Re: profiling latency in large org-mode buffers (under both main & org-fold feature)

[Ihor Radchenko]

Max Nikulin  writes:

> Thank you, Ihor. I am still not motivated enough to read whole page but 
> searching for "interval" (earlier I tried "overlay") resulted in the 
> following message:
>
> Message-ID:   <9206230917.aa16...@mole.gnu.ai.mit.edu>
> Date: Tue, 23 Jun 92 05:17:33 -0400
> From: r...@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Richard Stallman)
>
> describing tree balancing problem in GNU Emacs and linear search in lucid.
>
> Unfortunately there is no "id" or "name" anchors in the file suitable to 
> specify precise location. Even the link href is broken.

I think we have a misunderstanding here. That page does not contain much
of technical details. Rather a history. AFAIU, initially Emacs wanted to
implement balanced tree structure to store overlays, but the effort
stalled for a long time. Then, a company rolled out a simple list
storage causing a lot of contradiction related to FSF and a mojor Emacs
fork. At the end, the initial effort using balanced tree on GNU Emacs
side did not go anywhere and GNU Emacs eventually copied a simple list
approach that is backfiring now, when Org buffers actually do contain a
large numbers of overlays.

> Actually I suspect that markers may have a similar problem during regexp 
> searches. I am curious if it is possible to invoke a kind of "vacuum" 
> (in SQL parlance). Folding all headings and resetting refile cache does 
> not restore performance to the initial state at session startup. Maybe 
> it is effect of incremental searches.

I doubt that markers have anything to do with regexp search itself
(directly). They should only come into play when editing text in buffer,
where their performance is also O(N_markers).

Best,
Ihor

Re: [BUG] Prompted to submit (unsure what happened) [9.5.2 (9.5.2-g072523 @ /Users/apc/.emacs.d/straight/build/org/)]

[Ihor Radchenko]

Alejandro Pérez Carballo  writes:

> One more question: wouldn't replacing `org-in-src-block-p' with a function 
> that calls `org-in-src-block-p' only when in org-mode and returns `nil' 
> elsewhere suffice to make something that's like `org-in-src-block-p' but that 
> will work outside org-mode? E.g.: 
>
> (defun my/org-in-src-block-p ( arg)
>   (if (derived-mode-p 'org-mode)
>   (org-in-src-block-p)
> nil))

>From the docstring of electric-quote-inhibit-functions, a function
returning nil will have no effect. So, you should be safe to use your
function.

A slightly more concise version would be using when instead of if.
Also, unused function arguments are defined as "_" by convention.
Adding a docstring to all your function is a good habit to cultivate.

(defun my/org-in-src-block-p ( _)
  "Call `org-in-src-block-p' when in `org-mode' and return nil otherwise."
  (when (derived-mode-p 'org-mode)
(org-in-src-block-p)))

Best,
Ihor

Re: Links to javascript-based websites from orgmode.org: Paypal and Github

[Ihor Radchenko]

CCing RMS as this discussion might be of interest for him.
The previous emails in the thread are in
https://list.orgmode.org/b074b191-b06f-928d-284c-7a7ee5d97...@ctpowe.net/T/#u

Bastien Guerry  writes:

> Thanks for raising this issues.
>
> Ihor Radchenko  writes:
>
>> Fair point. Paypal requires non-free javascript. Github as well,
>> AFAIK.
>
> I've removed the GitHub Sponsors and Paypal links from orgmode.org.

To clarify, I did not intend to make you remove those links, but rather
wanted to hear your opinion and open a discussion.

As Michael pointed out, https://my.fsf.org/donate itself contains a
paypal payment option:

>> PayPal (not recommended: requires nonfree JavaScript)

Given the apparent contradictory statement in the GNU Coding Standards
(section 8), I feel that either we misunderstand something or the
standards should be updated adding guidelines for the donation services.

Donations (maybe except certain cryptocurrencies) are inherently
non-free because even for direct bank transfers users are often forced
to use bank "security" apps. At the same time, limiting the donation
options will do a lot of harm to FSF projects - cryprocurrency entry
barriers are too high for many users to donate even if they wish to and
not all the countries allow crypto legally.

The entry barriers are important. From my own experience, compared to
just bank details, some online payment made a difference in my decisions
to donate. Easy and familiar web services really facilitate actual
donations (as well as feedback from new users).

I wish there were more easy donation options for an ordinary user to
donate to FSF projects without a need to rely on non-free software. Note
that even liberapay, while providing bank transfer payments, also offers
paypal. Yet, it is the best option I am aware of. Maybe FSF could step
up providing such service?

> I've not removed the link to https://liberapay.com: I suppose it is
> usable without requiring non-free Javascript, but I've not checked.
> If someone wants to check, that'd be appreciated.

I just tried to setup a payment via liberapay using firefox with librejs
extension. I was unable to complete the card payment. It appears that
card payment service liberapay is using requires non-free javascript. I
might be wrong though. It was the first time I actually tried using
liberapay.

In any case, given FSF website providing paypal option, liberapay should
not be an issue. But it leaves us with no real option to allow _easy_
donations yet committing to FSF guidelines.

> I've not removed every links to github.com on orgmode.org: e.g. the
> link to TEC's homepage at the bottom of the website is still here.
>
> The reason is that browsing TEC's GitHub profile does not require
> non-free Javascript: I can browse it fine with M-x eww.

> I guess we shall remove references to non-free software (like the
> Sublime Text editor - I will do this later on.)

Sounds reasonable.

>> However, WORG contains links to various blogs, reddit,
>> stackoverflow, and even youtube and it feels right. I notice that I
>> am confused. I would like to hear Bastien's opinion on the topic.
>
> Here is my view on this: the orgmode.org website is part of the GNU
> project because Org is part of the GNU project, hence the root pages
> of https://orgmode.org should follow the GNU standards.
>
> Worg is different: it is a community-driven documentation about Org.
> Even though worg contents are licensed under GNU FDL, they are not
> part of the GNU project.
>
> If needed, we can make this clearer on the website or even host worg
> on a dedicated domain name.

If we really want to be very strict about following FSF, we might advice
users about alternative ways to view youtube (invidious/youtube-dl). I
just tried stackoverflow and reddit via librejs. The links there can be
opened and be read. I do not think that we need to care much about
commenting.

Best,
Ihor

Re: Links to javascript-based websites from orgmode.org: Paypal and Github

[Bastien Guerry]

Thanks for raising this issues.

Ihor Radchenko  writes:

> Fair point. Paypal requires non-free javascript. Github as well,
> AFAIK.

