On 2006-11-16 20:47:56 +0100 Richard Frith-Macdonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
So this can be controlled either by a theme or directly by setting
the
NSScrollViewInterfaceStyle user default.
[...]
Good idea, and it works. Though it looks a bit weird, since the top
'box' (the one that
Shouldn't it be GSScrollViewInterfaceStyle since it's a default that is not a
standard OpenStep/Cocoa default?
--
Gregory Casamento
- Original Message
From: Chris Vetter [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: discuss-gnustep@gnu.org
Sent: Saturday, November 18, 2006 7:34:40 AM
Subject: Re: Scrollbars
On 11/18/06, Stefan Bidigaray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Any idea on where the left-to-right scroll bar buttons will be located? On
the Mac they are also located on the right, next to the up-down scroll
buttons. I haven't seen the new scroller so not much I can comment on that.
I put a
Chris Vetter wrote:
[..]
or maybe better (IMHO) use it's own User Default,
[..]
Backed. If we want good support of themes, this should get its own
default. But this is a fundamental decision. Do you want lots of
defaults or do you want to be spare. The first case clutters up the code
and
Am 16.11.2006 um 10:37 schrieb Marc Brünink:
Do you want lots of defaults or do you want to be spare.
A typical case for an expert mode, right? Put a bunch of modifiers
into the code, bundle them into three or four choices in user visible
preferences. Experts will have to do a few extra
On 11/16/06, Marc Brünink [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
Because I really have faith in the intelligence of mankind
[...]
A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you
know it. -- Agent K
--
Chris
___
Discuss-gnustep
Marc Brünink wrote:
Chris Vetter wrote:
or maybe better (IMHO) use it's own User Default,
If we want good support of themes, this should get its own
default. But this is a fundamental decision. Do you want lots of
defaults or do you want to be spare. The first case clutters up the code
-defined themes, themes are created
elsewhere.
Then I advocate for B - it's easier to understand, easier to use,
and gives
the same power since user can create his own theme.
Experimentally, I Implemented right hand side scrollbars in the
'themes' branch in svn,
This is using
I think you'll find that the systems which have the scroll bar on the
right are also more than 10 years old. There may have been advances made
in GUI's in the last ten years, but the position of the scroll bar is
not one of them.
Hi all,
what do you think about a dragable ScrollView. By
know that
there are systems with right scrollbars that are more than 10 year
old? This is not a counter argument, you're only trying to shut me up.
Secondly, who are you to consider some new features are advances and
others not? You are definitely not objective.
I never said that left
stupid i didn't know that there
are systems with right scrollbars that are more than 10 year old? This
is not a counter argument, you're only trying to shut me up.
Secondly, who are you to consider some new features are advances and
others not? You are definitely not objective.
I never said
application,
but I'd like if it was able to blend nicely with the rest of the
environment. Themeing is not a problem, but the Scrollbars at the left,
although as a left handed I really like them, would be too different from
the rest of my (and most people's) desktop.
Is there any way to put the scrollbars
Easy: look for the tile method in gui/Source/NSScrollView.m (around line 870);
inside the if (_hasVertScroller) command, change the 2 occurences of
NSMinXEdge
into NSMaxXEdge. After make install, all apps that you run will have
right scrollers.
Oops, just realized that you also has to change
On 2006-11-15 17:57:28 +0100 Benhur Stein [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
[...]
Oops, just realized that you also has to change inside the if
(_hasVertScroller)
in the drawRect: method to change + scrollerWidth into - 1, so
that the
separation line is drawn in the right place.
If that really is
On 15 Nov 2006, at 17:10, Chris Vetter wrote:
On 2006-11-15 17:57:28 +0100 Benhur Stein [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
[...]
Oops, just realized that you also has to change inside the if
(_hasVertScroller)
in the drawRect: method to change + scrollerWidth into - 1, so
that the
separation line
with 'NSWindows95InterfaceStyle' or maybe better
(IMHO) use it's own User Default, in case you would want
'NSMacintoshInterfaceStyle' but still have the scrollbars to the
right.
--
Chris
___
Discuss-gnustep mailing list
Discuss-gnustep@gnu.org
http
, but the position of the scroll
bar is
not one of them.
First of all, do you really think i'm so stupid i didn't know that
there are systems with right scrollbars that are more than 10 year
old? This is not a counter argument, you're only trying to shut me up.
Hello,
Both
have a
particular preference.
I would suggest that, if you're so interested in having the scrollbars on the
right, that you write a theme which does this for Camaelon.
Later, GJC
I agree wholeheartedly with that comment.
I didn't think I was being aggressive or abusive, but then many
features being advances or
not, since you obviously have a particular preference.
I would suggest that, if you're so interested in having the
scrollbars on the right, that you write a theme which does this
for Camaelon.
Later, GJC
I agree wholeheartedly with that comment.
I didn't
with the rest of the environment. Themeing is not a problem, but the Scrollbars at the left, although as a left handed I really like them, would be too different from the rest of my (and most people's) desktop.
