date:20201211




> Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2020 at 3:35 AM
> From: "Jean Louis" 
> To: "Ihor Radchenko" 
> Cc: daniela-s...@gmx.it, to...@tuxteam.de, emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> * Ihor Radchenko  [2020-12-11 17:24]:
> > > ... there is no active
> > > hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.
> >
> > You are welcome to submit patches.
> >
> > I have experimental code to use pretty-symbols in agenda and align tags
> > even when frame size changes [1]. However, last time I proposed this on
> > mailing list, there was no interest...
> >
> > [1] https://orgmode.org/list/87r1v71aw0.fsf@localhost/
>
> By the way I have completely switched all action management to my
> database system with tabulated list mode. No more using Org for action
> management, only for document, not even short notes. Access to notes
> by relevance search by using PostgreSQL full text search is so much
> more logical personally. Computer performs search but as database is
> more compact it does not search over all files. Things are easily
> reordered rather then refiled. Key bindings for majority of actions
> are way shorter as tabulated list mode is not editing mode.
>
> - tasks can be assigned to one among 200,000+ people in the database,
>   and I need not take care how their names are written and if I will
>   lose a task because I made a type in writing their names. Person is
>   rather selected and computer thinks what is their unique ID, not
>   name.
>
> - listing tasks assigned to specific person or group of people is
>   quick and easy, related to person or group is quick or easy.
>
> - daily list of pending tasks can be sent by email automatically, list
>   of completed tasks can be sent. Task as such can be sent with one or
>   two keys pressed without me thinking as all related objects are
>   integrated (email address of assignee is already known).
>
> - I need not keep one list of assignees in one file, other list in
>   other file, etc. I can list all asignees straight with one key or
>   see actions assigned to them.
>
> - and I do not write subordinate tasks as TODO any more, that makes no
>   sense. There is one senior section on what subject, project or
>   objective has to be fullfiled and those subordinate tasks which are
>   not marked with TODO repetitevely can be marked as redundant or
>   superfluous, purposeless when senior objective have been
>   completed. This means they are not done as there is no need to get
>   something done if objective have been fullfiled. Org mode have
>   imposed reverse on users where for example a list of items is only
>   then completed as DONE when subordinate tasks have been completed as
>   DONE, which makes users lie to themselves as they will then
>   "complete" the task which is not complete because it is purposeless
>   only to complete the senior task as DONE.
>
> And I think it is possible for anybody regardless of programming skill
> level to make one's own system of management of tasks within less than
> a week that will get more aligned to personal individualized way of
> handling tasks, then trying to accommodate personal needs to software
> that may have gone one completly wrong direction.

If I said that I would be barraged by accusations of rudeness! :)

> Software is there to help the human, not human to help the software.
>
>

Re: Bring up a screen giving option to open a series of orgmode files

* Ihor Radchenko  [2020-12-11 18:24]:
> > As an even better approach, I consider merging of independently stored 
> > PDF file and annotations to it and presenting combined file with native 
> > PDF annotations. Several years ago I have not find tools for such 
> > operations, maybe new projects have appeared since that time.
> 
> I think hypothes.is supports pdf annotations (via pdf.js).

For public annotations that is great.

For private annotations with hypothes.is one can install it on own
server and protect system for one's own group. That will do only a
group that is serious enough or have serious demands for annotations.

Myself I do not prefer having too much software installed online
especially not databases that are private. What is private I keep off
the Internet. If I wish to communicate over Internet to somebody I
always establish first encrypted line. So I am about to develop system
to provide annotation to somebody over Internet, without compromising
security of the file or annotation.

As each hyperdocument has its unique ID, it is easy to expand it into:

example.com/1/2/3/4 for ID 1234

That would be HTML with PDF annotation where user could open PDF
inside of that HTML or click on the PDF to open it. I do hope that
pdfjs does support specific page jumps. And such annotation on HTML
should work with or without Javascript. Those without can simply open
PDF file and manually jump to specific page as annotated and
instructed.

iceweasel-uxp on Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre does not have pdfjs
built-in as I see it, GNU Icecat has it.

Then I would inject web server password protection and protect it from
public. But that does not protect the document of those who could
intrude into the server and also does not protect from cracking
attempts as username and password are not alone well secure. Better
would be having the encrypted HTML that is protected by user's private
PGP key, but I have no idea if such technology exists yet.

It seems that the framework exists:
https://www.w3.org/Conferences/WWW4/Papers2/245.html

but it is unclear which browsers would support such displaying of PGP
encrypted data. With Emacs it would be trivial, but asking variety of
users to install Emacs is not convenient though desired.

Workflow would be:

1. Annotate PDF, provide maybe personalized assignment.

2. Hit key. This would then cause annoation to be published with the
   hyperlink to PDF and page reference, it would encrypt and prepare
   the file for reomte user including it would inform remote user by
   email and SMS of the assignment. No tedious copy and paste.

3. User would report if it is done or not done. Reporting could be
   done also by single click or report written followed by click (HTTP
   POST). Best would be if report is PGP signed by user's verified and
   trusted key to have proper tracking and evidnece of the action.

Same workflow could be implemented from Org type of annotations.