I've removed the GitHub Sponsors and Paypal links from orgmode.org.

I've not removed the link to https://liberapay.com: I suppose it is
usable without requiring non-free Javascript, but I've not checked.
If someone wants to check, that'd be appreciated.

I've not removed every links to github.com on orgmode.org: e.g. the
link to TEC's homepage at the bottom of the website is still here.

The reason is that browsing TEC's GitHub profile does not require
non-free Javascript: I can browse it fine with M-x eww.

I guess we shall remove references to non-free software (like the
Sublime Text editor - I will do this later on.)

> While orgmode.org is not developed in the same repository with the Org
> mode itself, I have a gut feeling that we still have to follow GNU
> coding standards on the website. 

Yes -- please report other problems for orgmode.org.

> However, WORG contains links to various blogs, reddit,
> stackoverflow, and even youtube and it feels right. I notice that I
> am confused. I would like to hear Bastien's opinion on the topic.

Here is my view on this: the orgmode.org website is part of the GNU
project because Org is part of the GNU project, hence the root pages
of https://orgmode.org should follow the GNU standards.

Worg is different: it is a community-driven documentation about Org.
Even though worg contents are licensed under GNU FDL, they are not
part of the GNU project.

If needed, we can make this clearer on the website or even host worg
on a dedicated domain name.

-- 
 Bastien

Re: Inserting links stored in `org-store-link-plist`

[Alejandro Pérez Carballo]

Thanks for the suggestions! Will have a look. 

Best, 

A. 

> On Feb 25, 2022, at 8:25 AM, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> 
> On 25/02/2022 04:11, Alejandro Pérez Carballo wrote:
>> Thanks for your reply. I can store the ID calling `org-store-link'
>> if `org-id-link-to-org-use-id' is set to a non-nil value. But I wanted to be 
>> able to have `org-id-link-to-org-use-id' set to nil and
>> also have a function to store an ID link. (I make use of ID only in
>> certain files and try to avoid them otherwise, preferring the default
>> method of using a link to the file with a search string pointing to
>> the current line in most cases.)
> 
> I have no idea what interface `org-store-link' should have to be really 
> flexible and convenient.
> 
> Have you considered file- (or directory-) local variables?
> info "(emacs) Specifying File Variables"
> https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Specifying-File-Variables.html
> 
> # Local Variables:
> # org-id-link-to-org-use-id: use-existing
> # End:
> 
> at the end of specific files.
> 
>> I had expected that `org-insert-link' would be able to retrieve links stored 
>> both with `org-store-link' and `org-id-store-link'—it
>> seemed like a natural assumption, perhaps because I do not know of
>> other reasons for having an interactive function that stores links
>> aside from being able to insert them later?
> I can not say that I am happy with implementation of `org-store-link' or that 
> I fully understand ideas behind ol.el. I just found an example of 
> `org-id-store-link' usage:
> https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/org-contrib/tree/master/item/lisp/org-contacts.el#L1171
> see definition of "org-contact" link a bit above as well.

Protect Org export from auto-formatting hooks

[David Lukeš]

Hi all,

I recently started using non-Pandoc Org exports to HTML and ODT and
noticed some problems on my macOS 12.2.1 box. Non-ASCII characters were
coming out garbled, the whitespace around footnotes was getting
rewritten in weird ways. On my Linux boxes, the same export commands
went fine, so I thought this must be related to some encoding
assumptions Org makes that are slightly different on the two platforms.

Armed with my very limited knowledge of Emacs, Org Mode and Elisp, I
decided to dig into the Org codebase and try to figure out where the
corruption was happening. However, this turned out to be a wild goose
chase – up until the last moment where Org hands off to `write-file’ to
write the export to disk, the contents was fine.

Wanting to confirm this, I tried exporting to a buffer, where indeed,
the contents looked perfectly alright. *But as soon as I saved the
buffer, it got mangled.* This finally made me realize that the culprit
was somewhere else: in my auto-formatting setup. Before that, I hadn’t
realized that Org exports are done via a buffer, so I had no idea that
on-save hooks are run. But knowing this, everything started falling into
place.

It turned out to be a perfect storm of trickiness: I’m using Doom Emacs,
so I’d just enabled autoformatting via `(format +onsave)’. I don’t care
about HTML or XML formatting and never manually installed an
auto-formatter for those, so I was surprised to see the export
reformatted on save. The reason: macOS ships `tidy’ in its base
distribution, so it gets picked up as an auto-formatting provider.
Unfortunately, it’s a really old version (2006) which wreaks havoc on
non-ASCII UTF-8 bytes (details in [this Doom Emacs issue], if you’re
interested).

However, even a recent version of `tidy’ can have undesirable effects on
the export. For instance, I’ve confirmed that those aforementioned
footnote-related whitespace issues in ODT exports persist, even after
installing a new version of `tidy’ which handles UTF-8 correctly. This
is presumably due to `tidy’ re-arranging the XML in ways that affect
whitespace.

So I think Org should try to protect the export buffer from these
shenanigans as much as possible. The best way I can think of to achieve
that is to keep the export buffer in fundamental mode. This should
prevent all the mode-related code from running, potentially even making
the export speedier.

After some experimenting, the way I finally got this to work was by
locally overriding the `set-auto-mode’ function:

┌
│ diff --git a/lisp/ox.el b/lisp/ox.el
│ index 2a3edaa50..d5a77c26e 100644
│ --- a/lisp/ox.el
│ +++ b/lisp/ox.el
│ @@ -6462,14 +6462,16 @@ or FILE."
│   ',ext-plist)))
│ (with-temp-buffer
│   (insert output)
│ - (let ((coding-system-for-write ',encoding))
│ + (cl-letf ((coding-system-for-write ',encoding)
│ +   ((symbol-function 'set-auto-mode) #'ignore))
│ (write-file ,file)))
│ (or (ignore-errors (funcall ',post-process ,file)) ,file)))
│  (let ((output (org-export-as
│ backend subtreep visible-only body-only
ext-plist)))
│(with-temp-buffer
│  (insert output)
│ -(let ((coding-system-for-write encoding))
│ +(cl-letf ((coding-system-for-write encoding)
│ +  ((symbol-function 'set-auto-mode) #'ignore))
│(write-file file)))
│(when (and (org-export--copy-to-kill-ring-p) (org-string-nw-p
output))
│  (org-kill-new output))
└

What are your thoughts? Is this desirable? In my mind, yes: even if
someone has configured auto-formatting manually, they might still not
realize it’s getting run in a hidden buffer they never get to see. After
all, this is an implementation detail – if Emacs had a built-in function
to write a string to a file, I presume that would get used instead?

