Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected to the spoiler effect if any

2010-01-23 Thread Kristofer Munsterhjelm
Juho wrote: Many of the criteria would be nice to have. One must however remember that often they have two sides. Winning something in some area may mean losing something in another area (e.g. the LNH property of IRV has been discussed widely on this list recently) especially when trying to

Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected to the spoiler effect if any

2010-01-23 Thread Kristofer Munsterhjelm
Kathy Dopp wrote: Thanks Kristofer for the explanations. Do you know a good place that discusses the Ranked Pairs method of resolving cycles, or all the methods of resolving cycles? I would still like an example of a spoiler in Condorcet no matter how unlikely if possible. Thank you.

Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected to the spoiler effect if any

2010-01-23 Thread Kristofer Munsterhjelm
Juho wrote: On Jan 22, 2010, at 12:05 AM, Kristofer Munsterhjelm wrote: Jonathan Lundell wrote: In that case it might be a good starting point to define spoiler, so we know what we've found when we find it. What's an example of an IRV spoiler who's not a pretty strong candidate? A very

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality (back to the pile count controversy)

2010-01-23 Thread Kristofer Munsterhjelm
Kathy Dopp wrote: James, Your formulas below are only correct in the case that voters are allowed to rank all the candidates who run for an election contest. That may be true in Australia, but is not true in the US where typically voters are allowed to rank up to only three candidates. As a

Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected

2010-01-23 Thread Kristofer Munsterhjelm
Kathy Dopp wrote: Jonathan, Monotonicity is a mathematical concept that is fairly simple to describe. There is non-decreasing monotonicity, strictly increasing monotonicity, non-increasing monotonicity, etc. Arrow describes the concept re. elections fairly well in one of his fairness

[EM] Professorial Office Picking

2010-01-23 Thread Michael Rouse
Steven E. Landsburg (author of The Armchair Economist), had an interesting problem here: http://www.thebigquestions.com/2010/01/21/office-politics/ (in reference to an original question of the New York Times ethics column here: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/03/magazine/03FOB-Ethicist-t.html)

Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected to the spoiler effect if any

2010-01-23 Thread Juho
On Jan 23, 2010, at 1:55 PM, Kristofer Munsterhjelm wrote: Juho wrote: On Jan 22, 2010, at 12:05 AM, Kristofer Munsterhjelm wrote: Jonathan Lundell wrote: In that case it might be a good starting point to define spoiler, so we know what we've found when we find it. What's an example of an

Re: [EM] I need an example of Condorcet method being subjected

2010-01-23 Thread Kathy Dopp
Thanks again Kristofer for the explanations. Terrific. On Sat, Jan 23, 2010 at 10:41 AM, election-methods-requ...@lists.electorama.com wrote: From: Kristofer Munsterhjelm km-el...@broadpark.no To: kathy.d...@gmail.com Kathy Dopp wrote: Thanks Kristofer for the explanations.  Do you know a

Re: [EM] IRV vs Plurality (back to the pile count controversy)

2010-01-23 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 09:52 PM 1/22/2010, robert bristow-johnson wrote: now remember in the case we're discussing here, there is only two candidates. again, what consequence to the outcome of the election (that is, who of A or B wins) occurs whether a ballot is marked A (and B is last by default) or is marked AB?