solving fixture data conflicts

2008-03-03 Thread Evan H. Carmi
Hi, I am trying to loaddata from a file, bmdata.xml and getting an error: Problem installing fixture 'bmdata.xml': duplicate key violates unique constraint "django_content_type_app_label_key" I understand that there is a conflict in the fixture data. However, I don't know how to solve it. I

Re: Django on a shared host

2008-03-03 Thread Amit Ramon
I'm aware I'm a bit late :-), but here is a link to detailed instructions for setting up django on a shared host (site5 in this case): http://forums.site5.com/showthread.php?t=10236 --- Amit * Snoop1990 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-02-27 08:07 -0800]: > > Hey, > I am new to django (coming from

Re: How to get Model from object?

2008-03-03 Thread bob ning
mymodel_obj.__class__ On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Hugh Bien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In Python, you can always get a class from an object using the built-in > 'type' method: > type(mymodel_obj) > > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Davide.D <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > class

Re: revert database migration

2008-03-03 Thread stranger
Ok thank you found the answer. "Django will look for any new models that have been defined, and add a database table to represent those new models." So how about the django evolution. Is it fine to use it to track changes in django models and make database migrations. It is very sad that django

Re: revert database migration

2008-03-03 Thread stranger
Hi James, I have been following you blog for a very long time. Good posts. Awaiting you django projects book t... After searching this group archive i didnot find much regarding my question? I think django should automatically make the changes in the model. I have added a new model

Re: apache prefork or worker? other settings

2008-03-03 Thread Graham Dumpleton
On Mar 4, 11:44 am, Corey Oordt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Aljosa, > > The docs are really good. > (http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/modpython/ > ) I can attest that you should definitely use prefork instead of > worker. I was getting random crashes on our server until I realized >

Re: How to get Model from object?

2008-03-03 Thread Hugh Bien
In Python, you can always get a class from an object using the built-in 'type' method: type(mymodel_obj) On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Davide.D <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > class MyModel(models.Model): >... >... > > How to get MyModel from mymodel_obj? > > Thanks! > > >

Re: Multiple form instances in context (newforms)

2008-03-03 Thread Steve Potter
I did run across that post, at it does give some valuable information. However, I am still having a little bit of an issue figuring out how to handle the instance creation. The biggest thing is that I am using generic views and I am passing a large queryset Site.objects.all() and the generic

How to get Model from object?

2008-03-03 Thread Davide.D
class MyModel(models.Model): ... ... How to get MyModel from mymodel_obj? Thanks! --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to

Re: Multiple form instances in context (newforms)

2008-03-03 Thread Michael
This blog post recently really helped me out with figuring this out: http://collingrady.com/2008/02/18/editing-multiple-objects-in-django-with-newforms/ It actually is amazingly simple once you get what is going on. On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 5:23 PM, Steve Potter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >

Is there a better way to design my model?

2008-03-03 Thread jeffself
I'm working on a project where I've identified the following classes: class FiscalYear(models.Model): fyear = models.CharField(max_length=6, unique=True) startdate = models.DateField() enddate = models.DateField() class System(models.Model): system_number =

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Jeff Anderson
Manoj Govindan wrote: Is there a way to check out the latest version of Django code using the svn+ssh mechanism? svn co svn+ssh://code.djangoproject.com/svn/django/trunk/django Another solution that you could do is ssh to a site outside of the proxy, do the svn checkout on the remote host,

Re: Are there filter/query equivalents to accomplish 'group by' operations?

2008-03-03 Thread davenaff
Tim, This was super helpful. Thanks for the guidance. For anyone that finds this via search, I'd also recommend reading here: http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/db-api/#chaining-filters Dave On Feb 29, 5:52 am, Tim Chase <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > A few classes (sorry for the

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Reed Bailey
thank you, I'll give those a look On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 21:41 +0200, Christos Τrochalakis wrote: > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 6:26 PM, Reed Bailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 15:02 +0200, Christos Τrochalakis wrote: > > > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Malcolm

Re: HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread bobhaugen
On Mar 3, 5:00 pm, Malcolm Tredinnick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Terminal says: > > [03/Mar/2008 16:16:27] "GET /addorder/results HTTP/1.1" 200 898 > > This means you're not hitting the redirect line. The HTTP status code > for a redirect is 302, whereas this is showing a 200 response, which

Re: apache prefork or worker? other settings

2008-03-03 Thread Corey Oordt
Aljosa, The docs are really good. ( http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/modpython/ ) I can attest that you should definitely use prefork instead of worker. I was getting random crashes on our server until I realized that one of my admins installed worker. Switching to prefork

What do you think about http://www.parallelimportsworld.com?

2008-03-03 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]
What do you think about http://www.parallelimportsworld.com? --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-users@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe

Re: mod_wsgi & trailing slashes on urls

2008-03-03 Thread Graham Dumpleton
On Mar 4, 4:19 am, Matt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello group, > > I'm having some problems understanding the URL setup for mod_wsgi. The > documentation at [1] is excellent, but all of the examples of the > Apache configuration have a trailing slash appended to the Alias. Did you also read:

Re: HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread Brian Luft
Take a look at your url patterns. Your first one is: (r'^addorder/', add_order), so 'addorder/results' is going to match to your first url pattern (so would 'addorder/mydogspot' for that matter). The view to be executed will be add_order. Cheers -Brian On Mar 3, 2:27 pm, bobhaugen <[EMAIL

Re: Flatpages

2008-03-03 Thread bfrederi
The one that is throwing the error is "0.97-pre-SVN-6430" the other one that is working is "0.97-pre-SVN-7027" I am in the process of updating the server throwing the error to the trunk version of Django. I've just got to make sure everything is going to work first on my development server. I'll

Re: HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread bobhaugen
On Mar 3, 4:50 pm, Evert Rol <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Not 100% sure, but try adding a $ at the end of your regexes, to > indicate there's nothing after the url. That was the secret! Thanks alot. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are

Re: Form for model: how to inline-edit associated objects within the same form?

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 14:23 -0800, Berco Beute wrote: > I want to create a form for editing existing Poll objects and their > associated Choice objects (see below). Editing the Poll objects is no > problem, the 'name' textfield shows up nicely. But I also want to edit > the associated Choice

Re: HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 14:27 -0800, bobhaugen wrote: > Yet another n00b problem...I'm sure I got another stupid mistake in > here, but can't see it. Tried many variations. > > I cut this down to a simple example that reproduces the problem (the > real thing is a lot more complex), and only

Re: Flatpages

2008-03-03 Thread Michael
In your templates folder create a 404.html file. This should solve your problems. I read that there needs to be a 404.html and 500.html file somewhere but can't find the link to point you to it. On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 3:20 PM, Lewis Bergman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > If the configs are

Re: HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread Evert Rol
> > > # urls.py > > urlpatterns = patterns('', >(r'^addorder/', add_order), >(r'^addorder/results/', results), > ) Not 100% sure, but try adding a $ at the end of your regexes, to indicate there's nothing after the url. Django now finds the r'^addorder/' also for the url

HttpResponseRedirect not redirecting

2008-03-03 Thread bobhaugen
Yet another n00b problem...I'm sure I got another stupid mistake in here, but can't see it. Tried many variations. I cut this down to a simple example that reproduces the problem (the real thing is a lot more complex), and only included the relevant details here. Running django-trunk on Ubuntu

Form for model: how to inline-edit associated objects within the same form?

2008-03-03 Thread Berco Beute
I want to create a form for editing existing Poll objects and their associated Choice objects (see below). Editing the Poll objects is no problem, the 'name' textfield shows up nicely. But I also want to edit the associated Choice objects with the same form (much like you can do on the

Multiple form instances in context (newforms)

2008-03-03 Thread Steve Potter
I am in the process of building a replacement admin change_list for one of my models. My goal is to allow some of the more common fields to be edited on the change_list page as opposed to having to click on each individual to make changes. So, I have a basic model: class Site(models.Model):

Problem with EmailMultiAlternatives and attachments

2008-03-03 Thread Francis
Hi, I tried to use the EmailMultiAlternatives to send an email in html and a text. I also want to include a file to this email. But the later seems to erase my html content. Here is my code : msg = EmailMultiAlternatives(subject, html2text(html_content), list(email_from), list(email_to),

