[EVDL] EVLN: 'Enough w/ the sanctimonious green car license plates already'
'We know your car is green superior to us in every imaginable way' http://www.cnet.com/au/news/dear-tesla-prius-owners-enough-with-the-sanctimonious-license-plates/ Dear Tesla and Prius owners, enough with the sanctimonious license plates by Chris Matyszczyk 28 April 2015 Technically Incorrect: Why do owners of greener vehicles feel the need to crow about their eco-superiority? Is it pride, or a need to make the rest of us feel bad? Technically Incorrect offers a slightly twisted take on the tech that's taken over our lives. [images / Chris Matyszczyk/CNET http://cnet4.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/r/2015/04/27/f9d02acd-30ea-4061-a3f8-50d3c2d416d0/thumbnail/670x503/992745527e2277cb341c645aa3db44df/tesla-license-plate.jpg (LESCO2E) That's it, Tesla owner. Air it out http://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/r/2015/04/27/434b6d0f-cedb-4bbe-a10d-adf6bb1f64e7/resize/370xauto/990acab594428c5915f9fc1a43e4b7df/prius-license-02.jpg (TNKGLBL) Because if you don't, we'll all be dead ] I know we're supposed to be saving the world so that our self-centered millennial children can destroy it in their own individual ways. And I'm prepared to do my bit in order to recycle magazines I never ordered and wine bottles that remind me of an evening with people whose names I forget. I struggle, however, with all the people who point their fingers at me and tell me I'm not green enough. Or at least not as sanctimoniously green as they are. The worst thing is that they don't even know me. But it's clear that they need to stick a billboard on their car in order to laud their own holiness and, simultaneously, snort that their greenness is far superior to mine. I am overtaken by this emotional climate change as I contemplate news from greener climes. On Thursday evening of this week, Tesla Motors is set to make a big announcement about batteries, perhaps expanding its reach beyond its automotive microclimate. And Toyota last week began trying to build momentum for its hydrogen-fuel car, the Mirai, with a new campaign called Fueled by Bulls***. We get it. Green is it. I am fretful that yet more people, on buying a musky Tesla, Toyota's Prius or Mirai, or the greenly named Nissan Leaf, will create a license plate that reminds everyone that they've bought a Tesla, a Prius, a Mirai or a nonphotosynthetic Leaf. Even before their own license plates arrive, they sometimes enjoy a factory-made one that is equally haughty. How many times do I see a Tesla with the printed words Zero Emissions poking out of its behind? We know, we know. Do we have to be told again and again? It's even worse than one of my neighbors who insisted on having a Who's Your Farmer? sticker on his Subaru, in order to make me feel guilty -- I assume -- that I once bought ground beef at Safeway and had no clue where it came from. Why do green car owners, as spotted in my vicinity, need to tell me to TNKGLBL? I find it hard enough to TNKSTR8. I am imperfect. My car is only a diesel, and I sometimes feel driven to get a license plate shouting out ASHAMED. Why must they try to make me feel worse? Why do they insist that a license plate exists to shriek about carbon dioxide or any other aspect of saving this cheerily doomed planet? Are even BMW owners and their license plates this high and mighty? Perhaps I am more sensitive because here in California, vanity plates are not so common. Some years back, a study showed that the Golden State couldn't even crack the top 10, so rare were such pressed-metal displays of vanity. It's even worse when they congregate around the charging station outside my local supermarket. TNKGLBL, meet HYBRDIZ and chat about the farmer who grows your kale. You bought a Tesla. You have a lot of money. You feel slightly guilty about this, so you're telling me you're saving the world (and I'm not) while driving around in a deeply swish car? Does your shrink know? There's one Prius owner in my area who actually performed a commendable act of creativity. He or she bought a Prius and decided the license plate should be SMUGCAR. There is something so deeply self-aware about this that every time I see this car, I just toot my horn because the owner has tooted theirs in such an honest manner. So green car owners, we know that your car is green. We know that you are superior to us, society's grim detritus, in every way imaginable. [© cnet.com] ... http://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/detritus detritus=trash For EVLN posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Enough-w-the-sanctimonious-green-car-license-plates-already-tp4675347.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA
Re: [EVDL] Low cost solar, virtual power plant
What SC offers is a way for homeowners who are not flush to get something in the way of renewable energy going. It you are just scraping by, you can build a purpose made structure for PV, you may not even have the credit or collateral for a $15k or $20 financed installation. So yes it is lacks the greatest return, but the fact it is possible at all makes it pretty wonderful. You simply agree to the process and your power bill drops. You don't have to understand much - that means yt]ou can go to work , or soccer practice, or your second job instead of researching PV and rate schedules. Not optimal? Not everyone can get optimal. On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 7:26 AM, jerry freedomev via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Hi Cor and All, Fact is as much as I like SC leasing is very expensive compared to owning. SC makes almost ALL the money though makes clean power which isn't bad. But the low cost high profit way owning is far better with paybacks in many places under 3, even 2 yrs or places like Hawaii, 1 yr. How is cutting out all the parasites by buying the parts, kits from places like sunelec/dmsolar and having a local electrician to permit, install or do your own. This comes under $2k/kw. No reason to pay more. Next don't put it on the house roof unless the only choice. Much better to make a porch, carport, patio, awnings, shed, etc added value while avoiding huge engineering fees and making it easier to clean, maintain and install. Done right the added value of say a carport or shed and solar system could increase the home's value several x's cost making it very profitable from day 1. As for Tesla's battery it can make a profit in places like Cal Time of Day pricing, other higher rate areas, but really too costly. It needs to be under $200/kwhr and soon as Tesla/SC makes the market, many other stationary battery types under that price, many with unlimited life, will pop up. Sadly most utilities don't understand how DG, home solar can work with them to lower their cost supplying near pollution free power. US utilities are going to keep shrinking, they have for yrs, and need to plan on generating a lot less, transporting others power to make profit or they will go bankrupt as few will keep paying more for polluting power when the solution is a phone call away. Not just producing your home's energy needs but freeing one from ever higher transport fuel costs with EV's as part of the system lowers energy costs 50-75% with little pollution, is a hard to beat energy future.Jerry Dycus -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/d092971a/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/6bc18484/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
