Re: [DNSOP] Updated draft-hoffman-dns-in-json

[Paul Hoffman]

On Sep 21, 2016, at 3:15 PM, George Michaelson  wrote:
> I really like this document. I particularly like that it explicitly
> addresses how the JSON format it uses can represent *malformed* DNS
> state, as seen on the wire. This is very important, because some
> canonicalize-and-map-the-DNS efforts I've seen have focussed on
> well-formed packets, and this one stands out as saying "no, we have to
> be able to represent incorrect state, because that exists on the wire,
> and we need to show it sometimes"
> 
> It has multiple encoding possibilities for the DNS RR. I'm a little
> confused what difference it makes, that you'd want 'all the things'
> here. If the argument is 'long crypto hashes are better done as
> base64' then why do we have the hex at all?

Hex is easier to type for short blobs.

> Is that to preserve
> bit-field legibility for instance? Or, to encode unintelligible
> off-the-wire sequences which present as a valid RR but you can't
> decompose into their constituents? Maybe its just a little guidance
> when you saw the hex being used? rather than B64.

Really, it's just there because some people prefer one way over the other for 
some fields.

> Do you need to be explicit that transform through this JSON would
> permit re-emission of the wire content onto a network, and have the
> packets function? Is that even a goal?

Not a goal. (Particularly for badly-formed DNS responses :-) )

> The streaming reference sort-of
> made me think this might be a goal, but it wasn't explicit to me in a
> cursory reading.
> 
> I think this is a good document. I think its close to baked for me.

Thanks! And thanks to the many folks who have suggested (and will hopefully 
continue to suggest) changes. It's way better than the -00.

--Paul Hoffman
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Re: [DNSOP] Updated draft-hoffman-dns-in-json

[George Michaelson]

I really like this document. I particularly like that it explicitly
addresses how the JSON format it uses can represent *malformed* DNS
state, as seen on the wire. This is very important, because some
canonicalize-and-map-the-DNS efforts I've seen have focussed on
well-formed packets, and this one stands out as saying "no, we have to
be able to represent incorrect state, because that exists on the wire,
and we need to show it sometimes"

It has multiple encoding possibilities for the DNS RR. I'm a little
confused what difference it makes, that you'd want 'all the things'
here. If the argument is 'long crypto hashes are better done as
base64' then why do we have the hex at all? Is that to preserve
bit-field legibility for instance? Or, to encode unintelligible
off-the-wire sequences which present as a valid RR but you can't
decompose into their constituents? Maybe its just a little guidance
when you saw the hex being used? rather than B64.

Do you need to be explicit that transform through this JSON would
permit re-emission of the wire content onto a network, and have the
packets function? Is that even a goal? The streaming reference sort-of
made me think this might be a goal, but it wasn't explicit to me in a
cursory reading.

I think this is a good document. I think its close to baked for me.

George

On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 6:47 AM, Paul Hoffman  wrote:
> Greetings. Based on the recent discussion on the DNSOP mailing list (noting 
> again that this is not a WG work item!), I have updated 
> draft-hoffman-dns-in-json. I still plan to send this to the ISE for 
> Experimental in about two weeks, and am happy to make more changes before 
> then (or after, based on the ISE review).
>
> --Paul Hoffman
>
>> A new version of I-D, draft-hoffman-dns-in-json-08.txt
>> has been successfully submitted by Paul Hoffman and posted to the
>> IETF repository.
>>
>> Name: draft-hoffman-dns-in-json
>> Revision: 08
>> Title:Representing DNS Messages in JSON
>> Document date:2016-09-21
>> Group:Individual Submission
>> Pages:13
>> URL:
>> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-hoffman-dns-in-json-08.txt
>> Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hoffman-dns-in-json/
>> Htmlized:   https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-hoffman-dns-in-json-08
>> Diff:   
>> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-hoffman-dns-in-json-08
>>
>> Abstract:
>>   Some applications use DNS messages, or parts of DNS messages, as
>>   data.  For example, a system that captures DNS queries and responses
>>   might want to be able to easily search those without having to decode
>>   the messages each time.  Another example is a system that puts
>>   together DNS queries and responses from message parts.  This document
>>   describes a standardized format for DNS message data in JSON.
>
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