Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

On Sun, Oct 2, 2016, at 10:09 PM, Norman Walsh wrote:
> Joost Kremers  writes:
> > There's also a `docbook' writer,
> > which has been part of Pandoc much longer and which outputs to (I
> > assume) DocBook v4. So I suspect you either need to upgrade your Pandoc
> > or make sure ox-pandoc sets the output format to `docbook'.
> 
> Depending on what your down-stream processing is like, you could
> just go with V4 DocBook from org and then convert that to V5 with
> the upgrade stylesheet.
> 

Thank you, Norm. I'll keep that in mind, but if I can get directly to
DocBook5, that seems easier and less "lossy."

Cheers,
-pd

-- 
  Peter Davis
  www.techcurmudgeon.com

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

On Sun, Oct 2, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Marcin Borkowski wrote:
> 
> On 2016-10-02, at 23:23, Peter Davis  wrote:
> 
> > I'm trying this again, on a Mac instead of Windows. I managed to get
> > ox-pandoc working. (It now displays an org export menu too big to fit on
> > my screen, and I can't figure out how to scroll it.)
> 
> Space/backspace?

I'll give it a try. Thanks, Marcin!

Now here's the real problem. I get this slew of pandoc output options on
my Mac, but on my Win10 machine, also with pandoc 1.117.2, I only get
two options:

[P] Markdown to buffer
[p] To file

I seem to be running the right ox-pandoc, so I'm not sure how to get all
the other options. 

I could run pandoc on the org file from a command line, but then the
embedded dot diagrams won't be evaluated. Perhaps export to HTML (or
some other format?) and then use pandoc to convert to docbook?

Thanks,
-pd

-- 
  Peter Davis
  www.techcurmudgeon.com

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Marcin Borkowski]

On 2016-10-02, at 23:23, Peter Davis  wrote:

> I'm trying this again, on a Mac instead of Windows. I managed to get
> ox-pandoc working. (It now displays an org export menu too big to fit on
> my screen, and I can't figure out how to scroll it.)

Space/backspace?

Best,

-- 
Marcin Borkowski

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Norman Walsh]

Joost Kremers  writes:
> There's also a `docbook' writer,
> which has been part of Pandoc much longer and which outputs to (I
> assume) DocBook v4. So I suspect you either need to upgrade your Pandoc
> or make sure ox-pandoc sets the output format to `docbook'.

Depending on what your down-stream processing is like, you could
just go with V4 DocBook from org and then convert that to V5 with
the upgrade stylesheet.

Be seeing you,
  norm

-- 
Norman Walsh  | There is no monument dedicated to the
http://nwalsh.com/| memory of a committee.--Lester J.
  | Pourciau


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Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

Joost Kremers  writes:

> On Sun, Oct 02 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
>> Interesting. I just installed Pandoc on my Mac today with Homebrew, but
>> it claims to be 1.13.1. I'll try to find an update. Thanks.
>
> Check the "Installing" page on pandoc.org: there's a link to an OS X
> package on Pandoc's Github page:
>
> https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/releases/tag/1.17.2
>

Thanks again, Joost. I didn't find any installation instructions or kits, but I 
just copied the executable from the .pkg file to
/usr/local/bin on my machine, overwriting the 1.13 version that was there. That 
seems to have worked. I was able to export from org-mode to
docbook.

Thanks!
-pd

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Joost Kremers]

On Sun, Oct 02 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
> Interesting. I just installed Pandoc on my Mac today with Homebrew, but
> it claims to be 1.13.1. I'll try to find an update. Thanks.

Check the "Installing" page on pandoc.org: there's a link to an OS X
package on Pandoc's Github page:

https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/releases/tag/1.17.2

Perhaps you can use that?

-- 
Joost Kremers
Life has its moments

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

Joost Kremers  writes:

> On Sun, Oct 02 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
>> When I try to export to docbook via pandoc (C-c C-e p d), I get
>>
>> Running pandoc with args: (-f org -t docbook5 -o 
>> /Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.dbk --parse-raw --mathjax --standalone 
>> /Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.tmp3362h9T.org)
>> Error occured.
>> pandoc: Unknown writer: docbook5
>>
>> Any guesses? Is there something additional I need to install in pandoc?
>
> The `docbook5' writer was added to Pandoc fairly recently, in version
> 1.17.1, released in June of this year.