I ... put up... PV to max out the... tax credits. If I am lucky it will return 7% to 9%, but Duke [utility]doesn't see it the way I do... [their] rate is 9.7cents a kWh You have to abhor cracked atoms, heavy water out the yingyang and arsenic laced coal ash ponds to find much justification for residential PV here. To me that is the #1 justification. How can I in good conscience keep burning and polluting the planet of my kids? And secondly, the 9.7 cents is not going to stay constant. Your solar costs are done. Free now forever. But the utility will always go up. Even at 3% per year, by the end of 20 years, that 9.7 cents will be 18 cents. Bob On Mon, May 4, 2015 at 7:25 PM, Ben Goren via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: On May 4, 2015, at 4:15 PM, Cor van de Water via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Again, the most optimal case would be that you can shift the full 10kWh each day, which would yield $2.60 per day or $950 per year. In 10 years that would give you $9,500 which is about the money you invested in a 10kW system, 10 years earlier so this would give you a zero-percent investment with risks. Not good. Actually...a ten-year payoff is about a 7% annual rate of return, which is really rather good. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_72 A ten-year payoff means that you've doubled your money over the course of ten years. 70 / 10 = 7%. (That of course assumes the battery is still worth $10K at the end, and so on. I've still found the Rule of 70 to be a rather useful tool for doing this kind of financial analysis...anything with a ten-year or better payoff is almost always something you should seriously consider leaping at, if you've got the capital to spare. You'll have less money in your pocket, yes, but your expenses will be dramatically lowered giving you a lot more financial flexibility and security.) b ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150504/3c4a08 5b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: Getting More EVs On The Road Faster (v)
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/In-Gear/2015/0427/How-to-get-more-electric-cars-on-the-roads-video How to get more electric cars on the roads (+video) By Stephen Edelstein, GreenCarReports April 27, 2015 Electric car use has grown tremendously in recent years, but obstacles including cost, range, charging times, concerns about battery life, and lack of model choices remain. [video flash] 2015 Nissan Leaf Government incentives and support programs have been helpful to the proliferation of electric cars, but a new report says there remains more to be done. Government incentives and support programs have been helpful to the proliferation of electric cars, but a new report says there remains more to be done. In a report released Wednesday, the National Research Council (NRC)--part of the National Academy of Science--said the Federal government should take further steps to promote adoption of electric cars. The NRC suggests continuing purchase incentives for electric cars past the current production caps, and also asks the government to take a different role in the development of charging infrastructure. The report highlights several barriers to electric-car adoption, including cost, range, charging times, concerns about battery life, lack of model choices, and lack of comprehensive charging infrastructure. To tackle these problems, the report underscores the importance of research into cheaper batteries, as well as the development of universal standards for charging equipment and payment. However, it also argues the Federal government should refrain from further investment in charging infrastructure. Instead, the government should fund research into public-charging usage, to better determine where charging infrastructure can have the biggest impact on electric-car sales. As for current policies, the report calls for an extension of the current $7,500 Federal income-tax credit for electric cars, and a large-scale public-service campaign to advertise it. Under the current rules, the credit begins to phase out over a 12-month period for each automaker after it sells 200,000 plug-in electric cars. The NRC also suggests converting the tax credit into a rebate that can be applied at the point of sale, rather than a credit against future taxes that can take up to 15 months to realize for buyers who qualify. President Barack Obama has advocated multiple times that the credit be turned into a purchase rebate--as well as boosting it from $7,500 to $10,000--but Congress hasn't taken any action. A decision to extend the credit may be needed soon, said National Resources Defense Council transportation director Roland Hwang--a member of the committee that compiled the report--in a recent blog post. While total plug-in electric-car volumes remain small, he said, certain manufacturers could hit their production limits in 2017 or 2018. This could potentially stall the market just as it is poised to hit its tipping point, he said. Those makers who have sold the highest volumes of plug-in vehicles are likely most able to bring down battery costs to cut the cost of their newer products. As of March 2015, the best-selling electric car in the U.S. was the Nissan Leaf, with 76,407 sold since December 2010. It's followed in sales volume by the Chevrolet Volt, which has racked up 75,231 sales in the same period. Tesla Motors does not release detailed sales figures, and the plug-in sales totals from all other automakers are lower than those of the three leaders. Overall plug-in electric car sales passed the 100,000 mark for the first time last year, and are reportedly up 3 percent in the first three months of 2015. [© The Christian Science Monitor] ... http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1097980_getting-more-electric-cars-on-roads-faster-recommendations-from-nrc Getting More Electric Cars On Roads Faster: Recommendations ... Apr 24, 2015 Government incentives and support programs have been helpful to the proliferation of electric cars, but a new report says there remains more to ... For EVLN posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/plugged-in/2015/04/26/japan-now-has-more-ev-chargers-than-gas-stations/ Japan Now Has More EVSE Than Gas Stations http://www.transportengineer.org.uk/transport-engineer-news/van-operators-forecast-more-electric-vehicles-in-two-years/82297/ Van operators forecast more electric vehicles in two years http://www.nbc29.com/story/28879597/staunton-launches-first-electric-car-charging-station Staunton VA Launches Their 1st EVSE https://www.longislandexchange.com/press-releases/earth-day-2015-suffolk-unveils-electric-car-chargers-on-eastern-campus-other-campuses-to-follow/ Suffolk CC College L.Island NY has old CT2020 dual L2 EVSE + EVLN: Do Not Unplug and OK To Unplug hanging signage keeps it real {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context:
[EVDL] EVLN: Do Not Unplug OK To Unplug hanging signage keeps it real
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1098003_electric-car-do-not-unplug-notices-public-education-at-its-best Electric Car 'Do Not Unplug' Notices: Public Education At Its Best By Stephen Edelstein Apr 27, 2015 [images http://images.thecarconnection.com/med/do-not-unplug-hanger-sign-by-take-charge-and-go_100509089_m.jpg Do Not Unplug by Take Charge and Go. http://images.thecarconnection.com/lrg/do-not-unplug-hanger-sign-by-take-charge-and-go-photo-by-tom-moloughney_100509090_l.jpg http://images.thecarconnection.com/lrg/do-not-unplug-hanger-sign-by-take-charge-and-go-photo-by-tom-moloughney_100509091_l.jpg The signs are available through Take Charge and Go individually for $2.49 each, or in a 10-pack for $19.99. ] The arrival of modern electric cars and public charging infrastructure has brought a whole range of etiquette issues to the fore. Electric cars' long charging times, and the limited availability of parking spaces with access to charging stations, can sometimes create a bit of tension. It's not unheard of for drivers to unplug other cars when they can't find a charging station of their own--whether those cars are done charging or not. There's been much discussion about what to do in these situations, but now there's a simple solution. A hanger sign marked Do Not Unplug on one side and OK To Unplug on the other is now available through Take Charge and Go (via Tom Moloughney's BMW i3 blog). The signs are shaped like the Do Not Disturb signs you'll find in hotels, and they slip over a standard J1772 charging connector. There's even space on the Do Not Unplug side in which the driver can write the time when a car will be finished charging, along with a phone number. Both sides of the card also have a list of charging-etiquette tips that should encourage peaceful relations with other drivers. They advise electric-car owners not to park in a charging space if they aren't actually charging, to limit their charging times, and--of course--never to unplug another car while it's charging. One more feature is a QR code which, along with a link to the Take Charge and Go website, provides further information on public charging. Note that some electric cars have locking mechanisms that prevent them from being unplugged until charging is complete--unless the key fob is nearby. Only some plug-in cars have this feature, but it could create a minor sticking point in an otherwise straightforward system of owners giving permission to unplug after a certain time or charge level is reached. [© greencarreports.com] ... http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=keeping+it+real keeping it real ... [dated] http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1089095_etiquette-tips-for-electric-car-charging-new-video-explains-it-all Etiquette Tips For Electric-Car Charging: New Video Explains It All (Dec 2013) ... http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1080107_electric-car-owners-gas-car-in-your-space-use-this-notice Electric-Car Owners: Gas Car In Your Space? Use This Notice! (Oct 2012) https://transportevolved.com/2015/04/29/hotel-inspired-ev-charging-indicator-is-simple-easy-answer-to-electric-car-charger-sharing/ Hotel-Inspired EV Charging Indicator is Simple, Easy Answer to Electric Car Charger Sharing April 29, 2015 By Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield [images https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/ChargeAndGo-580x326.jpg As simple and as elegant as it gets, and there’s no excuse for unplugging you either https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/IMG_0811-580x435.jpg The innovative cards could help those queuing for a charge at public charging stations https://d290b3p3ki7y5s.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/OK-to-Unplug.jpg The hangers are simple and easy to understand ] As your parents — or perhaps Sesame Street or even Mr. Rogers — hopefully taught you, it’s good to share. With more plug-in cars on the road than ever before, that’s something early adopters and newbies to electric cars alike are having to learn, as the most popular charging station locations find themselves inundated with more plug-in cars than charging stations. At most rapid charging sites where owners tend to be within easy reach of their cars and tend not to leave their vehicles for more than 30 minutes at a time, there’s a general rule that says ‘first come, first served’. But what happens when you arrive at a slower Level 2 (Type 2) charging location to find a row of cars plugged in and charging with no owner in sight? How do you know which car to unplug — and how do you know which car can make it home with the charge it already has? To date, we’ve seen some pretty innovative solutions to help plug-in car owners play nice at public charging station, ranging from low-tech notes scribbled on pieces of paper to high-end smartphone apps with printed window stickers or private SMS messaging. But a new solution called the “EV Charging Hanger” has them all beat — and it’s about as
[EVDL] Test Drive of a Petrol Car
http://teslaclubsweden.se/test-drive-of-a-petrol-car/ Having heard so much good about petrol cars, we decided to test drive one. They are said to combine cheap price with long range and fast charging. A winning formula on paper – but how are they in real life? We sat us in the loaner car at the car salesman’s office. Automakers do not sell the cars themselves, only through independent car repair shops as middlemen. It may sound like a bad omen to buy the car from a car repair shop that you want to visit as seldom as possible. But you apparently can’t buy the car directly from the manufacturer but must go through such intermediaries. The seller was very ”pushy” and tried to convince us to buy the car very forcibly, but the experience is perhaps better elsewhere. So we sat in the car and pressed the START button. The car’s gasoline engine coughed to life and started to operate. One could hear the engine’s sound and the car’s whole body vibrated as if something was broken, but the seller assured us that everything was as it should. The car actually has an electric motor and a microscopically small battery, but they are only used to start the petrol engine – the electric motor does not drive the wheels. The petrol engine then uses a tank full of gasoline, a fossil liquid, to propel the car by exploding small drops of it. It is apparently the small explosions that you hear and feel when the engine is running. The petrol engine consists of literally hundreds of moving parts that must have tolerance of hundredths of a millimeter to function. We begun to understand why it is car repair shops that sell the cars – they might hope for something to break in the car that they can mend? We put in a gear and drove away with