(In a way, I was lucky that I encountered quite noticeable issues with
mangled characters. With the recent version of tidy, which only messes
up whitespace, I might not have noticed at all.)

And if such protection is desirable, is this the best way to do it? Or
can you come up with a better approach?

Anyway, thanks for reading this far :)

Best,

David


[this Doom Emacs issue]

Re: Inserting links stored in `org-store-link-plist`

[Max Nikulin]

On 25/02/2022 04:11, Alejandro Pérez Carballo wrote:

Thanks for your reply. I can store the ID calling `org-store-link'
if `org-id-link-to-org-use-id' is set to a non-nil value. But I 
wanted to be able to have `org-id-link-to-org-use-id' set to nil and

also have a function to store an ID link. (I make use of ID only in
certain files and try to avoid them otherwise, preferring the default
method of using a link to the file with a search string pointing to
the current line in most cases.)


I have no idea what interface `org-store-link' should have to be really 
flexible and convenient.


Have you considered file- (or directory-) local variables?
info "(emacs) Specifying File Variables"
https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Specifying-File-Variables.html

# Local Variables:
# org-id-link-to-org-use-id: use-existing
# End:

at the end of specific files.

I had expected that `org-insert-link' would be able to retrieve 
links stored both with `org-store-link' and `org-id-store-link'—it

seemed like a natural assumption, perhaps because I do not know of
other reasons for having an interactive function that stores links
aside from being able to insert them later?
I can not say that I am happy with implementation of `org-store-link' or 
that I fully understand ideas behind ol.el. I just found an example of 
`org-id-store-link' usage:

https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/org-contrib/tree/master/item/lisp/org-contacts.el#L1171
see definition of "org-contact" link a bit above as well.

Re: ox-publish: no HTML output but no errors

[Max Nikulin]

On 25/02/2022 21:14, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:


I tried to use ox-publish to create HTML files out of my org files 
[ ... ]


The output directory is empty but I also do not have a valuable error 
output. On that point I did not know where to go.


[ ... ]

  39 user-error: Unable to resolve link: 
"c6693020-d065-4d4f-8be8-650c66eee3e6"


I have round about 50 org files in my archive. There is one error about 
a dead link. But this should be no problem. Dead links are OK for me and 
also a "valid content" in the context of a Zettelkasten. A dead link is 
not a reason to stop the whole process.


Some users may consider a broken link as a fatal error. If you need 
different behavior, you can get it. See info "(org) Export Settings" 
https://orgmode.org/manual/Export-Settings.html for "broken-links".

[BUG] org-insert-link should use DEFAULT in read-string when asking for description

[Visuwesh]

Currently, when asking the user for the description of link,
`org-insert-link' calls `read-string' with a non-nil INITIAL-INPUT but
this argument is discouraged and deprecated; moreover, it is unfriendly.

`org-insert-link' should, ideally, use the DEFAULT argument.  If the
user decides that the suggested description is okay, they can type M-n.

Regards

Emacs  : GNU Emacs 29.0.50 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, cairo 
version 1.16.0, Xaw scroll bars)
Package: Org mode version 9.5.2 (release_9.5.2-9-g7ba24c @ 
/nix/store/0m0yw7b3zly74ljs3qmkblb780xg03id-emacs-git-20220130.0/share/emacs/29.0.50/lisp/org/)

Re: Links to javascript-based websites from orgmode.org: Paypal and Github (was: Communication problems and possible problems with the website)

[Michael Powe]

Hello,

There's an old joke, that C allows you to blow your own foot off, and 
C++ allows you to blow off the whole leg. The FSF is like the C++ of the 
free software world. Whatever your feelings about PayPal - I avoid it 
like plague - it's ubiquitous in the web world of donations. In fact, 
you can find it on https://my.fsf.org/donate. All, or nearly all, 
packages that I use in Emacs are hosted on GitHub. Oh my, what's this? 
https://github.com/emacs-mirror/emacs! Say it isn't so!


Years ago, the Debian team started a huge dust-up by threatening to 
exclude GCC documentation from its distribution because its license 
wasn't "free enough." Let's not drive down that road.


We didn't make this world, but we live in it.

Thanks.

mp

On 2/25/2022 10:14, Ihor Radchenko wrote:

c.bu...@posteo.jp writes:


Am 25.02.2022 15:18 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:

Org has no official GitHub page. This is partially a requirement from
Free Software Foundation:
https://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#References

I totally and absolute support that FSF requirement.

In that case I would say org-mode does violate that requirement because
there is a GitHub and a PayPal link on the landing page. And on the Worg
page (which is "official" from the new users point of view) there is
also a GitHub link.
It does not matter that there is not code on GitHub and that this is
only for sponsoring/donations. You have the link and the logo so you
"promote" that stuff that the FSF do not want you to promote.

Fair point. Paypal requires non-free javascript. Github as well, AFAIK.

At the same time, according to GNU Coding standards:


A web page recommends a program in an implicit but particularly
strong way if it requires users to run that program in order to use
the page. Many pages contain Javascript code which they recommend in
this way. This Javascript code may be free or nonfree, but nonfree is
the usual case.

If the purpose for which you would refer to the page cannot be
carried out without running nonfree Javascript code, then you should
not refer to it. Thus, if the purpose of referring to the page is for
people to view a video, or subscribing to a mailing list, and the
viewing or subscribing fail to work if the user’s browser blocks the
nonfree Javascript code, then don’t refer to that page.

The extreme case is that of web sites which depend on nonfree
Javascript code even to see the contents of the pages. Any site
hosted on ‘wix.com’ has this problem, and so do some other sites.
Referring people to such pages to read their contents is, in effect,
urging them to run those nonfree programs—so please don’t refer to
those pages. (Such pages also break the Web, so they deserve
condemnation for two reasons.)

While orgmode.org is not developed in the same repository with the Org
mode itself, I have a gut feeling that we still have to follow GNU
coding standards on the website. However, WORG contains links to various
blogs, reddit, stackoverflow, and even youtube and it feels right. I
notice that I am confused. I would like to hear Bastien's opinion on the
topic.

Best,
Ihor



--
"Do not neglect to do good, and to share what you have." - Hebrews 13:16a
Michael Powe
Naugatuck CT USA
po...@ctpowe.net

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Russell Adams]

On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 02:24:53PM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:
> Dear Ihor
>
> Am 25.02.2022 15:18 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:
> > Org has no official GitHub page. This is partially a requirement from
> > Free Software Foundation:
> > https://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#References
>
> I totally and absolute support that FSF requirement.
>
> In that case I would say org-mode does violate that requirement because
> there is a GitHub and a PayPal link on the landing page.

