Re: [DNG] Debian is no longer GNU/Linux?

On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 9:01 PM, Mitt Green wrote: > If you mean ubuntuBSD, it's made by a community. As is a lot of everything else...? -- "On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog." ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [DNG] Debian is no longer GNU/Linux?

On Mon, Apr 11, 2016 at 8:25 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: > A year or two ago they announced they were going to support BSD as > another kernel. IIRC they had previously supported BSD, had they not? -- "On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog."

Re: [DNG] How borged is D-bus?

On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 1:54 AM, Joel Roth wrote: > Being that > so much complex code is built on dbus, Pottering and co > guarantee that dbus will not be broken by updates in the > protocol. Meh, i don't buy their guarantees. Rephrasing: considering they're focusing on sd-bus,

[DNG] How borged is D-bus?

Greetings, Considering the systemd team has been focusing on sd-bus, how systemd-free is dbus? Cheers, Nuno ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Are my messages delivered?

On Gmail they're being marked as spam, along with GoLinux's. I weed them out every now and then. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

[DNG] How stable is the devuan migration?

Greetings, I have a VPS running whezzy (7.8) which was a little behind updates before systemd hit the fan. It's used as a LAMP stack and i'm wondering how easy would it be to upgrade it to devuan. I had a debian vm laying around and remember i did just that and IIRC it wasn't a big deal. Does

Re: [DNG] lilo development has ended

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 2:44 PM, dev1fanboy wrote: > So I assume lilo has stopped development altogether from the last release, > and we can look forward to only having the more complex grub2. Slackware uses lilo by default, maybe someone there will tend to it. Or

Re: [DNG] greybeards

Hi, On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 01:54:37PM -0500, Steve Litt wrote: >> On Thu, 12 Nov 2015 16:57:19 +0300 >> Mitt Green wrote: >> >> > ‎I wonder how many people that use Debian for quite long time

Re: [DNG] greybeards

On Fri, Nov 13, 2015 at 4:32 PM, Rainer Weikusat wrote: > (hence, having to recurr to someone who > accidentally made it through the hiring process despite he was > competent). Maybe you meant "incompetent"? Either way, have fun. Bye, Nuno

Re: [DNG] OT: Degree?

Gee i'm glad the world is united and there are no country-borders. Oh, wait... On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 12:51 PM, Mitt Green wrote: > This is offtopic. I'm interested in whether college or university degree > is necessary to work in IT industry (of any kind: admin, embedded

Re: [DNG] Distrowatch

On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 8:23 AM, <miro.ro...@croatiafidelis.hr> wrote: > On 151105-21:19-0500, Steve Litt wrote: >> On Thu, 5 Nov 2015 21:18:42 + >> Nuno Magalhães <nunomagalh...@eu.ipp.pt> wrote: >> >> > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 8:49

Re: [DNG] Distrowatch

On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 8:49 AM, wrote: > > It is very unlikely that Gentoo would switch to systemd. I sure hope so, it and slackware are my current distros of choice ever since Debian ceased to be, it's been fun. However, i must point out that Gentoo does have

Re: [DNG] Systemd-free distros Was Re: Distrowatch

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 6:28 AM, Edward Bartolo wrote: > I think, the majority of people opting to use a non-mainstream OS like > GNU/Linux do so for a good reason, and those who use it to look geeky > and to impress, simply cannot persevere when problems crop up and take > a

Re: [DNG] Systemd-free distros Was Re: Distrowatch

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 6:51 PM, Edward Bartolo wrote: > Here, you are talking to someone who developed a GRAPHICAL network > manager. You see, I too created an application to help 'clueless' > users. Ubuntu is not the only distribution to help newbies. I tend to make a

Re: [DNG] Distrowatch

Unfortunately it only allows you to search by package, leaving you with a lot of non-linux and inactive distros - and no ranking. But it's a nice feature. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Devuan Constitu..?

