Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
Those power banks are full of switching power supplies and I bet horrible RF noise generators. 73, Mark W7MLG On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 9:04 AM Gwen Patton wrote: > I've got a Talentcell 12Ah LiFePO4 that seems to work just fine. I have > some of their other little power banks, and they work great too. > > But I'm trying to concentrate on my USB-C PD power bank solution for the > time being, to get some additional testing time in on it. I've expanded the > testing to Qualcomm Quick-Charge 12v 1.5A testing as well. There's plenty > of PCBs and prebuilt cables out there now to do it easily and cheaply, and > the power banks are ubiquitous and inexpensive. And they can recharge your > phone, your tablet, and whatever other USB gear you have. (I have a few > USB-charged flashlights, my Bluetooth bone-conduction headset, my Bluetooth > speaker, a little Bluetooth transmitter I can plug into my radio, so I can > listen to it on said headset,and my 70cm Baofeng T1 Mini is also charged > via USB. So I have significant reason to standardize on USB power.) > > Recently I got a killer USB-C and DC power bank, the Omnicharge Ultimate. > It's 38.4 Ah, and provides USB-C, limited AC 120V, and a DC line that can > be set for anything from 5v to 60v at various current levels. Weighs about > 4 pounds and is a magnificent gadget that'll power just about anything I > need to power. I could even recharge the Chromebook I use for my MDS 40m > Phaser digimode transceiver...and power the Phaser as well! Prime Day on > Amazon gave me a deep discount on it. > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > 73, > Gwen, NG3P > http://www.ng3p.com > > > On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 1:28 PM Jim Brown > wrote: > > > On 8/7/2021 5:31 AM, John Harper wrote: > > > I'm a Bioenno fan, > > > > I've been using their batteries for 7 years. A 100Ah battery has been > > running my station for five years. > > > > 73, Jim K9YC > > __ > > Elecraft mailing list > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > Message delivered to ard...@gmail.com > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to marklgoldb...@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
I've got a Talentcell 12Ah LiFePO4 that seems to work just fine. I have some of their other little power banks, and they work great too. But I'm trying to concentrate on my USB-C PD power bank solution for the time being, to get some additional testing time in on it. I've expanded the testing to Qualcomm Quick-Charge 12v 1.5A testing as well. There's plenty of PCBs and prebuilt cables out there now to do it easily and cheaply, and the power banks are ubiquitous and inexpensive. And they can recharge your phone, your tablet, and whatever other USB gear you have. (I have a few USB-charged flashlights, my Bluetooth bone-conduction headset, my Bluetooth speaker, a little Bluetooth transmitter I can plug into my radio, so I can listen to it on said headset,and my 70cm Baofeng T1 Mini is also charged via USB. So I have significant reason to standardize on USB power.) Recently I got a killer USB-C and DC power bank, the Omnicharge Ultimate. It's 38.4 Ah, and provides USB-C, limited AC 120V, and a DC line that can be set for anything from 5v to 60v at various current levels. Weighs about 4 pounds and is a magnificent gadget that'll power just about anything I need to power. I could even recharge the Chromebook I use for my MDS 40m Phaser digimode transceiver...and power the Phaser as well! Prime Day on Amazon gave me a deep discount on it. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- 73, Gwen, NG3P http://www.ng3p.com On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 1:28 PM Jim Brown wrote: > On 8/7/2021 5:31 AM, John Harper wrote: > > I'm a Bioenno fan, > > I've been using their batteries for 7 years. A 100Ah battery has been > running my station for five years. > > 73, Jim K9YC > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to ard...@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
On 8/7/2021 5:31 AM, John Harper wrote: I'm a Bioenno fan, I've been using their batteries for 7 years. A 100Ah battery has been running my station for five years. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
I'm a Bioenno fan, having recently purchased a 12AH that has more than its advertised capacity: http://ae5x.blogspot.com/2021/03/pleasantly-surprised-with-bioennos-12v.html Note that in the comments, others mention similar results. John AE5X __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