Interesting. I just installed Pandoc on my Mac today with Homebrew, but
it claims to be 1.13.1. I'll try to find an update. Thanks.

> There's also a `docbook' writer,
> which has been part of Pandoc much longer and which outputs to (I
> assume) DocBook v4. So I suspect you either need to upgrade your Pandoc
> or make sure ox-pandoc sets the output format to `docbook'.

Well, I'm trying to output docbook5 anyway, so better to update my
installation.

Thank you.

-pd

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Joost Kremers]

On Sun, Oct 02 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
> When I try to export to docbook via pandoc (C-c C-e p d), I get
>
> Running pandoc with args: (-f org -t docbook5 -o 
> /Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.dbk --parse-raw --mathjax --standalone 
> /Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.tmp3362h9T.org)
> Error occured.
> pandoc: Unknown writer: docbook5
>
> Any guesses? Is there something additional I need to install in pandoc?

The `docbook5' writer was added to Pandoc fairly recently, in version
1.17.1, released in June of this year. There's also a `docbook' writer,
which has been part of Pandoc much longer and which outputs to (I
assume) DocBook v4. So I suspect you either need to upgrade your Pandoc
or make sure ox-pandoc sets the output format to `docbook'.

--
Joost Kremers
Life has its moments

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

Peter Davis  writes:

> To follow up ...
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016, at 06:17 PM, Peter Davis wrote:
>> On Thu, Sep 29, 2016, at 03:23 PM, Joost Kremers wrote:
>> > 
>> > Pandoc can convert to Docbook, so that might be an option. Note that
>> > Pandoc also converts *from* Org, (although it cannot handle all of Org's
>> > capabilities), so depending on your needs, that might be a way to go
>> > directly from Org to Docbook.
>> >
>> 
>> Thank you. I did succeed in exporting from org to texi, and then
>> makeinfo'ing that into a DocBook xml, though a bit of hand editing was
>> necessary.
>> 
>
> I did manage to get this working. I found I had to export to Pandoc
> instead of running pandoc from a command line with the org file as
> input. Otherwise, the embedded dot code I used would not link to an
> image, but simply contain the dot code as source.
>
> Unfortunately, in trying to export to a file, I'm getting 
>
> Unable to resolve link "www.gimp.org/downloads"
>
> I don't know where this is coming from, or how to fix it.
>
> Finally, the 'Export with Pandoc' menu item only gives me two choices:
>   [P] Markdown to buffer
>   [p] To file
>
> I assume it's just generating Markdown, which would then have to be
> converted to docbook or whatever in a separate step. Any way to export
> to docbook directly, using Pandoc implicitly?

I'm trying this again, on a Mac instead of Windows. I managed to get
ox-pandoc working. (It now displays an org export menu too big to fit on
my screen, and I can't figure out how to scroll it.)

When I try to export to docbook via pandoc (C-c C-e p d), I get

Running pandoc with args: (-f org -t docbook5 -o 
/Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.dbk --parse-raw --mathjax --standalone 
/Users/peterdavis/Dropbox/HMH/my_file.tmp3362h9T.org)
Error occured. 
pandoc: Unknown writer: docbook5

Any guesses? Is there something additional I need to install in pandoc?

Thanks!

-pd

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Nick Dokos]

Marcin Borkowski  writes:

> On 2016-09-29, at 20:04, Peter Davis  wrote:
>
>> I've started a new position in which I have to create and maintain a
>> large set of documents in DocBook xml format. For new books, I'd really
>> like to use org mode, since a) I'm already familiar with it, b) I love
>> it, and c) I believe it does (or can be made to do) nearly everything I
>> need.
>
> Nice.  Of many things XML is ill-suited to, marking text up is a nice
> exception: it seems really good at it (definitely way better than LaTeX,
> of which I'm a great fan!).
>

Why do you think so? I've used XML lightly over the years and I have found
it to be a bear. LaTeX has its own problems but I grew up with it, so I guess
I'm less conscious of its flaws (but I rarely write LaTeX any more: org has
subsumed it). Should I change my mind?

>>  3. The direct route from org to DocBook xml seems to be missing. From
>

My memory might be playing tricks on me, but wasn't there a docbook
exporter at some point? Maybe it did not survive the 8.x transition?
Or am I misremembering?