Jean

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

* Ihor Radchenko  [2020-12-11 17:24]:
> > ... there is no active
> > hacking on org-agenda and adding new features. 
> 
> You are welcome to submit patches.
> 
> I have experimental code to use pretty-symbols in agenda and align tags
> even when frame size changes [1]. However, last time I proposed this on
> mailing list, there was no interest...
> 
> [1] https://orgmode.org/list/87r1v71aw0.fsf@localhost/

By the way I have completely switched all action management to my
database system with tabulated list mode. No more using Org for action
management, only for document, not even short notes. Access to notes
by relevance search by using PostgreSQL full text search is so much
more logical personally. Computer performs search but as database is
more compact it does not search over all files. Things are easily
reordered rather then refiled. Key bindings for majority of actions
are way shorter as tabulated list mode is not editing mode.

- tasks can be assigned to one among 200,000+ people in the database,
  and I need not take care how their names are written and if I will
  lose a task because I made a type in writing their names. Person is
  rather selected and computer thinks what is their unique ID, not
  name.

- listing tasks assigned to specific person or group of people is
  quick and easy, related to person or group is quick or easy.

- daily list of pending tasks can be sent by email automatically, list
  of completed tasks can be sent. Task as such can be sent with one or
  two keys pressed without me thinking as all related objects are
  integrated (email address of assignee is already known).

- I need not keep one list of assignees in one file, other list in
  other file, etc. I can list all asignees straight with one key or
  see actions assigned to them.

- and I do not write subordinate tasks as TODO any more, that makes no
  sense. There is one senior section on what subject, project or
  objective has to be fullfiled and those subordinate tasks which are
  not marked with TODO repetitevely can be marked as redundant or
  superfluous, purposeless when senior objective have been
  completed. This means they are not done as there is no need to get
  something done if objective have been fullfiled. Org mode have
  imposed reverse on users where for example a list of items is only
  then completed as DONE when subordinate tasks have been completed as
  DONE, which makes users lie to themselves as they will then
  "complete" the task which is not complete because it is purposeless
  only to complete the senior task as DONE.

And I think it is possible for anybody regardless of programming skill
level to make one's own system of management of tasks within less than
a week that will get more aligned to personal individualized way of
handling tasks, then trying to accommodate personal needs to software
that may have gone one completly wrong direction.

Software is there to help the human, not human to help the software.

Re: [PATCH] org-agenda.el: Add a M-, binding for org-priority-show

2020-12-11 Thread Samuel Wales

off topic, but as a separate change, perhaps the 2 things named
priority could have separate names?

On 12/8/20, Kyle Meyer  wrote:
> [ Sorry, all, for the recent string of duplicate messages from me :x ]
>
> Adam Spiers writes:
>
>> This offers an easy way to check the internal numeric priority
>> used for sorting within the agenda.
>
> Thanks for the patch.  Please include a changelog entry in your commit
> message.
>
>> ---
>>  doc/org-manual.org | 8 
>>  lisp/org-agenda.el | 1 +
>>  2 files changed, 9 insertions(+)
>>
>> diff --git a/doc/org-manual.org b/doc/org-manual.org
>> index 5a84a6de6..e914af42d 100644
>> --- a/doc/org-manual.org
>> +++ b/doc/org-manual.org
>> @@ -9891,6 +9891,14 @@ the other commands, point needs to be in the
>> desired line.
>>Set tags for the current headline.  If there is an active region in
>>the agenda, change a tag for all headings in the region.
>>
>> +- {{{kbd(M-\,)}}} (~org-priority-show~) ::
>> +
>> +  #+kindex: M-,
>> +  #+findex: org-priority-show
>> +  Show the numeric priority for the current item.  This priority is
>> +  composed of the main priority given with the =[#A]= cookies, and by
>> +  additional input from the age of a schedules or deadline entry.
>> +
>>  - {{{kbd(\,)}}} (~org-agenda-priority~) ::
>
> With a C-u, org-agenda-priority calls org-priority-show.  So perhaps
> instead of adding a new binding, the documentation should be improved.
> What do you think?
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

Please learn what misopathy is.
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com/2013/10/why-some-diseases-are-wronged.html

Re: org-table change time from UTC to other timezones

2020-12-11 Thread Alan E. Davis

Maxim:

Thank for the clear explanation.  My little problem seems to require a
super steam hammer.  Your insights are most helpful.

Alan



On Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 07:46 Maxim Nikulin  wrote:

> 2020-12-11 Alan E. Davis wrote:
> >
> > I had hoped that subtracting 10 hours from 06:44 UTC would get me at
> > least -04:44.
>
> I am in doubts how to present negative time correctly. Having in mind
> wall clocks with hands, your expectation has some sense.
>
> I think, the source of confusion is that you are trying to use
> facilities intended for TimeInterval + TimeInterval arithmetic, where
> TimeInterval denotes a type. Actually you need to compute Time +
> TimeInterval. Sorry, I am unaware if Emacs provides proper functions.
>
> There are a lot of subtle issues with time-related operations, but most
> of DST complications pointed out by Tim could be handled with IANA
> (Olson) DB for time zones, on Linux it is almost always installed as
> tzdata package and is getting regular updates. It is rather precise and
> contains history of DST and other transitions. If people complains on
> incorrect results, usually they have wrong timezone set on their computers.
>
> For astronomy the best representation should be timestamp (seconds since
> epoch) converted to local date time when necessary. Unsure concerning
> leap seconds.
>
> Human-related future events mostly should be stored as date + local time
> + label of administrative region that allows to get time zone ID (namely
> ID, not offset from UTC). Time offset could be changed after event has
> been planned, time zone could be split into several ones with distinct
> offsets.
>
> - LocalTime + TimeInterval operation could give incorrect result unless
> LocalTime is augmented with date and TimeZone, the latter is the history
> of transitions.
> - TimeZone (e.g. Europe/Berlin) as full transition history is not the
> same as TimeOffset at particular moment (+0100).
>
> Carefully choose storage format:
> - just Date e.g. for date of birth (adding time or time zone could
> distort results),
> - Date + LocalTime + Place for planned events
> - Timestamp for most events in past. Use it for future if local time is
> irrelevant, astronomical events is an example.
>
> Conversion to local time could evolve due to administrative decisions.
>
> Examples when Olson DB is not enough and additional negotiations or
> justifications are necessary:
>
> - (March, 31) - (1 month)
> - Conversion from Date + LocalTime to Timestamp around time transition
> when non-existing or ambiguous local time is possible.
>
>
>

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists




> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 11:22 PM
> From: "Marco Wahl" 
> To: steve-humphr...@gmx.com
> Cc: "Org-Mode mailing list" 
> Subject: Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists
>
> Hi Steve!
>
> > I have made two versions for calling org-agenda-time-grid, but the first 
> > does not
> > comply with what the last call does.  Yet the parameters are identical.
> >
> > (setq grid-displ '(today daily require-timed))
> > (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 100))
> > (message "tm: %s" tm)
> > (setq org-agenda-time-grid '('grid-displ 'tm
> >".." ""))
> >
> > (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((today daily require-timed)
> >(800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
> >".." ""))
>
> Possibly my last answer was not so clear.
>
> IIUC you want to use some variables (concretely grid-displ and tm)
> instead of the hardcoded values in the setting of org-agenda-time-grid.

Correct

> This is a Lisp question AFAICT.
>
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((today daily require-timed)
> (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
> ".." ""))
>
> evaluates (C-x C-e) to
>
> ((today daily require-timed) (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600
> 1700 1800 2000) ".." "")
>
> and the agenda appears as expected, I guess.
>
> Let's check the details and use some variables.
>
> (number-sequence 800 2000 100)
>
> evaluates to
>
> (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700 1800 1900 2000)
>
> LGTM.
>
> Introduce variables grid-displ and tm
>
> (setq grid-displ '(today daily require-timed))
> (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 100))
>
> Ok.
>
> Let's check some variants using those variables
>
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid '(grid-displ
> tm
> ".." ""))
>
> evaluates to
>
> (grid-displ tm ".." "")
>
> which is not the wanted value i.e. the hardcoded version above.
>
> Somehow the variables grid-displ and tm need to get evaluated before the
> setting of org-agenda-time-grid.
>
> Next try
>
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid (list grid-displ
> tm
> ".." ""))
>
> This evaluates to ((today daily require-timed) (number-sequence 800 2000
> 100) ".." "") which is closer to the hardcoded
> version above. But the number-sequence call did not happen.
>
> Function eval can do that.
>
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid (list grid-displ
> (eval tm)
> ".." ""))
>
> This evaluates (almost) to the hardcoded version above.
>
> Note that function eval is considered rather bad style and should be
> avoided if possible.

If you say so.

> Possibly you can use the setting
>
> (setq tm (number-sequence 800 2000 100))
>
> instead of
>
> (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 100))
>
> and then just use tm instead of (eval tm) to get the list of numbers.
>
> If you want to dig deeper you can study the backtick notation of lisp
> which provides an elegant notation for variable evaluation in lists.

Have used the backtick before.  Will look how I can use it for this case.

> HTH,
> --
> Marco
>

Re: org-table change time from UTC to other timezones

* Maxim Nikulin  [2020-12-11 18:45]:
> 2020-12-11 Alan E. Davis wrote:
> > 
> > I had hoped that subtracting 10 hours from 06:44 UTC would get me at
> > least -04:44.
> 
> I am in doubts how to present negative time correctly. Having in mind wall
> clocks with hands, your expectation has some sense.
> 
> I think, the source of confusion is that you are trying to use facilities
> intended for TimeInterval + TimeInterval arithmetic, where TimeInterval
> denotes a type. Actually you need to compute Time + TimeInterval. Sorry, I
> am unaware if Emacs provides proper functions.
> 
> There are a lot of subtle issues with time-related operations, but most of
> DST complications pointed out by Tim could be handled with IANA (Olson) DB
> for time zones, on Linux it is almost always installed as tzdata package and
> is getting regular updates. It is rather precise and contains history of DST
> and other transitions. If people complains on incorrect results, usually
> they have wrong timezone set on their computers.
> 
> For astronomy the best representation should be timestamp (seconds since
> epoch) converted to local date time when necessary. Unsure concerning leap
> seconds.
> 
> Human-related future events mostly should be stored as date + local time +
> label of administrative region that allows to get time zone ID (namely ID,
> not offset from UTC). Time offset could be changed after event has been
> planned, time zone could be split into several ones with distinct offsets.
> 
> - LocalTime + TimeInterval operation could give incorrect result unless
> LocalTime is augmented with date and TimeZone, the latter is the history of
> transitions.
> - TimeZone (e.g. Europe/Berlin) as full transition history is not the same
> as TimeOffset at particular moment (+0100).

