[EM] Feature extraction and criteria for multiwinner elections

One way of making multiwinner elections proportional is to have the method pass certain criteria. Most obvious of these are Droop proportionality, which is the multiwinner analog to mutual majority. However, such criteria can only say what the method should do, in certain cases, not what it

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Dear James Gilmour, you wrote (2 Jan 2009): So let's try a small number of numbers. At a meeting we need to elect one office-bearer (single-office, single-winner). There are four candidates and we decide to use the exhaustive ballot (bottom elimination, one at a time) with the

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

James Gilmour wrote (2 Jan 2009): So let's try a small number of numbers. At a meeting we need to elect one office-bearer (single-office, single-winner). There are four candidates and we decide to use the exhaustive ballot (bottom elimination, one at a time) with the requirement

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Dear James Gilmour, you wrote (2 Jan 2009): So let's try a small number of numbers. At a meeting we need to elect one office-bearer (single-office, single-winner). There are four candidates and we decide to use the exhaustive ballot (bottom elimination, one at a time) with the

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Dave makes a good point, that I may have emulated Abd in verbosity in making my point. Here it is in a nutshell: Since the two-round runoff election system widely used in the U.S. that involves counting votes in two rounds is said to always elect a majority winner, meaning a majority of votes

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Not to muddy an already muddied water, but if I define majority to be 50%+1 of ELIGIBLE VOTERS no method can claim to select a majority winner unless there's a large turnout in every round (for systems that include more than one round of VOTING.) -Original Message- From:

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

I think the cited text provides an important distinction we need to use on EM. In theory, we want to discuss election methods based upon how they collect and count ballots, which is analytic in some sense. As soon as you introduce real candidates and party politics (i.e. strategies) we get a

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

At 06:34 AM 1/2/2009, James Gilmour wrote: Dave Ketchum Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 6:07 AM Terry and Abd look set to duel forever. Conduct of elections is a serious topic, but both of them offer too many words without usefully covering the topic. So let's try a small number of

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

At 01:09 PM 1/2/2009, Jonathan Lundell wrote: So sure, IRV elects majority winners in one particular operation sense of the term. Even if there's a first-round absolute majority, we're faced with the problem of agenda manipulation. To take another US presidential election, in 1992 I might have

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

On Jan 2, 2009, at 12:31 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: At 01:09 PM 1/2/2009, Jonathan Lundell wrote: So sure, IRV elects majority winners in one particular operation sense of the term. Even if there's a first-round absolute majority, we're faced with the problem of agenda manipulation. To

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Abd, I think you miss-understood James Gilmour's question. He was asking about an exhaustive ballot election without any ranked-choice ballots. In his scenario 100 voters vote in the first round and 92 vote in the second round. Does the final round winner with 47 votes win with a majority?

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

At 01:23 PM 1/2/2009, Terry Bouricius wrote: Dave makes a good point, that I may have emulated Abd in verbosity in making my point. Here it is in a nutshell: Since the two-round runoff election system widely used in the U.S. that involves counting votes in two rounds is said to always elect a

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

I don't believe RRs or practical implementations thereof define percentages this way. For instance, the US Senate rules call for 60 votes, not 60% of the Senators who vote, in their rules. Likewise by leaving the state, for a time Texas Democrats delayed the (ridiculous) re-districting plan the

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

At 02:51 PM 1/2/2009, Paul Kislanko wrote: I think the cited text provides an important distinction we need to use on EM. In theory, we want to discuss election methods based upon how they collect and count ballots, which is analytic in some sense. As soon as you introduce real candidates and

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

At 03:53 PM 1/2/2009, Jonathan Lundell wrote: FWIW, in California there's no way to write in NOTA and have it counted. Depends on the election and perhaps on local rules. Pick the absolute best candidate *including write-ins and, if necessary, write that name in. A write-in is None of the

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

On Jan 2, 2009, at 2:26 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Elections aren't merely picking some ideal best winner in a bad situation, they are seeking, if a majority is sought, one who will be accepted, *at least*, by most voters. That may well be a desideratum, but it's not the case in real

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

Who would have thought such a simple example and such a direct question could provoke so much obfuscation and prevarication. References to IRV, FairVote and Santa Clara are all completely irrelevant. So let's try again, with little bit of additional information that was (more or less) implied

Re: [EM] Feature extraction and criteria for multiwinner elections

--- On Fri, 2/1/09, Kristofer Munsterhjelm km-el...@broadpark.no wrote: Reverse Condorcet: If the election is (n-1, n) and there's a Condorcet loser, all but the Condorcet loser should be elected. Example: - 10 Republican candidates, one Democrat candidate - 55% support to Republicans - 45%

Re: [EM] Does IRV elect majority winners?

In real elections the problem is that the Powers That Be chose to not allow me to vote at all, despite the fact I'm a registered voter. So whatever method you propose or support I consider irrelevant, until you sort out the problems on the collection side. -Original Message- From: