[Emc-users] Radio station stories -- Was RE: Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread John Dammeyer
Hi Gene,
 
> And yes that supply s/b installed so it can be swapped out for a fresh
> one easily, the capacitors WILL die, sometimes a horribly messy death.
> Least dependable part in any system. We need to invent something more
> dependable for use as a large capacitance, but alu foil, kraft paper,
> and a cc or less of technical grade ethylene glycol is 100 years later,
> still the cheapest farad you can buy by several magnitudes. 

I used the highest hour rated, highest temperature and 4x the needed value for 
the simple linear DC power supplies in this project.  
http://www.autoartisans.com/LGB/Lions%20Gate%20Bridge%20Pano1.jpg
This summer it will have been running for 10 years without (AFAIK) any 
failures.  Granted the power factor sucked but a more complicated supply that 
would move the PF up to close to 100% would have added a major potential single 
point failure to 6 LED modules in each lamp.

I'm also a
> Certified Electronics Technician, now long since retired after spending
> nearly 50 years keeping some tv station on the air.

Spent a year as a disk jockey at CJOI 1440.  Evenings for the first 2.25 hours 
were boring playing religious "send me your money" tapes.  After that it was 
rock music till 1AM. I had the job because the automation system (International 
Good Music  IGM) was flakey and would play run the card reader empty and then 
just play the backup music tape and no commercials.

Since I had two hours every night where all I had to do was queue tapes and 
keep the volume high enough to determine it was working I'd play with the 
automation system.  All RTL logic.  Two of the 4 fans in the cabinet were 
toast.  I replaced those.  (I had a high school diploma in Electronics 
Technology).

Here's how the system worked.  A punched card reader.  An IBM Selectric 735 
computer controlled typewriter. Two reel-reel tape machines with music.  Two 
large cartridge machines (like 8 track but huge) one with odd minute messages 
and one with even minute messages.  Each message was about 8 seconds long.  
Then a series of rotary carousels with cartridges holding the commercials and 
promos.  Like 8 track but the pin roller was part of the player and not inside 
the cartridge.  It could take up to 25 seconds to rotate around and find the 
cartridge and cue it.

So a punch card would have and ID in the first 3 columns  like E21 or B12 for 
the cartridge carousels.  A T00 for a Time Card and a L00 or L01 for the reel 
to reel machines.  The program director would organize the music, commercials 
and time announcements  The rest of the punch card had information like client 
or song or whatever.

The card reader would index through the first three columns of the card and 
that would then select the carousel or tape machine getting it ready for the 
end of the previous selection.  Once the music or commercial started the card 
would be read at the speed of the Selectric which printed out the 3 digit 
number, and the rest of the text on the card onto the log printout.  Then the 3 
columns of the next card would be read and the corresponding hardware would be 
queued.

Finding that next selection took 25 seconds and didn't matter because the music 
and commercials were at least 30 seconds long.  The problem was the time 
announcements.  At about 8 seconds they'd be done before the next commercial 
was queued.  So the electronics (micro-processors didn't exist yet) would read 
the T00 time card, latch that a time announcement was needed.  Either ODD or 
EVEN, and then eject the T00 card and read the 3 columns of the next card.

And there was the problem.  Once it hit a time card, it would read it, eject it 
and then eject the entire pile in the reader too.  All the commercials were 
gone. With an empty card reader the music tape would default and play with a 
few seconds gap between songs.  And when it ran out, dead air.

Replacing the fans didn't really do anything.  But when one of the boards was 
on an extender card out in free air suddenly the system worked and sounded 
different.   A bit of time with a scope and freeze spray and I found the 
offending chip.  Once replaced the 3 column punch card read which had taken 
about 1/4 second suddenly sounded like it was a single column read it was so 
fast.  Kind of a blurp rather than a tick tick tick.  

There was another timer circuit.  If  took too long to read a card and the T 
column latched an EJECT signal for the card out went all of them. Once the new 
RTL chip was installed the read was so fast the timeout never happened.

All discovered because a slight change in temperature with the card out in 
ambient air on the extender card made the card reader sound ever so slightly 
different which set me onto the path with freeze spray.

And I'm willing to bet everyone on this list running CNC can 'feel' and 'hear' 
when something isn't quite right.  It's so subtle and often even difficult to 
explain to someone without experience.  But it's there.
> 

Re: [Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 22:20:38 John Dammeyer wrote:

> > Would you like to compare birthdays John? I've had 84 of them
> > things. ;-)
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
>
> I have a few years to go but for some reason still feeling growly. 
> Went looking for some tintable alkyd enamel paint today to match the
> mill so I could paint the CNC cabinet.  What a wasted day.  No one
> carries this anymore.  All water based.
>
> Trouble is the frame already has oil based primer so I can't really
> put water based anything on it until it's totally dry.  Have to try an
> autobody supply store tomorrow.
>
> So then I started installing all the electronics onto the frame and
> dropped the 24 volt supply.  Probably still works.  But now with 20-20
> hind sight I don't think the way I'm installing it will make it easy
> to service (replace).
>
> Time for a beer.

I've had my one near beer for the day, I was found diabetic about 25 
years back, so now I take a couple grams of metformin daily.

And I can testify that hind sight is a lot better than 20-20. Old age, it 
creeps up on you in very stealthy moccasins.  And its a good idea to 
never look back, something might be gaining on you.

