Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-10-04 Thread MIKE SHERMAN
My recollection is that NFPA 70 does require various equipment to be listed, 
but I am not sure that NFPA 70 directly links to that OSHA web site. It would 
seem odd to me for a consensus standard like NFPA 70 to include requirements 
that could potentially be changed by OSHA without following a consensus 
standards approval process.

Mike Sherman
Sherman PSC LLC

> On 10/04/2022 11:48 AM James Pawson (U3C)  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> Hello everyone,
> 
>  
> 
> Thank you for all the replies. Some of them confirmed my existing 
> understanding but there were more that revealed more questions.
> 
>  
> 
> Summary of previous points (please call these out for lack of accuracy)
> 
>  
> 
>1. Safety testing not explicitly based on any kind of voltage 
> threshold (like EU Low Voltage Directive) or on the presence of a Radio in 
> the equipment (like EU Radio Equipment Directive)
>2. NRTL approval and marking can be mandated by a number of sources:
>  1. If the equipment is used in a workplace where the employer 
> has more than 50 staff then the employer has to comply with OSHA requirements 
> for all equipment used on site, or;
>  2. If the product falls under the one of these safety approval 
> standards 
> https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/list-standards
>  then it requires listing? or;
>  3. Some large retailers e.g. Walmart insist on NRTL listing for 
> any products carried as a liability reduction exercise, or;
>  4. Some large retailers may insist on use of a particular NRTL 
> e.g. UL even though others are available, or;
>  5. Local jurisdictions (e.g. LA, California) require NRTL for 
> consumer
>3. NRTL selection
>  1. UL has become a generic term for NRTL certification like 
> “hoover” instead of “vacuum cleaner”
>  2. Check list of NRTLs 
> https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/current-list-of-nrtls
>  and verify that they are recognised for the specific standard
> 
> 
> Questions
> 
> 
> Is my understanding of Point 2.b above correct? Bernd mentioned that this 
> requirement comes from NFPA 70?
> 
> 
> Specific application
> 
> 
> The product in question is a motion sensor used in building control 
> systems. It is powered off a maximum of 36VDC and has a power consumption of 
> less than 1W.
> 
> 
> Following the EU standards trail, EN 60730-1 would be the most relevant 
> Harmonised Standard. I can see the equivalent UL 60730-1 in the list of 
> safety approval standards.
> 
> 
> Does that mean NRTL approval is required as per point 2.b above? Or is 
> NRTL use still a matter of choice if it doesn’t fall under point 2?
> 
> 
> I’m just trying to give the best advice to my customer. I appreciate 
> Scott’s well word comments of “better to go through the process and reduce 
> liability” so I appreciate the risk/liability dimension to this question.
> 
> 
> All the best
> 
> James
> 
> 
> James Pawson
> 
> Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver
> 
> 
> Office hours:
> 
> My mornings are reserved for full attention on consultancy, testing, and 
> troubleshooting activities for our customers’ projects.
> 
> I am otherwise contactable between 1300h to 1730h from Monday to Friday.
> 
> For inquiries, bookings, and testing updates please send us an email on 
> he...@unit3compliance.co.uk mailto:he...@unit3compliance.co.uk or call 01274 
> 911747.
> 
> Our lead times for testing and consultancy are typically 4-5 weeks.
> 
>  
> 
> Unit 3 Compliance Ltd
> 
> EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA : 
> Consultancy
> 
>  
> 
> www.unit3compliance.co.uk http://www.unit3compliance.co.uk/   |  
> ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk mailto:ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk
> 
> +44(0)1274 911747  |  +44(0)7811 139957
> 
> 2 Wellington Business Park, New Lane, Bradford, BD4 8AL
> 
> Registered in England and Wales # 10574298
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> From: James Pawson (U3C) 
> Sent: 27 September 2022 08:20
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> Subject: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question
> 
> 
> Hello experts,
> 
> 
> I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval 
> for electrical safety for sale in the United States.
> 
> 
> Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
> (https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
>  which links to this page (
> 
> https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)
> 
> 
> Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
> equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
> require NRTL approval?
> 
> 
> The question comes from a customer who was 

Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-10-04 Thread James Pawson (U3C)
Hello everyone,

 

Thank you for all the replies. Some of them confirmed my existing understanding 
but there were more that revealed more questions.

