Re: [PSES] PSU cert issue

[Kurt Beneder]

Dear Gilbert,

One Soulution could be:
You have to include the whole list of all separate orderable spare part
modules to your CE Declaration.
Of course the PSU is EMC LVD etc. tested in the overall system.
Also be aware that Turkey checks the Date of Issue of your CE Declaration
against the Date of arrival of your goods in Turkey and
therefore whether or not you had a valid CE Declaration at the time of
importing your spare part.

Best regards Kurt

On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 4:10 AM Jeffrey Gilbert 
wrote:

> Having a problem sending replacement 1U PSUs into Turkey. Apparently they
> (customs) are requiring full EMC certification, which no PSU manufacturer
> does. They do LVD, RoHS, but not EMC. These are useless outside of a system
> they are intended to be installed into and certified in. PSU manufacturer
> DoC explains this. We certify in a full system.
>
> I am under the impression that Turkey is supposed to be following EU CE
> rules. We do not have this issue in any other country on the planet. Has
> anyone else run into this problem?
>
> Jeff
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Re: [PSES] Routine Test 60950-1, 62368-1

[Kurt Beneder]

Dear Ken

its a 19 inch rack mountable product with a backplane and several submodule
plug-in pcb's.
It has a metall case for mounting it into a 19 inch rack.
>From the protection class point of view its a class I (protection earth)
product.
Good point regarding assembly failures and wiring failures. We will
performing an analysis and document it.

My argument for not doing an isolation test on the assembled system is that
it will test only solid insulation which is allready tested at subunit
level.
Maybe screws which are fallen in can be detected with that test.

I want to render the argument pointless which states that one can detect a
clearance distance violation due e.g. too long screws with such test.
Verification of clearances uses much higher test voltages which depends on
the height above sea level.
The hipot test is also done with voltage levels which tests the solid
insulation and not the clearances.

Best regards
Kurt Beneder


On Sun, Sep 3, 2017 at 6:10 PM, IBM Ken <ibm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Kurt!
> At the system (end product level);
>
> -Do you add a PDU and plug on the manufacturing line and plug all the
> modules into it?
> -Do you have small screws, wires, etc which are used to assemble the end
> product which might fall into the product?
> -Do you have any opportunity for miswiring/misplugging?
>
> In most cases, it's a good idea to hipot the assembly as a complete
> product at the end of the manufacturing line.  It is not usually required
> to re-do each module hipot test separately, but rather just once at the
> Mains input (but I don't know the construction of your product).
>
> Regarding your comment about height above sea level;  the hipot test is
> based on the working voltage and the maximum operating altitude as designed
> (it is not dependent on the actual altitude of the factory).
>
> -Ken A
>
>
> On Sun, Sep 3, 2017 at 11:28 AM, Kurt Beneder <kurt.bene...@ieee.org>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> i am defining the routine tests for a 19 inch Rack System according to
>> IEC 60950-1 and IEC 62368-1.
>> We test routinely the solid insulation of each submodule during
>> production.
>> The final system is variable, so some modules are sometimes in the system
>> or not, depending on the configuration from the customer.
>>
>> The question for me is wether a routine test of the solid insulation of
>> the final product is still necessary.
>> Especially if one has many circuits with hazardous voltages (relais
>> contacts, power supply, other hazardous voltage outputs) which increases
>> the test effort.
>>
>> As far as i know the test voltages applied according the standards are
>> for verification of solid insulation only.
>> This is done in our case at the subassembly level: every circuit against
>> every other circuit of the submodule
>> So the argument sometimes that we have to retest the whole device for
>> verification of the clearances,
>> which could be compromised during assembly of the final product, is not
>> valid for me
>> as this would require much different and higher voltage levels dependent
>> on the height above sea level of the test site.
>>
>> What is your opinion?
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> Kurt Beneder
>> -
>> 
>>
>> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
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>> at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in
>> well-used formats), large files, etc.
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[PSES] Routine Test 60950-1, 62368-1

[Kurt Beneder]

Hi all,

i am defining the routine tests for a 19 inch Rack System according to IEC
60950-1 and IEC 62368-1.
We test routinely the solid insulation of each submodule during production.
The final system is variable, so some modules are sometimes in the system
or not, depending on the configuration from the customer.

The question for me is wether a routine test of the solid insulation of the
final product is still necessary.
Especially if one has many circuits with hazardous voltages (relais
contacts, power supply, other hazardous voltage outputs) which increases
the test effort.

As far as i know the test voltages applied according the standards are for
verification of solid insulation only.
This is done in our case at the subassembly level: every circuit against
every other circuit of the submodule
So the argument sometimes that we have to retest the whole device for
verification of the clearances,
which could be compromised during assembly of the final product, is not
valid for me
as this would require much different and higher voltage levels dependent on
the height above sea level of the test site.

What is your opinion?

Best regards

Kurt Beneder

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