Those are links to supporting our maintainers. Not a project repo.

> And on the Worg page (which is "official" from the new users point
> of view) there is also a GitHub link.  It does not matter that there
> is not code on GitHub and that this is only for
> sponsoring/donations. You have the link and the logo so you
> "promote" that stuff that the FSF do not want you to promote.

I think that's a bit hazy, as they are services and not software. The
standards specify not to promote non-free software. While I don't like
Github at all, in this context it's only for the sponsorship
solution. That's a service like Paypal.

I'm not sure what a clear answer is here. I don't like having any
mention of Github and non-free services myself, but I respect that we
need to support the maintainers and that may require using common
services.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com

PGP Key ID: 0x1160DCB3   http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3

Links to javascript-based websites from orgmode.org: Paypal and Github (was: Communication problems and possible problems with the website)

[Ihor Radchenko]

c.bu...@posteo.jp writes:

> Am 25.02.2022 15:18 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:
>> Org has no official GitHub page. This is partially a requirement from
>> Free Software Foundation:
>> https://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#References
>
> I totally and absolute support that FSF requirement.
>
> In that case I would say org-mode does violate that requirement because 
> there is a GitHub and a PayPal link on the landing page. And on the Worg 
> page (which is "official" from the new users point of view) there is 
> also a GitHub link.
> It does not matter that there is not code on GitHub and that this is 
> only for sponsoring/donations. You have the link and the logo so you 
> "promote" that stuff that the FSF do not want you to promote.

Fair point. Paypal requires non-free javascript. Github as well, AFAIK.

At the same time, according to GNU Coding standards:

>> A web page recommends a program in an implicit but particularly
>> strong way if it requires users to run that program in order to use
>> the page. Many pages contain Javascript code which they recommend in
>> this way. This Javascript code may be free or nonfree, but nonfree is
>> the usual case.
>> 
>> If the purpose for which you would refer to the page cannot be
>> carried out without running nonfree Javascript code, then you should
>> not refer to it. Thus, if the purpose of referring to the page is for
>> people to view a video, or subscribing to a mailing list, and the
>> viewing or subscribing fail to work if the user’s browser blocks the
>> nonfree Javascript code, then don’t refer to that page.
>> 
>> The extreme case is that of web sites which depend on nonfree
>> Javascript code even to see the contents of the pages. Any site
>> hosted on ‘wix.com’ has this problem, and so do some other sites.
>> Referring people to such pages to read their contents is, in effect,
>> urging them to run those nonfree programs—so please don’t refer to
>> those pages. (Such pages also break the Web, so they deserve
>> condemnation for two reasons.)

While orgmode.org is not developed in the same repository with the Org
mode itself, I have a gut feeling that we still have to follow GNU
coding standards on the website. However, WORG contains links to various
blogs, reddit, stackoverflow, and even youtube and it feels right. I
notice that I am confused. I would like to hear Bastien's opinion on the
topic.

Best,
Ihor

Re: Org mode profiling meetup on Sat, Feb 26 (was: profiling latency in large org-mode buffers (under both main & org-fold feature))

[Ihor Radchenko]

Ihor Radchenko  writes:

> Dear all,
>
> Since there is at least a couple of people who might be interested, lets
> try to meet online on jitsi and debug performance issues you experience
> because of Org mode. Probably some time this Saturday (Feb 26). I am
> thinking about 9pm SG time (4pm Moscow; 8am New York; 1pm London). WDYT?
>
> Participants should preferably install the latest Org version from main.
> Older versions are also ok, but will be less of priority.

I will post the link one hour before the meeting start.

Best,
Ihor

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Russell Adams]

On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 12:48:17PM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:
> Am 25.02.2022 13:30 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:
> > If you think that the current wording is confusing, please point out
> > which parts. We are pretty much blind here on the potential issues for
> > the newcomers (for obvious reason - we are too familiar with Org).
> > Pointing to the confusing parts would help a lot.
>
> The text in the buffer after M-x org-submit-bugreport says in the first
> line "You are about to submit a bug report to the Org mailing list".
> This does not explain how this is done. As a (very fresh not Emacs
> familiar) user I wouldn't assume that I have to setup my Emacs as a mail
> client in that case. I would assume that there is some magic in behind.
> ;)
>
> Just write something like "Make sure your Emacs is setup to send emails
> or copy and paste the resulting buffer into an Email client of your
> choice."

Pardon. M-x report-emacs-bug opens a side panel which clearly states
you can copy the message content out for another email program.

Perhaps we should update the information popup in
org-submit-bugreport. Can you recommend some additional explaination?

> >> It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code
>
> But the front-page and the Install are not the place where I would
> expect infos like that. Repos are for contributers not for users.

Are they? Many Emacs users pull direct from repos, which is why it's
front and center on the main orgmode site.

I think the difference here is between users and developers, where in
Emacs many users are developers and use tools like Git daily.

> In contribute the git thing is explained in "Details on how to submit
> patches" but there is a repo url missing.

I think we should consider adding the repo to the top of contribute as
well. Good idea.

> btw: I would suggest to create links or mirror repos on your GitHub
> page.

This could be done in Worg.

> > Do you recall the urls where you tried to search for the source code?
>
> I searched behind the GitHub link (right top corner of the website)
> first.
> I searched around on savannah but still have problems with the
> interface; which is another topic.
>
> The point is that the users have to search (e.g. DuckDuckGo) because the
> links to the repo or to description that there is no public repo are not
> at the usual (compared to most of the other FOSS projects) places.

I agree this is rather confusing. I think maybe we should consider
creating a comprehensive list of repos on Worg.


--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com

PGP Key ID: 0x1160DCB3   http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3

ox-publish: no HTML output but no errors

[c . buhtz]

Hello,

I tried to use ox-publish to create HTML files out of my org files 
(created via org-roam v2) using the Tutorial 
https://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-publish-html-tutorial.html .


The output directory is empty but I also do not have a valuable error 
output. On that point I did not know where to go.
I evaluatet the code (below) via C-x C-e and then did M-x 
org-publish-project RET org RET.