 

Summary of previous points (please call these out for lack of accuracy) 

 

1.  Safety testing not explicitly based on any kind of voltage threshold 
(like EU Low Voltage Directive) or on the presence of a Radio in the equipment 
(like EU Radio Equipment Directive)
2.  NRTL approval and marking can be mandated by a number of sources:

a.  If the equipment is used in a workplace where the employer has more 
than 50 staff then the employer has to comply with OSHA requirements for all 
equipment used on site, or;
b.  If the product falls under the one of these safety approval standards 

  then it requires listing? or;
c.  Some large retailers e.g. Walmart insist on NRTL listing for any 
products carried as a liability reduction exercise, or;
d.  Some large retailers may insist on use of a particular NRTL e.g. UL 
even though others are available, or;
e.  Local jurisdictions (e.g. LA, California) require NRTL for consumer

3.  NRTL selection

a.  UL has become a generic term for NRTL certification like “hoover” 
instead of “vacuum cleaner”
b.  Check list of NRTLs 

  and verify that they are recognised for the specific standard

 

Questions

 

Is my understanding of Point 2.b above correct? Bernd mentioned that this 
requirement comes from NFPA 70?

 

Specific application

 

The product in question is a motion sensor used in building control systems. It 
is powered off a maximum of 36VDC and has a power consumption of less than 1W.

 

Following the EU standards trail, EN 60730-1 would be the most relevant 
Harmonised Standard. I can see the equivalent UL 60730-1 in the list of safety 
approval standards.

 

Does that mean NRTL approval is required as per point 2.b above? Or is NRTL use 
still a matter of choice if it doesn’t fall under point 2?

 

I’m just trying to give the best advice to my customer. I appreciate Scott’s 
well word comments of “better to go through the process and reduce liability” 
so I appreciate the risk/liability dimension to this question. 

 

All the best

James

 

James Pawson

Managing Director & EMC Problem Solver

 

Office hours:

My mornings are reserved for full attention on consultancy, testing, and 
troubleshooting activities for our customers’ projects.

I am otherwise contactable between 1300h to 1730h from Monday to Friday.

For inquiries, bookings, and testing updates please send us an email on  
 he...@unit3compliance.co.uk or call 01274 
911747.

Our lead times for testing and consultancy are typically 4-5 weeks.

 

Unit 3 Compliance Ltd

EMC : Environmental & Vibration : Electrical Safety : CE & UKCA : Consultancy

 

  www.unit3compliance.co.uk  |   
 ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk 

+44(0)1274 911747  |  +44(0)7811 139957

2 Wellington Business Park, New Lane, Bradford, BD4 8AL

Registered in England and Wales # 10574298

 

 

 

From: James Pawson (U3C)  
Sent: 27 September 2022 08:20
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

 

Hello experts,

 

I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.

 

Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (

https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)
 

 

Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval? 

 

The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this. 

 

Thanks as always. 

 

All the best 

James 



-


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Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-28 Thread Dave Pedersen
Hi James,

In your email below, you say, “The question comes from a customer who was 
emailed by one of his US customers stating that he should have "UL listing".”   
The US customer might be concerned about regulatory requirements in the US.  
They also might be concerned because the part in question is being used inside 
their end product that they know will be getting a UL/NRTL approval.  Their 
end-product investigation will likely go more smoothly if all of the 
safety-critical parts internal have some level of NRTL approvals (Listing, 
Recognition, etc.)  We look for this in the parts used in our end products and 
if there’s a part we really want to use that doesn’t have a NRTL approval, 
we’ll ask the vendor to get it for us to reduce the challenges during our UL 
Listing investigations.

Dave


From: James Pawson (U3C) 
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 1:20 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question


[ External Email ]

Hello experts,


I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.


Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (

https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)


Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval?


The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this.


Thanks as always.


All the best

James


-


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Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-28 Thread S Drysdale
Avoiding showing bias towards or against any particular NRTL, here is
a list of current NRTLs, each with their own specific scope:
https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/current-list-of-nrtls

IMHO - it is nobler in the mind to suffer the compliance cost then it
is to suffer the outrageous fortune in liability,
and to take precautions against a sea of troubles, and thus by being
cautious end those risks.