a jerk. The jerk came not from any extreme acceleration, but gasoline engines apparently cannot be driven as smoothly as electric motors. The acceleration did not occur at all, because we could not get the car to go faster than 40 km/h! By then the petrol engine literally howled and the whole car shook violently. Convinced that something must have broken we stopped the car. The seller then explained that with petrol engines you need to ”change gears” on a regular basis. Between the engine and the wheels are not a fixed ratio gear, but a variable one. The petrol engine can produce power only in a limited speed range, and must therefore be geared with different ratios in order to continue to accelerate. There are 5 different gears we can select with increasing speed as result. It is -as we learned quickly- very important that each time select a suitable gear otherwise the engine will either stop or get seriously damaged! You need a lot of training to learn to select the right gear at the right time – though there are also models with automatic transmissions that can do this themselves. In the manual transmission car, we needed to constantly guard the engine from damaging it. Very stressful. We asked if the constant sound of the engine -that frankly disturbed us from being able to listen to the radio- could be turned off. But it couldn’t. Very distracting. After getting the car up to speed through intricate changing of gears we approached a traffic light. Releasing the accelerator pedal resulted in no significant braking, we had to use the brake pedal very much to slow down the car. We were surprised to hear the brakes are completely mechanical! The only thing they generate is heat – braking gives no regeneration of gasoline back into the tank! Sounds like a huge waste, but it would soon get even worse. When we came to a stop the engine continued to run and the car vibrate – even though the car was standing still! The engine continued to burn gasoline without moving the car forward. Can it really be true? Yes, the seller explained, it is so with gasoline cars: the engine is always running and burning gasoline – even when the car is stationary. Some models however switches off the engine at a red light, he explained. Well that certainly makes more sense. After a while we came to a gas station where we could charge the car. The car claimed that it still had half a tank left, but we wanted to try the famous super-fast charging of petrol cars! So we drove to the gas station and opened the fuel cap. The filling nozzle is very similar to a charging connector, but it is not electrons that come out of it but gasoline. Gasoline is a highly carcinogenic, smelly and flammable liquid derived from plants and animals extinct since millions of years ago. The gasoline is pumped to a tank in the car, which then drives around with about 50 liters of this hazardous liquid in it. We put the nozzle to the car, but nothing happened. The seller then explained that we must pay to fuel! Much like those extremely expensive fast chargers some electric utility companies have set up. After we put the credit card in the reader we could start fueling. It was
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (battery backup thinking)
Here in northern NJ, we lose power a few days a year. Some years we'll have a storm that knocks out power for two or three days. After Hurricane Sandy we lost power for ten or eleven days. Obviously the cost of the lost power is negligible, even at PSEG's 17.5 cents per kWhr. That doesn't enter into the battery backup calculation at all. It's not money that drives the decision - it's convenience. At the moment, we have a few deep-discharge marine batteries and standalone pure-sine inverters (300W to 1500W) to power a few lamps, the refrigerator, the cable modem up, and to charge the cell phones and laptops. But during Sandy I had to borrow batteries out of my Jetta EV conversion. All of that did the job, but I missed the battery backup system's seamless switchover, the freedom from concern about batteries going dead, the bother of manual charging, and the drudge of moving batteries and inverters from room to room. Len Moskowitz ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (waiting for better...)
for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/d9245309/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
Even at 3% per year, by the end of 20 years, that 9.7 cents will be 18 cents. Yes, that is a personal justification for the financial investment. In 20 years at 3% a kWh will be less here than it is in Connecticut today. Much as I want to whine about Duke Progress, one result of their intransigence, micromanagement, and attachment to nukes is a low cost of power - very low. We have to weigh that against poisoned aquifers and ground water. On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 9:43 AM, Robert Bruninga via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: I ... put up... PV to max out the... tax credits. If I am lucky it will return 7% to 9%, but Duke [utility]doesn't see it the way I do... [their] rate is 9.7cents a kWh You have to abhor cracked atoms, heavy water out the yingyang and arsenic laced coal ash ponds to find much justification for residential PV here. To me that is the #1 justification. How can I in good conscience keep burning and polluting the planet of my kids? And secondly, the 9.7 cents is not going to stay constant. Your solar costs are done. Free now forever. But the utility will always go up. Even at 3% per year, by the end of 20 years, that 9.7 cents will be 18 cents. Bob On Mon, May 4, 2015 at 7:25 PM, Ben Goren via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: On May 4, 2015, at 4:15 PM, Cor van de Water via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Again, the most optimal case would be that you can shift the full 10kWh each day, which would yield $2.60 per day or $950 per year. In 10 years that would give you $9,500 which is about the money you invested in a 10kW system, 10 years earlier so this would give you a zero-percent investment with risks. Not good. Actually...a ten-year payoff is about a 7% annual rate of return, which is really rather good. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_72 A ten-year payoff means that you've doubled your money over the course of ten years. 70 / 10 = 7%. (That of course assumes the battery is still worth $10K at the end, and so on. I've still found the Rule of 70 to be a rather useful tool for doing this kind of financial analysis...anything with a ten-year or better payoff is almost always something you should seriously consider leaping at, if you've got the capital to spare. You'll have less money in your pocket, yes, but your expenses will be dramatically lowered giving you a lot more financial flexibility and security.) b ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150504/3c4a08 5b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/0bd93ea7/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Self-driving taxibots can eliminate 90% of private cars on the streets
