EV Digest 4594
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Alltrax Controller
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Putting breaker under the radio
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: What motor?
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Alternative batteries -
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: US EV-145s - was Re: Alltrax Controller
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Data Logger
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Almost instant Geo motorcycle hybrid conversion.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Review my plans
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Fw: EV of the past
by "j-ro" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Alternative batteries - was : RE: LA Times front page article
on EVs today
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Plug-in Prius was Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
by "Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Alltrax Controller
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) link 10 question
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Hi from a newbie : Decisions
by Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: open source-ness of Solectria E10?
by "Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Review My Plans?
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) What is CCDWE / CDWE?
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Correct AGM finish charge (Was: Re: PFC-30)
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) OT: Northwest burger chain switches to pure wind power
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Alltrax Controller
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Hi from a newbie : Decisions- and S10 Adaptor plate
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: What is CCDWE / CDWE?
by Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Hi from a newbie : Decisions- and S10 Adaptor plate
by Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Alltrax Controller
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> Sorry to say this Jerry, but Joe Average will never even consider
> driving something you're designing (3 wheeler). All I'm hearing
> from your posts is make it cheap cheap and then cheaper than that.
> I'm not saying that the cost should be ignored, but apparently it is
> not the top priority for a Joe buying SUVs and Hummers left and right.
But Joe Average's buying behavior for things other than cars does indeed
seem to be to buy cheap, cheaper, or cheapest; no matter what the
consequences.
Jerry's EV might very well appeal to Joe Average as an additional
vehicle, just as he now buys RVs, snowmobiles, motorcycles, boats, and
other "boy toys". Jerry is a long way from having the kind of marketing
moxie to attract such people today. But gas hits $4/gallon, and Jerry
has his Freedom EV in production, ad some TV news story puts it on the
evening news as "filler", he could instantly be buried with orders from
Joe Average and his kin!
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Robert Chew wrote:
>
> HI all,
>
> Just in the process of converting my Fiat 126 into electric drive. I really
> really want to use the Alltrax 7245 controller, 72 volts at 450 amps because
> its got an rs232 port to monitor and data log the parameters. I am doing my
> thesis on it. I know its cheap, i would like anyones thoughts on it. Also
> i'll give my specs of the car i am converting. It will weigh 750 kg all up,
> using Trojan SCS25 12 volts batteries, Uses a 6.7 inch advanced dc motor the
> K series, and running a 4 speed box with no
This all should work. It won't be very fast, range will be rather low,
and battery life won't be very good; but it's a good "training wheel"
sort of EV.
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David Roden wrote:
> I like to mount the main breaker under the seat and bring the
> hv wiring up through the floorpan. That's not really a good
> strategy because it still puts the hv wiring inside the passenger
> compartment, even if it's just a couple of feet.
The easy answer is to put the breaker (or contactors or any other high
voltage portions of your EV's wiring) in a metal box. This is the
standard solution for almost all wiring that could be dangerous to touch
or that might start fires in case of a problem.
Pick any UL listed electrical box, for confidence that at least someone
besides the manufacturer considers it safe for electrical equipment.
Though in fact almost any steel or aluminum box will work about as well.
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Pascal Ruyter wrote:
> My name is Pascal, I am from The Netherlands, since a month or so I have been
> reading the mails from this list because I am interested in an Electric
> vehicle for commuting.
Welcome, Pascal! I lived in Holland Michigan for 7 years, which is a
little piece of the Netherlands here in the USA. Plus I've visited your
beautiful country.
> electric UrbaCar... what kind of engine I can use instead of the
> mentioned Jack & Heinz #G23 aircraft generator...
This was a high tech design in the 1970's. You can still find these
motors surplus at low cost, but we can do better today.
If you are building something very small car like the UrbaCar, I think I
would use a Lynch/Lemco/Etek type of motor. This is a brushed DC
permanent magnet motor that is very efficient. One of these motors with
the UrbaCar type variable speed belt drive would outperform the
original.
