Re: Namespaces as Sugar (was: complexity tax)

2008-05-27 Thread Graydon Hoare
Brendan Eich wrote: I want to say thanks for making this proposal (open namespace search only for lexical references). It leaves most of the use-cases I cited intact. Well done, good compromise (not complete evisceration of property qualifiers, or dismissal of unqualified import).

Re: Multiple declarations

2008-05-01 Thread Graydon Hoare
Jeff Dyer wrote: Works for me in the RI: var x = 10; var x = 20; print(x) 20 As it should. Could be an old build? Check one of the snapshots. http://buildbot.ecmascript.org/es4/waterfall -Graydon ___ Es4-discuss mailing list

Re: Any blogs to help orient me re the reference implementation? contrasting with F#

2008-03-19 Thread Graydon Hoare
ToolmakerSteve98 wrote: Wondering if there is any info beyond the source itself that would give me a big picture view of what is there, before I start wandering around in the depths of the code. Not a lot, though I've posted some notes to this list in the past; I'm happy to discuss it

Re: Nature of Parametrized types

2008-03-17 Thread Graydon Hoare
Peter Hall wrote: I have a few questions/comments about parametrized types. Some I know has been discussed, but I still unclear on the outcome of those conversations. Good questions! 1. If there is a type T.J,K, can T be referenced itself, or must it be referenced for some specific values

Re: ES4 implementation process, teams, and meetings

2008-02-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Maciej Stachowiak wrote: To expand a bit on Geoff's comment: I'd like Apple and the WebKit project to get involved with ES4 implementation. Great! Though please keep in mind a point in the remainder of your comments: WebKit (and Rhino) are operating from a somewhat newcomer perspective,

Re: ES4 implementation process, teams, and meetings

2008-02-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Michael O'Brien wrote: As a solution: I think we need an intermediate step. Not a spec, but some detailed design notes. Lar's document was a good overview, but drill down on exactly how the mechanisms are meant to work would be very helpful to broaden the base of implementations. Some

Re: ES4 implementation process, teams, and meetings

2008-02-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Maciej Stachowiak wrote: I don't think the sets are disjoint, but they are not identical either. Agreed. I am trying to arrive at an understanding of which camp Apple aspires to (designer, implementor or both) and in particular how you wish to enact that role. Any Rhino hackers (or other

Re: ES4 implementation process, teams, and meetings

2008-02-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Maciej Stachowiak wrote: What I am asking is this: for each proposal where you'd like early implementations, before implementation commences please write down enough information about that proposal in some reasonably understandable form to represent the current shared understanding of the

Re: ES4 implementation process, teams, and meetings

2008-02-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Maciej Stachowiak wrote: We're unlikely to have much interest in working on implementing the RI. Ok. I'm sorry to hear that, but I understand. As for reading the RI, it seems a lot harder to understand than specs written in prose. As far as I can tell, only people who have coded

Re: ES4 work

2008-02-20 Thread Graydon Hoare
Michael O'Brien wrote: Graydon, Thanks -- that helps to understand the status. You are in a somewhat unique position having implemented more than any other. Given Jeff's roadmap outline and the goal of weighing the features against implementation experience -- which of the features that

New RI build available

2008-02-13 Thread Graydon Hoare
Hi, Dave Herman has prepared some new binary builds of the the ES4 RI and made them available for download at: http://www.ecmascript.org/download.php Please report any bugs you find in this release with the ES4 bug tracking system, and we'll endeavor to fix them:

Re: proper tail calls

2008-01-21 Thread Graydon Hoare
Igor Bukanov wrote: I am saying that even for calls in the tail position an implementation may not eliminate the parent frame completely as it still may be exposed via closures. As such the tail call optimization cannot guarantee that the space complexity of the tail recursion is O(1). This

Re: roundTiesToEven

2007-11-12 Thread Graydon Hoare
Jonathan Watt wrote: liorean wrote: On 11/11/2007, Jonathan Watt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've noticed that rounding in the reference implementation is implemented using IEEE roundTiesToEven, but in browsers .5 values appear to round towards zero. Although roundTiesToEven is desirable

Re: need some clarification on compile-time type vs. run-time type

2007-11-10 Thread Graydon Hoare
Brendan Eich wrote: let q = {p:42} : {p:int} [stack] [init q()] **ERROR** EvalError: typecheck failed, val=obj type={p: [ns public '__ES4__']::int } wanted={p: [ns public '__ES4__']::int } (near no filename:1:1-1.3) The val and wanted parts of the diagnostic look the same to me.

Re: need some clarification on compile-time type vs. run-time type

2007-11-09 Thread Graydon Hoare
Yuh-Ruey Chen wrote: I'm not sure how to phrase this, but it seems to me that ES4 is trying to make fixed properties and non-fixed properties (and by extension, type expressions and value expressions, and compile-time features and run-time features) as similar and compatible as possible (e.g.

Re: Implementor Question

2007-10-30 Thread Graydon Hoare
Brendan Eich wrote: But again, two engines don't cut it, for footprint and memory reasons. And two engines are intentionally unnecessary by the design of ES4. (Catching up on this thread...) An additional technical aspect of the language, for newcomers who may not have noticed it: It