Is there any way to put the scrollbars to the right ? If there is not an easy way, is it hard
On Nov 14, 2006, at 5:54 AM, Alexandre Moreira wrote:
I'm thinking in using GnuStep's framework to develop a simple
application, but I'd like if it was able to blend nicely with the rest
of the environment. Themeing is not a problem, but the Scrollbars at
the left, although as a left handed
Adam Fedor wrote:
On Nov 14, 2006, at 5:54 AM, Alexandre Moreira wrote:
I'm thinking in using GnuStep's framework to develop a simple
application, but I'd like if it was able to blend nicely with the
rest of the environment. Themeing is not a problem, but the
Scrollbars at the left
pros and cons arguments, but in the end I
think it was decided that it's not where the project wants to go.
The main goal is to create a free implementation of NeXTSTEP/OPENSTEP,
which has the scrollbars on the left. In the last few months that
I've been using GNUstep, and software built for it, I've
. Since most GUI systems have scrollbars on the right, most people won't find the GNUstep choice a smart one. (i agree this goes back to OpenStep but this is dead actually).Furthermore, copying the OpenStep interface like it was in the 90's is absurd because it is assuming that in 10 years time
On Nov 14, 2006, at 9:29 AM, Marc Brünink wrote:
Oh, I didn't cc'ed my reply to the list. But you didn't miss anything
:-)
I wrote something about having a default to configure the side on
which the scrollbar is drawn. I think this would be handy as soon as
you display arabic text. And
, but the
Scrollbars at the left, although as a left handed I really like them,
would be too different from the rest of my (and most people's) desktop.
Is there any way to put the scrollbars to the right ? If there is not
an easy way, is it hard to patch it to make the scrollbars appear on
the right ? That way
and this is linked to the knowledge he already has of other systems.
Since most GUI systems have scrollbars on the right, most people won't
find the GNUstep choice a smart one. (i agree this goes back to
OpenStep but this is dead actually).
Furthermore, copying the OpenStep interface like
Am 06.09.2006 um 06:15 schrieb Rogelio M. Serrano Jr.:
if we could not agree where scrollbars should be then scrollbars
are bad
and i would rather not have them. same goes for the menubar.
While I agree with your wishes for a lean GUI, you are
oversimplifying here.
While some people
On 9/6/06, Markus Hitter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Am 06.09.2006 um 06:15 schrieb Rogelio M. Serrano Jr.:
if we could not agree where scrollbars should be then scrollbars
are bad
and i would rather not have them. same goes for the menubar.
While I agree with your wishes for a lean GUI, you
that.
thats the same reason why the mac have limited user installable parts.
and even less configurability in the gui. sure you can change themes
but you cant change the basic gui elements. like have the scrollbars and
menubars in different locations from one computer to the next.
less
On 9/7/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
really? it momentum thats sustaining it. and people who is unwilling to
find something new.
I think you will find that the average user, who is not a hacker or an
IT developer, will not find it acceptable to have to search for an
i dont make
On 2006-09-04 19:01:33 +0200 Andrew Sveikauskas
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
3. An option to not show the app icon.
[...]
This is already implemented.
You can set
GSSuppressAppIcon = *BY;
either on a per-application to suppress the application's miniwindow
OR in NSGlobalDomain to
On 5 Sep 2006, at 01:23, Andrew Ruder wrote:
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 09:34:04AM +1000, phil taylor wrote:
I am dissapointed that the GNUstep project is devoted to its UI
design.
I had hoped the most important aspect was the API, not the look
and feel
of the GUI. IT will never suit me. I
On 2006-09-05 13:52:25 +0200 Richard Frith-Macdonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
The perennial debate
about what's good/bad in a user interface is, IMO, just a waste of
everyones
time.
Amen to that.
Especially since any 5 people will have 6 or 7 different opinions on
what really IS
On 9/5/06, Chris Vetter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 2006-09-05 13:52:25 +0200 Richard Frith-Macdonald
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[...]
The perennial debate
about what's good/bad in a user interface is, IMO, just a waste of
everyones
time.
Amen to that.
Especially since any 5 people will
Am 05.09.2006 um 14:03 schrieb Rogelio Serrano:
isnt the extreme configurability going to
make the whole unwieldy?
The whole X Windows and Motif system is configurable down into the
smallest corner and most people live fine with this. The brilliant
API and open source nature of GNUstep
phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Please read the reasoning in this page before commenting further:
http://www120.pair.com/mccarthy/nextstep/intro.htmld/
Please read the reasoning in this page before commenting further: -
what a doozy of a comment. Everyone these days is
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: discuss-gnustep@gnu.org
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2006 5:22 AM
Subject: Re: scrollbars [was: Re: really attracting developers]
phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The many different ideas
less configurability in the gui. sure you can change themes
but you cant change the basic gui elements. like have the scrollbars and
menubars in different locations from one computer to the next.
less configurability is so much better. its when you have bad design
that you need customisations.
if we
are on the left after all, so usually
thats where your mouse is isn't it ? whats needed here is for people to
desiign apps to that the controls are placed well - you'd get the same
problem with right hand scrollbars if everything else was on the left.
window. This is not nice for right handers. Its nice
I'm also right handed,
but thats less important to me than the fact that I read text from left to
right - so I want my scrollbars at the start of the line, and hence the left.