I would use a modern electronic motor speed controller, like the ones
used in golf cars and NEVs in the US. Or if low cost is important, a
contactor controller can be used.
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ryan, good thoughts!
Ryan Stotts wrote:
Victor wrote:
Force these companies to sell you their product at 1/20 of their
current prices and the problem is solved. Problem is, in a free
economy world, it ain't going to happen.
How could they be persuaded to lower their prices?
Only if they see economics in their favor AND reasonable
assurance that it will be sustained. If they hear from a
group of people the battery is very much wanted, they
take it as once they satisfy need for that group [of EVers],
there is nothing beyond it. There *might* be, but they see
no indication worth risking to start production of it only
to find out that just 10 resourceful geeks bought it.
Is the situation currently this:
They cater to the model aircraft people and in their case, ~$50 or
less for just 1 battery is maybe acceptable. But in our case, when we
need ~100+ of their $200 model...
Yes, exactly right. $50 is awfully a lot per Wh, but
absolute number $50 is small to waste on a hobby thing.
EV size battery can be bought to better per Wh price, but
absolute dollar amount up front makes it prohibitive for
most. So they keep selling the product providing them largest
$/Wh return, e.g. RC hobby market (I'm talking about Kokam).
Do they not want to sell more batteries?
Of course.
Wouldn't they like it if people bought over 100 batteries per
> purchase instead of just 1 or 2?
They would, but it is not enough. They need reasonable guarantee
that it will happen, say, twice per week for next 4 years
to be worth to convert production line.
So far no one could assure them this will be the case.
What is the reality of their manufacturing costs?
I don't know and no one suppose to know.
Normally around 20% to 25% of MSRP for such things.
Is their $200 worth of materials in a $200 battery?
Of course not. If it would be, this means they supply
free labor and take no profits.
Most likely $200 battery has $10 worth of raw materials
$20 labor costs $50 R&D payback $50 marketing expenses.
So about 40% profit margin. My wild guess.
Have you thought of starting your own battery company Victor?
No, I'm not that interested and it is beyond my field of
expertise. I'm electrical engineer and should do what I do
best and like, not necessarily what is potentially the most
profitable.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
They are EV- 145. 12v batteries. For your sport car I'd stay with Trojan's
or US 6v. They are listed http://www.usbattery.com/pages/12vsweeper.htm
with the Scrubber batteries. LR......
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 9:37 AM
Subject: US EV-145s - was Re: Alltrax Controller
Lawrence,
Are these US Batteries US-145s? I don't see an EV145.
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 06:58:45 -0700
Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
The US EV- 145's are $127 each in Hayward California.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Chew"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
HI all,
The batteries i am using for my car is Trojan SCS225 at $154 +gst aussie
> dollars, pretty cheap. but if you plan to do the conversion for about
2000 > us dollars, it might be running a bit tight. The conversion would
be good, > howeve i think you have to keep the weight down. In the ford
festiva, the > car itself weighs a fair bit, well prob 800-900kg. My car
only weighs 500 > kg or a little less after the stripdown. Use 12 volt
batteries as they > would keep the weight down and yeah 50 DOD is good to
aim for.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Congrats Peter;
We did a group purchase of TS cells here in the States for about
$1/Ah as well (actually UK fans followed me). The trouble is,
we believed in published specs before experience indicated that
<200Ah TS cells are not really suitable for an EV. Not capacity wise,
but the battery power especially at low temps.
So those who for 200Ah are lucky ones. I have 90Ah cells and
capacity is more than enough for me, but I can't get it out
at the rate I need, R_int is too high. 100Ah ones are better,
but very marginal - thy are OK only for lightest custom vehicles,
normally not conversions.
200Ah can handle current demands without noticeable voltage sag.
