped off my radar. Does anyone know what became of it. I do recall that they'd had discussions with Oracle. It was around this time that Oracle announced their Georaster format. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] OS Spatial environment 'sizing' + Image Management
IMO: Thanks for the comments Michael, I was wondering if you'd contribute;-) (Also, note that wavelet does not necessarily imply lossy anymore, as many assume. Story of my life.) Can you point me to any studies to support the claim that JPEG2000 can indeed be indeed non-lossy? I've seen the claims over the years, but nothing to support it (not that I've actively gone looking for the info, as I haven't had the need). Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')
IMO: Hi Tyler, Thanks for the reply. Am I correct in believing that the two things people desire with images in an RDB, is having an abstract 1) storage framework (tables) and 2) a common access language (SQL) for managing the framework. You could have the most complex storage set up behind the scenes, but as long as the access interface plays well, the complexity could be minimised by good UI design. At least I think so, but haven't done it before. I can't speak for other people's needs, but only give my own opinion. My experience with storing spatial data in a database is mainly limited to ESRI's solutions based on ArcSDE/Oracle (~7 years). I have had a cursory look at Oracle Spatial and PostGres/PostGIS and intend looking a lot closer at both. I've also used a number of spatial tools over the years from a number of vendors. I've implemented and managed a number of ArcSDE instances over the years. As skeptical as I am about the decision to rename the product as ArcGIS Server basic (or whatever its called now), ESRI have done a great job with the product. Particularly with its integration with ArcGIS Desktop as the primary user interface for adding, maintaining and managing spatial data from a GUI. You don't need to use SQL, but it also has its advantages (when appropriate). I've found a number of benefits with managing spatial data in a corporate database environment. These comments apply to both vector and image data. I'm sure that these comments are equally pertinent to most RDBMS maintained spatial data. Some examples are: - Within a large organisation, it is possible to get rid of most of the islands of data that are hidden in a wide variety of departments. If implemented right, people come to see the database as the authoritive source of their data and respect it as such. - This can remove the situation where you get multiple copies of the same dataset around your organisation, with different people making their own independent edits to the data and expecting someone to reconcile the edits with the authoritative data set at a later time (if you're lucky). - It can also remove the situation where someone takes a copy of a critical data set and does not update it for several years, leaving business people making critical decisions on suspect data. - You can start managing your data for a given geographic phenomena as a single entity covering a large geographic region, without having to resort to tiles and all the related edge matching problems that we had in the past (e.g. mismatching pixels, lines, polygons that just end at the tile boundary or have an incorrect attibute on the matching sheet etc). - Some of the biggest advantages though, come from the corporate IT support that you come to rely on, e.g. regular backups, large disk capacity on fast SAN devices, secure access to data by authorised custodians, redundant databases for disaster recovery, point in time restoration of data etc. To date, I have not found a suitable solution for managing imagery that includes multi and hyper spectral data in a database. But I'm looking. Ideally the solution will use open data formats for storage and delivery. I'm getting sick of having to redevelop corporate applications with the same functionality because a vendor has decided to change their technology and data formats. This results in a lot of wasted time and money that would be better used implementing effective decision support tools that allow businesses to better understand and exploit their data. Some more recent raster in db discussion here: http://spatialgalaxy.net/2008/02/15/rasters-in-the-database-why-bother/ Thanks for the heads-up Tyler. I obviously don't know what I'm talking about ;-) (eh Tim?). Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] GIS applications to off-shore EP (oil gas)
IMO: Hi Paulo, I have been wondering, and haven't found much literature on the subject of applying GIS to the EP chain. I can see it would be useful, but can't exactly see where and how. Also note, that I am coming from a geology background, now working with reservoir geophysics, and that one of my previous jobs was with GIS in the Brazilian Geological Survey. By EP, I'm assuming that you're referring to Exploration and Petroleum? I've worked in several roles over the years working with Geoscientific data particularly as it relates to data management and in Minerals Exploration and Mining. In my current role that is also my current focus, however there is a looming need for the integration of Petroleum related data as well. I don't claim to be an expert, but I personally think that this is just another application of spatial data, albeit with its own unique challenges, e.g.: - As I see it the problem space is essentially 4D in nature, where true 3D non-uniform data needs to be modelled, while taking into account changes over time to try and understand the factors that led to the formation of various 'rocks'. This includes looking at issues like continental drift to look for what was potentially adjacent in the past when looking for new provinces to explore. - The amount of data to be managed is challenging. We're looking at in the vicinity of 60TB and increasing rapidly. - There are a number of 'true 3D' modelling tools (NB: for others, I'm not talking DEMs here) that allow you to model sub-surface data at a mine scale (e.g. Datamine, Vulcan etc), and several others for regional scale work (we're using GoCad and GeoModeller). These use a variety of approaches from 3D wireframe modelling through to 3D block modelling with fluid dynamics. I don't know of any serious 3D data management in a database yet, though I understand that Oracle has announced something with v.11. As always, a good Spatial Metadata solution is essential. - 2D spatial data and tools such as GIS and Remote Sensing are very useful in getting an understanding of your area of interest. This includes traditional data such as topographic, environmental, exploration tenements, infrastructure and remote sensing data such as satellite imagery, hyperspectral imagery (one use is looking for oil seeps on the ocean surface), LIDAR, radar, geophysics etc Cross Sections through the earth surface may also be considered as 2D data, though they also have considerable value in the 3D modelling process. - Sonar, sesimic etc data is also 'spatial' data. - There are dedicated Petroleum systems that you may be interested in e.g Petrosys, dbmap etc. - When it comes to modelling Geoscientific data, the variety and depth of inter-relationships of aspatial requirements is probably beyond the ability of most (if not all) GIS to manage effectively. We're developing an approach for the management of our geoscientific data that has the geographic component of spatial data managed in ArcSDE via ArcGIS and the aspatial component managed in a dedicated database with an overarching WebSphere application controlling attribute maintenance and constructing geoscience 'objects' at run time. Our aim is to serve these as OGC 'complex objects' via WFS using **GeoServer** for use via GIS, 3D app, statistics package etc. You may want to have a look at the work happening with GeoSciML and the 'One Geology' project for more background on this. See: https://www.seegrid.csiro.au/twiki/bin/view/CGIModel/GeoSciML http://www.onegeology.org/ I hope this helps, Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')
IMO: Paul, On Feb 21, 2008, at 4:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What it comes down to is what is appropriate for your use case. Indeed! However, there seem to be vanishingly few use cases for which raster-in-database is actually the more appropriate solution. ;-) I beg to differ. (BTW, point-in-time recovery, a nice example of a place where database semantics have an upper hand. Although more modern file systems and enterprise backup systems are pretty competitive now... even a relatively simple hack like the OS/X Time Machine feature solves that problem for-all-practical-purposes.) Trying to manage very large regional datasets via a file based solution is problematic as described earlier with tile based approach to vector data in particular. Again for my use case the DB is better. Just to throw in another related issue: Lidar systems are throwing out an enormous amount of data. I had one dataset of only around 17 million odd records several years ago (of course stored in our corporate db ;-) ) that we could not handle with ArcGIS Desktop (v9.1). From memory it was a 32bit issue. What approaches are people using with large Lidar datasets? Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')
IMO: Tim, Would you like to expand on this? Bruce Completely off the wall thought, but what about using git? Tim Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Management in an RDBMS...(was OS Spatial environment 'sizing')
IMO 12 million records is teensy. Stuff it into PostGIS. It's the billion- point LIDAR sets that leave me queasy, but I can't begin to think of a reasonable architecture for that without learning more about how the points are actually USED, which I really am not clear on at the moment. Paul, Agreed. Generation of TINs or surfaces of roughness over that number of points will challenge any data management solution. However, the time is coming / has come when people will want to do it. It is perhaps a good candidate for Grid architectures and high performance computing. Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Image Handling in RDBMS
IMO: Hi Puneet. Thanks for the comments. That brings us back to PostGIS supporting images. Clearly, most folks who use it don't see it worth the effort implementing. I suggest two things -- one. This being open source, Bruce and others, start developing the capabilities and contribute it back to the PostGIS project as an add-on. Many like you, the silent ones, would appreciate it. Its hard to get a feel for the 'number' of silent ones... You may not want me getting my hands dirty in code development again its been a long time ;-). My current focus is on advocacy and on trying to get a big picture overview of OS Spatial so that I can work out where I can best help, rather than just jumping in blindly. With the advocacy, I may be able to help get additional resources assigned to some OS Spatial and OSGeo Projects. There are already Australian government resources going into the development of: - GeoNetwork (to support ANZLIC's adoption of GeoNetwork (http://www-ext.osdm.gov.au/osdm/policy/metadata.html)) - GeoServer and GeoTools (CSIRO work on complex objects to support GeoSciML): + http://www.nabble.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED],-Ben-Caradoc-Davies-td15312675.html + http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOTOOLS/SEEGrid+project+scope wrt the big picture work, I intend sharing what I have currently in the near future. I'll post more on this later. wrt imagery in Postgres, there is already work happening in this space. The Brazillian TerraLib project supports raster in Postgres. There have also been others mentioned in this thread. How can other projects take advantage of and further this work? two. Again, Bruce, you summed up the thread in another email -- might I suggest that you add the pros and cons of storing images in a db to the edu-OSGeo wiki as a presentation/decision-making aid so other data managers evaluating this issue have a valuable resource to lean on. I'll do this as soon as time allows (and I learn how to edit a wiki). Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] 'lossless' JPEG2000
IMO: Thanks for the reply Traian, I don't mean to be dismissive of this report, but I was hoping for something more definitive to prove that 'lossless' JPEG compressions did indeed protect the integrity of the data.. Perhaps its just my ignorance, but I was hoping for something along the lines of: - a study of a range of typical spatial 'imagery'. - evaluation of all spectral values for each pixel in each image before compression. - 'lossless' compression of the images - restoration of the compressed images - comparison of all spectral values for each pixel in each restored image against the original pre-compressed values. - definitive statement with reference to the study results. Bruce JPEG2K supports lossless via a reversible wavelet transform with integral coefficients (which make it reversible, and so lossless). Here is a reference: http://www.ece.uvic.ca/~mdadams/publications/pacrim2001.pdf Traian Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] 'lossless' JPEG2000
IMO: Michael, My concern as a custodian of significant image resources is to ensure that the integrity of this data is protected and available for future analytical use by ourselves and by the public. As an example, to conduct multi-temporal analysis of 'imagery' to help understand big picture issues such as climate change. I understand that wavelet compressions such as MrSid and ecw are lossy compressions and JPEG 2000 can be 'lossless', or as often occurs, lossy. I'm currently seeing proposals to the effect: - wrt imagery, most people only want to look at pretty pictures - therefore we'll compress our imagery via wavelet compression and save a lot of disk space and ongoing SAN costs by backing up the source imagery to tape. Noone uses it anyway. I've been around long enough to expect problems from tape backups, and to not expect my data to be there when I request a restore. I can also see an increasing need for image analysis for big picture issues such as climate change and water shortage (in Australia). Therefore, naiave as it is, I want to be 'convinced' that our data is protected for future use before agreeing to such potentially irreversible proposals. Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 24/02/2008 08:44:25 AM: Bruce- It is not clear to me what sort of study you would need to convince you, as the ISO standard for encoding data into the JPEG-2000 file format is by construction mathematically and numerically lossless process. (Indeed, compression, i.e. throwing away bits so as to further reduce storage requirements, is actually not defined within the scope of the standard.) -mpg Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] 'lossless' JPEG2000
IMO: Michael, Thanks for the comments on this thread. I've had a couple of private emails expressing interest in the outcome, so I'll continue this conversation in public, rather than moving it offline. One of the problems that I have is that I understand that JPEG 2000 can be 'lossy' or 'non-lossy'. (Is there a way to tell if a JPEG2000 file is lossy or not?) I don't pretend to understand the maths behind wavelet compressions. I have also not seen 'proof' that would convince me I would be able to safely compress all of my imagery using JPEG2000, (potentially) throw away my source imagery and feel confident that I'd be able to run image processing routines on the radiometric 'numbers' of the imagery at some undefined point in the future with confidence in the integrity of the results. As a reminder, when talking about 'imagery', I'm using the term in its broadest sense to include data such as multi and hyperspectral data in the umbrella term 'imagery'. I'm not talking about only three bands displayed as Red, Green and Blue, but **all** the bands in the 'file'. The description of a test that I included in the early stages of this thread would give me a degree of confidence that JPEG 2000 was a suitable format for long term archival of image data. All that I'm seeing at the moment from many people and organisations is something to the effect of Trust me, your data is saved using a loss-less compression. Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 26/02/2008 04:27:22 AM: Bruce- Again, I'm not sure how to convince you of this... JP2 is inherently lossless just like GeoTIFF is; what arguments do you / would you find persuaive to use GeoTIFF? (alternatively, what do you use now that you trust?) [feel free to take this to private email, this is probably a bit esoteric for the rest of the OSGeo crowd] -mpg Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] 'lossless' JPEG2000
IMO: Michael, Again, I don't pretend to be an expert on JPEG2000. However, I'd like to know more about the format for future reference. Does the wiki article at the following URL represent a good overview of the format? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JPEG_2000 If it is accurate, there is a section that leads me to conclude that the format is not suitable for a lot of remotely sensed spatial imagery: snip Color components transformation Initially, images have to be transformed from the RGB color space to another color space, leading to three components that are handled separately. There are two possible choices:... /snip If this *is* the case, then I wouldn't be able to use the format to store multi and hyper spectral imagery (ignoring other JP2 issues). As to what format are we using currently:The source format that the data came in with appropriate Geophysics, ERMapper and in some cases Erdas Imagine conversions. What are we using in the future: To be determined, probably a database oriented solution. As to data corruption: Many image processing algorithims and processes result in data loss. The aim for most people is to understand what is acceptable and to minimise the corruption of their data. In our situation, some of the imagery may result from many millions of dollars spent in capture and processing. Much of it is irreplacable. All of it must be protected for future use. Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Java Collaboration...Again
IMO: Hi Frank, I would also like to bring to your attention the MetaCRS project, an effort to confederate some other existing coordinate system related projects (particularly Proj4JS, CS-MAP and PROJ.4) and to work towards some shared test data and coordinate system dictionaries. http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/MetaCRS Its good to see another project listed. I hadn't see this project referenced before on the OSGeo Web site at: - http://www.osgeo.org/ - http://www.osgeo.org/content/faq/foundation_faq.html - http://www.osgeo.org/incubator/index.html I'm probably missing the obvious, but do we have a full listing of OSGeo projects that are in incubation or have graduated? Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Java Collaboration...Again
IMO: Thanks Markus, Bruce Markus Neteler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/05/08 07:33 PM Please respond to OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org To OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org cc OSGeo-incubator [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Java Collaboration...Again On Mon, May 5, 2008 at 9:45 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: IMO: Hi Frank, I would also like to bring to your attention the MetaCRS project, an effort to confederate some other existing coordinate system related projects (particularly Proj4JS, CS-MAP and PROJ.4) and to work towards some shared test data and coordinate system dictionaries. http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/MetaCRS Its good to see another project listed. I hadn't see this project referenced before on the OSGeo Web site at: - http://www.osgeo.org/ I have added indication in the OSGeo projects box to show which projects are yet in incubation. - http://www.osgeo.org/content/faq/foundation_faq.html Updated. - http://www.osgeo.org/incubator/index.html Points to http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Incubation_Committee I'm probably missing the obvious, but do we have a full listing of OSGeo projects that are in incubation or have graduated? It is essentially the (updated) box on the main site as well as the Wiki page indicated above. I agree that a couple (?) of projects aren't listed. I have added new new section Queuing requests to the Wiki http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Incubation_Committee#Queuing_requests which is possibly yet incomplete. Would leave that to the InCom chair... Markus ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] scale of FOSS projects
IMO: Well said Jo. I know, this argument has gone round and round in the past, and many are impatient with philosophising. I hope that philosophising can sometimes provide energysaving insight, or i wouldnt engage in it. But repeating without code, you are nothing grates on the nerves after a while. I'd also echo the sentiment with regards to OGC Standards bashing. One of the key reasons that we as a reasonably large organisation are looking seriously at adopting and contributing further the Open Source spatial world is because of its strong support for OGC standards. +1 to Frank's comments. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Sign the Hague declaration
IMO: Good points Michael. I'm not looking to start a debate, but... ditto. (perhaps I should stay out of this...) We call on all governments to: 1. Procure only information technology that implements free and open standards; This is desirable, however consider: There is often existing proprietary technology in use that meets the requirements of a business. There may have been a significant investment over a large period of time to implement and use this technology. The business unit may not have achieved its return on investment. There may also have been a significant investment in training end users in this product range. Another consideration is the availability of trained users and consultants within industry. Another is the overhead in data conversion of significant repositories, and the potential for lost context during the conversion process (e.g. topology). Considering the above, it may not be realistic to expect this to occur quickly. This is something that needs to be phased in strategically over time, if it makes sense to do so. From my viewpoint it is more important to make sure that data maintained within these 'proprietary systems' is able to be freely shared using open standards. This can be implemented parallel to the proprietary systems. In time systems can be converted when investment decisions allow and business functionality is met. 2. Deliver e-government services based exclusively on free and open standards; This another of those 'holy war' issues that never seem to go away and flair up from time to time. Not all countries, or even government organisations within countries have the same liberal approaches to free and open access to data that the US and Canada do. Many organisations still have their budgets tied to sales of 'licenses' to their data. There are also security issues for some countries. We can have open access to data as a goal, but don't expect overnight success. Also there is a significant demand for governments to provide data in someone's favourite format, so that they don't have to do the conversion into 'their' spatial tool. 3. Use only free and open digital standards in their own activities. Again desirable. My comments to point 1 above are also relevent here. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Should OSGeo get involved in the Information Architecture realm and nurture the development of definitive spatial ontologies?
