Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread Marcus Müller
Hi Daniel, shortly answering your questions: On 30.03.2016 17:50, Daniel Pocock wrote: > OK, so keeping the mixer cooled will help reduce loss but has nothing > to do with frequency stability? yes; well, the point is that the mixer is really just a multiplier, built from a nonlinear device, and

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread madengr
If you can synthesize the LO for the upconverter using the RTL XO as a reference, the drift may tend to cancel. I say "may" as this is a trick used in dual or triple down conversion chains. If you can alternate between low and high sided IFs, then the drifts will move in the opposite directions

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread mleech
Tsys is essentially irrelevant for HF receivers, since Tambient is much, much higher (thousands of K) than even some really-poor RF engineering scenarios. At HF, galactic background can be very high--1e4K or more. On 2016-03-30 10:30, Marcus Müller wrote: > Hi Daniel, > > haven't made

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread Daniel Pocock
On 30/03/16 16:49, mle...@ripnet.com wrote: > All of them use reasonably good crystals or crystal XOs. Certainly a > lot better than the RTLSDRs most of these were intended for. > > I assume that you're talking about frequency stability, rather than gain > stability? > Yes, frequency

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread Daniel Pocock
On 30/03/16 16:30, Marcus Müller wrote: > Hi Daniel, > > haven't made experience with any of these upconverters; but: > > The really temperature-sensitive aspect of an upconverter is probably > the oscillator, not the mixer. So the trick might really be keeping > your upconverter in the same

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread mleech
I know that some of them, like the HAMITUP, use a socket for the XO, which one could easily replace with a TCXO. Check with the manufacturers about the XO spec they use. On 2016-03-30 11:43, Daniel Pocock wrote: > On 30/03/16 16:49, mle...@ripnet.com wrote: > >> All of them use reasonably

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread mleech
All of them use reasonably good crystals or crystal XOs. Certainly a lot better than the RTLSDRs most of these were intended for. I assume that you're talking about frequency stability, rather than gain stability? On 2016-03-30 03:18, Daniel Pocock wrote: > Hi all, > > Has anybody been

Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread Marcus Müller
Hi Daniel, haven't made experience with any of these upconverters; but: The really temperature-sensitive aspect of an upconverter is probably the oscillator, not the mixer. So the trick might really be keeping your upconverter in the same environment as your SDR receiver (assuming both don't

[Discuss-gnuradio] comparing SDR upconverters, thermal stability

2016-03-30 Thread Daniel Pocock
Hi all, Has anybody been using any of the upconverters for SDR and has anybody made any comparison of them? I've seen some comments suggesting that many of the low cost models have poor thermal stability[1], has anybody seen problems with this in practice for receiving modes like SSB on