I have an opportunity to get other LiIon type for ACRX now
(I removed 90Ah pack at the moment), but if I'd go with TS,
I'd use 200Ah cells - no less. This is my recommendation to
anyone going this route. Granted, don't even think using
raw cells without a BMS. A collection of the cells connected
in series is NOT a propulsion battery yet. It is a recipe
for disappointment.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
Peter Perkins wrote:
As a TS Li-Ion (30x200ah) user for two years I am very happy.
Range went from a pb cell knackering 30 miles to 75+ with relative ease.
Possibly I could manage 100 if I tickled it along like Light foot Joe!
I would recommend them to ev users now. I would never go pb again unless I
was drag racing, which i'm not. They are also probably better now than when
I bought mine as part of the UK 2003 bulk purchase.
They are actually fairly simple to manage with stock components.
Cedric Lynch of Lynch Motors fame makes a nice idiot proof, simple and cheap
analogue Li-Ion cell protector which interfaces with most standard ev
controllers and chargers.
With some thermal management they give excellent range and reasonable
performance for my town EV.
Luckily I bought mine when they were $1.00 per ah.
Regards
Peter
www.solarvan.co.uk
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As far as I know link 10 does not measure speed or acceleration, but
I don't own one. Ask some owners to be sure what to expect.
Robert Chew wrote:
Hi all,
I am wanting to use a data logger in my electric car so that i can data
log all the parameters. I am using an Alltraax 7245 controller with
serial port. However, does anyone know one that can also measure the
speed, acceleartion??? as well. I like the emeter or Link 10 but its
hard to locate one in Australia.
Cheers
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you hit someone you'll wish you had insurance. I am paying 50 bucks a
year for liability only for my motorcycle. LR>.......
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2005 6:43 AM
Subject: Almost instant Geo motorcycle hybrid conversion.
I spoke with the builder of a Buick and a Fox 3 wheel 'motorcycle'. They
were driven from FL to Saint Louis, MO and back with no problems.
By reducing the cars to 3 wheelers, they become instant motorcycles in FL.
In these conversions, the rear wheel was placed in a wheel well in line
with
the rear wheels which were removed.
This got me to thinking. What if the rear wheel was placed behind the car
in the 5th wheel track instrument position?
You hang the wheel and your motor back there and place some batteries in
the
trunk and presto! a hybrid motorcycle.
This can be done with any FWD car.
BTW The prime reason for converting the Buick to a motorcycle was to avoid
$2,800 in annual insurance.
There are no insurance requirements for motorcycles.
BoyntonStu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You gotta understand the power of the sun's heating though. It would
take a crapload of insulation but then you've still got the windows.
Sun coming through them is enormous.
OK maybe this is coming from a Texas perspective but the problem here is
heating far above ambient. You need lots of heat pumping just to get it
down to the outside air temp.
So what I'm suggesting is just a fan to circulate out the hot air before
you get in. Actually a 95F car isn't that bad compared to a 125F car.
There are other cooling technologies. The ammonia cycle Servel
refrigerators use only heat as an input, but their BTU capacity is low.
There's also a dessicant cooling system that uses humidity and heat as
an input. Dessicant cooling has seen some significant uses..
Danny
Jeff Shanab wrote:
An interesting thought using those danfos compressors.
Since an EV doesn't have the same heat sources, and most automotive Air
conditioners are made 1 to 1.5 ton (12000 - 18000 BTU) just to be able
to "catch up" when you come out to a hot car, What if we were to
insulate better, and let a very small unit run while parked or charged.
Maybe set at 85 when parked, changeing to 75 when hit car remote, and an
overall timer to keep it from draining to much if the 10 min run into
the store becomes an hour.
In fact, My first idea with peltier was to drop a solar panel between
the bike rack on my sedan and try to make a cooler for the car off of
solar, I didn't know compressors could be had so small. at 78 Watts to
168 watts + 50 more for fans...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: j-ro
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:00 PM
Subject: EV of the past
I recall an article in either Popular Science or Popular Mechanics on the
conversion of a small truck to hybrid electric-- about 20 yrs ago-
the engine was replaced by an electric motor and the battery pack was modest as
was the voltage-- the key was that a gas engine was used as a generator when
the batteries were low-- so it might not be needed for short trips and could be
used when the vehicle was parked if no plug in was available.