Re: Issue With ExecuteMany

2008-03-03 Thread Alex Ezell
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 12:46 PM, Malcolm Tredinnick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 11:44 -0600, Alex Ezell wrote: > > I am getting a TypeError when using the executemany() method of the db > cursor. > > > > I'm not sure if this is a problem with psycopg2 or the DB

Re: Flatpages

2008-03-03 Thread Lewis Bergman
If the configs are nearly identical, do a diff and see what *is* the difference between the two? Are the two running the same django versions? bfrederi wrote: > I am using flatpages on a production box, and whenever I don't set > DEBUG to True in the settings.py file, the middleware won't

Re: Getting at order_by column values easily in queryset-refactor?

2008-03-03 Thread Matt Hoskins
> It's more than a preference and it's very important to realise that. It > is not possible for it to work unless you pick a behaviour arbitrarily. > Suppose you have the following objects: I don't think I've ever said anything about preferences (apologies if I had). It is, IMHO, a design choice

Flatpages

2008-03-03 Thread bfrederi
I am using flatpages on a production box, and whenever I don't set DEBUG to True in the settings.py file, the middleware won't redirect to my flatpages for some reason. It gives me a 'TemplateDoesNotExist: 404.html' error message. It works perfectly fine on another box, and the setup for both

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Christos Τrochalakis
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 6:26 PM, Reed Bailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 15:02 +0200, Christos Τrochalakis wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Malcolm Tredinnick > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 01:45 -0800, Manoj

Re: Issue With ExecuteMany

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 11:44 -0600, Alex Ezell wrote: > I am getting a TypeError when using the executemany() method of the db cursor. > > I'm not sure if this is a problem with psycopg2 or the DB backend in > Django. The first step would seem to be to resolve that issue. Remove Django from

Re: Problem with compiling django.po file

2008-03-03 Thread Alexey Moskvin
Thanks for quick reply, Malcolm. Now anything is ok. On 3 мар, 21:12, Malcolm Tredinnick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 10:04 -0800, Alexey Moskvin wrote: > > Hi! I am trying to compile django.po file for Russian language from > > HEAD django revision using

Re: Upgrade to development version - Admin no longer works

2008-03-03 Thread merric
Thanks James, I'll have a look. On Mar 3, 4:50 pm, "James Bennett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 10:29 AM, merric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > There is no VIEW called "help_no_cookies" in the promotions.views > > module. Should there be? > > You apparently have an old

Re: sxsw anyone?

2008-03-03 Thread rezzrovv
Have gone for several years but not this year. If you are going for the music, plan ahead. Seriously, it hurts because you have to make choices as to what you can attend because you are sure to find contradictions in your calendar. In years past I had set up semi- elaborate google calendars

Re: cannot set cache keys

2008-03-03 Thread merric
The problem seems to be with LOCMEM. I changed the CACHE_BACKEND setting to a DB and cache worked fine. In LOCMEM the cache seem to get set OK, but then cannot be retrieved correctly. I don't get any error messages, it just doesn't want to work. I tried this on two different machines, one

Re: OR lookups on m2m relations fail

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 10:17 -0800, omat wrote: > Hi, > > Suppose 'categories' is the name of a ManyToMany field in our model > (with blank=True). > > Q(name = 'test') | Q(categories__title = 'xyz') > > fails to match the instance with name = 'test' if the instance is not > related to any

OR lookups on m2m relations fail

2008-03-03 Thread omat
Hi, Suppose 'categories' is the name of a ManyToMany field in our model (with blank=True). Q(name = 'test') | Q(categories__title = 'xyz') fails to match the instance with name = 'test' if the instance is not related to any category. This seems like a bug. Any ideas? Thanks, oMat

Re: Problem with compiling django.po file

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 10:04 -0800, Alexey Moskvin wrote: > Hi! I am trying to compile django.po file for Russian language from > HEAD django revision using bin/compile-messages.py, but there is such > error: > > processing file django.po in locale\locale\ru\LC_MESSAGES >

Problem with compiling django.po file

2008-03-03 Thread Alexey Moskvin
Hi! I am trying to compile django.po file for Russian language from HEAD django revision using bin/compile-messages.py, but there is such error: processing file django.po in locale\locale\ru\LC_MESSAGES locale\locale\ru\LC_MESSAGES\django.po:1649: a format specification for argu ment 'counter'

Re: Getting at order_by column values easily in queryset-refactor?

