Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[paul dove via EV]

Should not be hard to calculate.
The modules weigh 8.4 lbs and there are 48 so that is approximately 403 lbs.The 
whole battery weighs 648 lbs... so, all the rest e=weighs 245 lbs.
That includes case, straps, nuts, BMS, etc.
A pack of CALB SE series would only be 525 lbs for 24KWh.

  From: brucedp5 via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org>
 To: ev@lists.evdl.org 
 Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 3:49 AM
 Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly
   
Thank you for sharing. I found it interesting to see the inside cells of he
pack, and the empty shell case.

How much do you think the empty case weighs, and what percentage of the
total pack weight would that be?

It looks like the case is heavy, and converters have an advantage over the
automakers in that converters can save on that case weight, and install the
li-ion cells without it.

If possible please consider grouping those images, and titling them. I am
thinking that effort will be found by the search engines and potential
converters around the world can see, learn, and improve on what you have
done.




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: 
http://evdl.org/evln/


{brucedp.150m.com}

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Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Cor van de Water via EV]

Seth,
The pack was carted out to me just before 11 AM and I took off at 3 PM
with the cells in the back of the Prius (again bolted together in the
original end plates to avoid having cells shift around in my car and
short-circus as Bob Rice would say)
I was prepared with a lot of tools, so I did not have to search or buy
things like the security Torx, I had it ready to use in my car next to
the pack. Mostly I used the 10mm and 1/2" socket with a short extension
and my small ratchet. I had brought my 3/8" drive ratchet and 3 ft
handle extension (steel pipe) which I did not need, but I used the large
ratchet and a 16mm socket for undoing a reinforcement bar that goes
across the pack between the front 4 stacks of 4 cells and the middle
stacks of 2 cells.
I needed the 2 crow bars that I also brought to lift the rear single
stack of 24 cells to undo the bolts that were slightly hidden inside the
bottom shell as I forgot to bring an open ended 10mm wrench, so I only
had the socket which needs to have clear space in front in order to
work.

I will soon know the difference as I am also planning to buy a 2015 Leaf
for the pack and part out the rest of the car, since I want tocombine 2
Leaf packs in my S10.

Thermal management: there is nothing to regulate the temp in a 2011
pack, it simply has a high voltage connector and a control connector,
the pack is sealed beyond that. I have heard that later packs have a
battery heater so I presume that the pack is still sealed but the
control interface can enable a heater that is attached to the internal
DC bus. The BMS does measure the temp of several spread-out cells, I
believe I removed 4 temp sensors (and retained them to be used on my S10
when I re-install this pack and BMS) which looked like simple pt1000
metal tubes held in place with a plastic clip.

Cor van de Water 
Chief Scientist 
Proxim Wireless 
  
office +1 408 383 7626Skype: cor_van_de_water 
XoIP   +31 87 784 1130private: cvandewater.info 

http://www.proxim.com

This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and
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-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Seth Rothenberg
via EV
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 11:52 AM
To: Jay Summet; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

Cor,
Thank you for the pics!   How long did that take you?

Do you know what the difference is between the 2011/12
vs 2013-2015 packs?

Also, is there some kind of thermal management?

Thanks
Seth
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Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Haudy Kazemi via EV]

Anyone know if pack swapping was on the mind of the Leaf engineers? I heard it 
used the same cells as the Better Place 24 kwh packs that were definitely 
designed with swapping in mind. Different packaging though. IIRC, those BP 
packs were eventually sold for about $2500 each when they finally got through 
the salvage auction process.

As for thermal management, I believe the 2012 is the first Leaf to have a 
rudimentary thermal control in terms of a minimal battery heater that kicks in 
at -4 C. I think it'd be more helpful if it started at a higher temp. Both 2011 
and 2012 are known to experience capacity loss, as well as some 2013s. There is 
more detailed info on the MyNissanleaf forum.