Didn't the Debian Constitution ultimately help in screwing that distro up? Or was it some other bureaucratic device? ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

[DNG] LXC template

Greetings Is there an LXC template for devuan? Or, has anyone tried modding the one for debian? Is it a drop-in replacement? Cheers, Nuno ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] LXC template

Answering self, using the gentoo template as base: -- MIRROR=${MIRROR:-http://http.debian.net/debian} ++ MIRROR=${MIRROR:-http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged/} -- configure_debian_systemd $path $rootfs ++ #configure_debian_systemd $path $rootfs lxc-create -n lxcdev -f /path/to/your/lxc.conf

Re: [DNG] OT: some ancient programming language history

On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Lars Noodén lars.noo...@gmail.com wrote: IIRC the Icon programming language had an exchange operator to swap the contents of two variables. a :=: b C: a = a ^ b; b = a ^ b; a = a ^ b; Much more fun. Them :=: look like weird emoticons. -- On the

Re: [DNG] Ashley Madison hack

On Wed, Jul 22, 2015 at 11:45 PM, James Powell james4...@hotmail.com wrote: You'd have to really spoof PAM and fool the IDS to some extent, and you have Firewalls to get past. You're assuming there is an IDS. It may have been via an employee logging in to the company extranet via cybercafé

Re: [DNG] Ashley Madison hack

You're forgetting SQL injection and XSS, to name a few. Wireshark in a cybercafé pops into mind too plus a gazillion of windows vulnerabilities. I'm placing no bets on Whether-or-not-it-was-systemd and find that discussion moot unless there's any solid details on the hack. Does Devuan keep up to

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 9:59 PM, James Powell james4...@hotmail.com wrote: It's a shame Devuan can't make a bold statement against the kernel itself to not want to buy into Greg Kroah-Hartman's systemdified kdbus future, and try to force the kernel to be forked as well. Let's hope Mr Torvalds

Re: [Dng] Slackware systemd creepin in maybe?

On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 10:18 PM, James Powell james4...@hotmail.com wrote: Patrick has no intent on enforcing the usage of systemd upon Slackware and it's users unless it becomes an unavoidable issue. Which raises the question: what does Patrick consider to be unavoidable? I thought Debian

Re: [Dng] dev-list

Oh wait, it wasn't offlist. On Thu, Apr 9, 2015 at 5:13 AM, Martijn Dekkers devuan-li...@dekkers.org.uk wrote: The «long standing, wide-ranging implementation pattern» thing is a bogus argument. Similar to Lots of people jump of bridges, care to join them? Thats just uninformed bullshit.

Re: [Dng] dev-list

Hi, Just me being picky here. On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:35 AM, Martijn Dekkers devuan-li...@dekkers.org.uk wrote: The flip side is those that say don't split the lists - there again is no significant cost to subscribing to both both lists, and follow and participate in both lists if they so

Re: [Dng] dev-list

On Tue, Apr 7, 2015 at 7:25 AM, Martijn Dekkers devuan-li...@dekkers.org.uk wrote: I know this has come up a few times in the past, but I would really like to see a dev specific list, with some strict dev-only rules. I disagree, this will mean the devs will self-segregate and tend to ignore

Re: [Dng] Call for factoids on the Debian fork

One thing that has always bugged me was that Debian was supposed to be *the* distro that runs on just about anything from an embedded system to a supercomputer, from an old dumb terminal or mainframe to a fairly recent laptop (well kinda, drivers etc). It was even one of the reasons the default

Re: [Dng] What do you guys think about Suggest and Recommends dependency?

On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 11:36 PM, Franco Lanza next...@nexlab.it wrote: Personally on debian i was using from date APT:Install-Recommends 0; APT:Install-Suggests 0; +1 ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [Dng] Another reason of why I am considering Devuan

On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 8:52 PM, T.J. Duchene t.j.duch...@gmail.com wrote: DNS calls are nonspecific data, associated only with your carrier's dynamic IP address, not a specific user. Where i come from ISP's dynamic IP lease times are *very* long, you need to reboot the home router to get a new

Re: [Dng] Claim your power

Please don't feed the trolls. Thank you. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [Dng] What about pulseaudio, avahi, ... ?