A few years ago I picked up a couple of the Hobbyking LiFePO4 packs, and a couple friends of mine did also. Every one puffed after some months despite being properly balance charged, not overdischarged, and not really used very hard. They continued to operate, but they were clearly outgassing. I've had many, many Hobbyking Lithium Ion packs without this problem, only the LiFePO4 seemed to suffer in this way. That was a few years ago, so perhaps it's not the same now. As was noted there's no BMS which means a balancing charger is needed, and extreme care to not overdischarge them. A small per-cell meter would be important to monitor the cell voltages periodically. Many folks report good results from the Dakota and Miady LiFePO4 batteries, as well as the Bioenno of course. Miady overstates their capacity and current ratings, so more reasonable data should be used. I've just graphed a Miady 8AH discharge (Amazon $35), and it puts out a solid 7 amp hours rather than the rated 8. Right now I'm graphing a Bioenno 6AH that's less than 2 years old and it just stopped at under 4.6 amp hours out of it's rated 6 (testing at 10 hour rate). You don't really want to run them fully out anyway, so expect about 80% of the rated amp hours and value accordingly. I also ordered some Bioenno in May for Field Day and am still waiting, so apparently they are having supply problems like many others. The Miady came a bit out of balance, letting them sit on the charger for a day or two will allow the BMS board to balance them which increases useable capacity. Clearly when selling a LifePO4 battery at these low prices they can't spend too much time on them, so the final QC is left to the buyer. It's easy to return Amazon items so charge them and check their voltage and amp-hour capacity, or buy more expensive brands that do more testing for you. The two Miady batteries I've tested seem to have 85% of their rated capacity out of the box, but their cost is about 35-40% of the brand names. Even the brand names don't always reach label capacity. I use Bioenno for the high current loads but for lower current items perhaps the lower cost battery is a good budget choice. Test it during the return period and see if you agree. There are quite a few Miady (and other) reviews on utoob, most who actually use them for awhile have had decent results. 73 de w6akb On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 9:57 AM Esquer Dave wrote: > Hello Arno, > > I just picked up 2 of these 13.2v, 4200mAh LiFePo batteries from > HobbyKing. So far, they are working great. I retired my SLA 12v, 5Ah > battery too. Twice the amp-hours at 1/2 the weight. They run at 13.2 volts, > so portable I can run the 12 watts for a bit. > http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=14067 > > They are in the US Warehouse too, no shipping from China. > > This guy turned me onto them: > > http://www.worldwidedx.com/hf-bands-hf-rigs/143215-ultimate-portable-power-elecraft-kx3.html > > At $46.00 each, a good deal in my pocketbook! > > Dave, K6WDE > > More static, more of the time … > > Dave Esquer, K6WDE > dave.esq...@gmail.com > http://www.daveesquer.com > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice, UPDATE
That is very reassuring information, Fred, thank you. So I understand you are using two fuses, one for each pole. What amp rating? My PCM includes overcurrent discharge protection at 42A with a protection delay time of 20 ms. Does that sound like it has the fuse built in? 73, Arno K7RNO __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice, UPDATE
On 11/22/2013 11:00 AM, Arno Dienhart wrote: So I understand you are using two fuses, one for each pole. What amp rating? Yes, I put a fuse in each lead. They're 5A fast-blow, they're supposed to open in less than 2ms. I decided to tolerate the tiny increase in resistance for the protection. I used the blade type automotive fuses, they make a really good, low resistance contact in the holder. My PCM includes overcurrent discharge protection at 42A with a protection delay time of 20 ms. Does that sound like it has the fuse built in? Yes, it does, and it probably will reset once the overcurrent condition is removed. Many of these packs that are capable of dangerous discharge currents seem to have them these days. LiFePO4 batteries like to be stored at less than full charge ... around 2/3 - 3/4 or so. My charger has a storage cycle on it that charges to full and then discharges to 2/3, keeping the cells balanced. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 - www.cqp.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice, UPDATE
On 11/21/2013 4:26 PM, Arno Dienhart wrote: When I hooked it up to the KX3 in RX (170mA draw), it started showing 13.5V and rapidly sunk to 13.1V within five minutes. Now, after ten minutes, it seems to have settled at 12.9V. Is this normal for such a battery, to have such a large difference between no load and small load? And also, is it normal for the Voltage do go down quite rapidly during the first few minutes? Yes and yes. That's what my A123 pack does. Right after a full charge, voltage is about 14.8/9 no load, and 14.1 or so with K2 receive load [~270mA]. It drops fairly quickly [minutes] to 12.8 or so. It will stay there or very close, dropping to perhaps 12.2/1 under full TX load, until near full discharge. At that point, the voltage falls very fast, resembling the glide angle of a brick. I charted mine using the K2 in RX as a load since it is constant, but will trip out on low voltage before discharging the pack too far. Incidentally, the internal resistance of an LiFePO4 pack is extremely low and they'll deliver 20-30C or more into a short circuit, so don't do that to them. :-)) I recommend fusing the power leads close to the battery and using fast-blow