Let me just comment that PostgreSQL database has date/time types such
as:

TIMESTAMP WITHOUT TIME ZONE and
TIMESTAMP WITH TIME ZONE

but all of them are stored without time zone, the difference being
that "WITH TIME ZONE" would only be displayed with specific time
zone.

Same approach can be used in other time storages, just store it as
UTC, display it as you wish.

Jean

Re: Bring up a screen giving option to open a series of orgmode files

* Maxim Nikulin  [2020-12-11 17:41]:
> 2020-12-11 Jean Louis wrote:
> > 
> > We have educational business where clients need to be brought to
> > specific references quickly without reading all the book and without
> > opening pages and wasting time. I can tell to staff members to copy 2
> > configuration files (.xpdfrc and script) in their corresponding target
> > directories or to download them there, and run xpdf with specific key
> > as a function where people press a key and describe or annotate the
> > hyperlink.
> 
> Frankly speaking, I have missed you point. I wrote that script evaluating
> feasibility of getting more context for a quote from a PDF file. If you need
> to point non-emacs users to particular place in some PDF file, browsers has
> a button to obtain a link for current view (position, scale). I do not see
> any problem to open local PDF files in browser. I have not checked however
> if format of such links is the same for Firefox and Chrome.

Relying on browser could be option here provided that browser can
invoke extenral script.

But thinking of my group of people, we use free software distributions
as endorsed by FSF we do not have neither Firefox nor Chrome. I do not
use it for freedom reasons
https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html

Maybe external groups could be handling it with other browsers, just
thinking. Maybe browsers are much more complicated and not made for
PDF browsing and speed of handling PDF with xpdf may be considerable.

I have not explored browsers for PDF reference captures.

I do like Evince, mupdf, zathura, but I will use any PDF viewer if I
have to capture specific page in specific index in the dynamic
knowledge repository on my computer. It will become possible to hire
even 10-50 people at once worldwide who then capture index items and
report to the database directly. Then I can get quickly indexed
various PDF files at once which in turn help our clients to pass the
crash course faster.

While it is easy to teach people to open single program, press a key,
and insert title, it is harder and time consuming to teach random
people how to use Emacs. This may not be true, it is just my current
impression. 

> As an even better approach, I consider merging of independently
> stored PDF file and annotations to it and presenting combined file
> with native PDF annotations. Several years ago I have not find tools
> for such operations, maybe new projects have appeared since that
> time.

Evince: click clipboard icon on the top left side, add annotations,
you can save it as independent file.

Re: from dired to an org file with list of files with links

2020-12-11 Thread Uwe Brauer


> Dear Uwe,
> * Uwe Brauer  [2020-12-10 22:45]:

> (require 'dired-x)

> (defun dired-to-org-links ()
>   "Generates Org links for Dired files and stores in memory. Yank
> it in other buffer"
>   (interactive)
>   (let* ((files (dired-get-marked-files)))
> (when files
>   (kill-new
>(with-temp-buffer
>(dolist (file files)
>  (let* ((base (file-name-nondirectory file))
> (link (format "[[file:%s][%s]]\n" file base)))
>(insert link)))
>(buffer-string))

Thanks, that is very nice. 
I played a bit around with org-fstree, that is also useful.


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Re: Bring up a screen giving option to open a series of orgmode files

* Ihor Radchenko  [2020-12-10 03:02]:
> 
> A side note: As Alan Schmitt pointed earlier, org-pdftools package
> allows creating links to specific pdf page or annotation on the page or
> to search string. It requires pdf-tools package as pdf viewer.

Thank you for the reference, it is useful in general.

Personally, the doc-view already offers easy access to pages which
allows for a function to capture Org. Thus there is no personal need
for that purpose to download extra package.

(doc-view-current-page)
(doc-view-goto-page PAGE)

Variable doc-view--current-search-matches contains query and page
number where match is found.

As you pointed it out as answer to xpdf capturing of references let me
give you good case use for xpdf versus Emacs.

We have educational business where clients need to be brought to
specific references quickly without reading all the book and without
opening pages and wasting time. I can tell to staff members to copy 2
configuration files (.xpdfrc and script) in their corresponding target
directories or to download them there, and run xpdf with specific key
as a function where people press a key and describe or annotate the
hyperlink.

That is much much easier than to tell people to open up Emacs, go
through Tutorial, use this or that M-x command or keybindings. Some of
them will be doing it so. Some will be doing straight from xpdf.

Re: Someone to oversee Org bugs as reported with M-x report-emacs-bugs?

* Bastien  [2020-12-11 09:28]:
> Thanks Jean, I agree with most of your points.
> 
> Are you volunteering for this task?

I am anyway answering to people. So I am already doing it. But I did
not copy to Org mailing list as I heard it is subscriber
based. Normally GNU mailing lists are not subscriber based.

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread tomas

On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 05:32:39AM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:

[...]