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 06:04 -0800, Matt Hoskins wrote: > > Having read this again in light of your complaint in #6701, I should > > point out that it's not going to work like this if you're always > > filtering on Contract. > > Not really a complaint in #6701 - you didn't say at first that you

Re: Admin Site Searching

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Sun, 2008-03-02 at 10:03 -0800, Lee Connell wrote: > I have configured my django admin site to allow searching. My > question is when a user logs in and chooses the table they wish to > make changes to, it automatically queries ALL data and then gives the > ability to search. Is there an

Issue With ExecuteMany

2008-03-03 Thread Alex Ezell
I am getting a TypeError when using the executemany() method of the db cursor. I'm not sure if this is a problem with psycopg2 or the DB backend in Django. I am using the psycopg2_postgresql backend directly via the django.db.connection. This is the code which I am trying to get working: def

mod_wsgi & trailing slashes on urls

2008-03-03 Thread Matt
Hello group, I'm having some problems understanding the URL setup for mod_wsgi. The documentation at [1] is excellent, but all of the examples of the Apache configuration have a trailing slash appended to the Alias. In my experience, that means that /my_app/foo results in a 404. All of my

Re: Upgrade to development version - Admin no longer works

2008-03-03 Thread James Bennett
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 10:29 AM, merric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > There is no VIEW called "help_no_cookies" in the promotions.views > module. Should there be? You apparently have an old URL pattern somewhere in your project which tries to reference such a view; previously this was not an

Re: Upgrade to development version - Admin no longer works

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 08:29 -0800, merric wrote: > I've just tried updating to the latest development version and the > admin no longer works. I get the following message whenever I try to > access a DB via the admin: [...] > There is no VIEW called "help_no_cookies" in the promotions.views >

Upgrade to development version - Admin no longer works

2008-03-03 Thread merric
I've just tried updating to the latest development version and the admin no longer works. I get the following message whenever I try to access a DB via the admin: ViewDoesNotExist at /admin/ Tried help_no_cookies in module promotions.views. Error was: 'module' object has no attribute

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Reed Bailey
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 15:02 +0200, Christos Τrochalakis wrote: > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Malcolm Tredinnick > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 01:45 -0800, Manoj Govindan wrote: > > > Is there a way to check out the latest version of Django code using > > >

sxsw anyone?

2008-03-03 Thread Peter Baumgartner
Anyone here going to SXSW? It'll be my first trip this year and anyone that wants to meet up or impart some wisdom on me regarding the event would be great. -- Pete --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups

Re: Admin Site Searching

2008-03-03 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hi Lee, On Mar 3, 1:22 pm, Lee Connell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Anyone? Are you using newforms-admin? I think that this would be possible under that branch. I can't speak for trunk, however. Regards, Felix --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message

RE: has "newforms-admin" branch been integrated?

2008-03-03 Thread Niklas Collin
Point taken, James. You're absolutely right. I should have checked there first. Will do better in the future. Niklas > -Original Message- > From: django-users@googlegroups.com > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Bennett > Sent: den 3 mars 2008 08:50 > To:

Re: cannot set cache keys

2008-03-03 Thread merric
On futher testing I am getting some very weird results. On occasions the cache key seems to get created, but expires almost immediately, so the next time through the "cache_working" returns to "NO". --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you

LDAP Auth and Groups

2008-03-03 Thread Thomas Guettler
Hi, I had a look at the LDAP Auth Backend. [1] It works for authentication, but groups are not supported yet. The user information gets copied from LDAP to the database. You could use the same method for groups, too. But when should changes in LDAP be copied to the django database? 1. If a

Re: Getting at order_by column values easily in queryset-refactor?

2008-03-03 Thread Matt Hoskins
> Having read this again in light of your complaint in #6701, I should > point out that it's not going to work like this if you're always > filtering on Contract. Not really a complaint in #6701 - you didn't say at first that you were going to remove support for m2m order_by, so I was concerned

Re: Is there a ModelChoiceField() HTML widget that accepts typing?