And yes that supply s/b installed so it can be swapped out for a fresh 
one easily, the capacitors WILL die, sometimes a horribly messy death. 
Least dependable part in any system. We need to invent something more 
dependable for use as a large capacitance, but alu foil, kraft paper, 
and a cc or less of technical grade ethylene glycol is 100 years later, 
still the cheapest farad you can buy by several magnitudes. I'm also a 
Certified Electronics Technician, now long since retired after spending 
nearly 50 years keeping some tv station on the air.

Its been quite a ride since I fixed my first tv in 1948, at 14 years old.  
Yup, I was a geek before the word was invented. But now I've had a 
couple health accidents that have slowed the thinker a bit. Most 
recently a pacemaker, I was getting dizzy in between heartbeats.  
Figured I had better get that fixed as I have a fading wife to care for.

Take care John.

> John
>
>
>
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread John Dammeyer
> Would you like to compare birthdays John? I've had 84 of them things. ;-)
> 
> Cheers, Gene Heskett

I have a few years to go but for some reason still feeling growly.  Went 
looking for some tintable alkyd enamel paint today to match the mill so I could 
paint the CNC cabinet.  What a wasted day.  No one carries this anymore.  All 
water based.  

Trouble is the frame already has oil based primer so I can't really put water 
based anything on it until it's totally dry.  Have to try an autobody supply 
store tomorrow.

So then I started installing all the electronics onto the frame and dropped the 
24 volt supply.  Probably still works.  But now with 20-20 hind sight I don't 
think the way I'm installing it will make it easy to service (replace).  

Time for a beer.

John




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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread TJoseph Powderly

Rafael

On 04/01/2019 12:46 AM, Rafael Skodlar wrote:

On 3/31/19 8:07 AM, TJoseph Powderly wrote:

hi gene
maybe redesign to drive past the switch
like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand over
the wall surface
rather than punching it :-)
( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to 
the

joint motion )
tomp



Good idea. Some computers from the 70's and 80's had a lot of 
mechanical parts. I remember seeing a double switch solutions to 
detect position of some kind of a sliding mechanism. Thinking about 
it, that kind of solution was possibly used on head assembly with 
voice coil in disk drives.


Switch assembly had tiny wheels on spring loaded lever that was 
pushing gently on microswitch. First switch would detect adjustable 
position close to the limit, second switch was the absolute limit. 
When the electronics detects first switch it slows down the motor and 
the mechanism continues to move to the absolute limit switch then stops.


A: No.
Q: Should I include quotations after my reply?

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?


noted
tomp


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Re: [Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 20:05:41 John Dammeyer wrote:

> > It's not just the order of posting---it's also the courteous habit
> > of editing the post
>
> I agree.
>
> > Another thing---it's not just the Linux invaders who insist on
> > bottom-posting---it's an age-honored tradition of the Usenet, so I
> > am surprised that you are surprised by it.
>
> Not surprised.  Just always annoyed by it.  The history is there in
> the previous messages.  Rarely are more than a few lines are needed. 
> But then note that I also changed the subject line.
>
> But I'm getting old and growly now even if I still have
> rec.crafts.metalworking posts from 1997.
>
> John
>
Would you like to compare birthdays John? I've had 84 of them things. ;-)
>
>
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread John Dammeyer
> 
> It's not just the order of posting---it's also the courteous habit of
> editing the post 

I agree.

> 
> Another thing---it's not just the Linux invaders who insist on
> bottom-posting---it's an age-honored tradition of the Usenet, so I am
> surprised that you are surprised by it.

Not surprised.  Just always annoyed by it.  The history is there in the 
previous messages.  Rarely are more than a few lines are needed.  But then note 
that I also changed the subject line.

But I'm getting old and growly now even if I still have rec.crafts.metalworking 
posts from 1997.

John




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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-users Digest, Vol 155, Issue 139

2019-03-31 Thread (PVT) Paul Lawrence

Gene,

Your limit switch over run issue is quite easy to solve. Rather than have your 
stops run into the switch, have the stops run across the switch. The typical 
switches used in industry has a roller on the end and the stops designed with a 
'V'. Thereby allow virtually unlimited ability to over run other than physical 
limits.

Regards

Paul
 


On 31/03/2019 18:19, emc-users-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net wrote:

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Today's Topics:

1. Re: Home-limit switch measuring (Jon Elson)
2. Re: Home-limit switch measuring (Gene Heskett)
3. Re: Home-limit switch measuring (Gene Heskett)
4. Re: Home-limit switch measuring (jrmitchellj)
5. Re: Home-limit switch measuring (Chris Albertson)


--

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2019 12:07:50 -0500
From: Jon Elson 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"

Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring
Message-ID: <5ca0f3e6.5010...@pico-systems.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

On 03/31/2019 08:59 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

Greetings everybody;

I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that
faint knocking sound.

Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
limit switches.

However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked
is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so
that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a
Coors can.

Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is
occuring?



Yes, use Halscope, and watch the limit switch and the axis
position, have the scope trigger on the switch.  Then, set
it up to home at the desired velocity, and hold a metal rod
or something that will trip the switch but not hurt anything
when it overtravels.  That should give you a trace of travel
vs time.  Then, select the position trace and use the cursor
in the scope window and it shows you the actual numerical
reading at the bottom.

