[EM] Two simple alternative voting methods that are fairer than IRV/STV and lack most IRV/STV flaws

2010-01-15 Thread Chris Benham
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote  (14 Jan 2010): snip Why does Kathy elsewhere defend Top Two Runoff which isn't monotonic? This opinion, stated as fact, is false. Top Two Runoff is a two-step system, and monotonicity doesn't refer to such. It refers to the effect of a vote on a single ballot as to

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality

2010-01-15 Thread Kathy Dopp
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 1:44 AM, robert bristow-johnson r...@audioimagination.com wrote: Kathy may make mistakes, but I'd be astonished to find her lying. she's pretty partisan (as am i), now i don't even remember what she said that i found so hard to believe. Really!!?? Since I've never

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality

2010-01-15 Thread robert bristow-johnson
On Jan 15, 2010, at 9:47 AM, Kathy Dopp wrote: On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 1:44 AM, robert bristow-johnson r...@audioimagination.com wrote: Kathy may make mistakes, but I'd be astonished to find her lying. she's pretty partisan (as am i), now i don't even remember what she said that i found

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality

2010-01-15 Thread Kathy Dopp
Oh. OK. I thought you were using the word partisan in the typical sense of political party adherent which I am not. OK. I agree that I am a strong adherent of voting rights so naturally oppose IRV/STV as removing the rights of voters to participate in the final decision-making process, removing

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality

2010-01-15 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 10:51 PM 1/14/2010, Jonathan Lundell wrote: On Jan 14, 2010, at 7:17 PM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax wrote: Again, as I mentioned, the Condorcet Criterion looks good, it's intuitively satisfying. Unfortunately, it depends on pure rank order, neglecting preference strength. Just for the record:

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality

2010-01-15 Thread Dave Ketchum
On Jan 15, 2010, at 7:46 PM, Juho wrote: On Jan 14, 2010, at 2:13 AM, Dave Ketchum wrote: On Jan 13, 2010, at 4:49 AM, Juho wrote: On Jan 13, 2010, at 9:14 AM, robert bristow-johnson wrote: it still is a curiosity to me how, historically, some leaders and proponents of election reform

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality (Dave Ketchum)

2010-01-15 Thread Kathy Dopp
Message: 3 Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2010 22:05:58 -0500 From: Dave Ketchum da...@clarityconnect.com To: Juho juho4...@yahoo.co.uk On Jan 15, 2010, at 7:46 PM, Juho wrote: On Jan 14, 2010, at 2:13 AM, Dave Ketchum wrote: On Jan 13, 2010, at 4:49 AM, Juho wrote: On Jan 13, 2010, at 9:14 AM, robert

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality (Dave Ketchum)

2010-01-15 Thread Jonathan Lundell
On Jan 15, 2010, at 7:51 PM, Kathy Dopp wrote: Imagine sending all your ballots nationwide to DC for manual counting to check the outcome of a Presidential election. We'll simply let the GW administration, for instance, count the results in his own IRV election! That's something of a non

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality (Dave Ketchum)

2010-01-15 Thread robert bristow-johnson
On Jan 15, 2010, at 11:34 PM, Jonathan Lundell wrote: On Jan 15, 2010, at 7:51 PM, Kathy Dopp wrote: Imagine sending all your ballots nationwide to DC for manual counting to check the outcome of a Presidential election. We'll simply let the GW administration, for instance, count the results