Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread David Cournapeau
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:36 PM, Justin Cappos jcap...@nyu.edu wrote: I am no expert, but I don't understand why backtracking algorithms would to be faster than SAT, since they both potentially need to walk over the full set of possible solutions. It is hard to reason about the cost because

[Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread David Mertz
I've just started monitoring this SIG to get a sense of the issues and status of things. I've also just started working for Continuum Analytics. Continuum has a great desire to make 'pip' work with conda packages. Obviously, we love for users to choose the Anaconda Python distribution but many

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread Daniel Holth
On May 16, 2015 11:22 AM, David Cournapeau courn...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:36 PM, Justin Cappos jcap...@nyu.edu wrote: I am no expert, but I don't understand why backtracking algorithms would to be faster than SAT, since they both potentially need to walk over the full

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Paul Moore
On 16 May 2015 at 20:04, David Mertz dme...@continuum.io wrote: What would be better as a user experience would be to let users do this: % pip install --upgrade pip % pip install some_conda_package Whether that second command ultimately downloads code from pyip.python.org or from

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 12:04 PM, David Mertz dme...@continuum.io wrote: Continuum has a great desire to make 'pip' work with conda packages. Obviously, we love for users to choose the Anaconda Python distribution but many will not for a variety of reasons (many good reasons). Hmm -- this

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Paul Moore
On 16 May 2015 at 20:04, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: I was referring to the SetDllDirectory API. I don't think that gets picked up by other processes. from: https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms686203%28v=vs.85%29.aspx It looks like you can add a path,

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 11:35 PM, David Cournapeau courn...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:56 AM, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: But in short -- I'm pretty sure there is a way, on all systems, to have a standard way to build extension modules, combined with a standard

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 17 May 2015 at 00:36, Justin Cappos jcap...@nyu.edu wrote: This only considers computation cost though. Other factors can become more expensive than computation. For example, SAT solvers need all the rules to consider. So a SAT solution needs to effectively download the full dependency

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:13 AM, Paul Moore p.f.mo...@gmail.com wrote: Though it's a lot harder to provide a build environment than just the lib to link too .. Im going to have to think more about that... It seems to me that the end user doesn't really have a problem here (pip install

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread Justin Cappos
I am no expert, but I don't understand why backtracking algorithms would to be faster than SAT, since they both potentially need to walk over the full set of possible solutions. It is hard to reason about the cost because the worst case is in theory growing exponentially in both cases. This

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 10:12 AM, Nick Coghlan ncogh...@gmail.com wrote: Maybe, but it's a problem to be solved, and the Linux distros more or less solve it for us, but OS-X and Windows have no such system built in (OS-X does have Brew and macports) Windows 10 has Chocalatey and

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread David Cournapeau
On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 12:40 AM, Daniel Holth dho...@gmail.com wrote: On May 16, 2015 11:22 AM, David Cournapeau courn...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:36 PM, Justin Cappos jcap...@nyu.edu wrote: I am no expert, but I don't understand why backtracking algorithms

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
On May 16, 2015, at 1:24 PM, Nick Coghlan ncogh...@gmail.com wrote: On 17 May 2015 at 00:36, Justin Cappos jcap...@nyu.edu wrote: This only considers computation cost though. Other factors can become more expensive than computation. For example, SAT solvers need all the rules to

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Paul Moore
On 16 May 2015 at 19:40, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: With 2., you still have the issue of DLL hell, could you clarify a bit -- I thought that this could, at least, put a dir on the search path that was specific to that python context. So it would require cooperation among all

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 11:54 AM, Paul Moore p.f.mo...@gmail.com wrote: could you clarify a bit -- I thought that this could, at least, put a dir on the search path that was specific to that python context. So it would require cooperation among all the packages being used at once, but not

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Sébastien Douche
On Fri, 15 May 2015, at 15:48, Donald Stufft wrote: Hey! Hi Donald Ideally I hope people start to use ReadTheDocs instead of PyPI itself. +1. Do you want to use the python.org domain (ex. pypi.python.org/docs) or keep RTD on it own domain? -- Sébastien Douche s...@nmeos.net Twitter:

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 15 May 2015 at 04:01, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: I'm confused -- you don't want a system to be able to install ONE version of a lib that various python packages can all link to? That's really the key use-case for me Are we talking about Python libraries accessed

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
On May 16, 2015, at 3:04 PM, David Mertz dme...@continuum.io wrote: I've just started monitoring this SIG to get a sense of the issues and status of things. I've also just started working for Continuum Analytics. Continuum has a great desire to make 'pip' work with conda packages.

Re: [Distutils] PyPI is a sick sick hoarder

2015-05-16 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 16 May 2015 at 11:52, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 16 May 2015 at 13:45, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: On May 15, 2015, at 9:22 PM, Robert Collins robe...@robertcollins.net wrote: On 16 May 2015 at 11:08, Marcus Smith qwc...@gmail.com wrote: Why not start

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 17 May 2015 06:19, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: indeed -- but it does have a bunch of python-specific featuresit was built around the need to combine python with other systems. That makes it an interesting alternative to pip on the package *consumption* side for data

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread David Cournapeau
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:56 AM, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 1:49 AM, Paul Moore p.f.mo...@gmail.com wrote: On 14 May 2015 at 19:01, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: Ah -- here is the issue -- but I think we HAVE pretty much got what we need

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 16 May 2015 at 04:34, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: So I can’t speak for ReadTheDocs, but I believe that they are considering and/or are planning on offering arbitrary HTML uploads similarly to how you can upload documentation to PyPI. I don’t know if this will actually happen and

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Wes Turner
On May 16, 2015 4:55 AM, Nick Coghlan ncogh...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 May 2015 at 04:34, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: So I can’t speak for ReadTheDocs, but I believe that they are considering and/or are planning on offering arbitrary HTML uploads similarly to how you can upload

Re: [Distutils] Dynamic linking between Python modules (was: Beyond wheels 1.0: helping downstream, FHS and more)

2015-05-16 Thread Paul Moore
On 16 May 2015 at 07:35, David Cournapeau courn...@gmail.com wrote: But in short -- I'm pretty sure there is a way, on all systems, to have a standard way to build extension modules, combined with a standard way to install shared libs, so that a lib can be shared among multiple packages. So

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
Ok, so unless someone comes out against this in the near future here are my plans: 1. Implement the ability to delete documentation. 2. Implement the ability to add a (simple) redirect where we would essentially just send /project/(.*) to $REDIRECT_BASE/$1. 3. Implement the ability to point

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:16 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: There are a few other benefits, but that’s not anything that are inherent in the two different approaches, it’s just things that conda has that pip is

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
On May 16, 2015, at 8:50 PM, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:16 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io mailto:don...@stufft.io wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io mailto:don...@stufft.io wrote: There are a few other

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Ben Finney
Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io writes: Ok, so unless someone comes out against this in the near future here are my plans: 1. Implement the ability to delete documentation. +1. 2. Implement the ability to add a (simple) redirect where we would essentially just send /project/(.*) to

Re: [Distutils] PyPI and Uploading Documentation

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
On May 16, 2015, at 9:31 PM, Ben Finney ben+pyt...@benfinney.id.au wrote: Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io writes: Ok, so unless someone comes out against this in the near future here are my plans: 1. Implement the ability to delete documentation. +1. 2. Implement the ability to

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Donald Stufft
On May 16, 2015, at 7:09 PM, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io mailto:don...@stufft.io wrote: There are a few other benefits, but that’s not anything that are inherent in the two different approaches, it’s just

Re: [Distutils] Making pip and PyPI work with conda packages

2015-05-16 Thread Chris Barker
On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Donald Stufft don...@stufft.io wrote: There are a few other benefits, but that’s not anything that are inherent in the two different approaches, it’s just things that conda has that pip is planning on getting, Huh? I'm confused -- didn't we just have a big