Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Ihor Radchenko]

Russell Adams  writes:

>> AFAIU, this should be supported by the IRC server. Does irc.libera.chat
>> (where #org-mode channel is hosted) support logging?
>
> There is no log today.
>
> Also our parent channel #emacs prohibits logging.
>
> https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsChannelLogging

Does #org-mode share such a strong stand?
If so, it may be problematic even to quote the discussions there in Org
commit messages.
IMHO, it makes #org-mode a lot less usable for the purposes of Org
development. Deliberately public and unencrypted matrix #org-mode room
is better in this regard.

-- 
Ihor Radchenko,
Org mode contributor,
Learn more about Org mode at https://orgmode.org/.
Support Org development at https://liberapay.com/org-mode,
or support my work at https://liberapay.com/yantar92

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[zimoun]

Hi,

On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 at 11:36, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:

>> Look at this example from Guix IRC channel:
>> https://logs.guix.gnu.org/
>
> AFAIU, this should be supported by the IRC server. Does irc.libera.chat
> (where #org-mode channel is hosted) support logging?

These logs are done by custom Scheme code [1,2] run in some Guix
project’s server [3].


1: 

2: 

3: 



Cheers,
simon

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Russell Adams]

On Sun, Sep 25, 2022 at 11:36:46AM +0800, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
> Jean Louis  writes:
>
> > For IRC, there are ways to record history, and I am sure that
> > such history may be recorded with referencable hyperlinks.
> >
> > Look at this example from Guix IRC channel:
> > https://logs.guix.gnu.org/
>
> AFAIU, this should be supported by the IRC server. Does irc.libera.chat
> (where #org-mode channel is hosted) support logging?

There is no log today.

Also our parent channel #emacs prohibits logging.

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsChannelLogging

Logging sounds nice until anyone can datamine it. You're welcome to
log locally on your client for private use.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com
https://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Timothy]

Hi Ihor,

> Jean Louis  writes:
>
>> For IRC, there are ways to record history, and I am sure that
>> such history may be recorded with referencable hyperlinks.
>>
>> Look at this example from Guix IRC channel:
>> 
>
> AFAIU, this should be supported by the IRC server. Does irc.libera.chat
> (where #org-mode channel is hosted) support logging?

On this note, I’ve recently discovered
 which looks rather 
promising
to me.

All the best,
Timothy

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Ihor Radchenko]

Jean Louis  writes:

> For IRC, there are ways to record history, and I am sure that
> such history may be recorded with referencable hyperlinks.
>
> Look at this example from Guix IRC channel:
> https://logs.guix.gnu.org/

AFAIU, this should be supported by the IRC server. Does irc.libera.chat
(where #org-mode channel is hosted) support logging?

-- 
Ihor Radchenko,
Org mode contributor,
Learn more about Org mode at https://orgmode.org/.
Support Org development at https://liberapay.com/org-mode,
or support my work at https://liberapay.com/yantar92

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Jean Louis]

* Ihor Radchenko  [2022-09-21 11:15]:
> The disadvantage of IRC is absence of message history.
> Without history, small-sized channels like I am proposing (dedicated to
> Org mode devs) are not very useful. We live in different time zones and
> countries.

>From Org master view point, every message shall be
referencable to be usable for future as part of the knowledge
base.

E-mails are very referencable, and mailing list too.

For IRC, there are ways to record history, and I am sure that
such history may be recorded with referencable hyperlinks.

Look at this example from Guix IRC channel:
https://logs.guix.gnu.org/

It is irrelevant and also natural that we are in different
time zones and countries. System administrator may decide the
reference time zone.

-- 
Jean

Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns:
https://www.fsf.org/campaigns

In support of Richard M. Stallman
https://stallmansupport.org/

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Ihor Radchenko]

Russell Adams  writes:

> The #org-mode channel has a large footprint already, though lower
> utilization than #emacs. There are 230 org users online right now.
>
> It would be great to see some dev discussions on IRC, and if we ever
> get too much traffic, maybe make a #org-mode-dev channel.
>
> I'd encourage you to try to use the existing resources first,
> especially where the user base is. Then split things up later.

This is an option. #emacs is very too noisy for me, but #org-mode
appears to be fairly quiet. It may work.

-- 
Ihor Radchenko,
Org mode contributor,
Learn more about Org mode at https://orgmode.org/.
Support Org development at https://liberapay.com/org-mode,
or support my work at https://liberapay.com/yantar92

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Russell Adams]

On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 10:59:14AM +0200, Russell Adams wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 04:05:56PM +0800, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
> > Russell Adams  writes:
> >
> > >> I am wondering if we could create a common Org dev matrix room for quick
> > >> discussions and then copy the transcript to the relevant ML thread, when
> > >> necessary.
> > >
> > > We have an IRC channel for real time chat. Join in anytime.
> >
> > The disadvantage of IRC is absence of message history.
> > Without history, small-sized channels like I am proposing (dedicated to
> > Org mode devs) are not very useful. We live in different time zones and
> > countries.
>
> I disagree. That's why most IRC users stay logged in.
>
> IRC is most accessible, and if you insist there is a Matrix bridge to
> Libera.

Let me pose this differently.

The #org-mode channel has a large footprint already, though lower
utilization than #emacs. There are 230 org users online right now.

It would be great to see some dev discussions on IRC, and if we ever
get too much traffic, maybe make a #org-mode-dev channel.

I'd encourage you to try to use the existing resources first,
especially where the user base is. Then split things up later.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com
https://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Russell Adams]

On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 04:05:56PM +0800, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
> Russell Adams  writes:
>
> >> I am wondering if we could create a common Org dev matrix room for quick
> >> discussions and then copy the transcript to the relevant ML thread, when
> >> necessary.
> >
> > We have an IRC channel for real time chat. Join in anytime.
>
> The disadvantage of IRC is absence of message history.
> Without history, small-sized channels like I am proposing (dedicated to
> Org mode devs) are not very useful. We live in different time zones and
> countries.

I disagree. That's why most IRC users stay logged in.

IRC is most accessible, and if you insist there is a Matrix bridge to
Libera.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com
https://www.adamsinfoserv.com/

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Ihor Radchenko]

Russell Adams  writes:

>> I am wondering if we could create a common Org dev matrix room for quick
>> discussions and then copy the transcript to the relevant ML thread, when
>> necessary.
>
> We have an IRC channel for real time chat. Join in anytime.

The disadvantage of IRC is absence of message history.
Without history, small-sized channels like I am proposing (dedicated to
Org mode devs) are not very useful. We live in different time zones and
countries.

-- 
Ihor Radchenko,
Org mode contributor,
Learn more about Org mode at https://orgmode.org/.
Support Org development at https://liberapay.com/org-mode,
or support my work at https://liberapay.com/yantar92

Re: IM dev discussions? (was: orgmode.org welcome page says to install via MELPA but as writing, this cannot be done)

[Russell Adams]

On Tue, Sep 20, 2022 at 05:22:50PM +0800, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
> The problem with the list is that emails often have ~minutes overheads.
> It sometimes takes unnecessary extra time to discuss small
> clarifications on list.
>
> I am wondering if we could create a common Org dev matrix room for quick
> discussions and then copy the transcript to the relevant ML thread, when
> necessary.

We have an IRC channel for real time chat. Join in anytime.

--
Russell Adamsrlad...@adamsinfoserv.com
https://www.adamsinfoserv.com/