Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Charlie Blackham
> What is not correct? The statement “Products leaving the factory after that must meet EN 55032” Is not correct There is no requirement for that anywhere. Regards Charlie From: John Woodgate [mailto:jmw1...@btinternet.com] Sent: 18 October 2016 21:50 To: Charlie Blackham;

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Ghery S. Pettit
How do you figure that? If they are using testing to harmonized standards as the means for issuing the DoC, after 5 March 2017 EN 55022 is of no use. Anything placed on the market (not just manufactured) as of that date must have been evaluated against EN 55032. To the original poster – it’s

[PSES] IEC 62368-1

2016-10-18 Thread McBurney, Ian
Dear Colleagues. I have been informed that China, Japan & Australia have not adopted IEC 62368-1 yet. Does anyone know of a document or website where I can check to see which countries have adopted the above standard? I am having to test products to the above standard but with the national

Re: [PSES] IEC 62368-1

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
There is such a document but it is an internal IEC TC108 HBSDT document. If your company were a member of a trade association represented on BSI committee EPL108 you could obtain a copy, but I don't think there is any legitimate way otherwise. I have proposed that the document (frequently

Re: [PSES] IEC 62368-1

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
I doubt that it's an IEC policy, it's more a case of committee members not giving it 'a high priority'. By the way, BSI itself couldn't supply the document, I think, but a committee member could obtain it for the organization he/she represents. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO - Own Opinions

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Allen
You often get heavy electrical machinery in residential, light commercial and hospital (etc.) (especially multi-story) premises - think local power transformers, air-conditioning systems, lifts/elevators, water/sewage pumping equipment, etc - and that can (and has certainly been seen to) affect

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
Yes, the 'zoning' is not perfect, but can you think of an improvement? I can't. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO - Own Opinions Only www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England Sylvae in aeternum manent. From: John Allen

[PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Rajneesh Raveendran
Hi All, For all our new programs, we would be testing for compliance as per the EN 55032 standard. But i have one question about some legacy products that we would continue to ship to our customers post March 2017. All these products have been tested as per the EN 55022 and if i am not wrong,

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Kortas, Jamison
Thank you - In your example of lifts or a/c it would need to comply with the more restrictive criteria (residential for emissions and industrial for immunity) even though the location may itself not be powered by low-voltage supply. The devices I am working with would not be considered fixed

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Doug Nix
My understanding has always been based on the Class and Group designations in CISPR 11 / EN 55011 for ISM equipment (based on the 2009 edition): > 5.3 Division into classes > Class A equipment is equipment suitable for use in all establishments other > than domestic and > those directly

[PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Kortas, Jamison
Good Morning, What do you use for criteria when reviewing the intended environment in which a device will be placed to determine if it is industrial or non-industrial? I have seen and read varying opinions on what criteria to use. It ranges from a transformer isolated factory to the nature of

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
No, because light industry premises are often very close to residential premises, get power from the low-voltage supply and broadcast receivers can be much closer than 30 m (the assumption for emission limit purposes is 10 m, but of course they could be even closer). With best wishes DESIGN IT

Re: [PSES] IEC 62368-1

2016-10-18 Thread McBurney, Ian
Hello John. Do you know why the IEC doesn't make this information available to the public? It would be very useful to those manufacturers who sell their products worldwide. Kind regards; Ian McBurney Design & Compliance Engineer. Allen & Heath Ltd. Kernick Industrial Estate, Penryn, Cornwall.

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
For Europe, 'industry' means heavy industry - large machines, high-power electrical installation, not powered from the public low-voltage supply. No broadcast radio or TV receivers likely to be within 30 metres. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO - Own Opinions Only

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Schmidt, Mark
Hi John, Would this be applicable for Light Industrial equipment as well? Thank you. From: John Woodgate [mailto:jmw1...@btinternet.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2016 10:49 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Allen
Jamison The shopping mall example could be a "difficult" situation, but for me that means that there will be quite a lot of Class A ITE such as servers and the like (and even a lot of that is now likely to be Class B because that is what many large end-use customers now specify and expect) in

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
There is an on-going (silent) conflict between the European commission and a number of cenelec and cispr committees, notably those responsible for EN 55032 and EN 55011. While the EC has expressed their opinion in the generic standards, and expressed their desire that all product committees

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
For Europe, the sources are the Generic standards, which are substantially consistent with CISPR 11. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England Sylvae in aeternum manent. From:

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
Yes, the docopocoss for EN 55022 is 5 March 2017. Products leaving the factory after that must meet EN 55032. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England Sylvae in aeternum manent.

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Ghery S. Pettit
Rajneesh, You are correct in your understanding. Existing products will have to be shown to be compliant with EN 55032 by March of next year. The good news is that you may be able to get the lab to evaluate how the testing to EN 55022 was performed and if it is still compliant with EN

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Charlie Blackham
Rajneesh Please note, compliance with EN 55032 is not “required” after March 2017 any more than EN 55022 is “required” now – it might be heavily recommended, but it is not “required”. A Harmonised Standard: · Provides a presumption of Conformity with a Directive · Is what

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Bill Stumpf
EN 55032 and EN 55022 are harmonized Standards which can be tested to in order for presumption of conformity to the EMC Directive. Once EN 55022 is withdrawn you will need to update your DOC to indicate compliance with EN 55032, assuming you continue to use the Harmonized Standard route to

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
This is not productive. The enquirer is clearly using the standards route , so there is no point in introducing the alternative and much less certain route. Yes, I could have written 'de facto but not de jure' but would it have helped the enquirer one iota? With best wishes DESIGN IT IN!

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Kortas, Jamison
Thanks all – at least I am not the only one unsure. I am trying to establish a set of criteria that I can ask our engineers and marketers that will determine the classification. A decision tree, if you will. This arose from a device that met the less stringent criteria, but not the more

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
A simple, undefined assertion is of no value. What is not correct? With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and Associates Rayleigh England Sylvae in aeternum manent. From: Charlie Blackham

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread Charlie Blackham
Your previous comment….. >From: John Woodgate [mailto:jmw1...@btinternet.com] >Sent: 18 October 2016 18:24 >To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG >Subject: Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032 >Yes, the docopocoss for EN 55022 is 5 March 2017. Products leaving the factory >after

Re: [PSES] Criteria for determining industrial vs. non-industrial for EMC testing purposes

2016-10-18 Thread Douglas Nix
Gert, You mention that there is a conflict, but you don't explain what the conflict is. Can you tell me how the EC definition varies from the definition I quoted from EN 55011? Sent from my iPhone Doug Nix d...@mac.com Mobile: (519) 729-5704 > On Oct 18, 2016, at 13:55, ce-test, qualified

Re: [PSES] Working towards compliance as per the EN 55032

2016-10-18 Thread John Woodgate
Mediaeval scholars used to answer any question by beginning with the Creation. I think that answers should be kept strictly simple and not explore the whole Universe. With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and