So this was simple and old technology and may not have panned out as written---
BUT-- I would like to find the article if anyone recalls this.
And if anyone knows more on this topic?
Thanks
Jim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
Michaela Merz wrote:
However, cost is a major problem. Lithiums are vastly more expensive.
Most EVs use plain old flooded lead-acid batteries because they have the
lowest initial cost and lowest cost per mile.
I should clarify this last statement. PbA has lowest cost per mile only
for the life of that PbA battery. If you put in a good NiCd battery
providung total X miles and calculate how many PbA packs you'd
need to replace to cover the same distance, most likely NiCd solution
will have lower cost per mile *for all these total miles*.
But you must travel all these miles to really exercize the advantage.
If you build an EV with the advanced battery which lasts 10 years and
sell it in 3 month you're worse off - in this case PbA is probably
better choice money wise.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In the article, was it just one car that was being converted? A plug-in Prius
would work
well, and maybe as well as the current edition. The current hybrid sales pitch
is that the
customer does not have to plug it in. Toyota and Honda treat an extensioncord
as if it
was a drawback.
The Prius and the Insight hybrids are professionally built cars with partly
electric
drivetrains, a warranty, and not merely for lease. The customer can rearrange
his own car.
Steve -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Catherine C. Burgard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "EV List"
<ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 11:45 PM
Subject: Re: 100 mile range, Re: Alternative batteries
> Boy, with all this testosterone flowing I don't know if a gal dare step in ;)
> Our local
paper the other day had a very interesting article about the Toyota Pirus being
converted
to plug-in. Apparently Toyota wasn't to happy about people messing with there
design but
they are keeping an open eye on it. The conversions are getting 230mpg, in
ideal
situations. Talk about John Doe wanting an EV, how about a hybrid that gets
230mpg. What
a selling point, he won't care that you have to plug it in.
> I figured even at half that mileage I could commute to work everyday and fill
> the car
about 6 times a year with gas. At $2.79 a gallon here, that's sound go to me!
I know
it's not a truuue EV but it's definitely a step in the right direction.
> Just my opinion :)
> Catherine
> ---------------------------------
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cedric Lynch of Lynch Motors fame makes a nice idiot proof, simple and
cheap analogue Li-Ion cell protector which interfaces with most
standard ev controllers and chargers.
Got a link? Thanks!
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX/voice message - 206-339-VOLT (8658)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
May be you're right Lee, remains to be seen. While nothing
demonstratable exist, there is no reliable way to tell for sure.
Victor
Lee Hart wrote:
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
But Joe Average's buying behavior for things other than cars does indeed
seem to be to buy cheap, cheaper, or cheapest; no matter what the
consequences.
Do you follow this pattern too?
If you don't like this pattern, try to break it.
If you take advantage of it , you're supporting and thus reenforcing it.
Then, why complain about it?
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Philippe,
Are you trying to hack the Alltrax data stream? If so I would like to know
how it comes out. Shortly after I purchased my controller I contacted
Alltrax to see if they had any published specs on this data, and they said I
had to use an Windows NT Class machine and their program. I really don't
want to strap a laptop to my motorcycle.
damon
From: "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 01:16:40 +0200
i have one driving a Lynch motor (3000km now) i'm pleased with it.
Data logging is a great feature for vehicle development.
I'm trying to have a connexion to a dashboard LCD + micro from alltrax
RS232, still spying the data though.