The message buffers looks like this

20 (("org-notes" :base-directory "~/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/" 
:base-extension "org" :publishing-directory "~/tab-cloud/_transfer/html" 
:recursive t :publishing-function org-html-publish-to-html :\
headline-levels ...) ("org-static" :base-directory 
"~/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/" :base-extension 
"css\\|js\\|png\\|jpg\\|gif\\|pdf\\|mp3\\|ogg\\|swf" 
:publishing-directory "~/tab-cloud/_transfe\
r/html" :recursive t :publishing-function org-publish-attachment) 
("org" :components ("org-notes" "org-static")))

 21 Loading /home/user/.org-timestamps/org-notes.cache...done
 22 Publishing file 
/home/user/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/20211109001227-programming_languages.org 
using ‘org-html-publish-to-html’

 23 48 files scanned, 45 files contains IDs, and 47 IDs found.
 24 45 files scanned, 45 files contains IDs, and 47 IDs found. [6 times]
 25 user-error: Unable to resolve link: 
"c6693020-d065-4d4f-8be8-650c66eee3e6"
 37 Publishing file 
/home/user/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/20211109001227-programming_languages.org 
using ‘org-html-publish-to-html’

 38 45 files scanned, 45 files contains IDs, and 47 IDs found. [7 times]
 39 user-error: Unable to resolve link: 
"c6693020-d065-4d4f-8be8-650c66eee3e6"


This is the piece of code (in scratch buffer) IMHO very near to the 
tutorials example


;https://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-publish-html-tutorial.html
(require 'ox-publish)
(setq org-publish-project-alist
  '(
   ("org-notes"
   :base-directory "~/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/"
   :base-extension "org"
   :publishing-directory "~/tab-cloud/_transfer/html"
   :recursive t
   :publishing-function org-html-publish-to-html
   :headline-levels 4 ; Just the default for this 
project.

   :auto-preamble t
  )
  ("org-static"
   :base-directory "~/tab-cloud/my.org-roam/"
   :base-extension 
"css\\|js\\|png\\|jpg\\|gif\\|pdf\\|mp3\\|ogg\\|swf"

   :publishing-directory "~/tab-cloud/_transfer/html"
   :recursive t
   :publishing-function org-publish-attachment
  )
  ("org" :components ("org-notes" "org-static"))
  )
)

I have round about 50 org files in my archive. There is one error about 
a dead link. But this should be no problem. Dead links are OK for me and 
also a "valid content" in the context of a Zettelkasten. A dead link is 
not a reason to stop the whole process.


The "html" folder is absolute empty. Nothing in there.

How can I go on with diagnosis?

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[c . buhtz]

Dear Ihor

Am 25.02.2022 15:18 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:

Org has no official GitHub page. This is partially a requirement from
Free Software Foundation:
https://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#References


I totally and absolute support that FSF requirement.

In that case I would say org-mode does violate that requirement because 
there is a GitHub and a PayPal link on the landing page. And on the Worg 
page (which is "official" from the new users point of view) there is 
also a GitHub link.
It does not matter that there is not code on GitHub and that this is 
only for sponsoring/donations. You have the link and the logo so you 
"promote" that stuff that the FSF do not want you to promote.


Kind,
Christian

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Ihor Radchenko]

c.bu...@posteo.jp writes:

> The text in the buffer after M-x org-submit-bugreport says in the first 
> line "You are about to submit a bug report to the Org mailing list".
> This does not explain how this is done. As a (very fresh not Emacs 
> familiar) user I wouldn't assume that I have to setup my Emacs as a mail 
> client in that case. I would assume that there is some magic in behind. 
> ;)
>
> Just write something like "Make sure your Emacs is setup to send emails 
> or copy and paste the resulting buffer into an Email client of your 
> choice."

Thanks! This makes sense. We should probably modify
org-submit-bug-report docstring, the prompts, and the email template.

>>> It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code 
>>> of
>>> the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch 
>>> for
>>> 2.
>> 
>> This is confusing. If you go to orgmode.org, the git link is in the 
>> front
>> page. Also, orgmode.org -> Install will bring you to the relevant page
>> of the manual, which provides all possible installation options
>> including cloning the official git repo.
>
> But the front-page and the Install are not the place where I would 
> expect infos like that. Repos are for contributers not for users.
> Users are reading "Install" and sometimes the front-page. I have not 
> read the front-page but clicked on contribute.
> In contribute the git thing is explained in "Details on how to submit 
> patches" but there is a repo url missing.

Fair point. We need someone to make a patch for
https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html Probably adding the git
repo links to Org mode, WORG, and the orgmode.org website:
git clone git://git.sv.gnu.org/emacs/org-mode.git
git clone https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg
git clone https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/orgweb

>> Similarly, https://orgmode.org/worg/ has the links to its code in the
>> first heading:
>> 
 Worg documentation on your machine
 git clone https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg
>
> Definitly my fault.
>
> btw: I would suggest to create links or mirror repos on your GitHub 
> page.

Org has no official GitHub page. This is partially a requirement from
Free Software Foundation:
https://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#References

I think that we might create some kind of mirror given that it is only
used as means to redirect users to this mailing list, but we will need
(1) have a volunteer ready to accept github legal terms and take care
about the mirror; (2) consult FSF. I would like to hear opinions from
other contributors on this idea.

>> Do you recall the urls where you tried to search for the source code?
>
> I searched behind the GitHub link (right top corner of the website) 
> first.
> I searched around on savannah but still have problems with the 
> interface; which is another topic.
>
> The point is that the users have to search (e.g. DuckDuckGo) because the 
> links to the repo or to description that there is no public repo are not 
> at the usual (compared to most of the other FOSS projects) places.

I understand your concern. We may probably add a link to "Contribute"
page as a "git" image in the top right corner. (and maybe rename
"Contribute" to "Feedback"). Alternative suggestions are also welcome. I
will let Timothy/Bastien decide on this.

Also, for some context (I do not imply that we should not update the
website to make it more familiar to users).

Org mode was

>> Created by Carsten Dominik in 2003, maintained by Bastien Guerry and
>> developed by many others.

while Github was

>>  LaunchedApril 10, 2008; 13 years ago

:P

Best,
Ihor

Re: org-cite and org-ref-cite

[Eric S Fraga]

On Friday, 25 Feb 2022 at 08:50, Henrik Frisk wrote:
> The only thing I can't seem to sort out is to change the style of the
> citation. Regardless where I do it I get the error "Wrong type
> argument: org-cite-processor,"

It would help if you could post a minimal example.

>
> Another question: if I would like to export to LaTeX but with citation
> commands rather than formated citations, would that be possible? I am
> sorry if I'm missing something obviuos.