Best Regards,
Scott Drysdale
OOO - Own opinions only

On Tue, Sep 27, 2022 at 3:20 AM James Pawson (U3C)
 wrote:
>
> Hello experts,
>
>
> I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
> electrical safety for sale in the United States.
>
>
> Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
> (https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
>  which links to this page (
>
> https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)
>
>
> Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
> equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
> require NRTL approval?
>
>
> The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
> stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
> the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
> appreciate any comments on this.
>
>
> Thanks as always.
>
>
> All the best
>
> James
>
>
>
> -
> 
>
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
> emc-p...@ieee.org
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
> Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to 
> unsubscribe)
> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html
>
> For help, send mail to the list administrators:
> Mike Cantwell mcantw...@ieee.org
>
> For policy questions, send mail to:
> Jim Bacher j.bac...@ieee.org
> David Heald dhe...@gmail.com
>
> 
>
> To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: 
> https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC=1

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Re: [PSES] [EXTERNAL] Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-27 Thread MIKE SHERMAN
Many retailers who sell consumer goods will require NRTL marking on electrical 
goods as part of their purchase contract with you.

Mike Sherman
Sherman PSC LLC

> On 09/27/2022 5:03 PM Knudsen, Patty 
> <1c82e1717b3f-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ieee.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> OSHA regulates the USA workplace, but a lot of local USA jurisdictions 
> (Los Angeles, California, for one) require NRTL approval for consumer 
> products.  There are many NRTL agencies (UL, CSA, Nemko, Intertek, TUV are a 
> few) that can do the job.
> 
> 
> Patty
> 
> 
> 
> From: Kevin Robinson 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 5:03 AM
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question
> 
> 
> [CAUTION: External Email]
> 
> 
> OSHA requires any electrical product being used in the workplace to be 
> tested and certified by an NRTL.  There is no lower voltage or power limit.  
> 
> 
> A “UL Listing” and “NRTL Certification” are the same thing.  The 
> difference being the UL Listing is a NRTL Listing specifically from UL 
> (similar to the difference between “Kleenex” and “facial tissue”
> 
> 
> Kevin Robinson 
> 
> 
> Get Outlook for iOS 
> https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Faka.ms%2Fo0ukef=05%7C01%7CPatty.Knudsen%40Teradata.com%7C115a6b328a05434a84a708daa0804228%7C9151cbaafc6b4f4889bb8c4a71982138%7C0%7C0%7C637998769973197017%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=ySnb3rJt%2BBKJ2YdX%2FYR%2Fe8flLWTmWro16CvNdSpXSp4%3D=0
> 
> 
> -
> 
> From: Dürrer Bernd mailto:bernd.duer...@wilo.com >
> Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 7:56:08 AM
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 
> mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG >
> Subject: [PSES] AW: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question
> 
> 
> Hello James,
> 
>  
> 
> I propose to check Annex A of the National Electrical Code NFPA 70 (NFPA 
> 70®: National Electrical Code® 
> https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nfpa.org%2Fcodes-and-standards%2Fall-codes-and-standards%2Flist-of-codes-and-standards%2Fdetail%3Fcode%3D70=05%7C01%7CPatty.Knudsen%40Teradata.com%7C115a6b328a05434a84a708daa0804228%7C9151cbaafc6b4f4889bb8c4a71982138%7C0%7C0%7C637998769973197017%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=nXBDZv1ceZH16GjMFzGLQyLm7K3D%2FP8ZA%2BOqdOSqR08%3D=0
>  ) that contains a list of product safety standards used for product listing 
> where listing is required by the NEC. If the equipment in question is in the 
> scope of a standard mentioned there, it requires listing (i.e. certification 
> by a NRTL as defined in NEC article 110.3(C)).
> 
>  
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
>  
> 
> Bernd
> 
>  
> 
> Von: James Pawson (U3C)  mailto:ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk >
> Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. September 2022 09:20
> An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> Betreff: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question
> 
> 
> Hello experts,
> 
> 
> I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval 
> for electrical safety for sale in the United States.
> 
> 
> Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
> (https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval
>  
> https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.osha.gov%2Fnationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program%2Fproducts-requiring-approval=05%7C01%7CPatty.Knudsen%40Teradata.com%7C115a6b328a05434a84a708daa0804228%7C9151cbaafc6b4f4889bb8c4a71982138%7C0%7C0%7C637998769973197017%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=iCx%2FZk5P5x4XAejFLjamQ2Y%2B1vfPdnHood%2BhB6nGlOY%3D=0
>  ) which links to this page (
> 
> https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307
>  
> https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.osha.gov%2Fnationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program%2F1910-references%231910_303-307=05%7C01%7CPatty.Knudsen%40Teradata.com%7C115a6b328a05434a84a708daa0804228%7C9151cbaafc6b4f4889bb8c4a71982138%7C0%7C0%7C637998769973197017%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C=wIjwXYAyHKykRDcgLHlBTPrkMMiEuJKO3TpPEWfNYsM%3D=0
>  )
> 
> 
> Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
> equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
> require NRTL approval?
> 
> 
> The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US 
> customers stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL 
> approval and the Listing 

Re: [PSES] [EXTERNAL] Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-27 Thread Knudsen, Patty
OSHA regulates the USA workplace, but a lot of local USA jurisdictions (Los 
Angeles, California, for one) require NRTL approval for consumer products.  
There are many NRTL agencies (UL, CSA, Nemko, Intertek, TUV are a few) that can 
do the job.