IMO: The discussion below has been extracted from a thread currently running on OSGeo-AustNZ that is exploring options for supporting the development of an ANZLIC Profile to GeoNetwork. This related discussion may be of interest to other members of the discuss list. Rob Atkinson has proposed that OSGeo may be the right body to nurture the development of a set of consistent ontologies describing commonly used spatial entities. This could make it much easier for us to build targetted applications in the long term. It could also become a key reason to adopt OSGeo products, particularly if it is consistently adopted across the OS stack. This suggestion has merit and should be explored further. Please see below for context. I'd be interested in other peoples thoughts on this proposal. Bruce Bannerman As a long term participant in OGC, I think it is capable of providing A computational view of a reference architecture. We may want to support parallel views - for example a registry can easily support CSW. ebXML, Z39.50, SPARL, OAI etc interfaces from the same content. This profiling pattern is possibly within the OGC purview, but its not handled well at the moment IMHO because its something that affects deployers, not technology developers: the need to maintain a consistent _information architecture_. OGC is a technology vendor association primarily. GSDI could own a SDI reference architecture - but doesnt seem geared up for it. OSGEO should at least consider the commonality between its projects, out of business sense. If databases and services and clients and registries dont handle common metadata, the pieces dont fit together well. Every time I get asked to advise someone on building tools I have to warn them they have a huge job gluing the pieces together into a coherent whole, and there will huge amounts of redundant information scattered across the configurations of each component that will make it all expensive to build, test and maintain. Proprietary systems do tend to be better at this, since inter- component interoperation is often the key to marketing success. Peopele want an application - and they buy all the components with the expectation the application will work. IMHO OSGEO could significantly improve its offerings by having a common information architecture (without necessarily mandating all projects use it). 2c, but with inflation $64million :-) Rob Rob, Your response highlights the pressing need for a good extensible Metadata Catalogue. (warning: ramblings follow...) This is further highlighted by OSGeo's OWS-5 screen casts that Raj Singh posted about today on the OSGeo Discuss list. http://www.opengeospatial.org/pub/www/ows5/demo.html The demos provide an exciting glimpse of what may be possible in the future using OGC web services. However we have a lot of work to do before we get there. Again, OWS-5 has also highlighted the need for a good catalogue / registry as well as the potential of the information architecture that you discussed. This stresses the importance of GeoNetwork to the ASDI, and also highlights that the ANZLIC Profile work is just the beginning. We are going to need a suite of 'profiles' or definitive registry lists going into the future (again a subject that you have been discussing for a number of years). I suspect that we'll also need strong support for ebRIM as well. With regards to Information Architecture: From memory, you touched on Information Architecture and the need for consistent ontologies describing data during your Keynote Address at the recent WALIS Forum. When you consider the big picture issues that we are currently facing e.g. Climate Change, Water Management, Security etc; it is becoming apparent that we need to have consistent schemas / ontologies to describe our data both nation-wide and world-wide in order to conduct effective spatial analysis. As anyone who has tried to integrate, a contiguous spatial dataset covering a large regional, or even continental area with spatial data coming from a number of data providers will attest, it is like opening Pandora's box and not an exercise to be undertaken lightly. We all call the same spatial entity type by a different name, record different aspatial attributes, or possibly the same attributes but with different and inconsistent values and data types, rendering successful analysis a joke. I understand that this issue has been around for years and that there have been a number of attempts at consistency, e.g.: - The ICMS Harmonised Data Model ( http://www.icsm.gov.au/icsm/harmonised_data_model/links.html ) - Ordnance Survey's Master Map - ESRI's Geodatabase Data Models Probably the most advanced that I'm aware of is the GeoSciML work for describing Geoscientific data ( https
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Should OSGeo get involved in the Information Architecture realm and nurture the development of definitive spatial ontologies?
Hi Jo, Thank you for your considered reply (...and no, I don't consider it trollish ;-) ) We need robust debate on these types of issues if we are to progress them. OK, I'll try and put some more context on the original query. I see that there are two main ways of utilising spatial information: - producing a pretty picture that helps people understand an issue. We have a number of types of products that fall in this realm, including Google Maps, Google Earth, Virtual Earth, Slippy Maps etc. - as an input into structured analysis that is used as an aid to answering a particular question and also as an aid to exploring inter-relationships between spatial, business, scientific data etc. The output from this analysis could be a 'map', but of equal relevance it could be in tabular, graphical or textual form. This is the realm of traditional spatial analysis, image analysis or a range of spatial products that I like to term 'Spatial Intelligence Frameworks' e.g. Cohga's Weave, NGIS' GeoSamba, ESRI Australia's Eview. I fall into the second camp and try to implement systems that help end users to explore and better utilise their data. For effective analysis to be undertaken, you need to understand your data and ensure that there are appropriate aspatial attributes to query and analyse to find an answer to your problem. While this is relatively straight forward for project work where you control the data capture and QA processes, it starts becoming very messy as soon as you start to try and take advantage of data captured by other people and organisations. Typically we find that another organisation has captured data describing the same geographic phenomena for a different purpose, modelled the data differently, with different fields and data types. This requires lost time and effort in trying to massage the data into a format that we can use and requires compromises in what can be considered an acceptable outcome. Throw into this the big picture issues that we are facing, e.g. Climate Change, Water Shortage (in Australia) etc that require analysis at a continental or global scale and we have a big problem. How can we as an industry help this work to progress quickly with minimal impact on the analysis, minimal double handling of data and in many cases the use of dynamic data from multiple sources? This is the context in which I made my original post. As I discussed, I think that the geoscience community is showing us a potential way forward with their community work developing the GeoSciML profile. Anyone who has worked with geological data will appreciate the magnitude of their accomplishments to date. This includes a way of describing one of the most abstract types of spatial data an a consistent way that can be understood by people of different cultures and different languages. This effort has taken a community four to five years to develop to its current state with considerable effort. How do we get consistent schema / ontologies / profiles for other spatial phenomena? You are right in that it could be a GSDI responsibility. It could also be an Enterprise Architecture responsibility (e.g. FEA Data Reference Model). In the end, I suspect that we will need community driven involvement to get it right. Communities of practice (like the geoscience community) will need to work together to develop *their* profiles describing *their* data. Is it an OSGeo responsibility? Probably not. I take the point of your earlier email that OSGeo is predominantly about OS software. Is this an issue that OSGeo can help with? Possibly. When you consider the analysis requirement for spatial data, I suspect that we as an industry may be heading in the wrong direction. Some of the issues that are are attracting a lot of effort are about simplifying spatial data (GeoRSS, GeoJSON, BXFS etc). These appear to be about catering to the 'pretty picture' use of spatial information. I'm regularly seeing serious efforts to address the analysis use of spatial data (e.g. GML 3 and complex features) ridiculed. I'm not saying that there is no use for the pretty pictures. There certainly is and Google in particular is catering to this very well and increasing the awareness of spatial information amongst decision makers and the public alike. Meanwhile 2050 is fast approaching, if we are to believe the climate change predictions. Bruce Bannerman signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source development metrics
IMO: An issue has come up recently on the OSGeo-AustNZ list that I'd appreciate some feedback from our wider OSGeo Community. The context of this issue is that we are exploring ways to support development of the GeoNetwork ANZLIC Profile. In particular, we're looking at options that allow permanent staff to contribute to ongoing OS development work outside of normal Project based development with its well defined deliverables and timeframes. In Australia within the public sector and also in many larger private organisations there is a Human Resources process in place that is based on Performance Management. This process allows either staff or managers to initiate discussions that allow for goal based work to be undertaken. In principal both parties agree to a set of goals. If the goals are met, it contributes to the employee's remuneration review. What I'm trying to find are some examples of generic metrics that are meaninful to Open Source development methodologies. They must be specific, meaningful and measurable. For example, we could look at measures such as: Get feature X accepted into the trunk of GeoNetwork by June 2009 However this is probably unrealistic as to do this the developer will have to have existing credibility within the community and there may be good reasons why the community does not want to have 'product X' included. Does anyone have any examples that they use or thoughts on the above? I do understand that metrics can be abused, may be meaningless and may not be the best way to handle this, however we have to start somewhere. We have a window of opportunity to get some more developers working on OS projects as the Performance Planning cycle re-starts shortly and I'd like to help our developers get some constructive ideas to take into their sessions. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source development metrics
IMO: Thanks for the comments Puneet, Actually, a variation on the above may be the best metric -- create feature X that we need in our organization and that works for us. That would allow your organization to determine what is meaningful for your organization first and for open source second. In other words, you would treat open source development no different from non-open source development. Open source would simply become a normal activity. Once feature X works for you, you could consider donating it to the open source community by whatever process that particular open source project has. Other metrics such as SLOC (source lines of code) or feature in SVN trunk are not only subject to abuse, they are also mostly meaningless. We want to avoid anything that could result in an isolated fork or branch. This is a danger with this approach. However, it has merit in that it would allow a developer to meet their performance criteria and concentrate on getting the customisation into the trunk in their own time. Bruce Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source development metrics
IMO: Thanks Landon and Puneet, In this case, I tend to agree with Jeroen. There is a community developing GeoNetwork (and other projects) with ongoing work occuring. This would be occurring concurrently with our development work on a fork. We would want to be able to take advantage of the new developments that others make to the parent project, without having to refactor our 'fork' each time, or conversly, the additional work of refactoring our customisations, or part there of back to the parent project. We (the Australian ANZLIC community) have tried this approach already with the GeoNetwork ANZLIC Profile, and it is clearly not working (despite might I add the outstanding efforts of the main developer). I think that the only sane approach is to work within the parent project's community as peer participants. I do agree with Puneet that the *ability* to fork a project is critical to the success of open source projects, however I think that it should really only be used as a last resort if a situation is clearly unsalvagable. There is too much dilution of effort otherwise. Bruce Bannerman Bruce, I agree with Puneet. In this scenario it would make more sense for the organization to maintain their own fork of the code to which improvements can be made. This really doesn’t cause problems for the parent of the fork as long as there is an established process and some honest effort made to integrate the best of the improvements back into the parent code base. This is actually how OpenJUMP works. There are only a handful of developers that actually work on the parent code base. Most of our contributors maintain their own fork, but siphon back improvements to the parent. Landon ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Gold Undercover Search and Delivery Channel Project - Tender RFT 304746
(Apologies for cross posting) Some of you may be interested in this tender. It has spatial components. - Gold Undercover Search and Delivery Channel Project - Tender RFT 304746 http://www.tenders.vic.gov.au Allow 30 minutes after registering before you download the documents. Any questions must be directed to the person nominated in the documentation. --- Bruce Bannerman IT Solutions Architect Information Development Branch Minerals and Petroleum Division Department of Primary Industries - Victoria Australia Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] studies / comparisons of software that serves OGC standards
(Apologies for cross posting) IMO: Is anyone aware of any studies / comparisons of software that serves data to the following OGC standards? - WMS v1.3 - WFS v1.1 (including support for complex features) - WCS v1.1+ I'm interested in current / recent studies. Bruce Bannerman Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Chickens, Boards and Export Restrictions
IMO: Paul, Some Local Chapters are going through this process currently, e.g. OSGeo-AustNZ. We will need to incorporate as a non profit within Australia with its overheads of audits, annual fees etc. One potential upside is that we may get some protection by way of Directors Insurance for people making decisions on behalf of OSGeo (or the local chapter). During the recent FOSS4G-2009 work, several of us were left high and dry with no protection from the parent body. This situation is not acceptable. Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 13/06/2008 03:28:31 AM: On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 10:23 AM, Dave Patton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are there practical matters (e.g. wording in the foundation's charter or letters of incorporation) that preclude OSGeo from being incorporated in multiple jurisdictions? Yes, it's work to be an entity. We're having enough trouble with the work involved in being an entity just one jurisdiction, adding more just adds more rules to follow and forms to submit. If the work involved and rules of the USA are too overwhelming, I could see changing to a different jurisdiction, but there would have to be a good reason to ditch all the effort invested thus far. P. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Director's Insurance (Chickens, Boards and Export Restrictions)
IMO: Cameron, Well said! We as a foundation are asking people to undertake roles of responsibility without training, guidance or in many cases even an outline of what is required. We trust to the good will and experience of the participants that noting will go wrong. One day, something will go wrong and I for one do not want to be on the receiving end. I would like to ask the board to revisit this issue and provide clear guidance on just what support official position holders can expect from OSGeo. Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 16/06/2008 07:35:29 AM: Insurance for office bearers is something I think is important and something I seriously consider when taking responsibility. While I enjoy giving a lot of my time to something I believe in, I don't want to put my house on the line in case I make a stupid decision. In taking my role as FOSS4G2009 committee chair, I first confirmed that I have no legal rights to approve finances (since I have no insurance). This is not a desirable situation. Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] URL
IMO: +1 Bruce Bannerman Mateusz Loskot [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 12/08/08 09:11 AM Please respond to OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org To OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org cc Subject Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] URL Markus Neteler wrote: On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 9:46 PM, Jason Birch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't think that it was specifically dropped, it just wasn't made a requirement for new projects coming into OSGeo. There are project pages on the OSGeo site (like http://www.osgeo.org/grass - just product info fliers) but from there the project URL can be anything from external host-based (like http://grass.osgeo.org/ - which is non-canonical, this seems to be the same as grass.itc.it) Jason, grass.itc.it and others are the mirror sites of http://grass.osgeo.org/ (which is the master site). @All: I would appreciate to see all projects using the project.osgeo.org scheme, even only with a redirection. Just to apply a generic scheme and provide transparency to our users... +1 -- Mateusz Loskot, http://mateusz.loskot.net Charter Member of OSGeo, http://osgeo.org ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Notice: This email and any attachments may contain information that is personal, confidential, legally privileged and/or copyright.No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the prior written consent of the copyright owner. It is the responsibility of the recipient to check for and remove viruses. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender by return email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. You are not authorised to use, communicate or rely on the information contained in this email. Please consider the environment before printing this email. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] [Fwd: Fee vs Free]