Yes, definitely possible.  I have the following:

#+cite_export: bibtex plain

which does the job very well for LaTeX export.
-- 
: Eric S Fraga, with org release_9.5.2-385-g37d8bc in Emacs 29.0.50

[PATCH] oc-basic.el: Better handling of CSL-JSON dates

[David Lukes]

* lisp/oc-basic.el (org-cite-basic--parse-json): Make date-parsing and
year extraction more resilient.  Provide more informative errors when it
fails.

A string-based date is not only indicated by the key 'raw, but also
possibly by the key 'literal.

String-based dates come in various formats, not necessarily -mm-dd.
So extracting the first sequence of 4 digits is arguably a better
heuristic for getting the publication year than splitting the string on
- and getting the car of that.

On error, include `value' in the message, which contains the original
value with actionable information, whereas the previously included
`date' is always nil in that case.

TINYCHANGE
---
 lisp/oc-basic.el | 20 ++--
 1 file changed, 14 insertions(+), 6 deletions(-)

diff --git a/lisp/oc-basic.el b/lisp/oc-basic.el
index d82406aff..81b7e4471 100644
--- a/lisp/oc-basic.el
+++ b/lisp/oc-basic.el
@@ -178,21 +178,29 @@ Return a hash table with citation references as keys and 
fields alist as values.
  " and ")))
  ('issued
   ;; Date are expressed as an array
-  ;; (`date-parts') or a "string (`raw').
-  ;; In both cases, extract the year and
-  ;; associate it to `year' field, for
-  ;; compatibility with BibTeX format.
+  ;; (`date-parts') or a "string (`raw'
+  ;; or `literal'). In both cases,
+  ;; extract the year and associate it
+  ;; to `year' field, for compatibility
+  ;; with BibTeX format.
   (let ((date (or (alist-get 'date-parts value)
+  (alist-get 'literal value)
   (alist-get 'raw value
 (cons 'year
   (cond
((consp date)
 (caar date))
((stringp date)
-(car (split-string date "-")))
+(replace-regexp-in-string
+  (rx
+(minimal-match (zero-or-more 
anything))
+(group-n 1 (repeat 4 digit))
+(zero-or-more anything))
+  (rx (backref 1))
+  date))
(t
 (error "Unknown CSL-JSON date format: 
%S"
-   date))
+   value))
  (_
   (cons field value
  item)
-- 
2.34.1

Re: More robust CSL-JSON date parsing in oc-basic

[David Lukeš]

Thanks for the quick feedback! I'll send the patch momentarily.

Best,

David

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Russell Adams]

On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 12:38:24PM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:
> Am 25.02.2022 13:25 schrieb Russell Adams:
> > On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 11:29:38AM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:
> >> This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports. It even does
>
> I was looking here: https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html
> Especially the section "Ways to contribute" -> "Ways that do not involve
> programming" -> "Send bug reports"
> There is not described _how_ to do this. That is the point.

This may just be an unfortunate lack of alignment between the
community Worg and the main site. Again, on the main site there is a
prominent Contribute button and it shows how to send a report.

We're open to suggestions how to make them integrate better.

>  From my point of view this is unusual to. But this just should made
> clear to the users. I wasted time searching the repo. Just write
> "The repo is not publicly available". ;) Because orgmode is FOSS
> everyone (new to it) would expect a source repo.

I expect the software product to have a repo. I don't always expect a
repo for their public facing site. Some sites don't use source tools
to publish, and their public facing site will be access controlled to
prevent defacement.

On the other hand, Org does have a repo and Ihor appears to be
requesting TEC to add a link to the page.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com

PGP Key ID: 0x1160DCB3   http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Ihor Radchenko]

Russell Adams  writes:

> https://orgmode.org/ is administered by Org maintainers. I'm not sure
> where that repo is, and it's not publicly writable. Suggesting edits
> for that site is certainly appropriate on this mailing list.

It is https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/orgweb/

Timothy, would you mind adding this link somewhere in the web page
footer?

Best,
Ihor

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[c . buhtz]

Am 25.02.2022 13:30 schrieb Ihor Radchenko:

If you think that the current wording is confusing, please point out
which parts. We are pretty much blind here on the potential issues for
the newcomers (for obvious reason - we are too familiar with Org).
Pointing to the confusing parts would help a lot.


The text in the buffer after M-x org-submit-bugreport says in the first 
line "You are about to submit a bug report to the Org mailing list".
This does not explain how this is done. As a (very fresh not Emacs 
familiar) user I wouldn't assume that I have to setup my Emacs as a mail 
client in that case. I would assume that there is some magic in behind. 
;)


Just write something like "Make sure your Emacs is setup to send emails 
or copy and paste the resulting buffer into an Email client of your 
choice."



5.
It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code 
of
the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch 
for

2.


This is confusing. If you go to orgmode.org, the git link is in the 
front

page. Also, orgmode.org -> Install will bring you to the relevant page
of the manual, which provides all possible installation options
including cloning the official git repo.


But the front-page and the Install are not the place where I would 
expect infos like that. Repos are for contributers not for users.
Users are reading "Install" and sometimes the front-page. I have not 
read the front-page but clicked on contribute.
In contribute the git thing is explained in "Details on how to submit 
patches" but there is a repo url missing.



Similarly, https://orgmode.org/worg/ has the links to its code in the
first heading:


Worg documentation on your machine
git clone https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg


Definitly my fault.

btw: I would suggest to create links or mirror repos on your GitHub 
page.



Do you recall the urls where you tried to search for the source code?


I searched behind the GitHub link (right top corner of the website) 
first.
I searched around on savannah but still have problems with the 
interface; which is another topic.


The point is that the users have to search (e.g. DuckDuckGo) because the 
links to the repo or to description that there is no public repo are not 
at the usual (compared to most of the other FOSS projects) places.

Re: profiling latency in large org-mode buffers (under both main & org-fold feature)

[Max Nikulin]

On 23/02/2022 23:35, Ihor Radchenko wrote:

Max Nikulin writes:


+;; the same purpose.  Overlays are implemented with O(n) complexity in
+;; Emacs (as for 2021-03-11).  It means that any attempt to move
+;; through hidden text in a file with many invisible overlays will
+;; require time scaling with the number of folded regions (the problem
+;; Overlays note of the manual warns about).  For curious, historical
+;; reasons why overlays are not efficient can be found in
+;; https://www.jwz.org/doc/lemacs.html.


The linked document consists of a lot of messages. Could you, please,
provide more specific location within the rather long page?