fuses. It will add a little resistance in your power leads, but it's a lot better than smoke. With two fuses, my stable RX voltage starts at about 12.8, and on TX [5W, ~1.7A depending on band] goes to about 12.1V. I'm fairly certain that is drop in the power cable and fuses. Radio works super. And, FWIW: I've never gotten my pack below about 30%. Made 30 CW Q's on W5N/RO-015 on day 1 and 27 on W5T/DE-003 on day 2 and it was at 30% when we got back to Mike's in El Paso that night. Really remarkable batteries! I'll run it down, verify that the under-discharge protection works, and then charge it again for a longer time to make sure balancing sets in and does its magic, if needed. I'm no battery chemistry expert, but I don't think running them down, like NiCd's, [except maybe to check the protection as you say] is necessary or desirable. I do know they like to be stored at around 2/3 charge, my charger has a mode to do that. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014 - www.cqp.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice, UPDATE
Thank you all for your help and suggestions. I wanted to stay small and lightweight, so I stayed with my original 3 Ah LFP from Bioenno. It arrived today in the mail, a very nicely covered pack (thin but firm, fully enclosed rectangle package, not just an open shrink tube over some cells). Anderson power poles already installed on battery and charger, so all an instant fit. It came with 14V on my external meter and charged up to 15.4V. When I hooked it up to the KX3 in RX (170mA draw), it started showing 13.5V and rapidly sunk to 13.1V within five minutes. Now, after ten minutes, it seems to have settled at 12.9V. Is this normal for such a battery, to have such a large difference between no load and small load? And also, is it normal for the Voltage do go down quite rapidly during the first few minutes? I'll run it down, verify that the under-discharge protection works, and then charge it again for a longer time to make sure balancing sets in and does its magic, if needed. Thank you for sharing your advice. 73 de Arno, K7RNO __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
So I have decided to retire my heavyweight UPS battery and upgrade to a LiFePo4 battery. This is what I am looking at: Bioenno 12V/3Ah with PCM and charger http://www.bioennopower.com/collections/12v-series-lifepo4-batteries/product s/12v-3ah-lifepo4-battery Am I expecting correctly that this should be plug play? I understand that more capacity will allow for longer operation, but I am not planning for any marathon, and from what I have read, 3Ah should last for several hours at 10W easily. Please correct me if I am off. Thank you for your objective assessment. 73 de K7RNO __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
Hi Arno, The Bioenno 12V/3Ah LiFePo4 should work nicely with your KX3 and provide several hours of 10W operation. I use a similar 3.3 Ah from http://www.batteryspace.com/lifepo4cellspacks.aspx and have been quite satisfied with it. John KN5L __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
Hello Arno, I just picked up 2 of these 13.2v, 4200mAh LiFePo batteries from HobbyKing. So far, they are working great. I retired my SLA 12v, 5Ah battery too. Twice the amp-hours at 1/2 the weight. They run at 13.2 volts, so portable I can run the 12 watts for a bit. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=14067 They are in the US Warehouse too, no shipping from China. This guy turned me onto them: http://www.worldwidedx.com/hf-bands-hf-rigs/143215-ultimate-portable-power-elecraft-kx3.html At $46.00 each, a good deal in my pocketbook! Dave, K6WDE More static, more of the time … Dave Esquer, K6WDE dave.esq...@gmail.com http://www.daveesquer.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Please evaluate LiFePo4 battery/charger choice
Looks very good, Dave. I like the extra capacity and the 4S2P configuration, and if they came with a PCM or if there were a reasonably priced balancing charger, I'd have considered that product. But I could not find it. How is this capacity working for you? To add some information about the Bioenno PCM that I hadn't found before.from their website somewhere: Bioenno PowerR Overcharge Protection for Each Cell: Min: 3.75 V; Typical: 3.80V; Max: 3.85 V Over-charge Detection Delay: Min: 0.5 seconds, Typical: 1.0 seconds; Max: 1.5 seconds Overcharge Recovery Protection for Each Cell: Min: 3.55V; Typical: 3.60V; Max: 3.65V Over-Discharge Protection for Each Cell: Min: 1.92V; Typical: 2.00V; Max: 2.08V Over-discharge Protection Delay Time For Each Cell: Min: 0.5 seconds; Typical: 1.0 Seconds; Max: 1.5 Seconds Over-Discharge Recovery Protection for Each Cell: Min: 2.2V; Typical: 2.3V; Max: 2.4V Discharge Overcurrent Protection: Min: 35A; Typical: 42A; Max: 48A Discharge Overcurrent Protection Delay Time: 20 ms Balance Start Voltage: Min: 3.55V; Typical: 3.60V; Max: 3.65V Balance Current: Min: 60 mA; Typical: 70 mA; Max: 80 mA Over Temperature Protection (Charging): Min: 60 deg C; Typical: 65 deg C; Max: 70 deg C Over Temperature Protection (Discharging): Min: 60 deg ; Typical: 65 deg C; Max: 70 deg C __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