> There are problems in Org-Agenda my friend [...]

I don't know whether it's your intention (I'm assuming it's not),
but your tone comes across as pretty rude.

Cheers
 - t


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Description: Digital signature

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options




> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 4:46 PM
> From: to...@tuxteam.de
> To: daniela-s...@gmx.it
> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 03:54:01PM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:
> > Two countrymen conspiring together.
>
> Calm down. The Germans ain't after you (BTW: I may have a .de
> address -- still I am not German. On the Internet, they say,
> nobody knows you're a dog [1]).

I'm a little cat really :)

> Cheers
>
> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Internet%2C_nobody_knows_you're_a_dog
>
>  - t
>

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists


On 2020-12-11 10:45, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:


Incidentally, how can one print a list in messages buffer?


Do you mean something other than standard:

```
(message "%s" my-list)
```

I wrote some quite involved function to take a list of variables and
print them to Messages buffer, formatting them nicely.  I use it when
debugging and writing code.  However I am not sure that is what you are
looking for or not?

Cheers,
TRS-80

Re: Exporting .org to .md for Sourcehut (sr.ht); ox-md not following Markdown spec?

An update!

I am very pleased to announce, that my campaign took me only a little
less than 2 weeks to achieve success! :)

And so, from now on, not only myself but /everyone/ who prefer writing
in .org instead of .md now have a clear path to nice looking rendered
HTML which is on par with the default .md at Sourcehut![0]

This was the only real gripe I had with that platform, as I generally
love what Drew is trying to do over there and I really wanted to
continue my support and participation. And now I can!

The main issue was that in-page links, generated by exporting .org ->
.md, and then getting processed by Sourcehut's HTML renderer were
getting broken in the process. However now they are working, as can now
be seen for example at README of one of my projects:

https://sr.ht/~trs-80/rofi-in-elisp/

Please feel free to go there and click in-page links! In fact I cannot
remember the last time I got so much enjoyment from something so simple
as clicking on a working in-page link! :D

Just to re-cap, I had taken a 2 pronged approach. First was on sr.ht
mailing list[1] about trying to fix the id sanitation in anchor links.
After some discussion and a couple patches, this approach is now live
and working.

However, simultaneously, I had also been pursuing a Pandoc based
solution (which, amazingly, was /also/ broken, but for a different
reason). This second approach has now also bourne fruit in the form of
a patch and a workaround, and eventually should also become fully
supported.[2]

I include both here for the benefit of anyone who comes searching along
later.

Special thanks to Tim Cross for helping me get the exact issue nailed
down in my head so I could go forth onto other mailing lists and fora
and explain the issue with clarity.

It really feels great to make some small contribution back to the larger
Orgmode ecosystem which has given me so much.

Cheers,
TRS-80

[0] https://sourcehut.org
[1]
https://lists.sr.ht/~sircmpwn/sr.ht-discuss/%3Cfe7aa296-9c90-463d-b4e6-50eeb7e57428%40localhost%3E

[2] https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/issues/6916

Possible problem with org-agenda-time-grid

I see big differences when using the two calls to "org-agenda-time-grid"
with identical parameters.


(setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 100))
(setq org-agenda-time-grid '((today daily require-timed) 'tm
   "" ""))

(setq org-agenda-time-grid '((today daily require-timed)
   (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
   "" ""))

Regards
Steve

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options



Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no active
hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be that there
are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.


> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 9:25 AM
> From: to...@tuxteam.de
> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 05:32:39AM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> > There are problems in Org-Agenda my friend [...]
>
> I don't know whether it's your intention (I'm assuming it's not),
> but your tone comes across as pretty rude.
>
> Cheers
>  - t
>

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options





Perhaps I should be a stand up comedian!  You want to enforce some social 
repercussions
like you did with Richard Stallman?

> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 2:59 PM
> From: "Detlef Steuer" 
> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Cc: to...@tuxteam.de
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> Am Fri, 11 Dec 2020 14:47:27 +0100
> schrieb daniela-s...@gmx.it:
>
> > Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no
> > active hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be
> > that there are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.
>
> Hmm, may be he just meant, what he very politely said.
>
> Intended or not you come across in quite a rude way.
> I share that feeling of Tomas.
>
> All the best
> detlef
>
>

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread Ihor Radchenko

> ... there is no active
> hacking on org-agenda and adding new features. 

You are welcome to submit patches.

I have experimental code to use pretty-symbols in agenda and align tags
even when frame size changes [1]. However, last time I proposed this on
mailing list, there was no interest...

[1] https://orgmode.org/list/87r1v71aw0.fsf@localhost/

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options




> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 3:26 PM
> From: "Ihor Radchenko" 
> To: daniela-s...@gmx.it, to...@tuxteam.de
> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> > ... there is no active
> > hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.
>
> You are welcome to submit patches.
>
> I have experimental code to use pretty-symbols in agenda and align tags
> even when frame size changes [1]. However, last time I proposed this on
> mailing list, there was no interest...
>
> [1] https://orgmode.org/list/87r1v71aw0.fsf@localhost/

Was your patch welcomed?  Perhaps it is time to bring the topics again.
It could be that there are some criteria for patches to go on the
official version.  I have had times when I made comments and the problem
gets understood quite some time later.  At times it is wise to assume the
person reporting an encountered difficulty is aware of something you ain't.