There is no specific location. That thread is an old drama unfolded when
intervals were first implemented by a third-party company (they were called
intervals that time). AFAIU, the fact that intervals are stored in a
list and suffer from O(N) complexity originates from that time. Just
history, as I pointed in the comment.


Thank you, Ihor. I am still not motivated enough to read whole page but 
searching for "interval" (earlier I tried "overlay") resulted in the 
following message:


Message-ID: <9206230917.aa16...@mole.gnu.ai.mit.edu>
Date:   Tue, 23 Jun 92 05:17:33 -0400
From:   r...@gnu.ai.mit.edu (Richard Stallman)

describing tree balancing problem in GNU Emacs and linear search in lucid.

Unfortunately there is no "id" or "name" anchors in the file suitable to 
specify precise location. Even the link href is broken.


Actually I suspect that markers may have a similar problem during regexp 
searches. I am curious if it is possible to invoke a kind of "vacuum" 
(in SQL parlance). Folding all headings and resetting refile cache does 
not restore performance to the initial state at session startup. Maybe 
it is effect of incremental searches.


Sorry, I have not tried patches for text properties instead of overlays.

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[c . buhtz]

Dear Russell,

thank your for the explanations and taking my issues into account.

Am 25.02.2022 13:25 schrieb Russell Adams:

On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 11:29:38AM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:

This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports. It even does
not make clear that the "way" is unusual (not web-based bug-trackers
like bugreport or github). It simply says "Submit a bug report" but 
does

not how. I think the important point and information for the users is
that "Bug reports are done via E-Mail" to the mailinglist with
manipulating the headers or using Emacs itself.


Where would this belong? On the main Org page? On Worg? It's
documented under "feedback" in the manual.

All Emacs bug reports are to mailing lists. That is the usual.

On the main org-mode site the first major point under "Contribute" is
how to submit a bug report.


I was looking here: https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html
Especially the section "Ways to contribute" -> "Ways that do not involve 
programming" -> "Send bug reports"

There is not described _how_ to do this. That is the point.

The first sentence links to how to produce "usefull feedback". Yes your 
are right to say, that behind that link is the M-x org-submit-bug-report 
described.
But org-submit-bug-report is about a bug-report and not about feedback. 
Feedback is not a bug-report.
Maybe it is the simplest to write "Submit bugs to the mailing list." And 
maybe give some more details about the manipulated header and if I have 
to subscribe to the list first to submit a bugreport.


What I meant with "unusual" is that in the broader context of FOSS it is 
unusual to do bug reports via M-x ...

By the way I wasn't aware that Emacs itself implements this way, too.

It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code 
of
the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch 
for

2.


Which site?

https://orgmode.org/ is administered by Org maintainers. I'm not sure
where that repo is, and it's not publicly writable.


From my point of view this is unusual to. But this just should made 
clear to the users. I wasted time searching the repo. Just write "The 
repo is not publicly available". ;)

Because orgmode is FOSS everyone (new to it) would expect a source repo.

Kind
Christian

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Ihor Radchenko]

c.bu...@posteo.jp writes:

> I accept that most of you does the work in your unpayed free time and 
> that each project has it's own "vibes" and ways to do things.
> I just wan't to show you my experience with my tries to communicate with 
> the project. It is not my goal to vent my anger; and I even have no 
> anger. My goal is to improve the project not only my own experience!

Thank you very much for your feedback! Many of the Org users are coming
from Emacs and are already familiar with many of our conventions. Users
coming from outside Emacs are often underrepresented in the received
feedback.

> And I hope it is OK that I collect all the items in one mail together.

No problem.

> 1.
> This website has a lot of deadlinks.
> https://orgmode.org/worg/exporters/ox-overview.html

I replied in the other email.

> 2.
> This website
> https://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-publish-html-tutorial.html
> at the end in sub-section "Further reading" points to the mailinglist 
> but only to the archive 
> (http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/) not to the 
> list-subscription site 
> (https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode).
> And on the archive site there is no link to the subscription site.

I agree that it may be confusing. I recall that I had to google a bit
first time I encountered this issue. I have submitted a report about the
lack of the subscription link GNU mailman bug tracker.

> 3.
> This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports. It even does 
> not make clear that the "way" is unusual (not web-based bug-trackers 
> like bugreport or github). It simply says "Submit a bug report" but does 
> not how. I think the important point and information for the users is 
> that "Bug reports are done via E-Mail" to the mailinglist with 
> manipulating the headers or using Emacs itself.

> 4.
> Search more around I found out that I have to submit bugreports from 
> inside Emacs via M-x org-something
> Make clear that I have to setup Emacs for sending emails in that case.
> In my case I am not able to submit regular bug-reports because I do not 
> manipulate my headers and my Emacs is not setup for emails.

Could you clarify which particular url you are referring to?
If you go to orgmode.org -> Contribute, you will see the following:

>> Send bug reports. Before sending a bug report, make sure you read the
>> section of the manual on how to provide useful feedback or this other
>> great text: How to Send Bug Reports Effectively.

The word "feedback" links to the manual page at
https://orgmode.org/org.html#Feedback
The page provides all the details about the mailing list and using
org-submit-bug-report + explains what to do if your Emacs is not
configured to send email:

>> If you find problems with Org, or if you have questions, remarks, or
>> ideas about it, please send an email to the Org mailing list
>> emacs-orgmode@gnu.org. You can subscribe to the list from this web
>> page.

>> If you are not sending the Email from within Emacs, please copy and
>> paste the content into your Email program.

If you think that the current wording is confusing, please point out
which parts. We are pretty much blind here on the potential issues for
the newcomers (for obvious reason - we are too familiar with Org).
Pointing to the confusing parts would help a lot.

> 5.
> It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code of 
> the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch for 
> 2.

This is confusing. If you go to orgmode.org, the git link is in the front
page. Also, orgmode.org -> Install will bring you to the relevant page
of the manual, which provides all possible installation options
including cloning the official git repo.

Similarly, https://orgmode.org/worg/ has the links to its code in the
first heading:

>> Worg documentation on your machine
>> git clone https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg

Also, https://orgmode.org/ has

>> Site created by TEC with Org mode licensed under the GNU FDL 1.3

linking to https://orgmode.org/worg/org-site-colophon.html


Do you recall the urls where you tried to search for the source code?
Could you give more details on what confused you?

Appreciate your feedback.

Best,
Ihor

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Russell Adams]

Just to start, honest critical feedback is just fine. Thank you for
not being negative. ;]

On Fri, Feb 25, 2022 at 11:29:38AM +, c.bu...@posteo.jp wrote:
> This website has a lot of deadlinks.
> https://orgmode.org/worg/exporters/ox-overview.html

Worg is community written and maintained. I've personally done
deadlock scans before, but I'm sure it needs to be done again.