Jon



--

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2019 13:14:58 -0400
From: Gene Heskett 
To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring
Message-ID: <201903311314.58424.ghesk...@shentel.net>
Content-Type: Text/Plain;  charset="iso-8859-1"

On Sunday 31 March 2019 11:07:51 TJoseph Powderly wrote:


hi gene
maybe redesign to drive past the switch
like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand
over the wall surface
rather than punching it :-)
( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to
the joint motion )
tomp


I hadn't thought of that idea, mainly because that would put the
mechanism out in the breeze and subject to damage, or maybe snagging a
hose etc as it moves. Mounted so as to detect the touch of the two parts
as it comes to the end of travel is quite appetizing in addition to
being "in out of the weather" so to speak. Mounting a 90 degree angled
and flexible lever for z would either project forward or sideways, and
sideways would cost me x travel too. I'll have to go stand and stare at
it some more & see what I can imagine AND make. I've already done some
of that, and keep throwing it away for one reason or another.  The best
idea seems to be to make a spring loaded button pusher with 1/4" of give
in the spring, but that sticks out. On both moving and stationary parts.
Sliding a ramp over the top of the button equals wear on the plastic
button. And complicated  by the inability to get at it to drill & tap
screw holes without a huge teardown. So whatever is going to have to be
set in position and superglued to the epoxy paint on everything.
Imagination will be made to work overtime for sure. Changing switch
style to roller lever is looking like a possibility. Put a short tab of
sheet alu to stick out of the gap and hit the roller might work, and
that would put the switch body flat on the stationary part. They can
stand some overtravel by flexing the lever. I have enough of those for
homes, but not for limits too.  And with no Radio Shacks left, China is
the nearest vendor. 6 weeks. Humm, for x home at left, peel my cable
back out of the gantry cable chain early. Y home never gets to the
gantry cable, only thru the new cambric coming down from the electronics
shelf. Like I said, stand and stare at it. 

Re: [Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread Przemek Klosowski
On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 2:20 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Personally I think that's a load of crap.  Usenet and email postings are
> sequential.  Scrolling through hundreds of lines of text all indented with
> various amounts of ">>>" depending on when it was posted is not only mind
> numbing but leads to ignoring posts.  I've lost track of the number of
> times I hit the X on the email when there are pages of old stuff that I
> just read on a previous email.  Now I have to carefully scroll through to
> find the reply.  Not worth my time.
>

It's not just the order of posting---it's also the courteous habit of
editing the post so that your response follows just the minimal snippet
necessary to provide the context to what you're saying. I think that more
than 12 lines of context almost always mean that such courtesy was not
extended.

Another thing---it's not just the Linux invaders who insist on
bottom-posting---it's an age-honored tradition of the Usenet, so I am
surprised that you are surprised by it.

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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 16:36:58 hubert wrote:

> Gene
>
>     How many roller switches would you need.  I have more than I need.
>
> Hubert

4 or so should get me going. PM me where I should send a 5$ bill.

>
> On 3/31/19 12:14 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Sunday 31 March 2019 11:07:51 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
> >> hi gene
> >> maybe redesign to drive past the switch
> >> like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand
> >> over the wall surface
> >> rather than punching it :-)
> >> ( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress
> >> to the joint motion )
> >> tomp
> >
> > I hadn't thought of that idea, mainly because that would put the
> > mechanism out in the breeze and subject to damage, or maybe snagging
> > a hose etc as it moves. Mounted so as to detect the touch of the two
> > parts as it comes to the end of travel is quite appetizing in
> > addition to being "in out of the weather" so to speak. Mounting a 90
> > degree angled and flexible lever for z would either project forward
> > or sideways, and sideways would cost me x travel too. I'll have to
> > go stand and stare at it some more & see what I can imagine AND
> > make. I've already done some of that, and keep throwing it away for
> > one reason or another.  The best idea seems to be to make a spring
> > loaded button pusher with 1/4" of give in the spring, but that
> > sticks out. On both moving and stationary parts. Sliding a ramp over
> > the top of the button equals wear on the plastic button. And
> > complicated  by the inability to get at it to drill & tap screw
> > holes without a huge teardown. So whatever is going to have to be
> > set in position and superglued to the epoxy paint on everything.
> > Imagination will be made to work overtime for sure. Changing switch
> > style to roller lever is looking like a possibility. Put a short tab
> > of sheet alu to stick out of the gap and hit the roller might work,
> > and that would put the switch body flat on the stationary part. They
> > can stand some overtravel by flexing the lever. I have enough of
> > those for homes, but not for limits too.  And with no Radio Shacks
> > left, China is the nearest vendor. 6 weeks. Humm, for x home at
> > left, peel my cable back out of the gantry cable chain early. Y home
> > never gets to the gantry cable, only thru the new cambric coming
> > down from the electronics shelf. Like I said, stand and stare at it.
> > And let my imagination out without a chaperone...
> >
> > Thanks TomP.
> >
> >> On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 9:03 PM Gene Heskett 
> >
> > wrote:
> >>> Greetings everybody;
> >>>
> >>> I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore
> >>> that faint knocking sound.
> >>>
> >>> Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> >>> between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially
> >>> as limit switches.
> >>>
> >>> However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has
> >>> clicked is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on
> >>> something crushable so that the getting stopped overtravel does
> >>> not crush the switch like a Coors can.
> >>>
> >>> Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds
> >>> is occuring?
> >>>
> >>> I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on
> >>> this machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable
> >>> distance when the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after
> >>> its clicked.
> >>>
> >>> So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I
> >>> can use for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN
> >>> LIMITS far enough away from the crash stop to provide crash
> >>> protection in the space between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or
> >>> how much crush room I have to build into the switch mount?
> >>>
> >>> Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or
> >>> how can one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping
> >>> the motor faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a
> >>> $90 dial into junk.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks all;
> >>>
> >>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> >>> --
> >>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >>>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> >>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> >>> Genes Web page 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> Emc-users mailing list
> >>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four 

Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 13:17:59 jrmitchellj wrote:

> As I tell the robotics students, design limit switches to survive
> missed detection & over travel.
> On a milling machine, I would recommend a roller type of switch, that
> would come in contact with a cam bar that is long enough  to reach end
> of travel.
>
> On my machine, I have two switches positioned about an inch apart, at
> the middle of travel.  Then the are cam blocks, one positioned near
> each end of travel
> The roller rides up on the block, trips the switch, and the switch
> body is safely out of the travel path.  I did my mill this way because
> I have sooo many pins available with the Mesa kit.
>
> On the school mill, I used one switch for each axis, and the cam block
> from either end of travel would trip it.
>
> So no failure (or other malfunction) will crush a switch!

I have my G0704 rigged much like that. But this gantry isn't built like 
the 704. As an experiment I've about half built when the better half 
pled hunger about an hour ago, so quit. I have a 4x.7x20 threaded into 
the front face of the gantry on the right side, whose flat head pushes 
one of these switches that is mounted on a small bit of pcb glued to the 
end of a 5/16" x 2" alu cut from some 40 thou panel, but will need to 
replace that 20mm screw with at least a 30mm and a lock nut. 
Experimentally it can flex the 2" of alu away from the frame with at 
least 1/8" of overtravel w/o actually bending it, so I'm thinking an 
even longer screw to trip it even earlier, and a lock nut so the screw 
won't work out of adjustment will handle the Y home ok. I think I can 
rig the X much the same. Z of course doesn't have to move near as far, 
so a slow search there isn't going to be too much like watching paint 
dry.  But Y might have to move 600mm, so its just got to march right 
along, ditto for the nearly 400mm X might have to move.

Thanks JRM.
>
> --J. Ray Mitchell Jr.
> jrmitche...@gmail.com
>
>
>
> "Good enough is the enemy of excellence"author unknown
>
> On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 7:03 AM Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > Greetings everybody;
> >
> > I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore
> > that faint knocking sound.
> >
> > Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> > between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> > limit switches.
> >
> > However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has
> > clicked is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something
> > crushable so that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the
> > switch like a Coors can.
> >
> > Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds
> > is occuring?
> >
> > I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
> > machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance
> > when the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its
> > clicked.
> >
> > So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can
> > use for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS
> > far enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in
> > the space between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush
> > room I have to build into the switch mount?
> >
> > Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how
> > can one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the
> > motor faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial
> > into junk.
> >
> > Thanks all;
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > Genes Web page 
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread hubert

Gene

   How many roller switches would you need.  I have more than I need.

Hubert

On 3/31/19 12:14 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Sunday 31 March 2019 11:07:51 TJoseph Powderly wrote:


hi gene
maybe redesign to drive past the switch
like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand
over the wall surface
rather than punching it :-)
( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to
the joint motion )
tomp


I hadn't thought of that idea, mainly because that would put the
mechanism out in the breeze and subject to damage, or maybe snagging a
hose etc as it moves. Mounted so as to detect the touch of the two parts
as it comes to the end of travel is quite appetizing in addition to
being "in out of the weather" so to speak. Mounting a 90 degree angled
and flexible lever for z would either project forward or sideways, and
sideways would cost me x travel too. I'll have to go stand and stare at
it some more & see what I can imagine AND make. I've already done some
of that, and keep throwing it away for one reason or another.  The best
idea seems to be to make a spring loaded button pusher with 1/4" of give
in the spring, but that sticks out. On both moving and stationary parts.
Sliding a ramp over the top of the button equals wear on the plastic
button. And complicated  by the inability to get at it to drill & tap
screw holes without a huge teardown. So whatever is going to have to be
set in position and superglued to the epoxy paint on everything.
Imagination will be made to work overtime for sure. Changing switch
style to roller lever is looking like a possibility. Put a short tab of
sheet alu to stick out of the gap and hit the roller might work, and
that would put the switch body flat on the stationary part. They can
stand some overtravel by flexing the lever. I have enough of those for
homes, but not for limits too.  And with no Radio Shacks left, China is
the nearest vendor. 6 weeks. Humm, for x home at left, peel my cable
back out of the gantry cable chain early. Y home never gets to the
gantry cable, only thru the new cambric coming down from the electronics
shelf. Like I said, stand and stare at it. And let my imagination out
without a chaperone...

Thanks TomP.


On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 9:03 PM Gene Heskett 

wrote:

Greetings everybody;

I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore
that faint knocking sound.

Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
limit switches.

However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has
clicked is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something
crushable so that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the
switch like a Coors can.

Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds
is occuring?

I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance
when the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its
clicked.

So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can
use for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS
far enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in
the space between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush
room I have to build into the switch mount?

Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how
can one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the
motor faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial
into junk.

Thanks all;

Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Cheers, Gene Heskett



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[Emc-users] Posting order

2019-03-31 Thread John Dammeyer


> A: No.
> Q: Should I include quotations after my reply?
> 
> A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
> Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
> A: Top-posting.
> Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?