It is- good to add patches, but at times people report something for the benefit
of everybody, not just themselves.  I should add that I resolved the problem
so have no need to argue how rude I can be.  We all know that there are many
in the community who lack social skills.  I went to one group meeting one time,
and buggered off in less than five minutes.

Regards
Daniela

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists

2020-12-11 Thread Marco Wahl

steve-humphr...@gmx.com writes:

> I am trying to insert finer timings in org-agenda with the following code.
> Haw can one pass a list in a list?
>
> (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 30))
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
>tm ".." ""))
>
>
> But this works well
>
> (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
>(800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
>".." ""))

What about

(setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 30))

vs.

(setq tm (number-sequence 800 2000 30))

?


HTH,
-- 
Marco

Re: from dired to an org file with list of files with links


On 2020-12-11 03:09, Uwe Brauer wrote:

Dear Uwe,
* Uwe Brauer  [2020-12-10 22:45]:



(require 'dired-x)



(defun dired-to-org-links ()
  "Generates Org links for Dired files and stores in memory. Yank
it in other buffer"
  (interactive)
  (let* ((files (dired-get-marked-files)))
(when files
  (kill-new
   (with-temp-buffer
 (dolist (file files)
   (let* ((base (file-name-nondirectory file))
  (link (format "[[file:%s][%s]]\n" file base)))
 (insert link)))
 (buffer-string))


Thanks, that is very nice.
I played a bit around with org-fstree, that is also useful.


Indeed, nice function!

And what great and fast service!  :)

If I may be permitted to pick a nit; Uwe, you may want to prefix the
function with `my-` or `uwe-` or your initials, etc. for namespace
reasons.  Unless of course this is something Jean Louis is planning on
submitting as a patch to dired itself... ;)

Cheers,
TRS-80

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists




> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 5:39 PM
> From: "TRS-80" 
> To: steve-humphr...@gmx.com
> Cc: "Emacs-orgmode" 
> , "Marco Wahl" 
> , "Org-Mode mailing list" 
> Subject: Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists
>
> On 2020-12-11 10:45, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:
> >
> > Incidentally, how can one print a list in messages buffer?
>
> Do you mean something other than standard:

Correct, something other than "%s".

>
> ```
> (message "%s" my-list)
> ```
> I wrote some quite involved function to take a list of variables and
> print them to Messages buffer, formatting them nicely.  I use it when
> debugging and writing code.  However I am not sure that is what you are
> looking for or not?

What is the biggest problem with printing lists that you have encountered?

> Cheers,
> TRS-80

Cheers always sounds better on a friday. :)

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread Christopher Dimech

Stick to the topic.  She encountered an org-agenda problem and she figured out 
what
was happening by herself.  And I'm sure it was not without any toil.



> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 2:59 PM
> From: "Detlef Steuer" 
> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Cc: to...@tuxteam.de
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> Am Fri, 11 Dec 2020 14:47:27 +0100
> schrieb daniela-s...@gmx.it:
>
> > Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no
> > active hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be
> > that there are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.
>
> Hmm, may be he just meant, what he very politely said.
>
> Intended or not you come across in quite a rude way.
> I share that feeling of Tomas.
>
> All the best
> detlef
>
>

Re: Bring up a screen giving option to open a series of orgmode files

2020-12-11 Thread Maxim Nikulin


2020-12-11 Jean Louis wrote:


We have educational business where clients need to be brought to
specific references quickly without reading all the book and without
opening pages and wasting time. I can tell to staff members to copy 2
configuration files (.xpdfrc and script) in their corresponding target
directories or to download them there, and run xpdf with specific key
as a function where people press a key and describe or annotate the
hyperlink.


Frankly speaking, I have missed you point. I wrote that script 
evaluating feasibility of getting more context for a quote from a PDF 
file. If you need to point non-emacs users to particular place in some 
PDF file, browsers has a button to obtain a link for current view 
(position, scale). I do not see any problem to open local PDF files in 
browser. I have not checked however if format of such links is the same 
for Firefox and Chrome.


As an even better approach, I consider merging of independently stored 
PDF file and annotations to it and presenting combined file with native 
PDF annotations. Several years ago I have not find tools for such 
operations, maybe new projects have appeared since that time.

Re: Bring up a screen giving option to open a series of orgmode files

2020-12-11 Thread Ihor Radchenko

> As an even better approach, I consider merging of independently stored 
> PDF file and annotations to it and presenting combined file with native 
> PDF annotations. Several years ago I have not find tools for such 
> operations, maybe new projects have appeared since that time.

I think hypothes.is supports pdf annotations (via pdf.js).

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists




> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 4:28 PM
> From: "Marco Wahl" 
> To: steve-humphr...@gmx.com
> Cc: "Org-Mode mailing list" 
> Subject: Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists
>
> steve-humphr...@gmx.com writes:
>
> > I am trying to insert finer timings in org-agenda with the following code.
> > Haw can one pass a list in a list?
> >
> > (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 30))
> > (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
> >tm ".." ""))
> >
> >
> > But this works well
> >
> > (setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
> >(800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
> >".." ""))
>
> What about
>
> (setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 30))
>
> vs.
>
> (setq tm (number-sequence 800 2000 30))
>
> ?