I heard about a 650 amp version, but never seen it for sell
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:24 AM
Subject: Alltrax Controller
> HI all,
>
> Just in the process of converting my Fiat 126 into electric drive. I
really really want to use the Alltrax 7245 controller, 72 volts at 450 amps
because its got an rs232 port to monitor and data log the parameters. I am
doing my thesis on it. I know its cheap, i would like anyones thoughts on
it. Also i'll give my specs of the car i am converting. It will weigh 750
kg
all up, using Trojan SCS25 12 volts batteries, Uses a 6.7 inch advanced dc
motor the K series, and running a 4 speed box with no clutch.
>
> Cheers
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Link 10 users,
Does this device has an output to toggle when some conditions are met?
For example can it shut off external charger if Ah rolls to zero?
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the kind words of advice Stefano! I think ill go with the
S-10 and found a deal on one so im trying to work out the details.
Do you think the parts below are also perfect for this S-10 conversion ?
FBI-4001A ADC DC Motor w/Dual Shaft
1231 Curtis Controller 96/144 500amp limit
PB6 Pot Box
Albright Contactors SW200
Zivan Charger System 2800 watts (is this particular model needed and if
not, what else would be just as good but not as expensive ?) I was
quoted $930 for this unit.
Curtis DC/DC Converter 300 Watts
*Model 1400E 120/140-1212F* (again is this model correct for the above
system ?)
Thanks so much in advance..
Cwarman
Stefano Landi wrote:
Hi there and welcome to the world of EVs, being a newbie myself I
can't give you very technical advice, but I do have my $0.02 worth on
your donor vehicle.
Pontiac Grand AM - very heavy I think and you should make sure it's
got a manual tranny as an automatic is a more problematic conversion.
Chevy S-10 - This is the defacto standard and the PERFECT vehicle for
conversion. In fact if you can get the S-10 don't think of any other
vehicle. The pickup platform is the ideal vehicle as it has a strong
frame (for battery weight), the parts overall are inexpensive for
repairs and the number of conversions are plenty so you have a large
amount of experience to tap into. If you go to www.grassrootsev.com
you can order a video on CD which goes through the whole conversion
process. On their conversion they placed the batteries within the
frame rails under the bed and it made for a very neat conversion. I'm
not affiliated with grassroots, but I do endorse what they are doing
and purchased the video, it will surely help me through my own
conversion.
regards,
Stefano
DrFestiva
http://fest-ev-a.slandi.net
On 8/18/05, Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi guys, my first post to this group and im very much a newbie to EV
cars and conversions. Im very much planning on starting one soon and ive
been soaking up every bit of information i can find online. I live in
maine and trying to find a good donor vehicle right now. Im in contact
with two different people about cars that i can buy on the cheap. One is
a 1997 Pontiac Grand Am and the other is a 95 Chevy S-10.
Any problems with converting either of these two vehicles. Ill be
talking to you all very much soon as i get deeper :)))))))))))))))) I
cant wait...
Cwarman
.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The original ICE version whether manual shift or automatic may have had the
problem that
it could not be towed. Flat beds are better for the car anyway. They are also
a bit more
expensive, sometimes. If a car is 6 or 7 years old but has been converted to
an EV, then
it has an extension and a new lease on life.
Steve -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:14 PM
Subject: Re: open source-ness of Solectria E10?
> What scares me a little about those trucks is, that you can't tow them
> (that is what I have been told). You have to put them onto a flat bed.
> After all, those cars are some 6-7 years old and, well, we all know that
> cars can and will fail. Being unable to call somebody for a quick tow home
> would be a BIG show stopper for me.
>
> mm.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Danny Miller wrote:
> What car has made an all-electric A/C? I have never heard of this. A
> LOT of electricity is required.
The only one I know of is the Toyota Prius. It has an electric motor
driving a compressor, instead of driving the compressor from the ICE.
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This page:
http://www.evsource.com/tls_warp8.php
Mentions CCWDE and CWDE in relation to shaft rotation direction. I
realize that CCW and CW refer to counter-clockwise and clockwise, but
what does the DE stand for? I'm assuming it means "As viewed from the
Drive End".