On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 8:25 PM, toto titi voidtothete...@gmail.com wrote: Do you plan to get rid of pulseaudio and avahi as well, or do you just focus on systemd ? (I don't speak for the VUA but, from what i've been reading...) Systemd is perceived as not freedom-friendly, hence the fork. If

Re: [Dng] This has GOT to be an April Fools joke

On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 12:25 PM, Nate Bargmann n...@n0nb.us wrote: Before anyone takes this too seriously a bit more research needs to be done as we are very close to the date that an elaborate ruse is plausible, at least for us in the USA. For the time being, it seems like a joke. At least

Re: [Dng] Devuan commitments - will trade-off be applied?

On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 1:41 PM, Joerg Reisenweber reisenwe...@web.de wrote: The linux trademark is owned and protected, I think they can't do with linux whatever they want. I believe it's onwn by Mr Torvalds to prevent someone else from clobbering it (like SCO). I don't think he plans to

Re: [Dng] Why daemontools is so cool

On Sat, Mar 28, 2015 at 12:15 PM, poitr pogo lepo...@gmail.com wrote: S6 even forces such a program must not handle daemon mode itself. That process must not background itself: being run by a supervision tree already makes it a background task. I don't know its innards, but i find it

Re: [Dng] rumors on RMS about systemd at libreplanet

On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 6:59 PM, Mark R. White whit...@gmail.com wrote: Just to be clear: I've seen a lot of cross talk about the possibility of systemd being put into Devuan via a sandbox or even having the systemd API written in. Is it safe to assume that going forward that there will be no

Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 6, Issue 75

On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 7:24 AM, T.J. Duchene t.j.duch...@gmail.com wrote: What I said was at some point Devuan will probably have to support systemd's API, in order to support upstream projects that actually require systemd. Why? Biggest example: GNOME (now) requires systemd. I don't want

Re: [Dng] Devuan commitments - will trade-off be applied?

On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 9:09 PM, Joerg Reisenweber reisenwe...@web.de wrote: My guess would be that all rogue stuff like systemd simply doesn't show up in devuan's packages.gz, and thus any package depending on it would run into unmet dependencies when trying to install it. Makes sense.

Re: [Dng] greets

On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 10:44 PM, Hendrik Boom hend...@topoi.pooq.com wrote: until they've been a member What constitutes Devuan membership? ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [Dng] release names

On Sat, Mar 7, 2015 at 6:44 PM, Klaus Hartnegg hartn...@uni-freiburg.de wrote: Nowhere on that page is a version number or a release date, so people not familar with cool have no idea how outdated this might be So let's strive to make better documentation.

Re: [Dng] release names

On Sat, Mar 7, 2015 at 4:16 PM, Klaus Hartnegg hartn...@uni-freiburg.de wrote: Just want to say that I really like this idea of naming releases after minor planets, such as Ceres. It's a way cool idea. +1 Cool yes, but useful? Numbers have the huge advantage that everybody knows their

Re: [Dng] Plan for Devuan to use Mozilla products as is

On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 7:06 PM, T.J. Duchene t.j.duch...@gmail.com wrote: If someone has issue with the code, it's open. Go look for yourself. I beg everyone's kind indulgence and excuse me for saying this, but the conspiracy theories about Google and the Chromium source code come from people

Re: [Dng] [OT] Debian problems with Jesse - was simple backgrounds

On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 10:42 PM, T.J. Duchene t.j.duch...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, 3 Mar 2015 07:25:23 + KatolaZ kato...@freaknet.org wrote: All computer languages are constrained to the physical nature of the processor, so the benefits of one over another are usually really nothing more

Re: [Dng] Init Freedom badges

On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:55 PM, Go Linux goli...@yahoo.com wrote: And why penguins? I think in terms of non-conformity, the platypus makes much more sense. Why? 'Cos us humans and out need for recognizable patterns can't quite classify it :) ___ Dng

Re: [Dng] Devuan Logo survey

On 02/26/15 10:24, Linuxito wrote: The logo threads are multiplying: it shows the impatience is growing. I disagree. IMHO the logo threads show a lot of users like to chip in with their opinions. No harm there, and no impatience either. I believe rushed things tend to hit fans. Therefore, i'd

Re: [Dng] OT - It may be only one file, but it does point to the bigger problem!