On May 29, 2016 6:45:42 PM CDT, Peri Hartman via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
>Fascinating, Cor.
>
>I wonder if Nissan designed the car to take advantage of the structural
>
>properties of the battery case.  It seems that one could design a 
>chassis that *is* the battery case and put a body on top of it.  Let 
>your imagination run, here.  I assume they did that to some extent but
>I 
>bet there's room for quite a bit of weight optimization.
>
>Peri
>
>-- Original Message --
>From: "Cor van de Water via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
>To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
>Sent: 29-May-16 4:32:42 PM
>Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly
>
>>Jay,
>>You hit it on the head, I was afraid that the wrecker guys would just
>>drop the pack on the ground in the parking lot or even chase me off
>>their property and dump it in the street on the hot asphalt, but they
>>were really cool with it, parking this cart in a corner of their lot
>>under a tree so I did not get the full brunt of the 93 deg weather 
>>while
>>slaving through the hot hours of the day, it was almost 3 hours drive
>>away (near Sacramento) so even though I left early in the morning, the
>>holiday weekend traffic caused me to arrive around 10:30 and they 
>>needed
>>some time to pull the Leaf from storage and find the pack.
>>Funny story: I had paid for and was waiting for them to bring the pack
>>out, then the workshop guy comes to the front desk: Where *is* the
>>battery on the Leaf? So I explained: under the car. I actually walked
>>back with him, he raised the forklift tines enough that we could peek
>>under the car and I pointed to the area between the 4 wheels and said:
>>there it is.
>>He also was a little hesitant for dealing with the high voltage, so I
>>asked him: did you pull the 12V battery out (I could see that it was
>>gone from under the also missing hood) and explained that the high
>>voltage can only come out when 12V power is applied to the relays that
>>disconnect when the car is not in use.
>>After that he was happy to unbolt the pack, disconnect the plugs and
>>cart it out for me to work on.
>>At the end of the lunchtime he dropped by again to look at the
>contents
>>of the pack with the words "you learn something every day" and I like
>>that attitude.
>>
>>Bruce,
>>Indeed the shell is quite heavy. The top is single layer of sheet
>steel
>>and probably around 40 lbs because I could carry it with some effort,
>>the bottom I did not handle more than shifting it a bit on the cart, 
>>but
>>seeing that it is double walled with some reinforcements, it must be
>at
>>least double the top shell so likely around 80-100 lbs.
>>This means that the entire battery pack in its enclosure is likely
>>40-50%
>>heavier than the weight of the modules, which in itself are 4 cells in
>
>>a
>>metal jacket.
>>
>>BTW, I did put a short description with every pic so you have an idea
>>what they are about, unfortunately the upload feature of Flickr put 
>>them
>>in the wrong order, you see them from end to start.
>>I don't have a blog to give the story with the pics but I did post
>them
>>as public to be able to share the innards of a Leaf pack. Looks very
>>well done.
>>
>>Cor van de Water
>>Chief Scientist
>>Proxim Wireless
>>
>>office +1 408 383 7626Skype: cor_van_de_water
>>XoIP   +31 87 784 1130private: cvandewater.info
>>
>>http://www.proxim.com
>>
>>This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential 
>>and
>>proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation.  If you 
>>received
>>this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender.  Any
>>unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of
>>this message is proh

Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Peri Hartman via EV]

Fascinating, Cor.

I wonder if Nissan designed the car to take advantage of the structural 
properties of the battery case.  It seems that one could design a 
chassis that *is* the battery case and put a body on top of it.  Let 
your imagination run, here.  I assume they did that to some extent but I 
bet there's room for quite a bit of weight optimization.


Peri

-- Original Message --
From: "Cor van de Water via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
Sent: 29-May-16 4:32:42 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly


Jay,
You hit it on the head, I was afraid that the wrecker guys would just
drop the pack on the ground in the parking lot or even chase me off
their property and dump it in the street on the hot asphalt, but they
were really cool with it, parking this cart in a corner of their lot
under a tree so I did not get the full brunt of the 93 deg weather 
while

slaving through the hot hours of the day, it was almost 3 hours drive
away (near Sacramento) so even though I left early in the morning, the
holiday weekend traffic caused me to arrive around 10:30 and they 
needed

some time to pull the Leaf from storage and find the pack.
Funny story: I had paid for and was waiting for them to bring the pack
out, then the workshop guy comes to the front desk: Where *is* the
battery on the Leaf? So I explained: under the car. I actually walked
back with him, he raised the forklift tines enough that we could peek
under the car and I pointed to the area between the 4 wheels and said:
there it is.
He also was a little hesitant for dealing with the high voltage, so I
asked him: did you pull the 12V battery out (I could see that it was
gone from under the also missing hood) and explained that the high
voltage can only come out when 12V power is applied to the relays that
disconnect when the car is not in use.
After that he was happy to unbolt the pack, disconnect the plugs and
cart it out for me to work on.
At the end of the lunchtime he dropped by again to look at the contents
of the pack with the words "you learn something every day" and I like
that attitude.