[ref http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Self-driving-taxibots-can-eliminate-90-of-private-cars-on-the-streets-tp4675308.html Self-driving taxibots can eliminate 90% of private cars on the streets ] [Not to be confused with aircraft taxibots taxibot-international.com] https://www.google.com/search?q=taxibots Search taxibots ... http://www.citylab.com/tech/2015/04/7-benefits-and-1-huge-problem-with-a-world-of-driverless-taxis/391952/ 7 Benefits and 1 Huge Problem With a World of Driverless Taxis Eric Jaffe Apr 30, 2015 Perhaps the biggest win: no more on-street parking. ... A city where private cars are largely replaced with driverless taxis doesn't feel terribly close, but it's not too far away to think about ... ... https://www.google.com/search?q=driverless+transitstart=10 Search driverless transit [Switzerland.edu driverless bus (v)] http://actu.epfl.ch/news/ride-across-the-campus-without-a-driver-4/ Ride across the campus without a driver [video (camera view from front of taxibot during route)] 04.05.15 - Since April 17, driverless vehicles roam the EPFL campus. Climb aboard for a taste of the future and meet the bellboy. We could have sworn that the profession of elevator operator was gone. At worst, we pictured a bellboy in an elevator in a luxury hotel in Mumbai. Yet, the profession comes back to life in what could become a means of transport as popular as the one inaugurated in New York on 23 March 1857. Since 17 April the EPFL campus is a life-size laboratory for testing autonomous shuttles as part of the European CityMobil2 project. There is no driver but there is a bellboy. Welcome aboard! Let us be clear: for the moment, the main motivation of the shuttles’ users is curiosity. Passengers can neither go very far nor very fast. The proposed route connects the M1 line stop at the Innovation Park, the Esplanade parking lot, the Rolex Learning Center, the Starling Hotel and the Estudiantines student residence. It was the only possible route on campus that does not disturb the traffic and which avoids construction sites explains our groom. During this first phase of testing, it takes 20 minutes to cover a distance of about 1’500 meters. Unless the passenger leaves the Starling hotel with 3 suitcases in the pouring rain, this formula has only a purely scientific interest. The turns of the itinerary require a safe speed and even during the few tens of meters of straight route the vehicles cannot use all their power: they are limited for security reasons. Why a bellboy? The mystery remains: why a bellboy in a driverless bus? In addition to being polite and answering questions, the bellboy is a complement to a developing technology. When leaving each stop, he presses the button to close the doors. This is an essential security gesture, followed by the sounding of a bell and a gentle start. Just like in the good old days! Except for the shuttle’s cutting edge technology. For each identified hazard, the vehicle slows down and sometimes even weeds and daisies unnecessarily activate its corner radars. Passersby also test its reflexes, honed by a radar on the roof. Although the vehicle can go faster, it is not the testers’ current intention. The technology is being tried: so far there are no accidents to report. Inside the vehicle, it is possible to follow the path, already mapped on a large screen, and see through the eyes of the radars. Small red dots highlight potential obstacles whereas a continuous line marks the trail left by a cyclist. Suddenly the shuttle stops, stubborn as a mule. A large truck stands before it. It is not yet able to go around obstacles, explains the modern times elevator operator. Without hesitation, he takes the vehicle’s controls and asks the truck’s driver to move his 26 tons. Once the way is open, he returns the controls to the electric vehicle and the journey resumes. There are between 150 and 200 curious passengers per day using the shuttle for this quick getaway. The same must have happened in the old days when people would use the elevator just to see how it is. It's fun, entertaining, and innovative. One feels a bit like a pioneer whose grandchildren will say one day: When Grandma was young buses still needed drivers. Public transport on demand Behind its casual appearance, this life test unique in its kind is a step towards the future. It aims to develop a piece of software that enables to manage a fleet of autonomous vehicles in real time from a control center, said Raphael Gindrat, CEO of the BestMile start-up, collaborating with the project. This promises interesting applications such as in airports, campuses, industrial centers, recreational parks or even for public transport on demand. Apart from the technology developed by EPFL’s start-up, CityMobil2 is interested in the sociological and legal aspects related to vehicles without drivers. The passengers willing to share their impressions are invited to answer a
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (battery backup thinking)
Since I really wanted a battery back-up... Everyone's situation is different, but I had to ask myself, how often do I lose power (and how quickly can I rig emergency power?)? Around here it is 99.95% reliable (average 4 hours per year outage). My typical home (1 kW average) then loses about 80 cents of electricity per year. Now how many thousands of dollars and maintenance and replacement of batteries for the rest of my life is worth 80 cents a year? To me, its ludicrous to have home batteries... But, of course, I do. (Wife insists on it). SO I have 4 small marine batteries and a 2 kW inverter (total cost about $500) to power all the lights and the refrigerator overnight. (Though I have not used it EVER in the 4 years I have had solar). And since it may on average only happen once a year, I don't even bother with a charging system. If I ever used the system, and needed to charge those 48v worth of batteries, I have two clip leads that I will just clip from the 450v solar panels directly to the battery. The solar panels of course are current limited to about 7 amps, so they will drop to the 48 volts for charging just fine (human in the loop to disconnect when full). The only excitement is when I disconnect the clip lead and draw a nice welding arc. With 16 kW of solar panels (6 strings at 450v or so) I have 6 strings of 7 amps or 42 amps of DC suitable for charging ANY battery (of any voltage) during an Armageddon event indefinitely. And although I have done designs of an automatic switch over system and charge regulator... I just cannot justify the time investment to replace 80 cents of electrticity per year... Again, everone's situation is different. But there is nothing I hate worse in life than batteries. (except the one in the EV of course!) Oh, another reason I have never used the home backup is simply because I have a 1500W inverter in the Prius, and the few times I needed power, I just plug stuff into it. See http://aprs.org/FD-Prius-Power.html P.S. The above availability of LOTS of kW of DC solar is why I have encourage DIY folks to wire their 400-500v SERIES Strings