Personally I think that's a load of crap.  Usenet and email postings are 
sequential.  Scrolling through hundreds of lines of text all indented with 
various amounts of ">>>" depending on when it was posted is not only mind 
numbing but leads to ignoring posts.  I've lost track of the number of times I 
hit the X on the email when there are pages of old stuff that I just read on a 
previous email.  Now I have to carefully scroll through to find the reply.  Not 
worth my time.

If you are reading a once a week email of all the postings on a subject then I 
can see wanting them all in order from top to bottom.   But otherwise it costs 
far more in concentration and time.  

But the idea that we should cater to lazy  people who don't read each posting 
in the order it came is just rude.  That's why there are time/date stamps on 
each email and your email program can sort them in order.  Then you start at 
the first and read the original question.  Move to the next in that subject and 
read the comment.  

This isn't rocket science.   Look at any forum where the postings are even 
indented and in most cases there might be a tiny bit of the previous subject 
above the answer but not a week or more worth of indented postings.

I can run my 1995 Forte Free Agent, select Rec.Crafts.Metalworking and postings 
from 1995 are in that same format.  Maybe a bit relating to the subject from 
previous posters or nothing at all in the indented answers.  But this was all 
before the Linux Police showed up telling people they were rude.

IMHO



> 
> --
> Rafael
> 
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Rafael Skodlar

On 3/31/19 8:07 AM, TJoseph Powderly wrote:

hi gene
maybe redesign to drive past the switch
like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand over
the wall surface
rather than punching it :-)
( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to the
joint motion )
tomp



Good idea. Some computers from the 70's and 80's had a lot of mechanical 
parts. I remember seeing a double switch solutions to detect position of 
some kind of a sliding mechanism. Thinking about it, that kind of 
solution was possibly used on head assembly with voice coil in disk drives.


Switch assembly had tiny wheels on spring loaded lever that was pushing 
gently on microswitch. First switch would detect adjustable position 
close to the limit, second switch was the absolute limit. When the 
electronics detects first switch it slows down the motor and the 
mechanism continues to move to the absolute limit switch then stops.


A: No.
Q: Should I include quotations after my reply?

A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?

--
Rafael


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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Chris Albertson
First off, a "real" microswitch costs only about $0.50 if you buy them on
eBay 10 at a time and on Amazon Prime, I paid about double that.  What you
want is repeatability and microswitches are good at that to better than
0.001 inch.   Test your push buttons to see if they always click on/off at
the same amount of depression.  They might be really good or really poor.

Next, you need to decide how to handle contact bounce.  The switch will
open and close perhaps a dozen times when ever it changes state.   If the
goal is to stop quickly you don't want the software to see a bouncing
switch.   Or for the first few milliseconds, the software will see "home"
and stoart slowing only to see "not home" and continue searching and flip
about a dozen times before seeing a solid signal. SOme switches are
MUCH better and some are much worse. I just tested a bunch of mine.   I
got the best performance from a small micro switch with a resistor and very
small capacitor soldered across the terminals.  It changed state in a few
nanoseconds, others were as bad as 20 milliseconds.Yes, a factor of
about 100,000 different.

How to know if you are skipping steps with an open loop stepper?   Measure
where to table stops AFTER it stops.  If steps were skipped it will
overshoot the mark.  But you need to find a way to measure one step of
travel. Maybe clamp a block to the table and measure the distance to
spindle but with spindle just above the block?
Make it stop quicker un till it overshoots then divide the speed by maybe
two.Do the testing with a typical weight bolted to the table to
simulate the weight of a part.

Also, if you are trying to stop WAY to fast, you will hear the
motor skipping steps.But don't depend on that because I doubt you could
hear just one missed step.

How to mount the switch.   A real micro switch can have a roller on a
lever.  Mount the switch so that a cam or "bump" on the table triggers the
switch the roller reduces friction as the cam passes.   If overshoot no
longer matters you can mount the switch at the center of the table, not on
the end.

One more idea uses two switches.  Switch one trips about an inch before the
real home switch and simply tells the software to "slow down".

The other way to just to ram the home switch at full speed. The machine
stops, likely after overrunning the home position.  But then it backs up
about 1/4 inch and approaches the switch very slowly. I have seen
systems where it repeats this backoff and then go slow perhaps three times
and then takes an average of all three positions.   Or if one of the three
positions is not a good match to the other two raise an error.

But in all cases mount the switch to the side so that a software error does
not destroy the switch.Then if you like, build a "'safety stop" switch
that the software never sees.  It simply disables the motor if tripped.
 (the "step" pulse has to go through an NC switch.) This could be mounted
on a spring or block of foam.  Even 1mm accuracy is overkill for this
safety-stop.





On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 7:02 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Greetings everybody;
>
> I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that
> faint knocking sound.
>
> Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> limit switches.
>
> However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked
> is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so
> that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a
> Coors can.
>
> Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is
> occuring?
>
> I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
> machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance when
> the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its clicked.
>
> So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can use
> for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS far
> enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in the space
> between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush room I have to
> build into the switch mount?
>
> Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how can
> one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the motor
> faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial into
> junk.
>
> Thanks all;
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
> ___
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>


-- 

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California

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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread jrmitchellj
As I tell the robotics students, design limit switches to survive missed
detection & over travel.
On a milling machine, I would recommend a roller type of switch, that would
come in contact with a cam bar that is long enough  to reach end of travel.

On my machine, I have two switches positioned about an inch apart, at the
middle of travel.  Then the are cam blocks, one positioned near each end of
travel
The roller rides up on the block, trips the switch, and the switch body is
safely out of the travel path.  I did my mill this way because I have sooo
many pins available with the Mesa kit.