There is a slide that I've seen relating to the Canadian SDI and the dramatic increase in downloads of data in the twelve month period after data was made free for download. http://www.thinkwell.ca/cgdi-icdg/libraryDocs/FeevsFree.pdf It shows an increase from around 96,000 to 5.4 Million downloads in that period. Can anyone point me to some studies that support the claim made in this slide please? Bruce Bannerman signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] FW: [OGC Press Release] The OGC forms a Spatial Law and Policy Committee [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Apologies for cross posting. Bruce Bannerman -Original Message- From: media-bounces+b.bannerman=bom.gov...@lists.opengeospatial.org [mailto:media-bounces+b.bannerman=bom.gov...@lists.opengeospat ial.org] On Behalf Of OGC Press Sent: Thursday, 26 February 2009 6:43 AM To: me...@lists.opengeospatial.org Subject: [OGC Press Release] The OGC forms a Spatial Law and Policy Committee PRESS ANNOUNCEMENT FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE For information about this announcement, contact: Sam Bacharach Executive Director, Outreach and Community Adoption Open Geospatial Consortium, Inc tel: +1-703-352-3938 sbachar...@opengeospatial.org -- - February 25, 2009, Wayland, Massachusetts. The Board of Directors of the Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC(r)) has chartered a committee of the Board to specifically address the spatial law and policy issues which will influence development requirements of the Consortium's technology process. The Spatial Law and Policy Committee (SLPC) will be chaired by OGC director and Executive Committee member, Kevin Pomfret, and will be organized under board leadership as an educational forum to include both select member and community participation. In the past, legal issues associated with spatial data and technology were primarily a concern for lawyers that worked with or for the government. Now, both public sector and private sector users and providers of geospatial data and technologies face a wide range of legal issues associated with growth in consumer and business applications for spatial technology. Such applications include Earth browsers, satellite navigation devices in cars and PDA's, location-based services associated with cell phones, business intelligence, social networking and satellite tracking of vehicles and equipment. All of these applications raise issues that involve intellectual property rights, liability, privacy, and national security. In many cases, the existing legal and policy framework is inadequate to provide governments, businesses and consumers clear guidance on these issues. David Schell, OGC Chairman, said, The OGC plays an expanding role in addressing society's increasing dependence on geospatial information services. The advent of information interoperability in this technology domain raises the profile of geospatial information for policy makers, managers and scientists around the world. The Board's creation at this time of a Spatial Law and Policy Committee reflects the increasing need of leaders to understand the challenges they face in this area, and the Board's commitment to meeting their related information requirements. Kevin Pomfret added, I am looking forward to working with the OGC and its members on these important issues. Due in large part to their collective vision and hard work, spatial technology and applications using spatial data are increasingly being utilized in a wide range of important activities. In order for this growth to continue, a solid legal and policy framework must exist. The OGC's Spatial Law and Policy Committee can play a critical role in the development of such a framework. The SLPC, in particular, will provide an open forum for OGC members' legal and policy advisors to discuss the unique legal and policy issues associated with spatial data and technology. The Committee will also work with relevant legal groups, such as the ABA, to raise awareness of these issues within the broader legal community. The SLPC will not provide legal advice to the OGC or its Members and will not take a position on any legal or policy matter on behalf of the OGC or its membership. It will rather focus on clarification of the legal and policy environment of the Consortium and work to ensure that Consortium standards reflect related best practices and the societal requirements that shape institutional uptake of interoperable geoprocessing. Kevin Pomfret is a Richmond, Virginia based attorney well known for the work he has done on assorted legal issues associated with spatial data and technology, including intellectual property rights, licensing, liability, privacy and national security. Prior to entering the law, he served as a satellite imagery analyst with the U.S. government where he specialized in the development of imagery collection strategies to monitor critical arms control agreements. He also served in various U.S. government positions responsible for developing Intelligence community satellite imagery collections and exploitation requirements. Over the years he has written and spoken extensively on spatial law and technology. The OGC(r) is an international consortium of more than 370 companies, government agencies, research organizations, and universities participating in a consensus process
[OSGeo-Discuss] Re: [Foss4g2009] FOSS4G looking for advice from local chapters
Cameron, Without wanting to diminish the importance of what you are trying to do, what is this list for? Isn't Discuss an international list? Bruce Bannerman On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 19:00 +1100, Cameron Shorter wrote: The FOSS4G organising committee is keen to get advise on how we should structure FOSS4G to make it attractive to local regions. In particular, we are especially interested in feedback from our close neighbours in the Asia/Pacific region. One of the great things about FOSS4G is that it moves around the world, sharing the unique opportunity of FOSS4G to local regions. We want to make sure we share this with as many people as we can in our local region. We will continue this thread on the following email list: http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/options/www_international-discuss Please join if you are not already on the list, and are interested in taking part. We will also use this email list to give local translators advance warning of upcoming media releases, to give them time to translate and release locally. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Open File Formats and Proprietary Algorithms [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
IMO: Just another thought on this issue (though we do seem to be recycling arguments over the years...): Assuming that I have a very large archive of spatial data, be it imagery or any other spatial format and that I store my data in a variety of proprietary formats: In ten years from now, can I be sure that: - the company that created, understands, and holds the IP in the data format will still be around? - there will still be software that runs on the then current operating environment, that can read and 'fully exploit' the data in the proprietary standard? - that this future software will work seamlessly with my then current spatial environment? - if all of the above risks prove to eventuate, can I be sure that I'll be able to salvage my data into another format, retaining its complete semantic context? IMO, it is a high risk proposition to lock public (or private) archives away in proprietary data formats. It makes more sense to use open standards and formats that are publically available. Bruce Bannerman -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Michael P. Gerlek Sent: Friday, 21 August 2009 6:55 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Open File Formats and Proprietary Algorithms Some clarifications: - MrSID has both lossy and lossless modes - MrSID is not fractal based; it uses wavelets (and arithmetic encoding) - you can't copyright algorithms; the MrSID source code certainly is, however - MrSID relies on a number of patents, not all of which are owned by LizardTech - reading MrSID does not require any fees; we have libraries you can download, although they are not open source That said, some editorial comments (although I'm now wishing I hadn't been so quick to rise to Landon's bait :-) - Some of you know the history of trying to open source MrSID; I won't go into that here, except to say that LizardTech doesn't own all of the required IP needed to make that happen. - If we are speaking of the NAIP data, then no, it is not exclusively available in MrSID format; it is also shipped as GeoTIFFs. - JPEG 2000 is a very robust open standard alternative to MrSID, and a number of players already support it (including LizardTech), but not enough to make it viable for certain domains like NAIP. - some of you also know the history on open JP2 support: there is today no open source implementation of JP2 that is suitable for geo work. Alas. -mpg From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Eric Wolf Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 2:15 PM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Open File Formats and Proprietary Algorithms The MRSID format is a very special case - and perhaps an opportunity for a new FOSS file format. MRSID is a lossless, fractal-based, multi-scale raster compression format. LizardTech has the algorithms to encode and decode MRSID locked up in copyrights, and I believe, patents. Even companies like ESRI shell out big bucks to LizardTech to be able to read and write the MRSID format. I guess I missed the context of the discussion. Is the government releasing certain data exclusively in this format? If so, I think the argument can be made against this practice. The different in compression between MRSID and gziped TIFFs isn't really that great in this day of cheap disks and fat pipes. -Eric -=--=---===---=--=-=--=---==---=--=-=- Eric B. WolfNew! 720-334-7734 USGS Geographer Center of Excellence in GIScience PhD Student CU-Boulder - Geography ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Re: FW: Insurance for contractors? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Michael, When I ran my consultancy as a limited liability company, we kept the normal range of insurance policies, including professional and public liability insurance policies. If you wish to be treated as a professional and work for the big end of town, these are a necessary business expense. Mind you, we didn't need to utilise the policies, which to my mind is a good thing. Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Michael P. Gerlek Sent: Tuesday, 1 September 2009 3:03 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Insurance for contractors? In the past I've hired some people for contract or consultant work (both open source projects and more general stuff) -- generally these people have been independent, one-man shops found by word of mouth and reputation, as opposed to hiring someone from an agency. I'm getting pushback now from the administrative side of my company saying that any contractor I hire needs to have proof of insurance. I understand the legal reasons for this, but I'm wondering how many of you out there actually have business/contractors insurance? Do companies you work for insist on it, or not? And how many of you are formally set up as LLCs or sole proprietorships or such? [while this is likely a US-centric issue from the hiring side, I'm interested in international responses too since I've hired some foreigners as well over the years] -mpg ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] RE: Documenting GIS Data Models (Again): Using DXF [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
IMO: Hi Landon, Data models with DXF? You're making life difficult for yourself... You may wish to have a look at the HollowWorld [1] developed by Australia's CSIRO. It will help you model your data using UML to generate standards compliant GML application schemas. [1] https://www.seegrid.csiro.au/twiki/bin/view/AppSchemas/HollowWorld Bruce Bannerman -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Landon Blake Sent: Thursday, 10 September 2009 5:48 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Documenting GIS Data Models (Again): Using DXF I posted a few weeks back I posted about possible ways to document and share GIS data models. I decided to move forward with a graphical approach. I started building diagrams to document my GIS data model for the Public Land Survey System in the United States. I am drawing these diagrams in a CAD program. When I get things ironed out I hope to release the following items to the GIS community: - My completed GIS data model in DXF format that can be used as an example or template for other models. - A set of CAD blocks that can be used to build similar diagrams. If I like how things come together with the diagrams, I might try converting the diagrams to SVG. The diagrams would be much prettier in SVG, but I am quicker with CAD than I am with Inkscape, and I want to get a prototype completed quickly. This will make a lot more sense when you get to see the example diagrams. I welcome any collaboration on this effort. If there is interest, I could move this discussion to the Standards mailing list. It would be great to get input from interested parties now, while the diagrams are still taking shape. Landon Warning: Information provided via electronic media is not guaranteed against defects including translation and transmission errors. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this information in error, please notify the sender immediately. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G-2009 Birds of a Feather Sessions
During the FOSS4G2009 conference http://2009.foss4g.org/ in Sydney, Australia, there will be conference rooms available for people to hold Birds-of-a-Feather sessions. Birds-Of-A-Feather sessions are unstructured timeslots where people can self organise themselves to discuss topics of interest. This year, Birds of a Feather sessions will be held on Thursday 22nd October. A number of rooms are available. First ones in get the rooms. Please visit the Wiki page [1] to register and organise your sessions. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2009_BirdsOfAFeather ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Next 5 years for OSGeo
Peter, You make a very good point as to the value of marketing. Thinking back to the early '90s when I was a MicroStation / Intergraph / GDS user, the factor that attracted me across to using ESRI software at the time was their marketing approach. Where Bentley and Intergraph were focusing on technology and the benefits of the latest widget, ESRI Australia were quietly selling their software by focusing on how it was being used to solve real world problems. The people managing the organisation at the time encouraged organisations to show how they were solving their day to day problems (oh, and by the way, we used product 'x' to do this). In Australia, ESRI AU appear to have now reverted to focusing on the technology. Perhaps that is something to try, demonstrating how the application of the technology has solved problems, rather than focusing on the OSGeo technology explicitly? In addition to the other good suggestions to come out so far, I'd like to see a good consistent and integrated Architecture developed for OSGeo applications. It can be rather daunting for someone new to FOSS4G to understand how the various pieces fit together and what application or library should be used where. It would be particularly helpful to Enterprise Architecture types to understand and feel more comfortable with a 'quality' integrated OSGeo applications stack. I know that Paul Ramsey has put together a few documents and I have some mind maps (tracing applications and high level features) that are getting a bit dated. Perhaps we can get a few of us together in Sydney to discuss this further. Bruce Bannerman -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Peter Batty Sent: Saturday, 3 October 2009 12:32 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Next 5 years for OSGeo A good discussion and one which is important for OSGeo's future. I agree with Cédric's initial statement that The OSGEO is very developer centric and probably need more input from management, end user, marketing etc... and I think that the responses to this thread reflect that. Most developers in my experience are skeptical of the value of / need for marketing (in the open source and closed source world), and we've seen a lot of that in the responses. I used to think that way too, but over time have come to appreciate the value of marketing more. Unfortunately the software business has many examples where a company became dominant despite having software that was inferior to its competitors, Microsoft and ESRI being two of these. Ultimately I think that a primary measure of the success of OSGeo has to be in the number of people using its products, and it is surely in the interests of developers to get more users too - which should result in more funding for further development, etc. I think that improved marketing would actually have much more impact in terms of getting more people using OSGeo products than anything we can do on the development front - there is always a long list of things to do, of course, but in general the current functionality of most OpenGeo products is very competitive, the main thing holding back broader usage is just that most people in the broader geospatial industry don't know about them (and/or they have misconceptions about open source software, etc). And thinking of marketing as taking people to fancy events etc is wrong (in this context at least) - I would say that better terms for what OSGeo should be doing in this area might be outreach and education (in various senses). One thing we are weak on in general is documentation on user projects / success stories. For example, last week I talked at the AGI conference in the UK and afterwards got an email from an attendee which said: During your talk you mentioned that you use PostGIS a lot and I was wondering if you could let me know about your experiences with it? At the moment we have our data on different servers and in different formats and I'm trying to get it all into one place. We have recently got SQL Server 2005 so I don't think we will be going for the 2008 spatial version for a few years. Therefore I have been looking into PostGIS which seems to be the perfect solution.however, I'm struggling to find people who have used it on a regular basis. We need to make it easy for people to connect with existing OSGeo product users, not a struggle. When I chose to use PostGIS for my startup a couple of years ago, a critical factor in that decision for me was attending FOSS4G and talking to others who had used it. I think that the direction that FOSS4G goes in is another key decision in terms of OSGeo's marketing strategy. I know there are people in the community who want to keep the event small and intimate and focused on the existing development community. There are others who think it is a great opportunity
[OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G-2009 - Volunteers needed to help pack conference satchels
Hi everyone, We still need a few volunteers to help pack conference satchels. We're trying to save $1,500 which we think could be better spent on pizza and drinks for the code sprint. We're aiming for 6 to 10 volunteers. Please add your name to the volunteers list at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2009_Volunteers#Stuffing_Conference_delegate_bags When and Where: At this stage we're planning for 9am on Monday 19th October at the Sydney Convention and Exhibition Centre. Please check the above link in case of changed details closer to the event. I estimate that the task will take a few hours to do. Bruce Bannerman ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects
I have been developing a Mind Map for a number of years, showing various Open Source spatial projects, with a summary of project features and links to project urls. It should help as an aide-memoire for Open Source spatial projects. I've released this under a Creative Commons license with the source in the OSGeo subversion repository. Details are at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman The information in the mind map is a little dated. Perhaps a few of us can collaborate to maintain it. Thanks to Tyler for his help in getting this into subversion. Bruce Bannerman ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects
Thanks George, Amazing. Congratulations! Can i suggest a project that has been around for some years? Check Terralib and TerraView. It's a brazilian project and it's quite mature. http://www.terralib.org/ http://www.terralib.org/ Regards, George Terralib is there. See Software DevelopmentToolkitsTerraLib From my assessment, I categorised it as a toolkit to help you develop spatial applications. I must say that I was impressed by the functionality available. If you haven't already, have a read of Gilberto Camara's overview of TerraLib / TerraView. The link is in the MindMap as per above. Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects
Tyler / Bob, Yes, it is in Freemind v0.8.1, the current stable version. I agree that a viewer will need to be dynamic. I expect to see updates for a long time to come. According to the Freemind FAQ, there is an applet that will allow the mindmap to be presented via a Web Page [1]. I have not tried this yet. Perhaps something hosted by OSGeo if the applet works OK? Bruce [1] http://freemind.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Asked_Questions#Mind_maps_on_web_pages_with_FreeMind.27s_applet -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Tyler Mitchell (OSGeo) Sent: Tuesday, 13 October 2009 3:32 PM To: OSGeo Discussions; Bob Basques Subject: Re: Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects Looks like it says it's 0.8.1 Freemind map version. I've looked a bit at other clients but they are usually involving a conversion step. e.g. you can do mm format into S5 presentation format and a few others. I'd like a more dynamic 'flowing' viewer for presentations - any hints and I'd like to hear them too. Tyler original message- From: Bob Basques bo...@gritechnologies.com To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2009 23:16:25 -0500 - Bruce, Yeah I got that to work, but was wondering if there were other client that could read it. I use a similar (pay for) application called Inspiration that allows for building of similar diagrams. I thought it might open the MM file, but no go. Nice file BTW. bobb Bruce Bannerman wrote: Bob, What's the best Client for this MM stuff? A little research on it reveals there are more than one version of the file format as well as more than one version of client, and not all clients read all formats . . . The format is Freemind mind mapping software. As per my original post: Details are at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman I've received a few emails advising me that some people's email clients have hidden the above URL. Two suggestions to get around this: - view the email source - go to the OSGeo Wiki and search for 'User:Bruce.bannerman'. You will find the details there. Bruce -- -- ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss __ ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Fwd: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mind Map - Open Source Spatial Projects
It would be great if you could add in the MapWindow project. MapWindow GIS Desktop Application is a C#/.NET desktop GIS that is completely open source and has about 6000 downloads per month from www.MapWindow.org. Also, under your library/developer tools, we the project also includes a set of .NET libraries and a COM C++ ActiveX component based on both NTS and GDAL. - Dan done OpenScales is a user-friendly and fast interface written in ActionScript3/Flex/AIR designed to visualize and manipulate spatial data. OpenScales is open source with an LGPL license. Aurélien Barbier-Accary done Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G-2009 Volunteers required - OSGeo Booth
We need people to help 'man' (or is that 'person ;-) ) the OSGeo Booth during FOSS4G-2009. The booth will be a centre of activity and you will get to meet a lot of the OSGeo personalities. Please volunteer for a half hour session, or two, or three... To sign up, add your name to the Wiki at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/FOSS4G_2009_Volunteers#OSGeo_Booth Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: [SDI-AsiaPacific] NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge
fyi -Original Message- From: sdi-asiapacific-boun...@lists.gsdi.org [mailto:sdi-asiapacific-boun...@lists.gsdi.org] On Behalf Of Kate Lance Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2009 11:03 PM To: SDI-Africa; SDI-Europe; SDI-AP; SDI-LAC; SDI-North America Subject: [SDI-AsiaPacific] NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge http://developer.navteq.com/site/global/market/lbs_challenge/p_lbs_home.jsp NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge The NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge is focused on driving the development and visibility of innovative location-based solutions (LBS) for wireless devices. The Global LBS Challenge has become the premier event in the wireless industry and a global symbol of LBS innovation and opportunity. From business applications to sports, travel and security, integrating the accuracy and richness of NAVTEQ digital map data facilitates the discovery of the next wave of LBS using dynamic positioning technology. Winners are chosen by a panel of distinguished judges in each of five regions. Since the launch of the NAVTEQ Global LBS Challenge, over 32% of the finalist companies have gone on to receive venture capital funding or launched commercially-distributed applications, many on major wireless carriers. Registration for all regions is now open. Europe-Middle East-Africa (EMEA) registration deadline: October 30, 2009 Europe-Middle East-Africa (EMEA) solution submission deadline: November 20, 2009 North American registration deadline: November 20, 2009 North American solution submission deadline: January 8, 2010 India registration deadline: December 11, 2009 India solution submission deadline: January 22, 2010 South America registration deadline: February 12, 2010 South America solution submission deadline: March 12, 2010 Asia-Pacific (APAC) registration deadline: March 5, 2010 Asia-Pacific (APAC) solution submission deadline: April 9, 2010 __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ SDI-AsiaPacific mailing list sdi-asiapaci...@lists.gsdi.org http://lists.gsdi.org/mailman/listinfo/sdi-asiapacific ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] The Rabbit
Paul, By unanimous decision of the LOC, you have been entrusted as keeper of the FOSS4G-2009 Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch [1]. We felt it better not to leave loose ends, and know that you will keep it in safe hands. Bruce [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Hand_Grenade_of_Antioch ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] new military OSS policy
Miles, It is encouraging to see this policy development. When combined with the new UK Government Policy on Open Source and Open Standards [1], I can see that OS (spatial) is finally starting to get some serious momentum within government circles. Perhaps other Governments will also start following suit... Bruce Bannerman [1] http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/government_it/open_source.aspx -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Miles Fidelman Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2009 4:16 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] new military OSS policy ... fresh from the OSD e-press -- Miles R. Fidelman, Director of Government Programs Traverse Technologies 145 Tremont Street, 3rd Floor Boston, MA 02111 mfidel...@traversetechnologies.com 857-362-8314 www.traversetechnologies.com ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Regarding The Microstation DGN Maps georeferencing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Padmini, It has been a long, long time since I used MicroStation, however this may help. Typically it will depend on the people who captured the data that you are working with: - some are only concerned with the immediate vicinity of their engineering project and will arbitrarily define a local (cartesian) grid with a datum point of (0,0) or similar and work with these coordinates. - others will be quite pedantic and work with projected coordinates e.g. UTM coords within their design files. With the first example, you'll have to find the relationship between the arbitrary datum and your Spatial Reference System and transform the data. With the second example, if you know the source SRS try just applying it. Now being good spatial professionals, your data providers will have provided spatial metadata (at least ISO 19139) with their spatial datasets, so you'll be able to easily work out the lineage of the data sets that were provided to you and work out the appropriate course of action. HTH. Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of bpadm...@bel.co.in Sent: Wednesday, 11 November 2009 4:43 PM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Regarding The Microstation DGN Maps georeferencing hello, I am newbie using Quantum GIS. I am able to extract layers from DGN file, but couldn't geo-reference it. are their any ways of doing so, please suggest. thanks and regards, Padmini Confidentiality Notice The information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this message are intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) and may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender at Bharat Electronics or supp...@bel.co.in immediately and destroy all copies of this message and any attachments. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo barriers to entry
Tyler, Perhaps this 'issue' is not so big after all... A comment that was made to me by a colleague after FOSS4G-2009 was that she thought that it was great to see such a high percentage of attendees were female; dramatically higher than she would have traditionally seen at a spatial / geoscience event in Australia. She commented further that this was a good reason to get more involved... Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Tyler Mitchell Sent: Tuesday, 17 November 2009 9:07 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo barriers to entry Thanks for the discussion Landon. I'll leave Pandora well enough alone :) Perhaps we can turn the thread to discussing what are the real or perceived barriers people, in general, find to getting involved with OSGeo. I'm sure that any barriers women would have might also affect others, so it might be useful to broaden the discussion so more participate. 1 What barriers are there to joining OSGeo and its projects? 2 How can we be more inviting? Have you heard negative comments from potential members? Are there any reasons you might not invite a colleague to join? 3 How can we encourage more people to contribute to our projects or join with the OSGeo mission? 4 What areas in OSGeo and its projects need more helpers? 5 What are the most interesting/compelling aspects? I'm sure there are more pointed questions but these are just off the top of my head. Best wishes, Tyler - Original Message - From: Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com Date: Monday, November 16, 2009 1:01 pm Subject: RE: RE: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] new: OSGeo women mailing list To: tmitch...@osgeo.org Cc: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org Tyler, I understand your wife's perspective completely. It seems reasonable to conclude that there are fewer women involved in OSGeo projects because there are fewer women involved in open source computing to begin with. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Will there be an OSGeo Desktop shootout atFOSS4G 2010? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
IMO: This may have already been covered. Several years ago Todd Buchanan prepared a thesis comparing ArcGIS and Grass [1]. The approach he used could provide a potential framework. It has features of Cameron's structured comparison; Simon's process approach; with a comparison of actual results of algorithm operations based on a control set of data. I'd like to see the list of features that Todd compared (at Table 13) expanded somewhat to include e.g. functionality related to data capture and maintenance; transformations; reprojections etc etc. Just a thought. -- Bruce Bannerman [1] http://www.toddbuchanan.net/thesis_ver.pdf -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Daniel Ames Sent: Tuesday, 22 December 2009 5:25 AM To: Maxim Dubinin; OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Will there be an OSGeo Desktop shootout atFOSS4G 2010? Folks, I like the structured comparison approach that Cameron outlined. Also equally (or perhaps more useful) would be to put together a wiki page with goals and benchmarks based on ArcGIS 9.3. And then indicate where the os packages compare. This would provide us with the ability to answer the most important question which is can this do what the proprietary software does. For example, we could post a couple of maps made in AG and then challenge each desktop team to create and upload the same maps. Etc. I have a line shapefile with 200 shapes. We could upload it and have everyone do some timing to show how fast to load,pan, etc on the data. This could also serve as a way for some of the teams to see their own deficiencies and find critical tasks to work on (they could then update their reporting on the wiki and indicate the version number)... - Dan On Dec 20, 2009 4:40 PM, Maxim Dubinin s...@gis-lab.info wrote: Simon, I was merely suggesting an approach. As I said, we didn't have a goal to inform other what Desktop GIS is the best, we just wanted to present a model dataset for many different packages, so that a person can try and choose by himself. However, there are some notes for each package at the bottom of the page. Personally, I have a favorite, of course, but I don't think this is appropriate to describe it here. That said, I think this will be relatively easy to construct a matrix based on our experience with missing bits for this particular task. We're currently going through updating software and this project and will discuss this among participants. Maxim Вы писали 20 декабря 2009 г., 16:52:06: Maxim, I looked at the webpage but could not find an outcome -- which system worked the best? Chee... Sometime ago, we were also interested in why are there so many desktop open GIS packages. So what w... ___ Discuss mailing listdisc...@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Include remote sensing software in OSGeo desktop shootout? Re: Discuss Digest, Vol 36, Issue 31 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
IMO: Hi Drew, A good question. I had assumed that as image manipulation and processing functionality is required as part of the normal desktop workflow for a significant range of spatial use cases that it would be included in this type of comparison. Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of pilant.d...@epamail.epa.gov Sent: Thursday, 24 December 2009 2:53 AM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Include remote sensing software in OSGeo desktop shootout? Re: Discuss Digest, Vol 36, Issue 31 Dear All, The discussion of an OSGeo desktop shootout prompts me to inquire if remote sensing / image processing software could be included in the comparison. Or, does anyone have an existing comparison of features and capabilities? More specifically, how do the FOSS remote sensing toolkits compare with commercial packages such as ENVI, ERDAS Imagine, PCI Geomatics, Idrisi, ECognition, Feature Analyst, Genie Pro, etc (sorry for any omissions on this list). Where are the gaps? By remote sensing packages, I'm referring to software that ingests satellite and aerial imagery and data (optical, infrared, thermal infrared, SAR, LIDAR, microwave), and applies various transformations, filters and workflows to generate geospatial information and maps. The remote sensing output is typically imported into GIS for further analysis and visualization. Many thanks and happy holidays, Drew Drew Pilant, Ph.D. Remote Sensing Research Scientist US Environmental Protection Agency Office of Research and Development Landscape Characterization Branch tel: 919.541.0648 fax: 919.541.9420 pilant.d...@epa.gov ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Simon, Check out the Australian Spatial Data Directory [1]. Geoscience Australia also have a wide range of datasets that I understand are now available via Creative Commons. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://asdd.ga.gov.au/asdd/tech/zap/basic.html -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Simon Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd) Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 10:36 AM To: OSGeo Discussions; Users and Developers mailing list Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? Hi, *** Sorry for cross-posting for those people on both lists *** Does anyone have or know of some high resolution vector and raster data that can be used in tutorials? The datasets need to be unfetted by intellectual property constraints. Essentially I want to build a set of tutorials around this data and have the users able to download and manipulate the data without breaking any laws. Preferably I would like data for Australia, even better southeast Australia. Data * georeferenced aerial photography (ECW or JPG, 0.15m/pixel) * shapefiles showing cadastral data, soils, contours, roads * DWG files showing details of a development or plan Spatial Reference System * GDA94 MGA55 -- Cheers Simon Simon Cropper Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020. P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437. mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Simon, IMO: After the recent Victorian Government Inquiry into public sector information, the outcome was that Vic Govt data should also be provided via Creative Commons. You should be able to see most of their VicMap datasets via the ASDD. There will be a lot of other more detailed data via DSE/Catchment Management Authority partnerships. Probably to the scale that you're after. Again check the ASDD. I'm assuming that you have DSE/SII contacts. Contact me off line if you don't. Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Simon Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd) Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 11:20 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] Bruce, I have been looking at the GeoScience Australia Downloads but all these are too broad for most of what I do. Need something at 1:25,000 or better. I suppose the biggest problem is aerial photography. What little is out there is very broad scale regional stuff. Nothing showing just one small area at a scale typically used by people such as myself. I am aware of the Australia Spatial Directory but I was hoping to find some freely downloadable and free to use datasets, before I go begging to data suppliers or data custodians. Cheers Simon Simon Cropper Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020. P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437. mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au On 13/01/2010 11:07 AM, Bruce Bannerman wrote: Simon, Check out the Australian Spatial Data Directory [1]. Geoscience Australia also have a wide range of datasets that I understand are now available via Creative Commons. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://asdd.ga.gov.au/asdd/tech/zap/basic.html -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Simon Cropper (Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd) Sent: Wednesday, 13 January 2010 10:36 AM To: OSGeo Discussions; Users and Developers mailing list Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] HELP PLEASE - Does anyone know where I can get high resolution GIS data for use in tutorials? Hi, *** Sorry for cross-posting for those people on both lists *** Does anyone have or know of some high resolution vector and raster data that can be used in tutorials? The datasets need to be unfetted by intellectual property constraints. Essentially I want to build a set of tutorials around this data and have the users able to download and manipulate the data without breaking any laws. Preferably I would like data for Australia, even better southeast Australia. Data * georeferenced aerial photography (ECW or JPG, 0.15m/pixel) * shapefiles showing cadastral data, soils, contours, roads * DWG files showing details of a development or plan Spatial Reference System * GDA94 MGA55 -- Cheers Simon Simon Cropper Botanicus Australia Pty Ltd PO Box 160, Sunshine, Victoria 3020. P: 9311 5822. M: 041 830 3437. mailto: scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au mailto:scrop...@botanicusaustralia.com.au web: www.botanicusaustralia.com.au http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au http://www.botanicusaustralia.com.au ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practices and how it help to foster collaboration. [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