PV with a center-tap so that with loss of grid, they can parallel the two halves and then get DOUBLE the current. In my case, that could make over 80 Amps of DC (at any voltage from 12 to over 200v) available for charging. Even on cloudy days, the 80 amps worth of solar will still produce 8 amps of charging (sun rise to sunset) which is alos fine for my 4 marine batteries. SO I never need more than overnight 12 hour battery storage for the refer and lights. Bob, WB4aPR -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of len moskowitz via EV Sent: Monday, May 04, 2015 8:26 PM To: Cor van de Water Cc: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant Cor wrote: that is why - next week, someone will come to inspect my home to establish whether he wants to make a bid on delivering me a system and I have already received a bid from SolarCity. I've had SolarCity and SunPower quote grid-tie PV systems for our home. Provided you have the cash available, it didn't make sense to do anything but buy the systems outright. They both came in at $4/watt installed, with SunPower offering a higher capacity system for our limited roof size. That was the main difference between them. Since I really wanted a battery back-up system like the one we had in our previous home, I asked SunPower if they could provide just their high efficiency solar panels, and I'd have a local contractor provide the rest of the system based on the Outback Radian inverters, charge controllers and monitors. The pricing they offered for panels-only was not at all competitive. It seems to me that they don't want to just sell panels. They want that $4/watt. Maybe now with the Tesla battery units becoming available, I can get SolarCity to quote a battery backup system. I still don't expect them to be price competitive. My impression is that they don't think that they need to be competitive. Len Moskowitz ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (battery backup thinking)
On May 5, 2015, at 7:34 AM, Cruisin via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Why not buy a Volt 16.5kwh battery and add your own inverter for a backup. That's what my customers are doing. Where does one actually buy a Volt battery? I've looked a couple times without much success. I suspect it might be well worth considering for a PHEV conversion I have in mind to do Thanks! b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/7bb1ad0d/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (waiting for better...)
Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150504/3c4a08 5b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. *Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html* A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/d9245309/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/9fd4f723/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
In northern NJ we're paying more than 18 cents per kWhr. Len Moskowitz ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
RIght my Sunpower array is insured and bonded for complete parts and labor for 20 years. The Sunpower PV is guaranteed for efficiency. In 20 years my PV should be still more efficient than any of the lower cost systems are new. Nothing matches quality manufacture for long use durable goods. On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 10:50 AM, len moskowitz via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Mark wrote: Did they both offer similar warranties? SunPower offers a better loss-of-efficiency-over-time warranty. Len Moskowitz ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/8b53626e/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
Mark wrote: Did they both offer similar warranties? SunPower offers a better loss-of-efficiency-over-time warranty. Len Moskowitz ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (battery backup thinking)
Why not buy a Volt 16.5kwh battery and add your own inverter for a backup. That's what my customers are doing. That's what Tesla is selling for a whole lot more. Be careful connecting anything between your solar inverter and the grid, as it is protecting the grid from power during a power failure. You don't want to put power into the grid during a failure Also, don't unplug your solar array from a backup battery charger while it is drawing power, you will destroy the collectors unless using Micro Inverters. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Re-virtual-power-plant-battery-backup-thinking-tp4675356p4675360.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Enclosed human-electric hybrid spins around the UCF campus
Looks like a good product. Be great to see plenty of those sorts of vehicles on the road. b On May 3, 2015, at 11:23 AM, Michael Ross michael.e.r...@gmail.com wrote: That looks a lot like the ELF product of the company I just started working for. I was previously a beta tester for them. It is a good design. I have been hired to develop new products, but I hope I can add to their manufacturing, purchasing and other efforts as well. Since I am an employee you have to take what I say with an open skeptical mind. I do still have the beta I bought, and commuted 25 miles each way with. (25 miles takes about 1kWh at 48VDC nominal on my older machine. I degraded my LFP batteries by charging them fully in the hot sun, and have not bought new packs. Now my commute is too long. I think their current packs are better than the ones I have, but I have no personal experience with them. The ELF they sell now is better than mine in a number of ways. Fit and finish, some suspension improvements, many small manufacturing details are better now.. Mpre options are available. It's effective and fun in an urban setting. It is easy for car drivers to see, and car traffic seems to treat you well - I have found it makes things go smoother if you wave people around you when it makes sense - some people just will not cross a double yellow without permission.. In suburbia you may want to find more of the 25mph roads, but it really gets you across intersections, up to speed from a dead stop, and up hills in a way no HPV only bike can do. On 25mph residential streets you will almost never hold up car traffic. On Sun, May 3, 2015 at 1:41 PM, Ben Goren via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: On May 3, 2015, at 12:27 AM, brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: The Human Assisted Electric Vehicle could reach speeds of up to 40 mph and has a range of about 50 miles. The entire vehicle cost about $4,000 to produce. Velomobiles are wonderful, as are electric-assist velomobiles. I'm not so sure they'll well suited for American suburbia...but there are definitely those for whom such a vehicle is perfect. The thing that surprises me, though, is that price tag. It's not that hard to spend that much on a recumbent trike, let alone add a fairing and an electric motor, and velomobiles generally start at that price and up -- potentially way up for high performance ones. Anybody know any more about this one? b -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150503/22e9d827/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. Warren Buffet Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 801 bytes Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/ae29e340/attachment.pgp ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