Oh. Never thought about that. This is a point for the left side indeed.
I just observed that I always tend to move
http://www120.pair.com/mccarthy/nextstep/intro.htmld/
After reading this something occured to me. NeXTstep is very nice,
and via GNUstep I am well used to the way they do things. But a large
quantity of people (most?) who are newly exposed to GNUstep are not
looking to replace NeXTstep.
On 2006-09-04 13:01:33 -0400 Andrew Sveikauskas
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
So, it seems the situation is like this:
* Faction A loves GNUstep for its NeXT goodness
* Faction B thinks GNUstep is out of place and should play nice
with other
desktops.
* Probably some people believe both
On 2006-09-04 13:34:40 -0400 Charles Philip Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
2. An option that makes all NSPanels visible regardless of what
application
has focus. This would solve the other half of the GNUstep doesn't
work with
focus follows mouse problem.
The problem with this is that it
it looks odd to me largely due to it being different to the
usual paradigm with which I am familiar, but even taking that into
account it is still rather odd.
As to the scrollbars being on the left, I have no basic objection to
that, except to say that it makes sense to have the scroll bars
On Mon, 2006-09-04 at 13:01 -0400, Andrew Sveikauskas wrote:
http://www120.pair.com/mccarthy/nextstep/intro.htmld/
After reading this something occured to me. NeXTstep is very nice,
and via GNUstep I am well used to the way they do things. But a large
quantity of people (most?) who are
for.
As to the scrollbars being on the left, I have no basic objection to
that, except to say that it makes sense to have the scroll bars on the
same side as the close button, since those two operations happen most
frequently. You open the window, scroll the text to locate something,
then close
On Sep 5, 2006, at 24:38, phil taylor wrote:
Can anyone (try to) explain the merits of the floating menus?
You just need a single click and no drag to perform an arbitary
(menu) action. You can easily detach the menu groups you need and
thereby form some kind of favorite menus.
A
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 09:34:04AM +1000, phil taylor wrote:
I am dissapointed that the GNUstep project is devoted to its UI design.
I had hoped the most important aspect was the API, not the look and feel
of the GUI. IT will never suit me. I HATE menus, especially cascading
ones.
This is an
Am 05.09.2006 um 01:06 schrieb Pascal Bourguignon:
On NeXTSTEP, I just kept the menu out of screen, and configured the
right button to pop it up under the mouse.[...]
Clearly, a menu bar is silly.
Clearly, menus popping up where ever your mouse is, are silly. The
human eye and brain
On 9/5/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 2006-09-04 at 12:26 +0100, Pete French wrote:
to scroll down without a scrollwheel and without the keyboard I've to
cross half of the screen to reach the scrollbar on the left side of the
Can anyone (try to) explain the merits of the
On Mon, 2006-09-04 at 18:58 -0400, Charles Philip Chan wrote:
On 2006-09-04 18:46:26 -0400 phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Most if not all developers of other GUI s work on the assumption that
people like to vary the appearance of their desktops - even Micro$oft.
Skin deep
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 01:06 +0200, Pascal Bourguignon wrote:
phil taylor writes:
I hardly see how anyone can believe that the dangling menu looks better.
I suppose it looks odd to me largely due to it being different to the
usual paradigm with which I am familiar, but even taking that into
On Mon, 2006-09-04 at 19:23 -0500, Andrew Ruder wrote:
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 09:34:04AM +1000, phil taylor wrote:
I am dissapointed that the GNUstep project is devoted to its UI design.
I had hoped the most important aspect was the API, not the look and feel
of the GUI. IT will never suit
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 03:28 +0100, Nicolas Roard wrote:
On 9/5/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 00:51 +0200, Helge Hess wrote:
On Sep 5, 2006, at 24:38, phil taylor wrote:
Can anyone (try to) explain the merits of the floating menus?
You just need a
On 2006-09-05 00:35:58 -0400 phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Take the case of the side by side lists used to browse the directory
structure within GNUstep. Its the most functional and easiest method I
have ever come across for directory browsing.
Yes, browser (column) view is great.
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 12:38 +0800, Rogelio Serrano wrote:
On 9/5/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 03:21 +0200, Markus Hitter wrote:
Am 05.09.2006 um 01:06 schrieb Pascal Bourguignon:
you have the source go ahead and create another ui.
Im over fifty.
On 9/5/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 12:38 +0800, Rogelio Serrano wrote:
On 9/5/06, phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 03:21 +0200, Markus Hitter wrote:
Am 05.09.2006 um 01:06 schrieb Pascal Bourguignon:
you have the source go
On 2006-09-05 00:47:45 -0400 phil taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Besides, if I did i would get all these jerks on the mailing list
telling me that I had stuffed up the user interface - who wants to put
up with that!!!
Ha, ha. I have no problems discussing different GUI's, although I
prefer
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