IMO: The Australian Federal Government's efforts currently appear to be focused on an initiative called 'Government 2.0'. See the blog at [1]. If you scroll down a bit you'll see a link to the final Taskforce Report. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://gov2.net.au/ -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Bob Basques Sent: Saturday, 16 January 2010 8:12 AM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practices and how it help to foster collaboration. All, I'm putting together a proposal here at the City to open up more of our datasets to the public. We currently have about 30 GIS data layers available to the public, http://, with ~170 layers that are not public. While there are some layers that won't be made available for security or licensing issues, there are many that the owners of simply don't want to make available. I'm looking for information to include in a short proposal that might sway some of the folks sitting on datasets internally to get them to publish the data to the masses and need points of reasoning to point them at. I already have some info related to general practices moving towards this type of data availability, and some of the recent threads on the OSGEO lists about data licensing would likely come into play as well. Thanks for any pointers on this. bobb ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practicesand how it help to foster collaboration. [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Bob, Another one from Australia: The url at [1] contains the link to the final report for the (Australian State) Victorian Government Parliamentary Inquiry into improving access to Public Sector Information and data. If you look closely at the report you'll see a number of references to the OSGeo-AustNZ submission made by Cameron Shorter and myself. The link to the OSGeo-AustNZ submission may be found at [2] if you're interested. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/edic/inquiries/access_to_PSI/final_report.html [2] http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/edic/inquiries/access_to_PSI/submissions/PSI_Sub_33_Open_Source_Geospatial.pdf -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Bob Basques Sent: Wednesday, 20 January 2010 1:44 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Looking for information about Open Data practicesand how it help to foster collaboration. All, Thanks for all the links to information, I've got a pretty good list of Federal initiatives, now I'm after more localized efforts, something at the City or Municipal level. Really it can be anything related to making government (geospatial) data available to the masses and why it makes sense. I will post my (short) write-up here as well. Thanks again. bobb Haris Kurtagic ha...@sl-king.com wrote: I really like presentation from Jason Birch from City of Nanaimo about reasons to open data and how to do it. http://www.slideshare.net/JasonBirch/moving-beyond-the-desk http://www.slideshare.net/JasonBirch/moving-beyond-the-desk Don't forget to look at notes too, I did forgot first time. Haris On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Bob Basques bob.basq...@ci.stpaul.mn.us wrote: All, I'm putting together a proposal here at the City to open up more of our datasets to the public. We currently have about 30 GIS data layers available to the public, http://, with ~170 layers that are not public. While there are some layers that won't be made available for security or licensing issues, there are many that the owners of simply don't want to make available. I'm looking for information to include in a short proposal that might sway some of the folks sitting on datasets internally to get them to publish the data to the masses and need points of reasoning to point them at. I already have some info related to general practices moving towards this type of data availability, and some of the recent threads on the OSGEO lists about data licensing would likely come into play as well. Thanks for any pointers on this. bobb ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership
Hi Arnulf, I'm just catching up on my email and noticed your renewal of this thread. If OSGeo is to go down the route of getting IP into one organisation, it would be good to see the IP protected in a regime that is not subject to software patents and can offer some protection against them. That doesn't really offer much scope at this stage (...and I'm not an expert in this area). ...perhaps somewhere in the EU? Bruce -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Arnulf Christl (aka Seven) Sent: Sunday, 14 February 2010 5:44 PM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership Cleaning up an older thread... From what I gather from the lists there seems to be no broad opinion in favor of making projects move their copyright under the hood of OSGeo. With the recent discussion of potential export restriction enforcement by incorporated organizations incorporated in USA the the need for a more global organization seems to be higher. I am frankly at a loss at where such an organization would be incorporated and what it could look like but if it existed I would very much like to support it. If anyone has a great idea what a truly global OSGeo should look like please speak up. We should spend some thought on copyright every time we admit and evaluate projects in incubation. My personal experience shows that having the copyright of Open Source projects completely under the hood of a community owned organization is a good thing. Everything else is messy. The messy bit only shows when things go wrong so lets keep fingers crossed and as long as nothing happens we'll all be fine. Best regards, Arnulf. On Mon, 2009-12-14 at 21:34 +, Chris Puttick wrote: The other issue with assigning code copyrights to a US-based organisation is a simple one. The US has the strongest software patent machine and the most supportive courts (if you pick your state carefully ;) ). As FOSSGIS applications bite ever harder into the profits of the dominant player(s), the chance of the game being changed to a legal one rather than a sales and marketing one is pretty high; a fight OSGeo couldn't afford to be in. Chris - Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com wrote: One example of the restrictions Luis is talking about is the prohibition against distributing certain cryptographic software outside of the US: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_of_cryptography Don't know that OSGeo would bump into that, but it is one example of a US specific restriction on organizations involved in software development. Landon Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268 Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658 -Original Message- From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Luis W. Sevilla Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:40 AM To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Software Copyright ownership Hi, one thing must be taken in account, IMHO. If I'm not wrong OSGeo is an USA foundation (is registered in the States, and must follow his laws, of course. As USA maintains a commercial embargo to Cuba [1], it seems there are a lot of things in technology fields restricted to American companies (and also foundations). If OSGeo will not became a more global (not so USA laws conditioned) institution, it doesn't seem so good the idea of giving all and every copyrights to the foundation. My two cents Luis [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Warning: Information provided via electronic media is not guaranteed against defects including translation and transmission errors. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this information in error, please notify the sender immediately. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- Files attached to this email may be in ISO 26300 format (OASIS Open Document Format). If you have difficulty opening them, please visit http://iso26300.info for more information. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- http://arnulf.us Exploring Space, Time and Mind ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org
RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Raster catalog ideas [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Hi Mike, A product for managing (muti-dimensional) raster data within a database that I've been monitoring since around 2002 has just been released under GPL. They have also applied for OSGeo Incubation. This product, Rasdaman, can be used with Postgres as its data store. Rasdaman has its lineage going back to around 1995 (I think). They are claiming the French government as a client using the product to manage TB image mosaics. I understand that there is a sister product that will soon be merged in with Rasdaman that offers good OGC support (WCS 1.1 and 2.0, WMS and WCPS). We intend investigating this product as a potential tool for managing grid, model and multi/hyperspectral remotely sensed data relating to the Climate domain. If you look at the product, let me know. I'll be happy to share experiences. See [1] for Rasdaman product information and [2] for example implementations. == Another option is the Brazillian Terralib Project [3]. They have developed an integrated suite of server and framework tools for developing integrated applications based around the use of imagery and the management of imagery within a database (Postgres from memory). I'm not doing them justice with this brief description. They have done some very impressive work. I'd recommend Gilberto Camara's intro paper at [4] for an overview of Terralib. === [1] http://www.rasdaman.org/ [2] www.earthlook.org [3] http://www.terralib.org/index.php [4] http://www.terralib.org/docs/papers/TerraLib-OSBook-versionJanuary2008.pdf Bruce Bannerman From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Mike Toews [mwto...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, 4 May 2010 6:11 AM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Raster catalog ideas Hi All, I'm wondering what existing open source options are available to store rasters with attributes. For example, I have several hundred air photos from northern Canada spanning from the 1940s to now. They have different projections (UTM zones), cell sizes, etc. This data store needs to be accessed from both web and desktop GIS software, but needs to have a definition query for the year attribute (so I can take all air photos from 1962, or between 1973 to 1978, or whatever is required). Our (my company) present solution is to use ESRI's raster catalog on a geodatabase. We've had a mixed range of problems on File/Personal/SDE Geodatabases. We've experienced corruption on all levels of storage options, so we keep our file path attributes to the original GeoTIFFs so the raster catalogs can be restored, if required. I'm a bit lost for the available options. The future PostGIS with raster capabilities sounds promising, but I need something that already exists. I don't think a WMS service will work, since it cannot use a query definition (e.g., I don't want to make layers for each year). What are other people doing for large stores of air photos? Thanks in advance. -Mike ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Jason / Cameron, From the potential utiliser / implementer viewpoint: I'd like to think that any project that has graduated OSGeo Incubation could be considered a quality project with all of the vectors described by Andrea. This proposed rating system implies that this may not be the case. Comments? Bruce On 6/06/10 10:14 AM, Jason Birch ja...@jasonbirch.com wrote: Wow, I'm really having opinions this week :) IMHO getting into rating projects is just asking for trouble, infighting, bitterness, and people/projects walking away from OSGeo. Jason On 5 June 2010 16:37, Cameron Shorter wrote: Andrea and others, does this fit with people's expectations? ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Cameron, Well stated. As an organisation that is implementing Open Source spatial, we are looking to applications that have graduated from OSGeo Incubation as an indication of quality. If this is not the case, as has been indicated in this thread, then IMHO, we as OSGeo need to devise an approach that will allow organisations to select quality applications for deployment. The last thing that anyone wants is for a major player to implement a poor quality application and have problems with the bad publicity that would follow. We cannot expect that knowledgeable OS Spatial people will always be doing product selection. This is often a function assigned to an IT group through Enterprise IT Governance processes. The people doing the selection, may or may not have appropriate skills and experience. Bruce On 9/06/10 8:24 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote: Michael, Your comments have been good in that they have made me think deeper about what OSGeo stands for and then how we market that. Successful product companies first find out what the market wants, the build a marketing message, then build the product to fit the market. Developing a shiny product then discovering no-one wants it is a sad but common story. In our case, we have created a brand called OSGeo Incubation. What does that mean? Why is it valuable? How can we get that message across to our target market of GIS users who are interested in Open Source but don't know what OSGeo is? If OSGeo Incubation doesn't represent quality or maturity (which is what the market are looking for) then what is the point of spending years of volunteer time going through incubation? I'm afraid that OSGeo Project is not a compelling sales message to our target market, unless we can tie the message to quality or maturity (or another word with similar meaning). Unless we can provide such positive marketing, I expect that we will have spin off projects or organisations defect from OSGeo create their own marketing message. (I wouldn't be surprise if OpenGeo had similar thoughts before they created and then marketed the OpenGeo suite.) Marketing like everything else has positives and negatives. Positives: + Lots of users which draws in money and developers and we all make money and thrive Negatives: - We need to distill our messages down into marketing sound bytes and generalised rating systems and the like - We need to be honest in describing ours and others projects because that is what the market wants to hear before they will spend money on us On 08/06/10 09:17, Michael P. Gerlek wrote: Since this is an OSGeo-based CD, presumably with the OSGeo logo all over it in various places, I'd suggest there are only three kinds of projects: - those which are Approved by OSGeo - those which are Undergoing OSGeo Approval - everything else With two simple logos you can indicate projects of the first two categories; I don't think much explanation should be required up front, especially if one avoids jargon words like graduated and incubation. -mpg From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Cameron Shorter Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 3:57 PM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating There have been some passionate views against rating projects. Maybe I should start by explaining the drivers which led to the proposal for a 5 star rating. Previously only OSGeo graduated and incubation projects were promoted by OSGeo at conferences and the like, however, with the OSGeo LiveDVD, we are packaging and hence promoting many non-graduated projects. How do we credit that a project has gone through the extensive graduation process in our marketing material in a manner that will be understood by the target audience? Unfortunately, putting OSGeo Graduated against a project is meaningless because the target audience usually hasn't heard of OSGeo and is even less likely to know what Graduated means. We could write a paragrah explaining what OSGeo and Graduation are on each Project Overview flier, but that wastes valuable marketing real-estate. Note: I'm basing our target audience on the typical profile of people who drop by the OSGeo booth at conferences. They pick up a LiveDVD and fliers which have Open Source on the cover. They are typically GIS users, have heard of Open Source and want to know what Open Source packages are available to replace their existing , but usually haven't heard of OSGeo and almost certainly don't know about the graduation process. They want to know about the best 2 or 3 packakges they should consider, and they definitely don't want to have to trawl through 350 software packages on http://freegis.org . They spend 5 to 20 minutes talking at the OSGeo stand, then walk onto the other 50 exhibition booths at the conference. Visitors to the OSGeo website are
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] 5 Star OSGeo project maturity rating [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
On 9/06/10 10:40 AM, P Kishor punk.k...@gmail.com wrote: The last thing that anyone wants is for a major player to implement a poor quality application and have problems with the bad publicity that would follow. We cannot expect that knowledgeable OS Spatial people will always be doing product selection. This is often a function assigned to an IT group through Enterprise IT Governance processes. The people doing the selection, may or may not have appropriate skills and experience. Due diligence, caveat emptor and all. If the people doing selection don't have appropriate skills and experience, then those people should be replaced with people who have the appropriate skills and experience to do the selection. Makes me shudder to think that not only might we have inexperienced and inappropriate people at the helm, we are willing to accept them there instead of changing them. The point that I was making is that Enterprise IT Governance processes often remove the product selection from the people specifying the Business Requirements. This is often an IT function. Spatial requirements are often seen as a Business function. In an ideal world, organisations would have people with appropriate IT, Spatial, OGC and OS Spatial skills making the recommendations. In the real world, we cannot expect that this will actually happen. Have you tried recruiting for people with appropriate IT, Spatial, OGC and OS Spatial skills lately (and at government wages...)? Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] displaying complex GML in web-based enviroment ? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