-- 
Nick

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

On Fri, Sep 30, 2016, at 05:37 AM, Marcin Borkowski wrote:
> 
> On 2016-09-29, at 20:04, Peter Davis  wrote:
> 
> > I've started a new position in which I have to create and maintain a
> > large set of documents in DocBook xml format. For new books, I'd really
> > like to use org mode, since a) I'm already familiar with it, b) I love
> > it, and c) I believe it does (or can be made to do) nearly everything I
> > need.
> 
> Nice.  Of many things XML is ill-suited to, marking text up is a nice
> exception: it seems really good at it (definitely way better than LaTeX,
> of which I'm a great fan!).
>

I'm also a big LaTeX fan, but I don't use it often enough to remember
everything I need. I rely on copying stretches from documents I created
earlier, or constantly having to Google for solutions.

One thing I like about org-mode for creating documents (as opposed to
all its other uses), is the fact that I can easily remember the simple
mark-up, see reminders on screen while editing, and easily generate HTML
and PDF.
 
> >  3. The direct route from org to DocBook xml seems to be missing. From
> 
> Why not start with the HTML exporter and write your own one?  It's quite
> fun, and can be done in reasonable time.
>

For some definition of "reasonable." Seriously, I might want to do this
as an exercise sometime, but I can't wait for that right now.

> 
> >  4. [LONGSHOT] Is there any way to /import/ docbook xml into org mode?
> 
> XSLT?
>

Yes, that's a good option I hadn't considered.

> 
> Hth,
> 

Definitely. Thanks!

-pd

-- 
  Peter Davis
  www.techcurmudgeon.com

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Marcin Borkowski]

On 2016-09-29, at 20:04, Peter Davis  wrote:

> I've started a new position in which I have to create and maintain a
> large set of documents in DocBook xml format. For new books, I'd really
> like to use org mode, since a) I'm already familiar with it, b) I love
> it, and c) I believe it does (or can be made to do) nearly everything I
> need.

Nice.  Of many things XML is ill-suited to, marking text up is a nice
exception: it seems really good at it (definitely way better than LaTeX,
of which I'm a great fan!).

>  3. The direct route from org to DocBook xml seems to be missing. From

Why not start with the HTML exporter and write your own one?  It's quite
fun, and can be done in reasonable time.

I did a talk about writing your own Org exporter during EmacsConf 2015;
also, I had a plan (and I even started) for a series of blog posts on
that topic, but I don't have time for that now.  Still, you might want
to pursue this road - you'd have (as opposed to Pandoc, which admittedly
is a great tool, but has its limitations, as Joost mentioned) full
control over what get exported to what.

>  4. [LONGSHOT] Is there any way to /import/ docbook xml into org mode?

XSLT?

> Thank you very much.
>
> -pd

Hth,

-- 
Marcin Borkowski

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Peter Davis]

Dear Joost,

On Thu, Sep 29, 2016, at 03:23 PM, Joost Kremers wrote:
> 
> On Thu, Sep 29 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
> >
> > but the PDFs I'm getting still look like articles. (I copied the
> > above from some examples posted on this list a while ago. Thanks!)
> 
> Your LaTeX_CLASS is set to `koma-article', so that makes sense.
>

Ah, yes! Thanks.

> 
> >  2. Are there any advantages to considering MarkDown or AsciiDoc as
> >  opposed to org markup? (Again, my familiarity with org is a strong
> >  incentive here, but I'm willing to consider other options.)
> 
> There is a (IMHO) excellent markdown-mode available on Melpa, and if you
> use Pandoc[1] to convert your documents you have a lot of flexibility.
> There's also `pandoc-mode' (of which I'm the author), a minor mode that
> makes interacting with pandoc from within Emacs easier.
>

Bravo! Thank you again.

> 
> >  3. The direct route from org to DocBook xml seems to be missing. From
> >  what I gather, I can get there somehow via texi (but I don't even have
> >  that in org currently), or perhaps export to HTML and then convert that
> >  to db xml. Am I missing something? Is there some other route I should
> >  consider?
> 
> Pandoc can convert to Docbook, so that might be an option. Note that
> Pandoc also converts *from* Org, (although it cannot handle all of Org's
> capabilities), so depending on your needs, that might be a way to go
> directly from Org to Docbook.
>

Thank you. I did succeed in exporting from org to texi, and then
makeinfo'ing that into a DocBook xml, though a bit of hand editing was
necessary.