Care to volunteer?

> This website
> https://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-publish-html-tutorial.html
> at the end in sub-section "Further reading" points to the mailinglist
> but only to the archive
> (http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/) not to the
> list-subscription site
> (https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode).
> And on the archive site there is no link to the subscription site.

Reading implies reading the list archive, not posting.

It's unfortunate that the archive doesn't link back to the main
list. I'm not sure that's configurable.

I've fixed it so that it links to the Worg page about the mailing
list. I hope that increases the clarity.

> This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports. It even does
> not make clear that the "way" is unusual (not web-based bug-trackers
> like bugreport or github). It simply says "Submit a bug report" but does
> not how. I think the important point and information for the users is
> that "Bug reports are done via E-Mail" to the mailinglist with
> manipulating the headers or using Emacs itself.

Where would this belong? On the main Org page? On Worg? It's
documented under "feedback" in the manual.

All Emacs bug reports are to mailing lists. That is the usual.

On the main org-mode site the first major point under "Contribute" is
how to submit a bug report.

> Search more around I found out that I have to submit bugreports from
> inside Emacs via M-x org-something
> Make clear that I have to setup Emacs for sending emails in that case.
> In my case I am not able to submit regular bug-reports because I do not
> manipulate my headers and my Emacs is not setup for emails.

M-x org-submit-bug-report

Emacs doesn't have to be setup for email, you can simply copy the
message into your mail client to send. It tells you that inside Emacs
when you create the report.

This is the same as M-x submit-emacs-bug.

Again the first point under Orgmode.org's Contribute button is bug
reporting.

> It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code of
> the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch for
> 2.

Which site?

https://orgmode.org/ is administered by Org maintainers. I'm not sure
where that repo is, and it's not publicly writable. Suggesting edits
for that site is certainly appropriate on this mailing list.

https://orgmode.org/worg/ is community written, and the git repository
is on the main page of both orgmode.org and Worg:
https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg

You can follow the directions below to request access to contribute to
Worg:

https://orgmode.org/worg/worg-about.html


--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com

PGP Key ID: 0x1160DCB3   http://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Fingerprint:1723 D8CA 4280 1EC9 557F  66E8 1154 E018 1160 DCB3

Re: Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[Byung-Hee HWANG]

Dear Christian,

c.bu...@posteo.jp writes:

> [...thanks...]
> This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports.

Easy. Ask here by mail.

It is same for other issues.

Sincerely, Gnus fan Byung-Hee

-- 
^고맙습니다 _救濟蒼生_ 감사합니다_^))//

Re: [PATCH v3] Fix FAQ entry about mailto links.

[Max Nikulin]

On 16/02/2022 08:29, Robert Goldman wrote:

On 14 Feb 2022, at 7:22, Max Nikulin wrote:

On 11/02/2022 00:42, Robert Goldman wrote:

I am sending the updated patch and a diff to your edits to highlight 
my latest changes.


Some responses below, then I think merging would be fine. I am losing my 
ability and energy to process these patch files, honestly.


One patch was for clean master HEAD state, another file was diff in 
comparison to your variant. The latter could be applied on the top of 
your patches or one could just read it to see changes.


To be honest, I'm not sure what value this whole comment section has. 
Given that, I'm ok with whatever you want to do: leave it as it, try to 
fix it, or just remove it altogether. I actually think that removing it 
might be best. It's confusing, and will eventually become out-of-date, 
and who will update it?


I pushed the patch without comment block. I decided to suggest 
`org-link-set-parameters' instead of customization of 
`org-link-parameters'. See updated variant at 
https://orgmode.org/worg/org-faq.html#mailto-links.


Robert, thank you for suggesting corrections and for reviewing my patches.

P.S. I was surprised that Apple does not provide online version of man 
pages for MacOS utilities.

Communication problems and possible problems with the website

[c . buhtz]

Hello together,

I accept that most of you does the work in your unpayed free time and 
that each project has it's own "vibes" and ways to do things.
I just wan't to show you my experience with my tries to communicate with 
the project. It is not my goal to vent my anger; and I even have no 
anger. My goal is to improve the project not only my own experience!


And I hope it is OK that I collect all the items in one mail together.

1.
This website has a lot of deadlinks.
https://orgmode.org/worg/exporters/ox-overview.html

2.
This website
https://orgmode.org/worg/org-tutorials/org-publish-html-tutorial.html
at the end in sub-section "Further reading" points to the mailinglist 
but only to the archive 
(http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/) not to the 
list-subscription site 
(https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode).

And on the archive site there is no link to the subscription site.

3.
This site does not make clear how to submit bug reports. It even does 
not make clear that the "way" is unusual (not web-based bug-trackers 
like bugreport or github). It simply says "Submit a bug report" but does 
not how. I think the important point and information for the users is 
that "Bug reports are done via E-Mail" to the mailinglist with 
manipulating the headers or using Emacs itself.


4.
Search more around I found out that I have to submit bugreports from 
inside Emacs via M-x org-something

Make clear that I have to setup Emacs for sending emails in that case.
In my case I am not able to submit regular bug-reports because I do not 
manipulate my headers and my Emacs is not setup for emails.


5.
It is unclear where the repositories for the source code and the code of 
the website are. If I had found them I would have created a PR/patch for 
2.


Kind regards
Christian

Re: org-cite and org-ref-cite

[Nicolas Goaziou]

Hello,

Henrik Frisk  writes:

> I have now finally got around to changing my setup to  org-cte. It works
> really well! The only thing I can't seem to sort out is to change the style
> of the citation. Regardless where I do it I get the error "Wrong type
> argument: org-cite-processor,"
>
> Another question: if I would like to export to LaTeX but with citation
> commands rather than formated citations, would that be possible? I am sorry
> if I'm missing something obviuos.

Could you show an example of a source document and what you expect as an output?

Regards,
-- 
Nicolas Goaziou

org-cite and org-ref-cite

[Henrik Frisk]

Hi,

I have now finally got around to changing my setup to  org-cte. It works
really well! The only thing I can't seem to sort out is to change the style
of the citation. Regardless where I do it I get the error "Wrong type
argument: org-cite-processor,"

Another question: if I would like to export to LaTeX but with citation
commands rather than formated citations, would that be possible? I am sorry
if I'm missing something obviuos.

Thanks,
/Henrik