CSIRO have a portal [1] that can consume WFS 3.1.1 including Complex Features as well as WMS. This was created as part of their GeoSciML collaborative work to consume and display data from Australian State Geoscience organisations. The work was created by Rob Woodcock's Auscope team. I'm not sure if it has been released under an Open Source license, though much of their work has been. Andrea, I think that you have contacts on this team via the GeoServer community. [1] http://portal.auscope.org/gmap.html Bruce Bannerman On 16/06/10 12:28 AM, Raj Singh r...@rajsingh.org wrote: I would love to know this too! --- Raj On Jun 15, at 10:00 AM, andrea giacomelli wrote: Hi - I received a request from a team who is not (yet) on the discussion list -- ...We are looking for free/open source package which can display complex GML 3.1.1 features in a web based environment, and supports both WFS and WMS -- TIA for any feedback Andrea ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] How to make a map on a CD [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Perhaps use GeoPDF [1] as the destination format on the CD? Bruce [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeoPDF On 1/07/10 2:53 AM, Landon Blake lbl...@ksninc.com wrote: Leith, I believe what you are proposing may not be as simple as it sounds. You might be able to create some type of live CD that they use to demo Linux distributions, but otherwise your map viewing software needs to be installed on the target computer. There are a few good open source desktop GIS programs that can display shapefiles. I'd promote OpenJUMP, but QGis is another program I hear really good things about. MapWindow also runs as a stand alone desktop program, not just a viewer. Landon Office Phone Number: (209) 946-0268 Cell Phone Number: (209) 992-0658 From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [mailto:discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] On Behalf Of Leith Bade Sent: Monday, June 28, 2010 10:09 PM To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] How to make a map on a CD Hi, I am new to GIS. I would like to make a vector map that can be burned onto a CD then viewed just by running a program on it which copies the map data and a simple viewer. The dataset is very large (all of New Zealand) so the viewer needs to be effcient, and I have all the data in shapefiles. What would be the best way to do this? I see that MapWindow lets you build a custom viewer application around its map viewer, but it would only work on Windows. Another idea I have is to make some sort of portable web server that runs GeoServer or MapServer. Otherwise I could start developing my own custom map viewer that uses OpenGL/Direct3D/Direct2D or something to make the render fast with smooth scrolling etc. This would allow me to develop a data format that is faster for rendering than shapefiles. Similar commercial products are http://www.maptoaster.com/maptoaster-topo-nz/topographical.html or http://memory-map.com.au/products/maps/topo-nz-std.html Thanks, Leith Bade le...@leithalweapon.geek.nz Warning: Information provided via electronic media is not guaranteed against defects including translation and transmission errors. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this information in error, please notify the sender immediately. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Commercial Support for OSGeo / FOSS4G applications [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
I need to respond quickly to an international / intergovernmental group, where I'd like to cite examples of: - Proprietary companies using FOSS4G software (e.g. ESRI using GDAL); - Examples of sizable organisations that provide support for FOSS4G applications, development and customisation. - studies showing the take up of FOSS4G within Government organisations. I'd appreciate responses by (today +4hrs of email date/time) 13 July 2010 at 02:30:00 UTC time [1]. Many thanks, Bruce [1] http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?day=13month=7year=201 0hour=2min=30sec=0p1=0 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Display of Multibeam data in open source gis [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
In addition to Grass, there are several image processing apps that may be of assistance: ossim: http://www.osgeo.org/ossim mbsystem: http://www.mbari.org/data/mbsystem/ rat: http://radartools.berlios.de/ Bruce On 18/07/10 7:15 AM, Markus Neteler nete...@osgeo.org wrote: On Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 2:30 AM, cruise...@comcast.net wrote: am in a quandry, have dense/large multibeam files i wish to display i a GIS for various purposes, essentially XYZ files, in DD WGS84 coordinates, ASCII tab-delimited or Mapinfo mid-mif formats, up to 10-million points plus in a datset. 1. have tried GVsig and quantumGIS, but neither seems to like the ascii tab-delimited format. 2. Quantum does not like the Mid-mif files i have, and it appears GVsig does not take the format Everything open-source GIS seems to want CSV or shapefiles. Find here a dedicated Wiki page for the GRASS software: http://grass.osgeo.org/wiki/Import_XYZ GRASS 6.4+ can meanwhile deal with extremely large data sets. Markus ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Install gvSIG 1.10 on Mac? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Can someone point me in the right direction here please? I'd like to install gvSIG 1.10 under Mac OSX 10.6. From doco at OSGeo project listing and at gvSIG site, the project appears to support Macs. At the downloads page [1], I only see options for Windows and Linux. I'm assuming that the Linux install will also work for Macs. Is this the case? Bruce [1] http://www.gvsig.org/web/projects/gvsig-desktop/official/gvsig-1.10 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Open Source OGC Sensor Web Enablement implementations [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
I'm trying to get an understanding of which FOSS4G projects are currently (or are planning to) support OGC Observations and Measurements as well as other OGC Sensor Web Enablement related standards. We see this as a strategic direction that we'll need to explore. Can you please reply to the list with urls to your documentation? Many thanks in advance. Bruce Bannerman ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Timmie, The Australian Government's Office of Spatial Data Management (OSDM) has been coordinating a few resources relating to Metadata that you may find of use. They are aimed at the ANZLIC Profile of ISO 19115 / 19139, however they are also relevant to other users of the standards as well. (fyi, ANZLIC is Australia and New Zealand's SDI Governance body. Also , essentially there is minimal difference between the ANZLIC Profile and the default ISO standard). Items of interest: [1] OSDM Metadata entry point. [2] Metadata resources page. [3] What we're planning with GeoNetwork. [4] An introduction to using ISO 19115. In particular, I'd recommend checking out the document 'ANZLIC Metadata Profile Guidelines'. It gives a good overview of why we need Metadata. [5] The ANZMet Toolkit. [6] ANZMet Lite: A stand alone Metadata Entry tool that generates ISO 19139 XML records that can be imported into GeoNetwork. While I do not consider it an appropriate Enterprise grade tool, it does provide an interesting 'Wizard' type user interface to guide people through the entry of their Spatial Metadata. The Australian Government retains the IP to this product. If there is sufficient interest, I understand that OSDM may be willing to release the source code under an appropriate Open Source license. (It is Windows based and I think uses MS Access). [7] A page containing presentations describing and showing the ANZMet Lite user interface. Congratulations to OSDM for putting this excellent resource together. And before we get too complacent, consideration should go to Rob Atkinson's and Rob Woodcock's (Australia's CSIRO) vision of future Spatial Metadata, where metadata is stored and exchanged as part of the data (and data model), ideally via OGC GML Community Schema / Profiles. Bruce Bannerman (apologies Markus, I won't have time in the next few weeks to add this to the wiki...) [1] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/default.aspx [2] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/default.aspx [3] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/GeoNetwork/default.aspx [4] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+Metadata+Profile/default.aspx [5] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+%28final+draft+-+07.2009%29/default.aspx [6] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+(final+draft+-+07.2009)/ANZMetLiteSetup-1.01.zip/?id=959 [7] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/ANZMet+Toolkit+(final+draft+-+07.2009)/06_1QuickStartIntroToANZMetLite.pdf/?id=999 On 26/08/10 3:41 AM, Markus Neteler nete...@osgeo.org wrote: On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Timmie timmichel...@gmx-topmail.de wrote: Hello, I have piled up quite some data for a current project. In order to keep track of the data I would like to use some automatic indexing to create a data catalog. Important issue! Time ago I put together this Wiki page: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Metadata_software Please add all new findings to it, Markus ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Fyi, Ben Searle from Australia's OSDM, asked me to forward this to the list. Bruce -Original Message- From: Ben.Searle Sent: Thursday, 26 August 2010 10:38 AM To: Bruce Bannerman; discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: RE: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] Bruce and Others, Thank you for providing this information to Timmie. As an update on some of your comments, OSDM is undertaking a couple of related activities that may also be of interest. We are currently in the process of re-building ASDD using GeoNetwork. This will enable a greater range of functionality including establishing direct access to data, rather than just the metadata record, provision of a catalogue of services and a significantly improved user interface (the Interface is part of a phase two activity). We are hoping to have the GeoNetwork version up in the next month or so. Secondly, we are in the process of re-developing the National Gazetteer and will be making this available at no cost via a new interface that will support both human and web service interactions. We are looking at roughly 20 weeks to have this completed. It is also likely that there will be a single interface to the gazetteer and the ASDD. Finally, we have some ANU software engineering students working on an ANZMet Lite replacement (for various reasons we are not able to make ANZMet Lite open source and also its architecture is such that it is very difficult to add new profiles or other metadata capabilities such as Dublin Core. The student project is focussing on similar capabilities to ANZMet Lite but with the ability to 'easily' add new profiles. A level of auto-configuration of entry screens based on the schema provided is part of this. While their project will not provide a production ready capability, we are aiming to employ one of the students to take it to a production ready application. I am anticipating this to be available early in the new year. I hope this additional information is of interest. Regards Ben Searle General Manager, Australian Government Office of Spatial Data Management -Original Message- From: Bruce Bannerman [mailto:b.banner...@bom.gov.au] Sent: Thursday, 26 August 2010 9:55 To: OSGeo Discussions Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Automatic-Metadata Catalogueing [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] Timmie, The Australian Government's Office of Spatial Data Management (OSDM) has been coordinating a few resources relating to Metadata that you may find of use. They are aimed at the ANZLIC Profile of ISO 19115 / 19139, however they are also relevant to other users of the standards as well. (fyi, ANZLIC is Australia and New Zealand's SDI Governance body. Also , essentially there is minimal difference between the ANZLIC Profile and the default ISO standard). Items of interest: [1] OSDM Metadata entry point. [2] Metadata resources page. [3] What we're planning with GeoNetwork. [4] An introduction to using ISO 19115. In particular, I'd recommend checking out the document 'ANZLIC Metadata Profile Guidelines'. It gives a good overview of why we need Metadata. [5] The ANZMet Toolkit. [6] ANZMet Lite: A stand alone Metadata Entry tool that generates ISO 19139 XML records that can be imported into GeoNetwork. While I do not consider it an appropriate Enterprise grade tool, it does provide an interesting 'Wizard' type user interface to guide people through the entry of their Spatial Metadata. The Australian Government retains the IP to this product. If there is sufficient interest, I understand that OSDM may be willing to release the source code under an appropriate Open Source license. (It is Windows based and I think uses MS Access). [7] A page containing presentations describing and showing the ANZMet Lite user interface. Congratulations to OSDM for putting this excellent resource together. And before we get too complacent, consideration should go to Rob Atkinson's and Rob Woodcock's (Australia's CSIRO) vision of future Spatial Metadata, where metadata is stored and exchanged as part of the data (and data model), ideally via OGC GML Community Schema / Profiles. Bruce Bannerman (apologies Markus, I won't have time in the next few weeks to add this to the wiki...) [1] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/default.aspx [2] http://www.osdm.gov.au/Metadata/ANZLIC+metadata+resources/default.aspx [3] http
[OSGeo-Discuss] EU Guide on procurement of open source revised [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
fyi: For those who keep tabs on these issues: http://www.osor.eu/news/eu-guide-on-procurement-of-open-source-revised Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: Staistical analysis support needed [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Mayank, You may wish to implement this functionality via an OGC Web Processing Service. That way, if your technology requirements change in the future, you can limit the impact of the change. Bruce On 14/09/10 1:40 AM, Alex Mandel tech_...@wildintellect.com wrote: On 09/13/2010 06:45 AM, mayank_agarwal wrote: Hello Christopher, Sorry for that, I didnt mean to be so harsh on GRASS, but as R can be bridged with JAVA using JRI library, that's why I prefer R, and then it is simpler in using, and I agree that both will have there pros and cons, no doubt. Never the less thanks for helping me so much and iI am sorry if I hurt you. Note you can also implement R code inside of Postgres. http://www.bostongis.com/PrinterFriendly.aspx?content_name=postgresql_plr_tut01 Enjoy, Alex ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: git like for geodata management [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Ragi, I agree. I think that we have a way to go yet to have something comparable to the ArcSDE / ArcGIS Multi-versioning and version conflict detection functionality. The advantage that the ArcSDE solution has is that edits are made directly within the database. This works well within an Enterprise environment as described by Fabio earlier in this thread. I may be wrong, but I think that git works on files, but I haven't used it myself. Can git detect changes to the spatial representation of a feature within a binary file? Also, speaking as someone who implemented an ArcSDE/ArcGIS Multi-versioned edit scenario several years ago, the ESRI solution is far from perfect. It imposes very strict environment management on the system managers, e.g.: * All versions of the software used (client and server) must be at precisely the same version, service pack and patch; * The environment can only use software that implements the ArcObjects environment (from experience, this rules out the use of the ArcSDE Java and C API's); * Editors must be well trained and knowledgeable in using both ArcGIS and Multi-versioned processes; * The Organisation needs to think through their maintenance processes to get best advantage of the functionality; and * It doesn't remove the need for data maintenance people to talk to each other about work that is going on, as the software cannot resolve all conflicts. For example, if two editors make changes to the spatial representation of a feature, which one is correct? The software will detect the conflict, but the editors (or their managers) will need to resolve the issue of which version of the feature's spatial representation is correct. Bruce On 24/09/10 4:05 AM, Ragi Burhum r...@burhum.com wrote: Hi Noli, thanks for the link. That is definitely a step in the right direction, but it is hardly comparable to git ArcSDE versioning at that. The article and sample code you describe above generates hashes for all rows and tables in the db and compares them to the target db. So 1 million rows in a db, regardless if the two dbs are identical, would cause 1 million hashes to go over the wire. Every single time you ask to sync you pay the price. Git and ArcSDE keep track of changesets, and when it is time to synchronize, they exchange that changeset and apply it. One insert? That is all that needs to be sent. Another issue is that there is nothing about conflict resolution there (what happens when you delete one row in one db and modify it in another one?). There is also the problem of allowing multiple versions of the data in the same db (Like having multiple heads). Regardless, thank you for the link, - Ragi Date: Thu, 23 Sep 2010 13:22:17 +1000 From: Noli Sicad nsi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Re: git like for geodata management To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org Message-ID: aanlkti=3anc4baand4hk9uuzfsasxn-8ybpnkyong...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 PostgreSQL Synchronization Tool --- psync [1] The article introduces a method of synchronizing two PostgreSQL databases. Although, this seems to be an easy task, no product (slony, londiste, ...) really satisfied the needs within the maps.bremen.de http://maps.bremen.de http://maps.bremen.de project. Either they have special prerequsits that didn't apply for our problem or they didn't support synchronizing of large objects. Large objects are used to store tiles of a street/aerial map within PostgreSQL. My GIS-server queries the database and gets the tiles out. By using this construction we are getting a flexible infrastructure for updating and maintaining different versions of the maps. Everything was working fine until the service needs to be spread over three servers. How can we easily synchronize the databases? I really found no really working solution that is clean and easy to use. [1]http://www.codeproject.com/KB/database/psync.aspx http://www.codeproject.com/KB/database/psync.aspx Noli On 9/23/10, Ragi Burhum r...@burhum.com wrote: Are you looking for an alternative to (1)ESRI's versioning, (2)ESRI's disconnected editing, or a mix of both (3)git like? the scenario that you described first was more like (2), but this one fits (1). I would love to see something like (3), but truth of the matter, AFAIK, there is nothing like that implemented for geo (yet). On Sep 22, 2010, at 9:00 AM, discuss-requ...@lists.osgeo.org wrote: On Wed, 2010-09-22 at 12:10 +0800, maning sambale wrote: Any real world cases for this? Imagine the following scenario: * 50 ~ 70 digitizers * 5 QA * 1 Manager Each QA has 10 digitizers assigned. After all the data is validated, the manager merges it and generates the geodb. All users work against the same DB, most of them linked. This causes disconnections, duplicated data, and lots of random errors. Also, they can't be forced to work on different DB's because they are all working on the