2008-03-03 Thread Adam Stein
Thanks. I'll check it out when I get a chance. On Sat, 2008-03-01 at 06:53 -0800, Zack wrote: > Check this out: http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/AJAXWidgetComboBox > > If it doesn't suit your needs you can make your own widget and then > tell your form field to render itself using your

Generic Views: Variable Table Columns

2008-03-03 Thread Darryl Ross
Hey All, I'm using the generic views and trying to build a HTML table where both the rows and columns are generated dynamically. Simplified example follows. I am having a problem though in that I can't work out if it is possible to reference an attribute of a model using a template variable.

Re: Admin Site Searching

2008-03-03 Thread Lee Connell
Anyone? --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-users@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For

cannot set cache keys

2008-03-03 Thread merric
I can't get cache to work inside a view. Can anybody point out where I'm going wrong In my settings file I have the following:- CACHE_BACKEND = 'locmem:///' The view is as follows:- def offers(request): from django.core.cache import cache cache_time=60*60*24 cache_name = "offers"

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Christos Τrochalakis
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Malcolm Tredinnick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 01:45 -0800, Manoj Govindan wrote: > > Is there a way to check out the latest version of Django code using > > the svn+ssh mechanism? > > svn co

Re: has "newforms-admin" branch been integrated?

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 08:48 +0100, Niklas Collin wrote: > Hi! > > I was wondering if (and I quote the manual chapter 17 ;) the > "newforms-admin"-branch has been integrated yet? No, it hasn't. Please don't hijack other threads to start your own topic. Start a new thread. Otherwise, it messes

Re: Getting at order_by column values easily in queryset-refactor?

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 02:30 -0800, Matt Hoskins wrote: > In my application I have a component for displaying paged sorted > tables of objects. Sometimes it's relevant for a column to show > information from a related object. In some cases it's relevant for the > column to show information from

Re: python singletons

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 02:12 -0800, Thierry wrote: > Implementing a singleton is slightly different in python. > When you create a singleton it actually ends up remembering state > across requests. > I tried several on this list: > http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?PythonSingleton > > So if i have a groups

Re: Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Malcolm Tredinnick
On Mon, 2008-03-03 at 01:45 -0800, Manoj Govindan wrote: > Is there a way to check out the latest version of Django code using > the svn+ssh mechanism? > svn co svn+ssh://code.djangoproject.com/svn/django/trunk/django No, there isn't. Regards, Malcolm -- Always try to be modest and be proud

Re: Adding custom fields to M2M relationship

2008-03-03 Thread Russell Keith-Magee
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 8:07 PM, Mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hi > > New to django, and I was wondering if there is anyway of adding custom > fields to M2M relationships in the model? > > For example I have two tables source and destinations, and a M2M mapping > between them. I would

Adding custom fields to M2M relationship

2008-03-03 Thread Mat
Hi New to django, and I was wondering if there is anyway of adding custom fields to M2M relationships in the model? For example I have two tables source and destinations, and a M2M mapping between them. I would like to add a order field (int) to show which order to list the destinations in,

Getting at order_by column values easily in queryset-refactor?

2008-03-03 Thread Matt Hoskins
In my application I have a component for displaying paged sorted tables of objects. Sometimes it's relevant for a column to show information from a related object. In some cases it's relevant for the column to show information from related objects where the related objects are related via a many

python singletons

2008-03-03 Thread Thierry
Implementing a singleton is slightly different in python. When you create a singleton it actually ends up remembering state across requests. I tried several on this list: http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?PythonSingleton So if i have a groups list and i append to it, for every request to the server i have

Checking out Django using svn+ssh

2008-03-03 Thread Manoj Govindan
Is there a way to check out the latest version of Django code using the svn+ssh mechanism? svn co svn+ssh://code.djangoproject.com/svn/django/trunk/django I am obliged to do this as the proxy server I rely on (but do not control) is not configured to recognise the necessary HTTP methods such as

Downlaod Free Softwares

2008-03-03 Thread Softwares
Downlaod Free Softwares Click here http://softwares8501.blogspot.com/ --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-users@googlegroups.com To