----------------------------------------
> From: hoegb...@hotmail.com
> To: billd...@killacycle.com
> Subject: RE: [EVDL] TESLA - Patent Issued for Transient Detection of an
> Exceptional Charge Event in a Series Connected Battery Element
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2017 11:57:30 +0100
>
> Hmm,
> all decent bms do allt/most of this already today, right?
> At least the one we build at the hobby-level, hehe
>
> Statistics used on all individual cells/modules and using the peak load/regen
> and the charger, no load voltage drop after charge andso on, statistics on
> temperature dependancy at high currents,
>
> dont we all use the car as the "heavy duty battery tester"?
>
> Also the "oooh-shit"-redundant solution from Linear about 7-10 years ago had
> a fallback,
> at least monitoring the min max voltage -levels(?) Done at a different chip,
> ..if the main ltc680x chip or computer / signal lines fails for any reason,
> right?
>
> if I remember their solution right it wasjust puses out as long all ok, could
> be daisy on all pack cells monitoring to a single output "allgood", or
> individual pulse-chanels in paralell, one pulse channel for each bank of 12
> cell-levels if you like that better.
>
> At least I think I have this redundant circuits on my dev-boards from
> Linear.. :-)
>
> / John
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
>> To: ev@lists.evdl.org
>> Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2017 23:29:39 -0700
>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] TESLA - Patent Issued for Transient Detection of an
>> Exceptional Charge Event in a Series Connected Battery Element
>> From: ev@lists.evdl.org
>>
>> Doesn't Lee Hart's "Batt Bridge" do this?
>> Seems like it monitors cell behavior (impedance, voltage) and
>> continuously compares it with the group behavior.
>> Wouldn't the Batt Bridge be prior art?
>> Seems like it to me.
>>
>> Bill D.
>>
>> On 1/7/2017 10:32 PM, Cor van de Water via EV wrote:
>>> I read the claims of the Patent (which is the meat of the invention)
>>> and while I understand that you can establish parameters for a pack and
>>> determine for example loss of a single cell in a parallel configuration
>>> in a number of ways, for example because that set of parallel cells will
>>> have lower capacity than the other (series connected) sets, so the
>>> voltage of the set with one less (functioning) cell will rise and fall
>>> faster with SoC;
>>> it is also possible to determine (increase of) impedance of a set of
>>> parallel cells by monitoring the short-term voltage variation correlated
>>> with changes ("transient" in terms of the patent) in the current flowing
>>> through the cells (from acceleration and regen or charging start/stop),
>>> but I do not understand their claim that they determine an overcharge
>>> event by finding a *lower* impedance of the cell than normal ????
>>> All data that I have seen show that pack impedance goes *up* at the low
>>> and the high end of SoC, so how can they determine overcharging from
>>> lowered impedance???
>>> Unless the Panasonic/Tesla cells react differently to overcharge than
>>> other chemistries.
>>> For over*dis*charge they do expect and detect a rise in cell impedance.
>>>
>>> After Claim 9 we find the usual stuff for a Lithium-ion battery with BMS
>>> that balances cells, the only really new thing that this patent seems to
>>> claim is the *de*crease of impedance during overcharge and the fact that
>>> it uses an independent system for the over- and under-charge threshold
>>> detection so that if the main BMS fails and balancing is unavailable, at
>>> least this backup system prevents the battery from over- and
>>> under-charge so the car can continue to be used (and driven to the
>>> service appointment) with the main BMS out.
>>> This fact of a backup BMS as well as the *lowered* impedance measured to
>>> represent overcharging was probably never claimed before and thus it is
>>> possible to get a patent on this, but I find this a very flimsy basis
>>> for a patent.
>>> It is always possible that I misunderstood the patent - reading and
>>> interpreting claims is never easy stuff but I have a bit of experience
>>> ;-)
>>>
>>> Cor van de Water
>>> Chief Scientist
>>> Proxim Wireless
>>>
>>> office +1 408 383 7626 Skype: cor_van_de_water
>>> XoIP +31 87 784 1130 private: cvandewater.info
>>>
>>> http://www.proxim.com
>>>
>>> This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and
>>> proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation. If you received
>>> this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any
>>> unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of
>>> this message is prohibited.
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Lee Hart via EV
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 07, 2017 3:59 PM
>>> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
>>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] TESLA - Patent Issued for Transient Detection of an
>>> Exceptional Charge Event in a Series Connected Battery Element
>>>
>>> Danny Ames via EV wrote:
>>>> Yet another advanced strategy Tesla has come up with to keep Li
>>> battery packs from thermal run away and charge safely and quickly.Danny
>>>> Patent Issued for Transient Detection of an Exceptional Charge Event
>>> in a Series Connected Battery Element (USPTO 9529048)
>>>
>>> Man, they sure make it difficult to tell what (if anything) is new or
>>> any different than what people have been doing for decades.
>>>
>>> Can anyone find anything in here that's actually a new invention?
>>>
>>
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