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Charter member candidates, pls step forward! [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Hi Michael, I don't like beating my own drum... I'll let my actions stand on their merits. We are indeed fortunate to have such a wealth of talent in our community, as can be seen by the nominees. Bruce On 5/11/10 3:46 AM, Michael P. Gerlek m...@lizardtech.com wrote: Those of you who've been nominated, feel free to announce yourselves with a few immodestly chosen lines about why we should vote for you! There are a lot of seemingly good candidates, but not enough votes to go around... -mpg ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Fedora Geo/GIS Spin [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Do we really need two projects doing this work? To my perhaps naive thinking, wouldn't the results of both projects be essentially the same? Bruce On 18/11/10 6:36 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Viji, This sounds very interesting. I suggest touch base with Mathieu from the Enterprise Linux packaging efforts, who are packaging for redhat. I assume that between your two projects there will be much that you can share. http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Enterprise_Linux_GIS Also, I've involved in the OSGeo-Live packaging effort, which has packaged 42 of the best geospatial open source applications on top of Ubuntu, including all the OSGeo incubated projects. Of particular interest would be our shell install scripts which you should be able to copy in order to create your rpm installers, and also the documentation which projects are creating for us which you will likely be interested in copying too. http://live.osgeo.org (for docs) http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Disc (our main wiki) http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Live_GIS_Add_Project (provides links to our build scripts) Good luck, I'm interested to hear how things go. On 17/11/10 21:05, Viji V Nair wrote: Hi, I am a Fedora project contributor and have been working on Linux for the last 10+ years, specifically on GIS projects for the last 4+ years. We are adding more GIS application to fedora. If everything goes fine, there will a GIS/Geo spin for Fedora 15. Please have a look at: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Geo_Spin http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/GIS The following new packages have been pushed for Fedora 13/14 and rawhide (F15), currently under testing. pgRouting (Provides routing functionality to PostGIS/PostgreSQL) tilecache (A web map tile caching system) To test: yum --enablerepo=updates-testing install python-tilecache yum --enablerepo=updates-testing install pgRouting If you are interested in becoming a contributor, we are very happy. Please feel free to contact me if you have any queries. Thanks Viji Nair https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Viji_V_Nair ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Re: [Meteo.DWG] multi-lingual WMS-legends [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Fyi, Thanks Jeff, Bruce On 28/05/11 12:06 AM, Jeff de La Beaujardiere jeff.delabeaujardi...@noaa.gov wrote: There is already an HTTP mechanism for language negotiation: the Accept-Language header described at http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec14.html#sec14.4 and elsewhere. OGC and OSGeo should not invent another mechanism for this. Regards, Jeff DLB -- Jeff de La Beaujardière, PhD NOAA Data Management Architect NESDIS/OSD/TPIO On 2011-05-24 18:14, Bruce Bannerman wrote: An issue from OSGeo-Discuss that may be of relevance here as well. Do we have a proposed way of handling this? Bruce -- Forwarded Message *From: *Steven M. Ottens ste...@minst.net *Reply-To: *OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org *Date: *Tue, 24 May 2011 19:51:44 +1000 *To: *OSGeo Discussions Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org *Subject: *[OSGeo-Discuss] multi-lingual WMS-legends Hi all, I'm currently building a multi-lingual Web-GIS application. One of the requirements is that the legends of the maps are multi-lingual. E.g. if the chosen language is English, the legend will say 'forest', whereas when the chosen language is Dutch it will say 'bos'. So no need to have all the languages in one image, using something like lang=en is fine by me. I've done a quick look in the mapserver documentation but it doesn't appear to support lang for generating legends. Nor does the WMS 1.3.0 specification for that matter. Has anyone tried to do such a thing? regards, Steven ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- End of Forwarded Message ___ Meteo.DWG mailing list meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org https://lists.opengeospatial.org/mailman/listinfo/meteo.dwg ___ Meteo.DWG mailing list meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org https://lists.opengeospatial.org/mailman/listinfo/meteo.dwg ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] weave release [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Hi Percy, Fyi there is already a spatial intelligence framework on the market called Weave [1]. We've been using it with great effect recently. I'll be interested in looking at your product as well. Bruce Bannerman [1] http://www.cohga.com/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=9Itemid=26 On 17/06/11 4:17 AM, percy per...@pdx.edu wrote: I'm happy to announce that a new open source interactive data visualization tool for the web is available. It's called Weave, and is currently in beta. It requires a java servlet engine on the server, and flash in the client. I am using it to serve up data for the Portland region, as I've been lucky enough to participate in the pre-beta testing. What's really cool is the interactivity between the graphs, data tables, legend and map. It's all linked up. Plus time animations for map data! Other regional indicator projects are also using it, and we anticipate a big rollout in the Fall. Since it's beta, don't expect a lot of support yet... Cheers, Percy -- David Percy Geospatial Data Manager Geology Department Institute for Metropolitan Studies Portland State University http://gisgeek.pdx.edu 503-725-3373 ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Geomajas Geometry Project [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Pieter, I agree with Jody. I'm seeing increasing demand for clients that can utilise vector data constrained by an application schema. Europe is probably most advanced in this work with Inspire. In Australia we have a lot of work currently at research and at implementation stage trying to work with Simple Features 1 (aka Complex Features). Some examples are WaterML 2.0 and GeoSciML. We will also be looking seriously at CSML 3.0. Bruce Bannerman On 13/07/11 10:52 PM, Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.com wrote: It is the ISO 19107 specification; the same one that lurks behind GML Ready to leap out from under a surface and foist trans finite set on an unsuspecting world. It is worth while getting the ISO 19107 document (ie pay for it) as it is much easier to read and follow then learning this information second hand. We had a brief code sprint with deegree (compatible LGPL license) in order to see if multiple project would be interested in attacking the problem. GeoAPI was the first attempt (which has now been released last month), we have a couple of implementations in GeoTools (mostly ports or wrappers of JTS). deegree has an implementation that is closer to the GML constructs etc If you are interested in pursuing this I recommend talking to Tisham who has been more active research. I am afraid I am interested in using a Geometry library and enthusiasm goes as far as setting one up with a good design so that it can be completed successfully. -- Jody Garnett On Wednesday, 13 July 2011 at 9:54 PM, Pieter De Graef wrote: Hi Jody, that's the GeoApi specification no? At first we would be using it on the GWT client we where hoping to also include curves, as those can be directly drawn in SVG/VML. At a later stage we could switch the backend to make use of it as well. Jody, you have been looking into creating you own Geometry library for some time now I understand. How would you approach this? I was hoping to start with something simple, that can grow at it's own pace. Important for me is that I can use the same objects on both client and server (meaning Java with some GWT restrictions). I am also afraid to be re-inventing the wheel, but using 2 different libraries on client and server would be a shame when using GWT... 2011/7/13 Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.com There is a third model; the ISO19107 model that deals with a few more things; it is however object oriented in nature -- Jody Garnett On Wednesday, 13 July 2011 at 6:36 PM, Pieter De Graef wrote: Hi everyone, for the Geomajas project, we are looking into separating the Geometry functionality into an independent project. In other words, I am talking about a Geometry project for the Web. This code would be written in Java for GWT and thus be available on Java backends as well as client environments (we intend to add a JavaScript wrapper around the GWT code). Now the problem that I'm facing here, is which model to follow On one hand there is the Simple Feature Specification which is clearly an Object Oriented model with the advantage that it is well known but is also more difficult to implement the JavaScript wrapper around. On the other hand we could follow a service based model (more like SFS for SQL) which is easier to get up and running, easier to create a JavaScript wrapper for and easier to translate into web services. As it's difficult for us to chose and as it's a pretty crucial decision for the future of the Geomajas project, I as wondering how you guys feel about this. Kind regards, Pieter De Graef ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] FW: [OGC Press Release] Take the 'Business Value of OGC Standards' Survey! [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
For those who haven't seen this. If you have the time, please take this survey. The results will be very useful. Bruce Bannerman -- Forwarded Message From: OGC Press Release annou...@opengeospatial.org Reply-To: annou...@opengis.org, annou...@opengeospatial.org Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2011 06:54:14 +1100 To: me...@lists.opengeospatial.org Subject: [OGC Press Release] Take the 'Business Value of OGC Standards' Survey! PRESS ANNOUNCEMENT FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE For information about this announcement, contact: Contact: Steven Ramage Executive Director, Marketing and Communications Open Geospatial Consortium (OGC) http://www.opengeospatial.org/contact --- *** Win an Apple iPad 2 Tablet, an Apple iPod touch or Bose AE2 headphones! *** The survey is a joint effort by two academic researchers who are OGC members and by the OGC Business Value Committee. Dr. Mu Xia at Santa Clara University and Dr. Kexin Zhao at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte developed the survey based on requirements from the OGC Business Value Committee to support their studies on standards effectiveness. The OGC Business Value Committee will use a summary of the results to help the OGC better understand the value of the OGC's open standards and improve its programs for geospatial standards development, compliance testing and outreach. We encourage everyone involved with geospatial or location data, software and services to complete the survey. This is an opportunity for technical and commercial colleagues to work together and highlight their business needs and requirements around open standards. OGC membership is not a requirement, and you can participate even if the software you use or provide does not implement OGC standards. The survey takes about 10 to 15 minutes to complete. Individual responses will be seen only by the researchers and OGC staff. The researchers will summarize the data gathered from the survey, removing all references to individual responses, and make the summary available to OGC Business Value Committee members. An executive summary will be provided to survey respondents. The researchers have prepared two versions of the online survey. To take the survey, if you are a technology user, visit http://uncc.surveyshare.com/s/AQAIJDC. If you are a technology provider (a vendor or a system integrator) or a consultant, visit http://uncc.surveyshare.com/s/AQAIZBC. If you are not sure which version to use, contact us. Please also forward this message to others who might be interested in completing the survey. The survey period is 1st November through 18th December 2011. Prizes will be awarded at random to three individuals who complete the survey. The first person whose name is drawn after the survey has closed will receive an iPad 2 (16GB, WiFi), the second will receive an iPod Touch (8GB, 4th Generation) and the third will receive a set of Bose AE2 headphones. Thanks for your support! The members of the OGC Business Value Committee http://www.opengeospatial.org/projects/groups/businessvalue The OGC is an international consortium of more than 430 companies, government agencies, research organizations, and universities participating in a consensus process to develop publicly available geospatial standards. OGC Standards support interoperable solutions that geo-enable the Web, wireless and location-based services, and mainstream IT. OGC Standards empower technology developers to make geospatial information and services useful with any application that needs to be geospatially enabled. Visit the OGC website at http://www.opengeospatial.org/contact. ___ Press and Media mailing list Open Geospatial Consortium, Inc. 35 Main Street, Suite 5, Wayland, MA 01778 USA me...@lists.opengeospatial.org Subscribe/unsubscribe for OGC lists at http://www.opengeospatial.org/resources/?page=email Other List Options available at https://lists.opengeospatial.org/mailman/listinfo/media -- End of Forwarded Message ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Mapping Tools for Real Estate Parcels [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Arnie, Is this data not available via your local government authority that is responsible for property related data? Bruce On 7/01/12 3:37 AM, Arnie Shore shor...@gmail.com wrote: Hello all. We have a need for mapping a few hundred parcels, and I expect that will mean walking the property boundaries with GPS device in order to pick up corner coordinates, for subsequent entry into a database. Nothing at all unusual, I'm sure. I'm OK with taking the point data for presentation, but I wonder if anyone here can speak (actually, type!) to experiences with the initial point data capture step; devices, etc, with recommendations. AS ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Talk on Copyright and Licensing for Geospatial Data [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Landon, At [1] you'll find the report from the 'Inquiry into Improving Access to Victorian Public Sector Information and Data' from Australia's Victorian Parliament. Their approach is to move towards a Creative Commons scheme. This allows the recognition of the data set creator's copyright. There are a lot of relevant observations in the report. CC is becoming the default approach from many governments around the world. If you dig a little deeper at [1], you'll see the OSGeo AustNZ submission put together by myself and Cameron Shorter. We were even cited in the final report a few times. Bruce [1] http://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/component/content/category/31 From: Landon Blake sunburned.surve...@gmail.com Reply-To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 04:06:02 +1100 To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: [OSGeo-Discuss] Talk on Copyright and Licensing for Geospatial Data OSGeo Folks: I'm giving a talk to CCVGPG (http://www.ccvgpg.org), our local GIS user group this Friday. My talk will be about copyright and licensing of geospatial data. I've found a good amount of information on copyright and a bit on its application to GIS. However, I haven't found much at all in the way of information about the licensing of geospatial data. If you have some references I can investigate, I would appreciate that. Or, if you work for an organization that had to make decisions about the licensing of geospatial data, and you'd be willing to discuss things you considered as part of that decision process, please let me know. I'll post a link to a video of the talk if recording and editing goes OK. Thanks. Landon ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
FW: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and library connections [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
I put together a mind map of foss4g projects several years ago. It hasn't been maintained for the last couple of years, but may be of use. You can access it via: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/User:Bruce.bannerman Bruce -- Forwarded Message From: Cameron Shorter Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 17:22:14 +1000 To: Bruce Bannerman Subject: Fwd: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and library connections Bruce, I seem to remember that you created a map of osgeo-projects at one point? Original Message Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] chart/diagram of all osgeo projects and library connections Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 08:34:29 +0200 From: Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas js...@osgeo.org mailto:js...@osgeo.org Reply-To: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.org mailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org To: discuss@lists.osgeo.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 El 30/03/12 07:37, maning sambale escribió: My websearch skills are failing right now. I beleive it was mentioned here before of very big flow chart/diagram of all OSGEO projects. I distinctly remember that almost all projects connects to GDAL. I need for a presentation about osgeo. We uploaded the diagram Miguel Montesinos and me created for an article some time ago. It's really outdated (2009!) so any improvement is more than welcomed https://svn.osgeo.org/osgeo/community/mindmaps/project-relationships-diagram/ I used Inkscape to edit the map so it's in SVG format. Cheers - -- Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas http://es.osgeo.org http://jorgesanz.net -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPdVP1AAoJEAOYD75lvHdBZ2MIAKEwJJRlXF/fA2a95/uxwnIn 7MYZd2bNObY6y5KnAXhhWU/8osJTut1pLx/ZYHckqDQO6+2Qvukb3DM6NAeOCSdj 8DL56nmnPaS5IdOJkgyqNaY8QplU64qAzgYxNig9X6EPtjsXbOSQwFpIsFqLsCE/ u8nvI02ZauxAbUpz86HgnkYGHJuMN7N/dFsi7Fs5TtsHix/eaZSYZ+9n+J/QfOjW e6/XIQQmG/gi6JOIbgRDh2hRbFekfqCdq8F0Z0sf+iZP7agknnh3cauvgOol7To7 7r2Lponry9orn37feLtLZDMHTRHqBHoPmw6VUUFgOcKwvjDPq7BCt+W/Q7g2wds= =KCui -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- End of Forwarded Message ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Xlink 1.1 [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Please note Carl Reed's blog on OGC's policy and timeline to move to Xlink 1.1: http://www.opengeospatial.org/blog/1597 Bruce Bannerman ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G 2012 Cancel Request
@LOC FOSS4G-2012, This is a courageous decision. Well done! It would have been a very difficult decision to make after the time that you have spent in organising this event. I know from experience how critical a professional conference organiser is in putting together a successful event of the calibre of recent FOSS4G. If our professional organiser for FOSS4G-2009 had pulled out months before our event, I suspect that we would have had to do what you have done. @Jeff, well said. Bruce Bannerman -- Forwarded Message *From: *Jeff McKenna jmcke...@gatewaygeomatics.com *Date: *Tue, 10 Jul 2012 21:40:33 +1000 *To: *foss4g2012 foss4g2...@lreis.ac.cn, board bo...@lists.osgeo.org *Cc: *tomgaoang tomgao...@gmail.com, chengcx chen...@lreis.ac.cn, yanxunyx yanxu...@gmail.com, discuss discuss@lists.osgeo.org, song.osgeo song.os...@gmail.com, chenrg che...@lreis.ac.cn *Subject: *Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G 2012 Cancel Request Hello Chen, Gao, Dr. Song, Venka-sensei, and all of the 2012 Committee, This is unfortunate news, and I thank you for making such a difficult decision now, before any travel plans are made by attendees. Having been recently on behalf of OSGeo to Beijing (late 2010), I know the passion for FOSS4G there is very strong; Dr. Song, Venka-sensei, Gao, and Professor Yu (who unfortunately passed away recently) are leaders in the community there. I still get questions through a mailing list that Venka-sensei setup there for local researchers examining FOSS. I have no doubt that this passion will continue in China and Asia. I am honored to call such local leaders such as Dr.Song, Professor Yu (may he rest in peace), and Venka-senei my close friends as well. I hope personally that a smaller local FOSS4G event can be planned in Beijing, and I would be sure to attend that wonderful event. FOSS4G is indeed strong in Asia, I hope to relay this message in this email from me. Having traveled there so many times (more than 7 times recently, now too many to keep track) I have seen this first hand. Lastly, I know how much hard work it is to put together proposals for FOSS4G, gather committee members, talk to the venue, etc. and I thank you for all of the effort you put into that. I believe this experience will help you for planning another event in the future. I hope to see you all in an Asia-region event soon, where we can together continue to share this wonderful FOSS4G passion. Thank you. Your friend, -jeff On 12-07-10 6:25 AM, OSGeo China wrote: Dear OSGeo Board, With great regret, the FOSS4G Beijing Local Organizing Committee (LOC) has made the difficult decision of cancelling the event due to a lack of financial resources and the unexpected withdrawal of the Professional Conference Organizer. Please officially approve our decision and advise any procedures we may need to follow to minimize the impact on the community. We also wrote letter for FOSS4G Beijing 2012 potential participants, we will publish this announcement on the foss4g2012 website and e-mail them after we get feedback from Board. ** Dear Participants of FOSS4G Beijing 2012, With great regret, the FOSS4G Beijing Local Organizing Committee (LOC) has made the difficult decision of cancelling the event due to a lack of financial resources and the unexpected withdrawal of the Professional Conference Organizer. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this has caused. For those interested in FOSS4G events, the LOC suggests consider: * FOSS4G 2013, to be held in Nottingham, United Kingdom, 2013 * The Asian Geospatial Forum, September 2012, Hanoi, Vietnam, which will have an OSGeo session. http://www.asiageospatialforum.org/ http://www.asiageospatialforum.org/ Thank you for your patience and support! Best regards, FOSS4G Beijing 2012 LOC * Best regards, FOSS4G Beijing 2012 LOC ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- End of Forwarded Message ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] NOAA's standards based Enterprise Spatial environment [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