Anyone?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich and Peter (and Roger but really all),
Based on your discussion about AGM filling up I want to get a
consensus (if exist :-) ) how it should be done "properly".
I need to program one of the gadgets to do it. You were debating
how long 2A current after CV stage should last and if there
must be voltage limit. I didn't see a clear answer.
Assume you have only one Optima (or AGM PbA in general) battery.
I realize the string in series requires some extra things,
but assume I have magic means to electrically remove a battery
from the series string and give it what I want - extra current for
some duration, based on that battery condition only, independently
of what other batteries in the string get.
So, 2 questions are still in the air:
- After bulk CC and CV (was it thermo-compensated 14.4V?) and
the current tapered current down to 2A Peter suggested to
keep these 2A for I think 2 hours no voltage limit, and you suggest
that it will (might) vent and the voltage limit is still needed
but higher than for CV stage.
So which is the case? If the voltage limit is needed for
this final I in IUI sequence, what is the value?
Now, main question:
If you don't have limit and strictly time it, you put exactly
4Ah in if you keep 2A for 2 hours.
If you do have second voltage limit, it will take some time
to reach it and once clamped, the current is going to start
dropping again slowly tapering less than 2A.
So if the goal is to put in exactly 4Ah (or whatever number),
I can extend the time beyond 2 hours to put in exactly that
amount (I can track Ah in). But If I still use 2 hours time
limit, Ah charged in will be less than 4Ah and in general
will vary depending on how much it tapered down from that
second clamp voltage.
So is the goal is to put fixed Ah in after IU while
preventing possible venting by clamping, or really
no_voltage_limit at 2A (or less) is the phenomena
which renders the battery 100% filled up?
In other words can I be sure that extra 4Ah will *always*
fill up the battery to 100% SOC regardless if the rate was
2A or less and if the voltage was limited or not (provided
battery didn't vent)?
Thanks in advance for clarification,
Victor
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Royale With Breeze
straight to the source: The Daily News, Courtney Sherwood, 16 Aug 2005
straight to the source: Portland Business Journal, 15 Aug 2005
straight to the source: GreenBiz.com, 16 Aug 2005
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I agree, it would really be nice to use a Palm Pilot
or Windows CE device if somebody is willing to write
the app. I don't have experience with this although I
would like to try. Unfortunately I don't have time
right now.
Rod
--- damon henry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Philippe,
>
> Are you trying to hack the Alltrax data stream? If
> so I would like to know
> how it comes out. Shortly after I purchased my
> controller I contacted
> Alltrax to see if they had any published specs on
> this data, and they said I
> had to use an Windows NT Class machine and their
> program. I really don't
> want to strap a laptop to my motorcycle.
>
> damon
>
>
> >From: "Philippe Borges"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> >To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> >Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
> >Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 01:16:40 +0200
> >
> >i have one driving a Lynch motor (3000km now) i'm
> pleased with it.
> >Data logging is a great feature for vehicle
> development.
> >I'm trying to have a connexion to a dashboard LCD +
> micro from alltrax
> >RS232, still spying the data though.
> >I heard about a 650 amp version, but never seen it
> for sell
> >
> >Philippe
> >
> >Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du
> volant ?
> >quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
> > http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
> >Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
> >http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> >Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:24 AM
> >Subject: Alltrax Controller
> >
> >
> > > HI all,
> > >
> > > Just in the process of converting my Fiat 126
> into electric drive. I
> >really really want to use the Alltrax 7245
> controller, 72 volts at 450 amps
> >because its got an rs232 port to monitor and data
> log the parameters. I am
> >doing my thesis on it. I know its cheap, i would
> like anyones thoughts on
> >it. Also i'll give my specs of the car i am
> converting. It will weigh 750
> >kg
> >all up, using Trojan SCS25 12 volts batteries, Uses
> a 6.7 inch advanced dc
> >motor the K series, and running a 4 speed box with
> no clutch.