On the school mill, I used one switch for each axis, and the cam block from
either end of travel would trip it.

So no failure (or other malfunction) will crush a switch!

--J. Ray Mitchell Jr.
jrmitche...@gmail.com



"Good enough is the enemy of excellence"author unknown


On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 7:03 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Greetings everybody;
>
> I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that
> faint knocking sound.
>
> Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> limit switches.
>
> However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked
> is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so
> that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a
> Coors can.
>
> Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is
> occuring?
>
> I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
> machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance when
> the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its clicked.
>
> So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can use
> for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS far
> enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in the space
> between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush room I have to
> build into the switch mount?
>
> Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how can
> one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the motor
> faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial into
> junk.
>
> Thanks all;
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
> ___
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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 13:07:50 Jon Elson wrote:

> On 03/31/2019 08:59 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Greetings everybody;
> >
> > I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore
> > that faint knocking sound.
> >
> > Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> > between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> > limit switches.
> >
> > However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has
> > clicked is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something
> > crushable so that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the
> > switch like a Coors can.
> >
> > Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds
> > is occuring?
>
> Yes, use Halscope, and watch the limit switch and the axis
> position, have the scope trigger on the switch.  Then, set
> it up to home at the desired velocity, and hold a metal rod
> or something that will trip the switch but not hurt anything
> when it overtravels.  That should give you a trace of travel
> vs time.  Then, select the position trace and use the cursor
> in the scope window and it shows you the actual numerical
> reading at the bottom.
>
> Jon
>
Thanks Jon.
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
On Sunday 31 March 2019 11:07:51 TJoseph Powderly wrote:

> hi gene
> maybe redesign to drive past the switch
> like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand
> over the wall surface
> rather than punching it :-)
> ( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to
> the joint motion )
> tomp
>
I hadn't thought of that idea, mainly because that would put the 
mechanism out in the breeze and subject to damage, or maybe snagging a 
hose etc as it moves. Mounted so as to detect the touch of the two parts 
as it comes to the end of travel is quite appetizing in addition to 
being "in out of the weather" so to speak. Mounting a 90 degree angled 
and flexible lever for z would either project forward or sideways, and 
sideways would cost me x travel too. I'll have to go stand and stare at 
it some more & see what I can imagine AND make. I've already done some 
of that, and keep throwing it away for one reason or another.  The best 
idea seems to be to make a spring loaded button pusher with 1/4" of give 
in the spring, but that sticks out. On both moving and stationary parts.  
Sliding a ramp over the top of the button equals wear on the plastic 
button. And complicated  by the inability to get at it to drill & tap 
screw holes without a huge teardown. So whatever is going to have to be 
set in position and superglued to the epoxy paint on everything. 
Imagination will be made to work overtime for sure. Changing switch 
style to roller lever is looking like a possibility. Put a short tab of 
sheet alu to stick out of the gap and hit the roller might work, and 
that would put the switch body flat on the stationary part. They can 
stand some overtravel by flexing the lever. I have enough of those for 
homes, but not for limits too.  And with no Radio Shacks left, China is 
the nearest vendor. 6 weeks. Humm, for x home at left, peel my cable 
back out of the gantry cable chain early. Y home never gets to the 
gantry cable, only thru the new cambric coming down from the electronics 
shelf. Like I said, stand and stare at it. And let my imagination out 
without a chaperone...

Thanks TomP.

> On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 9:03 PM Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > Greetings everybody;
> >
> > I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore
> > that faint knocking sound.
> >
> > Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> > between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> > limit switches.
> >
> > However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has
> > clicked is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something
> > crushable so that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the
> > switch like a Coors can.
> >
> > Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds
> > is occuring?
> >
> > I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
> > machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance
> > when the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its
> > clicked.
> >
> > So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can
> > use for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS
> > far enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in
> > the space between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush
> > room I have to build into the switch mount?
> >
> > Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how
> > can one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the
> > motor faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial
> > into junk.
> >
> > Thanks all;
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > Genes Web page 
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Jon Elson

On 03/31/2019 08:59 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

Greetings everybody;

I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that
faint knocking sound.

Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
limit switches.

However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked
is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so
that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a
Coors can.

Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is
occuring?


Yes, use Halscope, and watch the limit switch and the axis 
position, have the scope trigger on the switch.  Then, set 
it up to home at the desired velocity, and hold a metal rod 
or something that will trip the switch but not hurt anything 
when it overtravels.  That should give you a trace of travel 
vs time.  Then, select the position trace and use the cursor 
in the scope window and it shows you the actual numerical 
reading at the bottom.


Jon


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Re: [Emc-users] Pc choice ... help

2019-03-31 Thread theman whosoldtheworld
thanks ... this is the same that  i  know  but my last  study about
motherboard was wiyh Z80  so my knowelge about is not updated.

regards

Il giorno dom 31 mar 2019 alle ore 18:43 theman whosoldtheworld <
bleachk...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

>
>
> Il giorno sab 30 mar 2019 alle ore 04:26 Przemek Klosowski <
> przemek.klosow...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>
>> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 2:13 PM theman whosoldtheworld <
>> bleachk...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > PCW in the forum normally suggest desktop motherboard ... Is it just a
>> > matter of Platform Controller Hub that prevented the rt-preemt kernels
>> > from having good performances?
>> >
>> I always thought the realtime latencies are mostly caused by the black
>> magic of the SMB---the system management firmware which is allowed to take
>> over completely from the main CPU. Somehow this is connected to the video
>> hardware: even though video normally does not have its own non-preemptible
>> firmware. The way I understand it, the SMB code ends up calling the video
>> callbacks which are poorly designed and take excessively long.
>>
>> Since SMB is a black box subsystem, there's no way to predict its
>> latencies. My understanding is that there is only one sure way to find
>> out:  run latency tests, like LinuxCNC is doing.
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] Pc choice ... help

