Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
On 12/15/21 16:58, aitor wrote: Hi Steve, On 16/12/21 1:09, Steve Litt wrote: I'm not so sure. We're hearing anecdotes of people running Firefox with only ALSA. Perhaps there's some secret magic incantation that we don't yet know about. FF needs to be compiled passing the flag: ac_add_options --enable-alsa I removed pulseaudio, apulse and libpulse0, and the sound is working for me. Cheers, Aitor. I don't think I'm up for compiling firefox from source. And it would have to be recompiled every time mozilla releases a new version. Marc ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
On 12/15/21 18:32, Gregory Nowak via Dng wrote: On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 03:34:09PM -0800, Marc Shapiro via Dng wrote: Installed apulse. Still no sound in firefox, or xine. Simply installing apulse doesn't mean applications will start using it. You need to use /usr/bin/apulse as a wrapper around every application you want to use it. Sounds tedious, but once you either write a shell script, or modify a desktop shortcut to call the application in question (I.E. /usr/bin/apulse your_application_binary), you can run the application as usual from then on. Greg I understand that. I started firefox with: apulse /path/to/firefox Marc ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 03:34:09PM -0800, Marc Shapiro via Dng wrote: > Installed apulse. Still no sound in firefox, or xine. Simply installing apulse doesn't mean applications will start using it. You need to use /usr/bin/apulse as a wrapper around every application you want to use it. Sounds tedious, but once you either write a shell script, or modify a desktop shortcut to call the application in question (I.E. /usr/bin/apulse your_application_binary), you can run the application as usual from then on. Greg -- web site: http://www.gregn.net gpg public key: http://www.gregn.net/pubkey.asc skype: gregn1 (authorization required, add me to your contacts list first) If we haven't been in touch before, e-mail me before adding me to your contacts. -- Free domains: http://www.eu.org/ or mail dns-mana...@eu.org ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
Hi Steve, On 16/12/21 1:09, Steve Litt wrote: I'm not so sure. We're hearing anecdotes of people running Firefox with only ALSA. Perhaps there's some secret magic incantation that we don't yet know about. FF needs to be compiled passing the flag: ac_add_options --enable-alsa I removed pulseaudio, apulse and libpulse0, and the sound is working for me. Cheers, Aitor. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
Marc Shapiro via Dng said on Wed, 15 Dec 2021 15:34:09 -0800 >On 12/14/21 17:00, Steve Litt wrote: >> Marc Shapiro via Dng said on Tue, 14 Dec 2021 14:09:31 -0800 >> [snip] >> Have you power cycled yet? >Thanks for reminding me! > >Powered down and rebooted. No sound in Firefox, or xine. > >Installed apulse. Still no sound in firefox, or xine. > >Re-installed pulseaudio. Sound is back. > >Uninstalled pulseaudio. Reinstalled pipewire. No sound. > >Uninstalled pipewire. Reinstalled pulseaudio. Sound is back. None of this surprises me. My experience with Pulseaudio tells me that Pulseaudio is highly state dependent, and therefore acts in accordance with historical events. Imagine having to blink your car requiring two headlight blinks, then two key turns, then a shift to reverse and a shift back to park, in order to start. That's what I've found Pulseaudio to be. >Looks like I'm stuck with pulsaudio. I'm not so sure. We're hearing anecdotes of people running Firefox with only ALSA. Perhaps there's some secret magic incantation that we don't yet know about. Also, please read https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/1209469 . >BTW: As expected, play and aplay work just fine with neither >pulseaudio or pipewire installed. Yep. play, aplay, record, arecord, speaker-test and that whole crew are ALSA tools. SteveT Steve Litt Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio: apulse & firefox
On 12/14/21 17:00, Steve Litt wrote: Marc Shapiro via Dng said on Tue, 14 Dec 2021 14:09:31 -0800 On 12/14/21 06:00, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 14/12/2021 à 13:37, ael via Dng a écrit : Firefox works fine on my systems for playing audio without pulseaudio or apulse. So, I suggest verifying firefox works for you without apulse first. Interesting. I only use firefox occasionally, but some versions at least need apulse. On Chimaera: Mozilla Firefox 78.15.0esr - sound workswith Alsa only. I just purged ale pipewire configs and removed and purged pulseaudio. Firefox 95.0 (downloaded from Mozilla) is providing sound with no issues, so far). Have you power cycled yet? Thanks for reminding me! Powered down and rebooted. No sound in Firefox, or xine. Installed apulse. Still no sound in firefox, or xine. Re-installed pulseaudio. Sound is back. Uninstalled pulseaudio. Reinstalled pipewire. No sound. Uninstalled pipewire. Reinstalled pulseaudio. Sound is back. Looks like I'm stuck with pulsaudio. BTW: As expected, play and aplay work just fine with neither pulseaudio or pipewire installed. Marc SteveT Steve Litt Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologisthttp://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio
Alexis PM via Dng said on Wed, 15 Dec 2021 11:23:07 + (UTC) >RedHat is not an enemy, I disagree. Their systemd-based attempt at hegemony is all I need to conclude they're an enemy. > it contributes by developing interesting free >software. With AARD code to break systems not doing things Redhat's way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AARD_code SteveT Steve Litt Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Mosquitto cannot be started, because no /var/mosquitto directory (Devuan stable)
