Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss
On 8/7/21 3:17 am, Jonathan Kamens via dmarc-discuss wrote: It's not useful to come back and say, "Well, I mean, if they did things differently, then this wouldn't be an issue." They're not doing things differently, and they don't want to do things differently. It's our job to facilitate them

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss
On 8/7/21 2:11 am, Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss wrote: > A mailbox provider is only one of the service providers that an organisation > might contract to send email on its behalf. Other common examples include: > > * Marketing automation (list management, sending mailouts, analytics)

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread John Levine via dmarc-discuss
It appears that Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss said: >I see. I note that the examples you mention, except some kind of marketing, >need to receive mail, besides sending it. Indeed, being bidirectional is a >peculiar email characteristics. So, if a service can be integrated with a

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Jonathan Kamens via dmarc-discuss
On 7/7/21 2:11 PM, Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss wrote: On Wed 07/Jul/2021 15:19:35 +0200 Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss wrote: A mailbox provider is only one of the service providers that an organisation might contract to send email on its behalf. Other common examples include:   *

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss
On Wed 07/Jul/2021 15:19:35 +0200 Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss wrote: On 7/7/21 4:03 pm, Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss wrote: If I outsourced my mail to google (to stick to the example) what other providers' SPF record do I have to include? Oh yes, John said "to several providers".

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss
On 7/7/21 4:03 pm, Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss wrote: If I outsourced my mail to google (to stick to the example) what other providers' SPF record do I have to include? Oh yes, John said "to several providers". Why does one need more than one provider, then? A mailbox provider is

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-07 Thread Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss
On Wed 07/Jul/2021 07:33:57 +0200 Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss wrote: On 7/7/21 2:57 am, John Levine via dmarc-discuss wrote: It appears that Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss said: I'd suggest that a resolution to this might be to expand the finite limit (I've also had trouble with the

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-06 Thread Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss
On 7/7/21 2:57 am, John Levine via dmarc-discuss wrote: It appears that Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss said: >> I'd suggest that a resolution to this might be to expand the finite limit (I've >> also had trouble with the 10 lookup limit, even for a small organisation), > >Why do

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-06 Thread John Levine via dmarc-discuss
It appears that Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss said: >> I'd suggest that a resolution to this might be to expand the finite limit >> (I've >> also had trouble with the 10 lookup limit, even for a small organisation), > >Why do organizations need more than 10 lookups? Do they have a

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-06 Thread Alessandro Vesely via dmarc-discuss
On Tue 06/Jul/2021 02:55:23 +0200 Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss wrote: On 22/5/21 7:41 am, Brandon Long via dmarc-discuss wrote: At least at one point we definitely saw enough senders requiring too many lookups that we cared more about trying to find a positive evaluation than downside from

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-07-05 Thread Roland Turner via dmarc-discuss
On 22/5/21 7:41 am, Brandon Long via dmarc-discuss wrote: I think the limits in the RFC are overly restrictive... as a receiver, I don't see any issue with having a much higher limit, you waste fairly minimal resources in that regard... there may be an issue in the large as a DoS type attack,

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-05-21 Thread Brandon Long via dmarc-discuss
On Wed, May 19, 2021 at 1:08 PM John Levine via dmarc-discuss < dmarc-discuss@dmarc.org> wrote: > It appears that Alexander NAZARIAN via dmarc-discuss < > alexander.nazar...@gmail.com> said: > >So I want to understand whether having MX placed in the beginning of SPF > >record can cause a quicker

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-05-19 Thread John Levine via dmarc-discuss
It appears that Alexander NAZARIAN via dmarc-discuss said: >So I want to understand whether having MX placed in the beginning of SPF >record can cause a quicker reach of '10 DNS lookup limitation' for G Suite >senders, due to the reason that G Suite has 5 MX records (and I assume that >number of

Re: [dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-05-19 Thread Matthäus Wander via dmarc-discuss
Alexander NAZARIAN via dmarc-discuss wrote on 2021-05-18 20:40: Different online SPF checkers show different results. > [...] > So, looks that mailbox providers count MX mechanism as 1 lookup (no matter how many hostnames MX record resolves to) and dmarcanalyzer.com

[dmarc-discuss] Correct counting of DNS lookups for SPF record containing MX mechanism

2021-05-18 Thread Alexander NAZARIAN via dmarc-discuss
Greetings. I have a dummy domain for DNS records testing - 'edrc.top', with the following SPF test record: v=spf1 mx ptr include:_spf.google.com include:spf.smtp2go.com -all What would be the correct number of DNS lookups (queries) that will be performed during SPF record parsing at the time of