On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 12:57 AM, Noel Torres env...@rolamasao.org wrote: We have RAID tools like mdadm for RAID, and filesystems like ext4 or Reiserfs for file storage. Why would I want a tool combining both? You'd want one so you can, for isntance, avoid a RAID5 write hole. ZFS seems pretty

Re: [Dng] Looking for advices in preparation to switch from Debian to Devuan

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 1:48 AM, Anto arya...@chello.at wrote: No comment anyone? Actually, i didn't see your first post... For Debian, you could try, as a hack, to install either and older wheezy or squeeze, pin stuff and upgrade. There are also docs laying around for stippping systemd from

Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11

On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 2:38 PM, Ста Деюс sthu.d...@openmailbox.org wrote: But, at the first, what is planned to perform to protect «Devuan» from the guys, that got hold of the fantastic project «Debian»? In other words, if the guys come to «Devuan» and by their cruelty will start to «help»

Re: [Dng] Dng Digest, Vol 5, Issue 11

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 8:54 PM, Hendrik Boom hend...@topoi.pooq.com wrote: Unless, of course, we choose to use the band's logo as well... Paul Stanley's tongue... Tux sticking its tongue out... dunno. Anyway will Devuan have release names? I'd go with Calimero for 1.0.

Re: [Dng] Looking for advices in preparation to switch from Debian to Devuan

On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 7:15 PM, Anto arya...@chello.at wrote: What is not clear to me is that, what will happen to udev or all systemd related packages that are currently required by nginx-extras and php5-fpm for instance? On wheezy i don't see nginx-extras depending on udev or any systemd*.

Re: [Dng] UEFI secure boot not secure

On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 4:20 PM, Gravis rin...@adaptivetime.com wrote: As recent news has shown, we also need to start writing new firmware for our hard drives. Since so many things have shown to be insecure, the question has becomes if it's worth reverse engineering proprietary systems versus

Re: [Dng] KDE systemd lock-in

On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 5:47 PM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: They were specialists in monolithic entanglement when Lennart was in diapers. i'd say any Behemoth DE does that and, like some else said, systemd doing it is just the latest (and most blatant) example of this. Cheers,

Re: [Dng] About Devuan's audience

Didn't know this thread was poll-ish. I use/administer/whatever 100 machines at the moment: 11 run linux, the other 1 (my laptop) runs windows while still in warranty (and because in a realistic world i have to deal with Microsoft Office, although i've heard its 2003 version runs well in WINE).

Re: [Dng] recommendation for consideration: keep as close to debian as possible

Assuming i don't get moderated out (unlike the resident troll), On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 9:59 PM, Luke Leighton l...@lkcl.net wrote: 1) your debian system will not be screwed up or compromised by using devuan. you will also not lose any functionality or packages. 2) we understand the

Re: [Dng] Community polls on Devuan design

I'd go for: 1. http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/File:Negative-Galaxy-v1.5-SVG.svg or a spinoff of this, seems sober and not too flashy, i like it 2. http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/File:Devuan-D-Inspired-2.svg if the swirl could be improved and, as a suggestion, the other

Re: [Dng] Please!! revive Bastille hardening tool for Devuan

Isn't Bastille a set of scripts to harden Debian security? Well, IMMHO, Devuan shouldn't need such a collection if said security was default (which should be). Cheers, Nuno ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org

Re: [Dng] Community polls on Devuan design

On Sun, Feb 8, 2015 at 6:03 PM, Jaromil jaro...@dyne.org wrote: However, I don't think this is a priority now. I still cannot imagine why someone would want to be strictly anonymous while accessing that. You can replace anonymous with systemd, you know? It's a matter of choice.

Re: [Dng] About separate mailing lists

Talking about something else, it seems that the list is becoming two-fold. On one hand, it becomes concentrated on development, while at the same time it discusses more philosophical issues. Maybe is it the moment to separate into a dev list and a users list? Nope. I think both being together