Thank you Marco.

I have made two versions for calling org-agenda-time-grid, but the first does 
not
comply with what the last call does.  Yet the parameters are identical.

(setq grid-displ '(today daily require-timed))
(setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 100))
(message "tm: %s" tm)
(setq org-agenda-time-grid '('grid-displ 'tm
   ".." ""))

(setq org-agenda-time-grid '((today daily require-timed)
   (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
   ".." ""))

Incidentally, how can one print a list in messages buffer?


> HTH,
> --
> Marco
>
>

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread tomas

On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 03:54:01PM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:
> Two countrymen conspiring together.

Calm down. The Germans ain't after you (BTW: I may have a .de
address -- still I am not German. On the Internet, they say,
nobody knows you're a dog [1]).

Cheers

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Internet%2C_nobody_knows_you're_a_dog

 - t


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread tomas

On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 02:47:27PM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:
> 
> Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no active
> hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be that there
> are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.

No need to second-guess me. As Detlef wrote in this thread,
I meant what I wrote -- no more, no less.

Cheers
 - t


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

Two countrymen conspiring together.

> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 3:43 PM
> From: to...@tuxteam.de
> To: daniela-s...@gmx.it
> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting 
> user options
>
> On Fri, Dec 11, 2020 at 02:47:27PM +0100, daniela-s...@gmx.it wrote:
> >
> > Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no active
> > hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be that there
> > are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.
>
> No need to second-guess me. As Detlef wrote in this thread,
> I meant what I wrote -- no more, no less.
>
> Cheers
>  - t
>

Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists

I am trying to insert finer timings in org-agenda with the following code.
Haw can one pass a list in a list?

(setq tm '(number-sequence 800 2000 30))
(setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
   tm ".." ""))


But this works well

(setq org-agenda-time-grid '((daily today require-timed)
   (800 900 1000 1100 1200 1300 1400 1500 1600 1700  1800 2000)
   ".." ""))

Re: org-table change time from UTC to other timezones

2020-12-11 Thread Maxim Nikulin


2020-12-11 Alan E. Davis wrote:


I had hoped that subtracting 10 hours from 06:44 UTC would get me at 
least -04:44.


I am in doubts how to present negative time correctly. Having in mind 
wall clocks with hands, your expectation has some sense.


I think, the source of confusion is that you are trying to use 
facilities intended for TimeInterval + TimeInterval arithmetic, where 
TimeInterval denotes a type. Actually you need to compute Time + 
TimeInterval. Sorry, I am unaware if Emacs provides proper functions.


There are a lot of subtle issues with time-related operations, but most 
of DST complications pointed out by Tim could be handled with IANA 
(Olson) DB for time zones, on Linux it is almost always installed as 
tzdata package and is getting regular updates. It is rather precise and 
contains history of DST and other transitions. If people complains on 
incorrect results, usually they have wrong timezone set on their computers.


For astronomy the best representation should be timestamp (seconds since 
epoch) converted to local date time when necessary. Unsure concerning 
leap seconds.


Human-related future events mostly should be stored as date + local time 
+ label of administrative region that allows to get time zone ID (namely 
ID, not offset from UTC). Time offset could be changed after event has 
been planned, time zone could be split into several ones with distinct 
offsets.


- LocalTime + TimeInterval operation could give incorrect result unless 
LocalTime is augmented with date and TimeZone, the latter is the history 
of transitions.
- TimeZone (e.g. Europe/Berlin) as full transition history is not the 
same as TimeOffset at particular moment (+0100).


Carefully choose storage format:
- just Date e.g. for date of birth (adding time or time zone could 
distort results),

- Date + LocalTime + Place for planned events
- Timestamp for most events in past. Use it for future if local time is 
irrelevant, astronomical events is an example.


Conversion to local time could evolve due to administrative decisions.

Examples when Olson DB is not enough and additional negotiations or 
justifications are necessary:


- (March, 31) - (1 month)
- Conversion from Date + LocalTime to Timestamp around time transition 
when non-existing or ambiguous local time is possible.

Re: Emacs inserts hardwired org-agenda-files variable, overwriting user options

2020-12-11 Thread Detlef Steuer

Am Fri, 11 Dec 2020 14:47:27 +0100
schrieb daniela-s...@gmx.it:

> Freak out how much you like but it occurs to me that there is no
> active hacking on org-agenda and adding new features.  Or it may be
> that there are no new ideas and you are getting upset about it.

Hmm, may be he just meant, what he very politely said.

Intended or not you come across in quite a rude way.
I share that feeling of Tomas.

All the best
detlef

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists

On 2020-12-11 11:48, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:

TRS-80 wrote:

On 2020-12-11 10:45, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:
>
> Incidentally, how can one print a list in messages buffer?

Do you mean something other than standard:

Correct, something other than "%s".

```
(message "%s" my-list)
```
I wrote some quite involved function to take a list of variables and
print them to Messages buffer, formatting them nicely.  I use it when
debugging and writing code.  However I am not sure that is what you 
are

looking for or not?

What is the biggest problem with printing lists that you have 
encountered?