In case you missed this: http://www.opengeospatial.org/blog/1665 Bruce ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G presentation review process [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Agreed. Well said Cameron, with the aside that there may be an interesting talk from a previously little known person. I suggest leaving this to the discretion of the LOC and interested parties who subscribe to that year's FOSS4G mailing list. A popularity campaign is not required or wanted. Bruce On 2/10/12 9:36 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote: I believe that for the general program, we should publish both the presenter and abstract. Reasons: 1. I'm attracted to a talk by both the topic and the presenter. I'm more likely to listen to a talk by someone who has a deep knowledge of a topic, which typically equates to someone with a big reputation. 2. And I think it is appropriate that people who have committed much time to the Open Source community, and hence have built up a big reputation, are allowed to be recognised by the selection community. 3. It also makes good business sense to the FOSS4G conference, as big names on the program will likely attract more delegates, and will likely have the delegates going away satisfied that they have seen presentations that they wanted to see. 4. The alternative of only seeing an abstract when voting is that anyone who can write a good abstract can potentially present on a topic, even if they don't have a deep insight in the topic of interest. On 2/10/2012 4:59 AM, Schlagel, Joel D IWR wrote: I believe anonymous reviews has a place as a component of paper selection - as a compliment to editorial review and professional judgement.FOSS4G conference is the number one marketing opportunity for the OSGEO community. We should make a deliberate effort to have a balance between inward focused technical / developer oriented presentations and outward focused policy / success / benefit type good news presentations. -joel From: discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org [discuss-boun...@lists.osgeo.org] on behalf of Paul Ramsey [pram...@opengeo.org] Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 2:43 PM To: Volker Mische Cc: osgeo-discuss Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G presentation review process I'm in favour too. It has potential, let's see how an anonymous community process works in practice. P. On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 11:31 AM, Volker Mische volker.mis...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, On 10/01/2012 06:10 PM, Barry Rowlingson wrote: In our bid for FOSS4G 2013 Nottingham, we didn't precisely say how we intended to select presentations for the main track of the conference. Some discussion amongst the committee has been going on, and we think it necessary to informally poll the community to get a feel for what method is preferred. Previous FOSS4Gs have not used anonymous reviews (note: the Academic Track will be a double-blind review process, we are discussing the main conference presentations here), and have used a blend of committee reviews and community reviews. Note that even with a numerical ranking system its normally still necessary to do a manual step to get a balanced conference. The big change we could do would be to have anonymous community reviews. Proposals would be rated based on title and abstract only. The arguments for this include: * selection is on quality of proposal rather than bigness of name * rating procedure can prevent up-votes from whoever has the most followers on twitter * promotes inclusivity: http://2012.jsconf.eu/2012/09/17/beating-the-odds-how-we-got-25-percent-women-speakers.html and against arguments include: * some names are big draws, and it would be disappointing to not have someone because their abstract wasn't that exciting. * previous FOSS4Gs have used non-anonymous reviewing and that worked fine. Why change it? * it may be hard to distil an exciting talk into an abstract without losing the excitement. So, as this would be quite a change for FOSS4G, what do you - the OSGeo community at large - think? I do have a google poll nearly ready on this, but lets have a bit of a debate here and maybe it won't even be necessary. I think an anonymous selection process makes a lot of sense. I personally always hoped that people don't do a please up-vote me campaigns on blogs or Twitter, but it happened. It will still be possible as people could publish the titles of the abstract, but I hope this won't happen and everyone will play along nicely. One thing we have to keep in mind, that this conference is different from the JSConf.eu. The JSConf.eu is about the bleeding edge an what's hot in the fast changing JavaScript world. The audience are definitely non-beginners. At the FOSS4G the audience is way more wide-spread. It ranges from beginners to absolute pros. Hence there are also talks that are kind of the same every year. Things that come to my mind are my own talks, which are always about GeoCouch, or the State of ... talks. They have a place, but you'd know upfront the the State of GeoServer e.g. is
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FOSS4G North America - Blind voting [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
Cameron, Agreed. As has been discussed in similar threads, and as we found for Sydney, it helps the LOC determine relative popularity of presentations for room allocation. However, perhaps the actual final results do not need to be published. Presenters are either accepted or they're not, after deliberation by the LOC. There is no need to establish a popularity contest. Bruce On 18/01/13 6:24 AM, Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com wrote: On 17/01/13 03:58, David William Bitner wrote: Additionally following advice from other events as well as many members of our community, we are making the community review process for presentation submission author anonymous as a concern with how we have done this in the past has been the fear that many folks have of feeling publicly shamed with critique and voting of their proposals. These are only two small steps that we are taking to addressing an environment in the overall open source world that by the numbers is very unwelcome to women and other groups (while there have not been any overt issues that I know of as part of any FOSS4G, if you look at the percentage of female conference goers or developers in our community, we do have a long ways to go). David, If I understand you correctly, you are suggesting blind voting on abstracts without knowing who will be presenting it? I've heard that blind auditions has been successfully applied to recruitment for orchestras, (which makes sense), however I don't think it is applicable for Open Source communities. You see, in selecting Open Source presentations, I think it is very important to know who will be presenting, almost as important as the presentation content itself. This is because the presenters who will have the most insightful content, and who will attract the most audience are usually those who have built up a large, very public reputation, (as leaders of open source communities, usually with a long history of insightful emails, blogs, and IRC trails). I appreciate the importance of being welcoming to all communities. In fact, I think that successful Open Source communities are naturally welcoming as they have managed to attract developers and community. However, I don't think that blind voting is right for us. -- Cameron Shorter Geospatial Solutions Manager Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050 Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254 Think Globally, Fix Locally Geospatial Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source http://www.lisasoft.com ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] FW: OSGeo Board Priorities
Cameron and 'The Board', Thanks for putting these thoughts together. This seems like a good strategic approach to take. Bruce *From: *Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.com *Date: *Mon, 4 Mar 2013 10:44:42 +1100 *To: *OSGeo Discussions, OSGeo-Board List *Subject: *[OSGeo-Discuss] OSGeo Board Priorities A productive virtual meeting of the OSGeo Board http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Board_Meeting_2013-02-26 resulted in general consensus over OSGeo's priorities, which in turn should help the OSGeo Board and OSGeo committees when guiding OSGeo into the future. These principles are: - OSGeo should act as a low capital, volunteer focused organisation. - OSGeo should focus support on OSGeo communities and initiatives which support themselves. Current priority areas include: - Global, regional and local FOSS4G related events, or events which include a FOSS4G stream. - Marketing OSGeo, which is currently focused around OSGeo-Live http://live.osgeo.org/ . - Education, which is currently focused around the network of Open Source Geospatial Research and Education Laboratories http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Edu_current_initiatives . - Local Chapters, as outreach initiatives are typically driven at the local level. So lets expand on these: *OSGeo as a low capital, volunteer focused organisation * Should OSGeo act as a high capital or low capital organisation? I.e., should OSGeo dedicate energy to collecting sponsorship and then passing out these funds to worthy OSGeo causes. While initially it seems attractive to have OSGeo woe sponsors, because we would all love to have more money to throw at worthy OSGeo goals, the reality is that chasing money is hard work. And someone who can chase OSGeo sponsorship is likely conflicted with chasing sponsorship for their particular workplace. So in practice, to be effective in chasing sponsorship, OSGeo will probably need to hire someone specifically for the role. OSGeo would then need to raise at least enough to cover wages, and then quite a bit more if the sponsorship path is to create extra value. This high capital path is how the Eclipse foundation is set up, and how LocationTech propose to organise themselves. It is the path that OSGeo started following when founded under the umbrella of Autodesk. However, over the last seven years, OSGeo has slowly evolved toward a low capital volunteer focused organisation. Our overheads are very low, which means we waste very little of our volunteer labour and capital on the time consuming task of chasing and managing money. Consequently, any money we do receive (from conference windfalls or sponsorship) goes a long way - as it doesn't get eaten up by high overheads. As discussed and agreed by the board, this low capital path is something that is working very well for us, and is the path we should continue to follow. *Support initiatives which support themselves * With the thousands of great initiatives and opportunities that OSGeo could get involved in, and limited budget, how should OSGeo set funding priorities? Acknowledging that our volunteer community is blessed with many talented individuals, our most effective way to tap into community potential is to welcome individuals to help scratch their itch. Extending on this, funding priorities should follow the *actions* of already successful communities. (Note the difference between talk and action). If a task or project is important enough, it will attract volunteers and/or sponsors to make it happen. In practice, this will usually equate to providing co-contributions rather than outright funding. OSGeo's focus should be on initiatives which are of value to all or most OSGeo projects, and to get best value for our limited budget, OSGeo should target initiatives which have high value with minimal investment. With that in mind our priorities should be: - Cover the costs of running OSGeo: Bank fees, insurance, infrastructure, hosting etc. - Support marketing and out reach activities, with a primary focus on our FOSS4G global conference, followed by regional and then local FOSS4G or related events. - Educational type activities are a high priority, but likely will be a minimal cost activity from OSGeo's perspective. - Other initiatives which fit our priorities, as suggested by membership. Initiatives which probably wouldn't quality: - Sponsoring core development of a particular project. (Too expensive, and only supports one project) - OSGeo speaker travel expenses, or booth registration costs at a conference. (If conferences/local community feel this is important, they will either: 1. pay for the keynote, 2. make use of local talent, 3. waive fees for our non-profit, 4. find a local sponsor) *Conferences and related events * Conferences are financially risky events. They need to be planned well in advance, and you are never sure how many people will turn up, or whether some global
[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: End the vote!
Adrian, As a 'reject';-)I agree with your assessment. It did cause me to reassess my level of contribution, but did not stop me from working within the community. I also did not like the requirement to 'bang my own drum'. That left me in a very uncomfortable situation and I chose not to do so. What needed to be said had already been outlined by my nominees. Bruce On 16/07/13 12:58 AM, Adrian Custer acus...@gmail.com wrote: The former sucks since its only effect will now be to 'exclude' or 'reject' people who are passionate and respected enough to have been nominated. In other words, up to now all has been positive, building respect and support but, now, the only outcome of *voting* is rejection and possibly discouragement of those same people. That seems silly. ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Nomination for Mark Leslie [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
+1 Mark is a passionate advocate for OSGeo and FOSS4G. He delivers a good course too ;-) Bruce From: Cameron Shorter cameron.shor...@gmail.commailto:cameron.shor...@gmail.com Date: Thursday, 18 July 2013 10:52 AM To: Jody Garnett jody.garn...@gmail.commailto:jody.garn...@gmail.com Cc: OSGeo Discussions discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:discuss@lists.osgeo.org Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Nomination for Mark Leslie I second Mark Leslie's Nomination. Mark works along side me at LISAsoft. I can vouch for his depth of experience with regards to Geospatial Open Source (and OGC standards). He was one of the major contributors to OSGeo-Live during the difficult early days when the project was starting out. He played a major role coordinating FOSS4G 2009, in particular coordinating workshops. He has run numerous training courses, in PostGIS and GeoServer in Australia. And he has contributed to PostGIS, Geotools, UDig and GeoServer projects. On 18/07/2013 9:57 AM, Jody Garnett wrote: I would like to nominate Mark Leslie as Charter Member. Mark Leslie is a long time member of the open source community, participating in the GeoServer and PostGIS communities. In Australia Mark is active in supporting the OSGeo Aust-NZ chapter. -- Jody Garnett ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.orgmailto:Discuss@lists.osgeo.orghttp://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss -- Cameron Shorter Software and Data Solutions Manager Tel: +61 (0)2 8570 5050 Mob: +61 (0)419 142 254 Think Globally, Fix Locally Geospatial Data Solutions enhanced with Open Standards and Open Source http://www.lisasoft.com ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] FW: [Meteo.DWG] Interested in Governing Earth Science Data Communities? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
fyi From: Ted Habermann thaberm...@hdfgroup.orgmailto:thaberm...@hdfgroup.org Date: Friday, 3 January 2014 9:28 am To: meteo@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org meteo@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org, hydro@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:hydro@lists.opengeospatial.org hydro@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:hydro@lists.opengeospatial.org, ess@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:ess@lists.opengeospatial.org ess@lists.opengeospatial.orgmailto:ess@lists.opengeospatial.org Subject: [Meteo.DWG] Interested in Governing Earth Science Data Communities? Hello all, EarthCube (www.earthcube.orghttp://www.earthcube.org) is an NSF initiative with the goal of creating a community-driven data and knowledge management system for the geosciences. The EarthCube Test Governance Project is holding a series of stakeholder workshops to help formulate ideas and models for governing this community. Private sector and open-source software/tool developers will have an important role in this community. A workshop will be held in Boulder during the first week in March to get input from this group. Travel funding may be available from NSF. Please let me know if you are interested in attending. Thanks and Happy New Year, Ted [cid:302D-45F4-4250-BB1C-8AFBD78174C5] attachment: SignatureSm2.png___ Meteo.DWG mailing list meteo@lists.opengeospatial.org https://lists.opengeospatial.org/mailman/listinfo/meteo.dwg ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[OSGeo-Discuss] Fwd: FW: Possible CS-W Portal Opportunity
Paul, I noted your last paragraph below, which does ring alarm bells for me. What is the intent of this approach? Is it: - To potentially launch a piece of software as an open source project that DHS ST will sponsor and support through the incubation process until the project becomes self sustaining; or - To declare some software that DHS ST has developed as open source with a view for OSGeo, or some other party, to pick it up, sponsor and support it through the incubation process, with DHS ST hoping to get the software maintained by others with little or no involvement by DHS ST. I'm unclear of the intent behind the approach from your email. I suspect that you would receive a more favourable response if it was the first option above. You may even find that an existing project that works in this space may pick up the software if it is appropriate for their long term road map. Bruce Subject: Re: [OSGeo-Discuss] Possible CS-W Portal Opportunity snip There may be an opportunity to completely open source the system, which would require some additional development to fully support the CS-W interface. Based upon the responses I've received so far (thanks again), it seems like there may be some interest, but I think DHS ST may need a stronger expression of interest from OSGeo to move forward. If there's interest, I could try to schedule a webex meeting to show the system. /snip ___ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.osgeo.org http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