On May 5, 2015, at 7:50 AM, len moskowitz lenmoskow...@optonline.net wrote: Mark wrote: Did they both offer similar warranties? SunPower offers a better loss-of-efficiency-over-time warranty. Len Moskowitz Thank you. SC folks claim they have the best warranty in the space, but I've not had an opportunity to really compare. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] Acquitted: Charging-EVr PD-assaulted pushed, handcuffed, punched, pepper-sprayed +
http://www.smmirror.com/articles/News/Pico-Neighborhood-Man-Will-Not-Be-Charged-After-Arrest-In-Virginia-Avenue-Park/43242 Pico Neighborhood Man Will Not Be Charged After Arrest In Virginia Avenue Park May. 5, 2015 Brenton Garen / Editor-in-Chief [image http://smmirrorstatic.s3.amazonaws.com/media/220/143084520347853.jpg Courtesy of SMPD Justin Palmer will not be charged after he was arrested for allegedly violating the City’s park closure ordinance at Virginia Avenue Park on the night of April 21. ] A Pico neighborhood man who was arrested at Virginia Avenue Park during the late evening of April 21, for allegedly violating the City’s park closure ordinance and delaying and obstructing officers in the performance of their duties, will not be charged. According to the Santa Monica Police Department, officers were conducting a check at Virginia Avenue Park at the corner of Pico and Cloverfield on that night when they came across a man later identified as Justin Palmer, whose vehicle was parked at the charging station. The SMPD said officers told Palmer that the park closed at 11 pm and that the electric vehicle charging station was closed as clearly posted. “The subject repeatedly refused to leave the park and after numerous requests, officers made the decision to issue him a citation for violating the city’s park closure law,” according to the SMPD. “When officers requested to see his identification, he repeatedly refused to provide it. The subject was placed under arrest for violation of the municipal park closure ordinance and delaying and obstructing an officer in the course of his duties. During the arrest, the subject actively resisted. Officers deployed pepper spray and physically restrained him.” Palmer, 36, was taken to Santa Monica Public Safety Facility where he was fingerprinted and booked. “At the Santa Monica Jail the subject complained of pain,” the SMPD said. “He was transported to the Santa Monica Hospital for treatment and was medically cleared. The subject was subsequently issued a citation and released.” Palmer and passersby disputed the time of the incident, saying it happened just before 11 pm while the SMPD stands by its records that the incident happened just after 11 pm. After footage appeared on social media [ http://www.fac ebook.com/christinegp/videos/10153243630119486/ ], the matter was submitted to the Criminal Division of the Santa Monica City Attorney’s Office for review and possible filing of criminal charges. After careful examination of the circumstances, a decision was made not to file charges against Palmer, according to a statement issued at 9:26 pm Monday from the City of Santa Monica. “Factors which precluded the filing of criminal charges were Mr. Palmer’s belief that being present in the parking lot did not constitute a park closure violation, signage at the entrance to the parking lot of Virginia Avenue Park did not clearly indicate that the parking lot is included in the park closure ordinance, and a question concerning when Mr. Palmer arrived in the parking lot and when officers made their initial contact with him,” the statement read. “The prosecution bears the heavy burden of proving a criminal case beyond a reasonable doubt. The heightened standard of proof required to sustain a criminal filing when coupled with the totality of factors associated with this incident, precluded the filing of criminal charges.” [© smmirror.com] For EVLN posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Charging-EVr-PD-assaulted-pushed-handcuffed-punched-pepper-sprayed-tp4675150p4675369.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Acquitted: Charging-EVr PD-assaulted pushed, handcuffed, punched, pepper-sprayed +
Hurray for justice! But what a load to go through for Palmer. Can't the police learn how to deal with situations like this in a more tolerable way - like watching for menacing indications before taking action? Peri -- Original Message -- From: brucedp5 via EV ev@lists.evdl.org To: ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: 05-May-15 12:06:05 PM Subject: [EVDL] Acquitted: Charging-EVr PD-assaulted pushed, handcuffed, punched, pepper-sprayed + http://www.smmirror.com/articles/News/Pico-Neighborhood-Man-Will-Not-Be-Charged-After-Arrest-In-Virginia-Avenue-Park/43242 Pico Neighborhood Man Will Not Be Charged After Arrest In Virginia Avenue Park May. 5, 2015 Brenton Garen / Editor-in-Chief [image http://smmirrorstatic.s3.amazonaws.com/media/220/143084520347853.jpg Courtesy of SMPD Justin Palmer will not be charged after he was arrested for allegedly violating the City’s park closure ordinance at Virginia Avenue Park on the night of April 21. ] A Pico neighborhood man who was arrested at Virginia Avenue Park during the late evening of April 21, for allegedly violating the City’s park closure ordinance and delaying and obstructing officers in the performance of their duties, will not be charged. According to the Santa Monica Police Department, officers were conducting a check at Virginia Avenue Park at the corner of Pico and Cloverfield on that night when they came across a man later identified as Justin Palmer, whose vehicle was parked at the charging station. The SMPD said officers told Palmer that the park closed at 11 pm and that the electric vehicle charging station was closed as clearly posted. “The subject repeatedly refused to leave the park and after numerous requests, officers made the decision to issue him a citation for violating the city’s park closure law,” according to the SMPD. “When officers requested to see his identification, he repeatedly refused to provide it. The subject was placed under arrest for violation of the municipal park closure ordinance and delaying and obstructing an officer in the course of his duties. During the arrest, the subject actively resisted. Officers deployed pepper spray and physically restrained him.” Palmer, 36, was taken to Santa Monica Public Safety Facility where he was fingerprinted and booked. “At the Santa Monica Jail the subject complained of pain,” the SMPD said. “He was transported to the Santa Monica Hospital for treatment and was medically cleared. The subject was subsequently issued a citation and released.” Palmer and passersby disputed the time of the incident, saying it happened just before 11 pm while the SMPD stands by its records that the incident happened just after 11 pm. After footage