Patty


From: Kevin Robinson 
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 5:03 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

[CAUTION: External Email]

OSHA requires any electrical product being used in the workplace to be tested 
and certified by an NRTL.  There is no lower voltage or power limit.

A "UL Listing" and "NRTL Certification" are the same thing.  The difference 
being the UL Listing is a NRTL Listing specifically from UL (similar to the 
difference between "Kleenex" and "facial tissue"

Kevin Robinson

Get Outlook for 
iOS

From: Dürrer Bernd mailto:bernd.duer...@wilo.com>>
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 7:56:08 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 
mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>>
Subject: [PSES] AW: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question


Hello James,



I propose to check Annex A of the National Electrical Code NFPA 70 (NFPA 70®: 
National Electrical 
Code®)
 that contains a list of product safety standards used for product listing 
where listing is required by the NEC. If the equipment in question is in the 
scope of a standard mentioned there, it requires listing (i.e. certification by 
a NRTL as defined in NEC article 110.3(C)).



Kind regards,



Bernd



Von: James Pawson (U3C) 
mailto:ja...@unit3compliance.co.uk>>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. September 2022 09:20
An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Betreff: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question



Hello experts,



I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.



Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (

https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)



Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval?



The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this.



Thanks as always.



All the best

James


-


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discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
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Re: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-27 Thread Kevin Robinson
OSHA requires any electrical product being used in the workplace to be tested 
and certified by an NRTL.  There is no lower voltage or power limit.

A “UL Listing” and “NRTL Certification” are the same thing.  The difference 
being the UL Listing is a NRTL Listing specifically from UL (similar to the 
difference between “Kleenex” and “facial tissue”

Kevin Robinson

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From: Dürrer Bernd 
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2022 7:56:08 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG 
Subject: [PSES] AW: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question


Hello James,



I propose to check Annex A of the National Electrical Code NFPA 70 (NFPA 70®: 
National Electrical 
Code®)
 that contains a list of product safety standards used for product listing 
where listing is required by the NEC. If the equipment in question is in the 
scope of a standard mentioned there, it requires listing (i.e. certification by 
a NRTL as defined in NEC article 110.3(C)).



Kind regards,



Bernd



Von: James Pawson (U3C) 
Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. September 2022 09:20
An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Betreff: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question



Hello experts,



I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.



Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (

https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)



Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval?



The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this.



Thanks as always.



All the best

James


-


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[PSES] AW: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-27 Thread Dürrer Bernd
Hello James,

I propose to check Annex A of the National Electrical Code NFPA 70 (NFPA 70®: 
National Electrical 
Code®)
 that contains a list of product safety standards used for product listing 
where listing is required by the NEC. If the equipment in question is in the 
scope of a standard mentioned there, it requires listing (i.e. certification by 
a NRTL as defined in NEC article 110.3(C)).

Kind regards,

Bernd

Von: James Pawson (U3C) 
Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. September 2022 09:20
An: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Betreff: [PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question


Hello experts,


I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.


Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (

https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)


Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval?


The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this.


Thanks as always.


All the best

James


-


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discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
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Amtsgericht Dortmund, HRB 21356
www.wilo.com

Vorstand/Executive Board:
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[PSES] To NRTL or not NRTL, that is the question

2022-09-27 Thread James Pawson (U3C)
Hello experts,

I'm trying to understand what electrical products require NRTL approval for 
electrical safety for sale in the United States.

Looking on the OSHA website I find this page 
(https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/products-requiring-approval)
 which links to this page (
https://www.osha.gov/nationally-recognized-testing-laboratory-program/1910-references#1910_303-307)
 

Taking this at face value, particularly 303(g)(2)(i), does this mean that 
equipment operating at less than 50V (I'm assuming DC and AC RMS) does not 
require NRTL approval? 

The question comes from a customer who was emailed by one of his US customers 
stating that he should have "UL listing". I understand that NRTL approval and 
the Listing process are different with the latter being more involved? Would 
appreciate any comments on this. 

Thanks as always. 

All the best 
James 



-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
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_
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