2019-03-31 Thread theman whosoldtheworld
Il giorno sab 30 mar 2019 alle ore 04:26 Przemek Klosowski <
przemek.klosow...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 2:13 PM theman whosoldtheworld <
> bleachk...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > PCW in the forum normally suggest desktop motherboard ... Is it just a
> > matter of Platform Controller Hub that prevented the rt-preemt kernels
> > from having good performances?
> >
> I always thought the realtime latencies are mostly caused by the black
> magic of the SMB---the system management firmware which is allowed to take
> over completely from the main CPU. Somehow this is connected to the video
> hardware: even though video normally does not have its own non-preemptible
> firmware. The way I understand it, the SMB code ends up calling the video
> callbacks which are poorly designed and take excessively long.
>
> Since SMB is a black box subsystem, there's no way to predict its
> latencies. My understanding is that there is only one sure way to find
> out:  run latency tests, like LinuxCNC is doing.
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread TJoseph Powderly
hi gene
maybe redesign to drive past the switch
like you can brush a wall mounted light switch by swiping your hand over
the wall surface
rather than punching it :-)
( try mounting so the direction of switch activation is 90 degress to the
joint motion )
tomp


On Sun, Mar 31, 2019 at 9:03 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Greetings everybody;
>
> I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that
> faint knocking sound.
>
> Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall)
> between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as
> limit switches.
>
> However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked
> is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so
> that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a
> Coors can.
>
> Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is
> occuring?
>
> I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this
> machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance when
> the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its clicked.
>
> So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can use
> for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS far
> enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in the space
> between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush room I have to
> build into the switch mount?
>
> Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how can
> one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the motor
> faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial into
> junk.
>
> Thanks all;
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] SPI comms for linuxcnc (was Re: Rock64 pre-orders on Banggood.) --> CPU + Ethercat + FPGA/CPLD but no PRU

2019-03-31 Thread Danny Miller
One common solution is you have a sizable FPGA and just add a soft core 
into it.


RISC-V is an open-source, royalty-free core specifically architected to 
efficiently implement as FPGA gates that Keil can compile for, and the 
common Segger JTAG programmer can program AND debug the code.


At that point, you're pretty seamless.  You can write your own 
peripherals that just memory map onto the data bus without touching the 
core.  You can have a custom hardware neural network that has registers 
and DMA that you just let run independent of the instruction core.


Danny

On 3/31/2019 3:14 AM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:

A CPU with Ethernet and a builtin FPGA/CPLD to implement the SPI ports would 
probably be a very good device for an SPI router, probably also very cheap. 
Packets could routed to ordinary computer running Linuxcnc as is today or split 
so that real time part is in the simple device. It is not to different from a 
PLC I have on my workplace, it is mounted on a din rail without any user 
interface except a reset start/stop/reset button, there is an Ethernet 
connecter used for the programming, it is also possible to connect user 
interface if needed but I have not investigated how it communicate.


I remember someone here talked about someone implementing PWM on a PRU. I did 
on an ordinary Micro controller once, I guess code could be reused but I do not 
want to do it again. A timer with compare registers plus a few other things 
usually available in micro controllers is really good at this.


On Thu, 28 Mar 2019 08:05:26 +0700
TJoseph Powderly  wrote:


Gene hello



On 03/27/2019 08:13 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Wednesday 27 March 2019 08:12:48 TJoseph Powderly wrote:


( list apology, I seem to have replied to posters rather than to the
list, and several times :-(

re SPI comms Linuxcnc SBC microcontrollers ...

it has been said on this mail list,
that SPI is a good candidate for a bus technology to work _with_
realtime.

heres some work in that vein (maybe overlooked)

yeltrow's work:
a generic spi hal module so you can use other SPI devices ( rpi,
arduino, mcp23s17, ENC28J60, theres a lot of spi stuff to hang onto
such a bus )
https://www.forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/28851-spi-bus-generic
-driver-and-st-l6480


Interesting driver for the big stuffs. However, I wonder if yeltrow is
aware of rpspi.ko, now part of LCNC.  Not parport based but gpio,
written specificly for the rpi3b.  And I'm using it, writing to a Mesa
7i90 at 42 megabaud, and reading back from the 7i90 at 25 megabaud
useing only 4 gpio pins for 2 or 3  target devices.

I dont find source rpspi.c in my sources.
cant google it except to find messages from you.

My RIP source tree is DGarr's external offset branch.

I dont have raspi.kp either.

Where are these files?

The files I was speaking of were generic spi utilities,
not RPi to Mesa communication modules,
They were attempts to make SPI available on any hardware platform to any
SPI device.
They are attempts only ( one uses a parport but i guess that could be
altered to gpio )
But from the parport, the author connects to many different SPI devices.

What file builds rpspi.ko ?

Maybe its private/unpublished work from Matsche ?

I cant find it on https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc either.