appeared on social media [ http://www.fac ebook.com/christinegp/videos/10153243630119486/ ], the matter was submitted to the Criminal Division of the Santa Monica City Attorney’s Office for review and possible filing of criminal charges. After careful examination of the circumstances, a decision was made not to file charges against Palmer, according to a statement issued at 9:26 pm Monday from the City of Santa Monica. “Factors which precluded the filing of criminal charges were Mr. Palmer’s belief that being present in the parking lot did not constitute a park closure violation, signage at the entrance to the parking lot of Virginia Avenue Park did not clearly indicate that the parking lot is included in the park closure ordinance, and a question concerning when Mr. Palmer arrived in the parking lot and when officers made their initial contact with him,” the statement read. “The prosecution bears the heavy burden of proving a criminal case beyond a reasonable doubt. The heightened standard of proof required to sustain a criminal filing when coupled with the totality of factors associated with this incident, precluded the filing of criminal charges.” [© smmirror.com] For EVLN posts use: http://evdl.org/evln/ {brucedp.150m.com} -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Charging-EVr-PD-assaulted-pushed-handcuffed-punched-pepper-sprayed-tp4675150p4675369.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant (battery backup thinking)
Available from cru...@live.com -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Re-virtual-power-plant-battery-backup-thinking-tp4675356p4675371.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] virtual power plant
SC are newly manufacturers. SC bought SIlevo and plans a highly automated facility in Ohio I believe. They may intend to honor a warranty that is beyond what the current panels should be. But since the mostly own the panels and the electrons they make for the installations, it is not worth their while for them to be broken. It is a good deal if they don't fold someday. Sunpower is bonded so if they go out of business, there is a mechanism to honor the warranty. In a short time, I couldn't find what seemed like a complete warranty for all their products. They talk about 21% efficiency, but I only found this warranty for an 18.4% system: http://silevosolar.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Silevo-Triex-R-Series-Datasheet4.pdf It is comparable in time to Sunpower, but not as high efficiency. It is limited whereas the Sunpower is not. On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 10:58 AM, Mark Abramowitz via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: On May 5, 2015, at 7:50 AM, len moskowitz lenmoskow...@optonline.net wrote: Mark wrote: Did they both offer similar warranties? SunPower offers a better loss-of-efficiency-over-time warranty. Len Moskowitz Thank you. SC folks claim they have the best warranty in the space, but I've not had an opportunity to really compare. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/7129ab81/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] Fw: virtual power plant
They mentioned Buffalo, NY and Hangzhou, China , but not Ohio on their web site,Silevo History | silevo | | | | | | | | | Silevo History | silevoSilevo is a solar cell innovator and photovoltaic (PV) solar module manufacturer that has evolved the use of silicon for solar to offer cost-effective high performance solar modules. | | | | View on silevosolar.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | | On Tuesday, May 5, 2015 1:36 PM, Michael Ross via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: SC are newly manufacturers. SC bought SIlevo and plans a highly automated facility in Ohio I believe. They may intend to honor a warranty that is beyond what the current panels should be. But since the mostly own the panels and the electrons they make for the installations, it is not worth their while for them to be broken. It is a good deal if they don't fold someday. Sunpower is bonded so if they go out of business, there is a mechanism to honor the warranty. In a short time, I couldn't find what seemed like a complete warranty for all their products. They talk about 21% efficiency, but I only found this warranty for an 18.4% system: http://silevosolar.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Silevo-Triex-R-Series-Datasheet4.pdf It is comparable in time to Sunpower, but not as high efficiency. It is limited whereas the Sunpower is not. On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 10:58 AM, Mark Abramowitz via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: On May 5, 2015, at 7:50 AM, len moskowitz lenmoskow...@optonline.net wrote: Mark wrote: Did they both offer similar warranties? SunPower offers a better loss-of-efficiency-over-time warranty. Len Moskowitz Thank you. SC folks claim they have the best warranty in the space, but I've not had an opportunity to really compare. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/7129ab81/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/e0fda4d1/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Low cost solar, virtual power plant
Hi Cor and All, Fact is as much as I like SC leasing is very expensive compared to owning. SC makes almost ALL the money though makes clean power which isn't bad. But the low cost high profit way owning is far better with paybacks in many places under 3, even 2 yrs or places like Hawaii, 1 yr. How is cutting out all the parasites by buying the parts, kits from places like sunelec/dmsolar and having a local electrician to permit, install or do your own. This comes under $2k/kw. No reason to pay more. Next don't put it on the house roof unless the only choice. Much better to make a porch, carport, patio, awnings, shed, etc added value while avoiding huge engineering fees and making it easier to clean, maintain and install. Done right the added value of say a carport or shed and solar system could increase the home's value several x's cost making it very profitable from day 1. As for Tesla's battery it can make a profit in places like Cal Time of Day pricing, other higher rate areas, but really too costly. It needs to be under $200/kwhr and soon as Tesla/SC makes the market, many other stationary battery types under that price, many with unlimited life, will pop up. Sadly most utilities don't understand how DG, home solar can work with them to lower their cost supplying near pollution free power. US utilities are going to keep shrinking, they have for yrs, and need to plan on generating a lot less, transporting others power to make profit or they will go bankrupt as few will keep paying more for polluting power when the solution is a phone call away. Not just producing your home's energy needs but freeing one from ever higher transport fuel costs with EV's as part of the system lowers energy costs 50-75% with little pollution, is a hard to beat energy future. Jerry Dycus -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150505/d092971a/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)