I don't have any problem printing simple list.  Well, maybe one case.
If the list is too long (because you only get some part of it in
Messages buffer).  In that case, I do my function in fundamental-mode
with C-j (I think?)  which put the results in the same buffer.  Then you
can do  (or maybe it's ?) and that will expand to the full
result, if you need to look at that.

But the reason I wrote my function was because I wanted to provide short
list of (separate) variables and have them print out to nicely formatted
message as intermediate structure code and/or for debugging purposes.
Which is nothing to do with lists, per say.

Cheers always sounds better on a friday. :)

You make me thirsty all of a sudden!  :)

Cheers,
TRS-80

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists

2020-12-11 Thread Christopher Dimech

> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2020 at 6:23 PM
> From: "TRS-80" 
> To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> Subject: Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists
>
> On 2020-12-11 11:48, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:
> > TRS-80 wrote:
> >> On 2020-12-11 10:45, steve-humphr...@gmx.com wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Incidentally, how can one print a list in messages buffer?
> >>
> >> Do you mean something other than standard:
> >
> > Correct, something other than "%s".
> >
> >>
> >> ```
> >> (message "%s" my-list)
> >> ```
> >> I wrote some quite involved function to take a list of variables and
> >> print them to Messages buffer, formatting them nicely.  I use it when
> >> debugging and writing code.  However I am not sure that is what you
> >> are
> >> looking for or not?
> >
> > What is the biggest problem with printing lists that you have
> > encountered?
>
> I don't have any problem printing simple list.  Well, maybe one case.
> If the list is too long (because you only get some part of it in
> Messages buffer).  In that case, I do my function in fundamental-mode
> with C-j (I think?)  which put the results in the same buffer.  Then you
> can do  (or maybe it's ?) and that will expand to the full
> result, if you need to look at that.
>
> But the reason I wrote my function was because I wanted to provide short
> list of (separate) variables and have them print out to nicely formatted
> message as intermediate structure code and/or for debugging purposes.
> Which is nothing to do with lists, per say.

Perhaps you might get some ideas from
https://github.com/oantolin/icomplete-vertical

> > Cheers always sounds better on a friday. :)
>
> You make me thirsty all of a sudden!  :)

:)

> Cheers,
> TRS-80
>
>

Bug: org-capture does not work if called from minibuffer [9.4 (9.4-55-g706ba9-elpaplus @ /home/omarantolin/.emacs.d/elpa/org-plus-contrib-20201207/)]

2020-12-11 Thread Omar Antolín Camarena



Remember to cover the basics, that is, what you expected to happen and
what in fact did happen.  You don't know how to make a good report?  See

 https://orgmode.org/manual/Feedback.html#Feedback

Your bug report will be posted to the Org mailing list.


I have enable-recursive-minibuffers set to t, and just noticed that
org-capture does not work if called from the minibuffer.

Steps to reproduce:

1. run emacs -Q
2. evaluate (setq enable-recursive-minibuffers t) in the scratch buffer
3. Open the minibuffer, say by using C-x C-f
4. While still in find-file, run M-x org-capture and pick a template (t for 
Task seems to be offered by default).

You should get an error message saying "Can't expand minibuffer to full frame".

Emacs  : GNU Emacs 28.0.50 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.5, 
cairo version 1.16.0)
 of 2020-10-13, unofficial emacs-snapshot build: http://emacs.ganneff.de/, git 
commit 8d241e8840fdb02dcfce52425626dd8f2125e51a
Package: Org mode version 9.4 (9.4-55-g706ba9-elpaplus @ 
/home/omarantolin/.emacs.d/elpa/org-plus-contrib-20201207/)

[PATCH][9.4] Mention org-adapt-indentation as escape hatch in ORG-NEWS

2020-12-11 Thread Kévin Le Gouguec

If it's not too late for this to make it into 27.2, I think this could
make dealing with the electric-indent-mode kerfuffle easier for
unsuspecting users.

>From 829a98c8ee4ba8b914b9ac81bae510ae6f2820aa Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: =?UTF-8?q?K=C3=A9vin=20Le=20Gouguec?= 
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2020 19:47:37 +0100
Subject: [PATCH] Offer alternative to disabling electric-indent-mode

* etc/ORG-NEWS (=RET= and =C-j= now obey ~electric-indent-mode~):
Mention alternative values for org-adapt-indentation.
---
 etc/ORG-NEWS | 4 
 1 file changed, 4 insertions(+)

diff --git a/etc/ORG-NEWS b/etc/ORG-NEWS
index 0ed626fb7..b8c6e9d3b 100644
--- a/etc/ORG-NEWS
+++ b/etc/ORG-NEWS
@@ -234,6 +234,10 @@ explicitly:
 (add-hook 'org-mode-hook (lambda () (electric-indent-local-mode -1)))
 #+end_src
 
+Alternatively, if you wish to keep =RET= as the "smart-return" key,
+but dislike Org's default indentation of sections, you may prefer to
+customize ~org-adapt-indentation~ to either =nil= or ='headline-data=.
+
 *** =ob-C.el= allows the inclusion of non-system header files
 
 In C and C++ blocks, ~:includes~ arguments that do not start with a
-- 
2.29.2

Re: Using org-agenda-time-grid with lists