Plz lemmeno
TomP

Perusal of that code might be of help to yeltrow. gpio seems to be about
10x faster than trying to simulate SPI over a parport.  The 7i90 has
both modes depending on the firmware loaded.


the files are on the forum for members linuxcnc-upload-2015-12-03.tar

So this work handily predates rpspi.ko. Still, theres obviously things to
be learned from the rpi version.


erste's work:
for ethernet circumventing usb ( via spi
interesting as spi and ethernet seem to be future avenues
http://erste.de/ethraw/README

theres other efforts but less coupled to the spi grail

tomp


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Cheers, Gene Heskett



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[Emc-users] Home-limit switch measuring

2019-03-31 Thread Gene Heskett
Greetings everybody;

I think I've got the coolant pump starting problem fixed.  Ignore that 
faint knocking sound.

Now I would like to use a teeny little pushbutton (6x6x2.5mm tall) 
between two solid parts of this machine for home and potentially as 
limit switches.

However the amount of available overtravel after the switch has clicked 
is quite limited unless this switch is mounted on something crushable so 
that the getting stopped overtravel does not crush the switch like a 
Coors can.

Is there a way to determine how much overtravel vs approach speeds is 
occuring?

I ask because a wide open x or y move  can do around 220 ipm on this 
machine, and that stopping distance is not an ignoreable distance when 
the switch only has maybe .010" of overtravel after its clicked.

So I first would like to determine the maximum safe SEARCH_VEL I can use 
for homeing, then from that, be able to set MAX and MIN LIMITS far 
enough away from the crash stop to provide crash protection in the space 
between the LIMIT set in the ini file, or how much crush room I have to 
build into the switch mount?

Also, in attempting to minimize this stopping distance, what or how can 
one detect a motor step slip if the ACCEL's are stopping the motor 
faster than it can stop? Hopefully without pounding a $90 dial into  
junk.

Thanks all;

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 



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Re: [Emc-users] SPI comms for linuxcnc (was Re: Rock64 pre-orders on Banggood.) --> CPU + Ethercat + FPGA/CPLD but no PRU

2019-03-31 Thread Nicklas Karlsson
A CPU with Ethernet and a builtin FPGA/CPLD to implement the SPI ports would 
probably be a very good device for an SPI router, probably also very cheap. 
Packets could routed to ordinary computer running Linuxcnc as is today or split 
so that real time part is in the simple device. It is not to different from a 
PLC I have on my workplace, it is mounted on a din rail without any user 
interface except a reset start/stop/reset button, there is an Ethernet 
connecter used for the programming, it is also possible to connect user 
interface if needed but I have not investigated how it communicate.


I remember someone here talked about someone implementing PWM on a PRU. I did 
on an ordinary Micro controller once, I guess code could be reused but I do not 
want to do it again. A timer with compare registers plus a few other things 
usually available in micro controllers is really good at this.


On Thu, 28 Mar 2019 08:05:26 +0700
TJoseph Powderly  wrote:

> Gene hello
> 
> 
> 
> On 03/27/2019 08:13 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Wednesday 27 March 2019 08:12:48 TJoseph Powderly wrote:
> >
> >> ( list apology, I seem to have replied to posters rather than to the
> >> list, and several times :-(
> >>
> >> re SPI comms Linuxcnc SBC microcontrollers ...
> >>
> >> it has been said on this mail list,
> >> that SPI is a good candidate for a bus technology to work _with_
> >> realtime.
> >>
> >> heres some work in that vein (maybe overlooked)
> >>
> >> yeltrow's work:
> >> a generic spi hal module so you can use other SPI devices ( rpi,
> >> arduino, mcp23s17, ENC28J60, theres a lot of spi stuff to hang onto
> >> such a bus )
> >> https://www.forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/28851-spi-bus-generic
> >> -driver-and-st-l6480
> >>
> > Interesting driver for the big stuffs. However, I wonder if yeltrow is
> > aware of rpspi.ko, now part of LCNC.  Not parport based but gpio,
> > written specificly for the rpi3b.  And I'm using it, writing to a Mesa
> > 7i90 at 42 megabaud, and reading back from the 7i90 at 25 megabaud
> > useing only 4 gpio pins for 2 or 3  target devices.
> I dont find source rpspi.c in my sources.
> cant google it except to find messages from you.
> 
> My RIP source tree is DGarr's external offset branch.
> 
> I dont have raspi.kp either.
> 
> Where are these files?
> 
> The files I was speaking of were generic spi utilities,
> not RPi to Mesa communication modules,
> They were attempts to make SPI available on any hardware platform to any 
> SPI device.
> They are attempts only ( one uses a parport but i guess that could be 
> altered to gpio )
> But from the parport, the author connects to many different SPI devices.
> 
> What file builds rpspi.ko ?
> 
> Maybe its private/unpublished work from Matsche ?
> 
> I cant find it on https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc either.
> 
> Plz lemmeno
> TomP
> > Perusal of that code might be of help to yeltrow. gpio seems to be about
> > 10x faster than trying to simulate SPI over a parport.  The 7i90 has
> > both modes depending on the firmware loaded.
> >
> >> the files are on the forum for members linuxcnc-upload-2015-12-03.tar
> > So this work handily predates rpspi.ko. Still, theres obviously things to
> > be learned from the rpi version.
> >
> >> erste's work:
> >> for ethernet circumventing usb ( via spi
> >> interesting as spi and ethernet seem to be future avenues
> >> http://erste.de/ethraw/README
> >>
> >> theres other efforts but less coupled to the spi grail
> >>
> >> tomp
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> 
> 
> 
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