> 
> >  4. [LONGSHOT] Is there any way to /import/ docbook xml into org mode?
> 
> Pandoc also converts *from* Docbook, and can convert *to* Org, so again,
> that might be of help.
> 
> Of course, whether Pandoc can be useful to you really depends on your
> needs. Pandoc's internal document representation is based on Markdown,
> and by its very nature Markdown is more limited in it capabilities than
> Org. In essence, anything that cannot be handled by (Pandoc's version
> of) Markdown, cannot be handled by Pandoc in other formats.
>

Thanks. Sounds like Pandoc should really be in my toolkit.

> 
> HTH

Definitely!

Thanks,
-pd


-- 
  Peter Davis
  www.techcurmudgeon.com

Re: [O] Making DocBook xml books from org mode?

[Joost Kremers]

On Thu, Sep 29 2016, Peter Davis wrote:
> I've started a new position in which I have to create and maintain a
> large set of documents in DocBook xml format. For new books, I'd really
> like to use org mode, since a) I'm already familiar with it, b) I love
> it, and c) I believe it does (or can be made to do) nearly everything I
> need.
>
> However, after Googling around the org-mode/DocBook space, I'm left with
> some questions.
>
> 1. I'm going to be creating books, as opposed to articles. My org-header
> looks like this:
>
> #+STARTUP: showeverything logdone
> #+OPTIONS:   H:5 num:t \n:nil @:t ::t |:t ^:nil -:t f:t *:t <:t
> #+LaTeX_CLASS: koma-article
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: \usepackage{listings}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \setlength{\parskip}{2ex plus 4pt minus 2pt}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \setlength{\parindent}{0pt}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \renewcommand{\baselinestretch}{1.0}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \setlength{\topsep}{-10pt}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \setlength{\partopsep}{0pt}
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: \usepackage{xcolor}
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: \lstset{
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: basicstyle=\ttfamily,
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: breaklines=true,
> #+LaTeX_HEADER:
> prebreak=\mbox{\ensuremath{\color{red}\hookleftarrow}},
> #+LaTeX_HEADER:
> postbreak=\raisebox{0ex}[0ex][0ex]{\ensuremath{\color{red}\hookrightarrow\space}},
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: columns=fullflexible,
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: keepspaces=true
> #+LaTeX_HEADER: }
> #+LaTeX_CLASS_OPTIONS:
> [book,letterpaper,times,12pt,listings-bw,microtype]
>
> but the PDFs I'm getting still look like articles. (I copied the
> above from some examples posted on this list a while ago. Thanks!)

Your LaTeX_CLASS is set to `koma-article', so that makes sense.

>  2. Are there any advantages to considering MarkDown or AsciiDoc as
>  opposed to org markup? (Again, my familiarity with org is a strong
>  incentive here, but I'm willing to consider other options.)

There is a (IMHO) excellent markdown-mode available on Melpa, and if you
use Pandoc[1] to convert your documents you have a lot of flexibility.
There's also `pandoc-mode' (of which I'm the author), a minor mode that
makes interacting with pandoc from within Emacs easier.

>  3. The direct route from org to DocBook xml seems to be missing. From
>  what I gather, I can get there somehow via texi (but I don't even have
>  that in org currently), or perhaps export to HTML and then convert that
>  to db xml. Am I missing something? Is there some other route I should
>  consider?

Pandoc can convert to Docbook, so that might be an option. Note that
Pandoc also converts *from* Org, (although it cannot handle all of Org's
capabilities), so depending on your needs, that might be a way to go
directly from Org to Docbook.

>  4. [LONGSHOT] Is there any way to /import/ docbook xml into org mode?

Pandoc also converts *from* Docbook, and can convert *to* Org, so again,
that might be of help.

Of course, whether Pandoc can be useful to you really depends on your
needs. Pandoc's internal document representation is based on Markdown,
and by its very nature Markdown is more limited in it capabilities than
Org. In essence, anything that cannot be handled by (Pandoc's version
of) Markdown, cannot be handled by Pandoc in other formats.

HTH

--
Joost Kremers
Life has its moments