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have an 1988 S10 adaptor plate for an automatic
transmission (would mounting be the same for a
manual?).
This was made for a GE motor but could easily work
with an ADC.
$140
Rod
P.S. If you do use a GE 9" I also have an adaptor for
the rotor shaft.
--- Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Thanks for the kind words of advice Stefano! I
> think ill go with the
> S-10 and found a deal on one so im trying to work
> out the details.
>
> Do you think the parts below are also perfect for
> this S-10 conversion ?
>
> FBI-4001A ADC DC Motor w/Dual Shaft
> 1231 Curtis Controller 96/144 500amp limit
> PB6 Pot Box
> Albright Contactors SW200
>
> Zivan Charger System 2800 watts (is this particular
> model needed and if
> not, what else would be just as good but not as
> expensive ?) I was
> quoted $930 for this unit.
>
> Curtis DC/DC Converter 300 Watts
> *Model 1400E 120/140-1212F* (again is this model
> correct for the above
> system ?)
>
> Thanks so much in advance..
>
> Cwarman
>
> Stefano Landi wrote:
>
> >Hi there and welcome to the world of EVs, being a
> newbie myself I
> >can't give you very technical advice, but I do have
> my $0.02 worth on
> >your donor vehicle.
> >
> >Pontiac Grand AM - very heavy I think and you
> should make sure it's
> >got a manual tranny as an automatic is a more
> problematic conversion.
> >
> >Chevy S-10 - This is the defacto standard and the
> PERFECT vehicle for
> >conversion. In fact if you can get the S-10 don't
> think of any other
> >vehicle. The pickup platform is the ideal vehicle
> as it has a strong
> >frame (for battery weight), the parts overall are
> inexpensive for
> >repairs and the number of conversions are plenty so
> you have a large
> >amount of experience to tap into. If you go to
> www.grassrootsev.com
> >you can order a video on CD which goes through the
> whole conversion
> >process. On their conversion they placed the
> batteries within the
> >frame rails under the bed and it made for a very
> neat conversion. I'm
> >not affiliated with grassroots, but I do endorse
> what they are doing
> >and purchased the video, it will surely help me
> through my own
> >conversion.
> >
> >regards,
> >
> >Stefano
> >DrFestiva
> >http://fest-ev-a.slandi.net
> >
> >On 8/18/05, Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Hi guys, my first post to this group and im very
> much a newbie to EV
> >>cars and conversions. Im very much planning on
> starting one soon and ive
> >>been soaking up every bit of information i can
> find online. I live in
> >>maine and trying to find a good donor vehicle
> right now. Im in contact
> >>with two different people about cars that i can
> buy on the cheap. One is
> >>a 1997 Pontiac Grand Am and the other is a 95
> Chevy S-10.
> >>
> >>Any problems with converting either of these two
> vehicles. Ill be
> >>talking to you all very much soon as i get deeper
> :)))))))))))))))) I
> >>cant wait...
> >>
> >>Cwarman
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >.
> >
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What is better for a s-10 Conversion a Warp DC motor or a Advanced DC
motor ? Any thoughts and reasons ?
Cwarman
Eric Poulsen wrote:
This page:
http://www.evsource.com/tls_warp8.php
Mentions CCWDE and CWDE in relation to shaft rotation direction. I
realize that CCW and CW refer to counter-clockwise and clockwise, but
what does the DE stand for? I'm assuming it means "As viewed from the
Drive End".
Anyone?
.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Im unsure, the S-10 im hoping to use is a manual transmission. If its
the same i would be interested. Can someone tell us if they are the same
and would fit a ADC motor or Warp motor >?
Cwarman
Rod Hower wrote:
I have an 1988 S10 adaptor plate for an automatic
transmission (would mounting be the same for a
manual?).
This was made for a GE motor but could easily work
with an ADC.
$140
Rod
P.S. If you do use a GE 9" I also have an adaptor for
the rotor shaft.
--- Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Thanks for the kind words of advice Stefano! I
think ill go with the
S-10 and found a deal on one so im trying to work
out the details.
Do you think the parts below are also perfect for
this S-10 conversion ?
FBI-4001A ADC DC Motor w/Dual Shaft
1231 Curtis Controller 96/144 500amp limit
PB6 Pot Box
Albright Contactors SW200
Zivan Charger System 2800 watts (is this particular
model needed and if
not, what else would be just as good but not as
expensive ?) I was
quoted $930 for this unit.
Curtis DC/DC Converter 300 Watts
*Model 1400E 120/140-1212F* (again is this model
correct for the above
system ?)
Thanks so much in advance..
Cwarman
Stefano Landi wrote:
Hi there and welcome to the world of EVs, being a
newbie myself I
can't give you very technical advice, but I do have
my $0.02 worth on
your donor vehicle.
Pontiac Grand AM - very heavy I think and you
should make sure it's
got a manual tranny as an automatic is a more
problematic conversion.
Chevy S-10 - This is the defacto standard and the
PERFECT vehicle for
conversion. In fact if you can get the S-10 don't
think of any other
vehicle. The pickup platform is the ideal vehicle
as it has a strong
frame (for battery weight), the parts overall are
inexpensive for
repairs and the number of conversions are plenty so
you have a large
amount of experience to tap into. If you go to
www.grassrootsev.com
you can order a video on CD which goes through the
whole conversion
process. On their conversion they placed the
batteries within the
frame rails under the bed and it made for a very
neat conversion. I'm
not affiliated with grassroots, but I do endorse
what they are doing
and purchased the video, it will surely help me
through my own
conversion.
regards,
Stefano
DrFestiva
http://fest-ev-a.slandi.net
On 8/18/05, Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi guys, my first post to this group and im very
much a newbie to EV
cars and conversions. Im very much planning on
starting one soon and ive
been soaking up every bit of information i can
find online. I live in
maine and trying to find a good donor vehicle
right now. Im in contact
with two different people about cars that i can
buy on the cheap. One is
a 1997 Pontiac Grand Am and the other is a 95
Chevy S-10.
Any problems with converting either of these two
vehicles. Ill be
talking to you all very much soon as i get deeper
:)))))))))))))))) I
cant wait...
Cwarman
.
.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
for the moment i just collected ton of data, i still have to look at them,
not usable as it is stored on computer.
Will let you know more soon.
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
> Philippe,
>
> Are you trying to hack the Alltrax data stream? If so I would like to
know
> how it comes out. Shortly after I purchased my controller I contacted
> Alltrax to see if they had any published specs on this data, and they said
I
> had to use an Windows NT Class machine and their program. I really don't
> want to strap a laptop to my motorcycle.
>
> damon
>
>
> >From: "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> >To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> >Subject: Re: Alltrax Controller
> >Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 01:16:40 +0200
> >
> >i have one driving a Lynch motor (3000km now) i'm pleased with it.
> >Data logging is a great feature for vehicle development.
> >I'm trying to have a connexion to a dashboard LCD + micro from alltrax
> >RS232, still spying the data though.
> >I heard about a 650 amp version, but never seen it for sell
> >
> >Philippe
> >
> >Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
> >quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
> > http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
> >Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
> >http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> >Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 12:24 AM
> >Subject: Alltrax Controller
> >
> >
> > > HI all,
> > >
> > > Just in the process of converting my Fiat 126 into electric drive. I
> >really really want to use the Alltrax 7245 controller, 72 volts at 450
amps
> >because its got an rs232 port to monitor and data log the parameters. I
am
> >doing my thesis on it. I know its cheap, i would like anyones thoughts on
> >it. Also i'll give my specs of the car i am converting. It will weigh 750
> >kg
> >all up, using Trojan SCS25 12 volts batteries, Uses a 6.7 inch advanced
dc
> >motor the K series, and running a 4 speed box with no clutch.
> > >
> > > Cheers
> > >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