Hi, Thank you so much for your exhaustive answer! The links helped me to solve my next issue as well, that's great! I thought Debian would focus on systemd, I better have looked for myself first. In case someone else faces a similar issue and reads this, I like to add a detail. The patch provided by Sergio attached to #993048 is simple and very elegant, but did not work for me, because mosquitto.conf contains a pid_file option, too. By this, the directory still is needed. Additionally, I had to change this option to use a different filename, otherwise mosquitto tried to overwrite the file created by start-stop-deamon (user=root) and got EPERM (because user=mosquitto). Maybe the pid_file option could be removed from the configuration, or -u mosquitto added to start-stop-deamon, but I did not test this. Steffen On Tue, Dec 14, 2021 at 1:59 AM Ludovic Bellière via Dng wrote: > > Hello Steffen, > > The systemd service file does create the necessary directories (see: > https://github.com/eclipse/mosquitto/blob/master/service/systemd/mosquitto.service.simple). > > /run/mosquitto not being created is most likely an issue with debian itself. > Creating the folder from the init file, as per your workaround, is valid. To > resolve the installation issue would require to file a bug against mosquitto > on > debian BTS. Apparently somebody did just that, and provided a patch to boot: > https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=993048 > > See also: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=983429 > > Cheers, > Ludovic > > On Mon, 13 Dec 2021, Steffen Dettmer via Dng wrote: > > >Hi, > > > >mosquitto does not start, because there is no /var/mosquitto directory > >for its PID file. Actually it cannot even be installed, because dpkg > >script already wants it. > >Also creating directory does not solve the problem, because /run is > >tmpfs, so manually created directory won't be there on next reboot. > > > >As workaround, I simply added > > > > mkdir -p /run/mosquitto/ ; chown mosquitto /run/mosquitto > > > >to /etc/init.d/mosquitto script. I guess this in Debian is done by > >some systemd magic, which could be needed to be "emulated" in Devuan, > >so I write here. > > > >What should I do? > > > ___ > Dng mailing list > Dng@lists.dyne.org > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio
On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 11:23:07AM +, Alexis PM via Dng wrote: > > > > Main contributor is from certain company associated with color red and > > a headgear. Given the sentiment on this list, you may want to think twice. > > "pipewire" is not Red Hat's evil version of a supposedly innocent and > community-based "pulseaudio". In fact, knowing who is behind each, although I > distrust both, I think possibly more reliable the person behind "pipewire". > > The creator of "pipewire" is Wim Taymans, Red Hat engineer, co-creator of the > "gstreamer" multimedia framework together with Erik Walthinsen. > > On the other hand, Lennart Poettering, Red Hat engineer too, is the person > behind "pulseaudio" and "systemd". I also think there can be an over reaction to Redhat. I know someone who works for them, and distrusts systemd as much as anyone on this list, and I gather that he is not alone in that view within redhat. It seems to be a pretty accurate rule of thumb that any company that is publically owned cannot be trusted. Google and RH were not too bad until they were listed. It seems that then the corrupting suits move in and destroy any ethics. ael ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Pipewire and PulseAudio
> En lunes, 13 de diciembre de 2021 10:05:34 CET, Tomasz Torcz
> escribió:
> On Sun, Dec 12, 2021 at 09:40:20PM -0800, Marc Shapiro via Dng wrote:
>> I was scrolling though my e-mail from the debian user group and I saw
>> mention of pipewire, as a replacement for pulseaudio. It seemed to suggest
>> that it was in Testing, so would not be available on my Devuan Stable
>> (chimaera) system, but I took a look, anyway. It seems to be available,
>> and, in fact, installed on my system. It seems to have been brought in by
>> zoom.
>
> Are you sure you want pipewire? Looking at the code:
> https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/pipewire/pipewire/-/commits/master
>
> Main contributor is from certain company associated with color red and
> a headgear. Given the sentiment on this list, you may want to think twice.
"pipewire" is not Red Hat's evil version of a supposedly innocent and
community-based "pulseaudio". In fact, knowing who is behind each, although I
distrust both, I think possibly more reliable the person behind "pipewire".
The creator of "pipewire" is Wim Taymans, Red Hat engineer, co-creator of the
"gstreamer" multimedia framework together with Erik Walthinsen.
On the other hand, Lennart Poettering, Red Hat engineer too, is the person
behind "pulseaudio" and "systemd". IMHO the pulseaudio design already subtly
shows the Potterings way of doing things, which later became very clear with
systemd: become not an alternative but the "de facto standard" of their area
(sound or init) with a very personal ("poetterings") "new way" of doing things
(but newer does not mean better) highly complex, intrusive,
compatibility-despising and hostile (WONTFIX to every bug report he doesn't
like), in confrontation with the "simpler and older" solution that works well
(alsa or sysv) (but older does not mean worse, and simple is usually much
better for auditing and fixing problems), in collusion with the company
promoting them that wants to be the "de facto standard" of GNU/Linux (RedHat).
RedHat is not an enemy, it contributes by developing interesting free software.
But RedHat is not a disinterested friend either, it is a company that seeks to
monopolize the GNU/Linux world as a way to strengthen its dominance of the free
software sector. It is a company so I understand that it cannot be asked to be
different or act as if it were a non-profit entity (SUSE is no different, just
smaller). RedHat is to be truly appreciated for developing free software, just
that its free software developments should be used with care and critical
approach. systemd as a complex that beyond being a simple init seeks to gobble
up all GNU/Linux (udev, logging daemon, cron & anacron, hostname, date, locale,
users accounts, groups and home directories, session management, network
configuration, name resolution,...) is an example of RedHat software to be
rejected by any GNU/Linux distro that is not made by RedHat (the serious Red
Hat Entreprise Linux, its proving ground named Fedora, and the
we-don't-know-how-to-manage-now, previously outside-RedHat RHEL
reimplementation, CentOS).
Best regards.
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