Bruce,
Indeed the shell is quite heavy. The top is single layer of sheet steel
and probably around 40 lbs because I could carry it with some effort,
the bottom I did not handle more than shifting it a bit on the cart, 
but

seeing that it is double walled with some reinforcements, it must be at
least double the top shell so likely around 80-100 lbs.
This means that the entire battery pack in its enclosure is likely
40-50%
heavier than the weight of the modules, which in itself are 4 cells in 
a

metal jacket.

BTW, I did put a short description with every pic so you have an idea
what they are about, unfortunately the upload feature of Flickr put 
them

in the wrong order, you see them from end to start.
I don't have a blog to give the story with the pics but I did post them
as public to be able to share the innards of a Leaf pack. Looks very
well done.

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless

office +1 408 383 7626Skype: cor_van_de_water
XoIP   +31 87 784 1130private: cvandewater.info

http://www.proxim.com

This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential 
and
proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation.  If you 
received

this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender.  Any
unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of
this message is prohibited.


-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Jay Summet via
EV
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 1:45 AM
To: ev@lists.evdl.org
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

Phew! That's a full days work! At least that cart put it up at a nice
working height so you didn't have to stoop over all day

Jay

On 05/29/2016 03:18 AM, Cor van de Water via EV wrote:

 Today I bought a 2011 Leaf battery pack and completely dis-assembled

it,

 to take it home in my Prius,
 the shell was too wide to fit in the car.
 Also I was by myself and had no help lifting, each module is over 8

lbs

 and there are 48 in a pack
 so about 400 lbs in cells alone, besides the compression plates,
 contactors, service disconnect,
 bus bars and hundreds of bolts. And of course the steel shell halves.
 So, I disassembled the pack in the parking lot of the recycler and

took

 several pics of the process.
 You can enjoy them here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/33178064@N05/

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Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Cor van de Water via EV]

Jay,
You hit it on the head, I was afraid that the wrecker guys would just
drop the pack on the ground in the parking lot or even chase me off
their property and dump it in the street on the hot asphalt, but they
were really cool with it, parking this cart in a corner of their lot
under a tree so I did not get the full brunt of the 93 deg weather while
slaving through the hot hours of the day, it was almost 3 hours drive
away (near Sacramento) so even though I left early in the morning, the
holiday weekend traffic caused me to arrive around 10:30 and they needed
some time to pull the Leaf from storage and find the pack.
Funny story: I had paid for and was waiting for them to bring the pack
out, then the workshop guy comes to the front desk: Where *is* the
battery on the Leaf? So I explained: under the car. I actually walked
back with him, he raised the forklift tines enough that we could peek
under the car and I pointed to the area between the 4 wheels and said:
there it is.
He also was a little hesitant for dealing with the high voltage, so I
asked him: did you pull the 12V battery out (I could see that it was
gone from under the also missing hood) and explained that the high
voltage can only come out when 12V power is applied to the relays that
disconnect when the car is not in use.
After that he was happy to unbolt the pack, disconnect the plugs and
cart it out for me to work on.
At the end of the lunchtime he dropped by again to look at the contents
of the pack with the words "you learn something every day" and I like
that attitude.

Bruce,
Indeed the shell is quite heavy. The top is single layer of sheet steel
and probably around 40 lbs because I could carry it with some effort,
the bottom I did not handle more than shifting it a bit on the cart, but
seeing that it is double walled with some reinforcements, it must be at
least double the top shell so likely around 80-100 lbs.
This means that the entire battery pack in its enclosure is likely
40-50%
heavier than the weight of the modules, which in itself are 4 cells in a
metal jacket.

BTW, I did put a short description with every pic so you have an idea
what they are about, unfortunately the upload feature of Flickr put them
in the wrong order, you see them from end to start.
I don't have a blog to give the story with the pics but I did post them
as public to be able to share the innards of a Leaf pack. Looks very
well done.

Cor van de Water 
Chief Scientist 
Proxim Wireless 
  
office +1 408 383 7626Skype: cor_van_de_water 
XoIP   +31 87 784 1130private: cvandewater.info 

http://www.proxim.com

This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and
proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation.  If you received
this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender.  Any
unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of
this message is prohibited.


-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Jay Summet via
EV
Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 1:45 AM
To: ev@lists.evdl.org
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

Phew! That's a full days work! At least that cart put it up at a nice 
working height so you didn't have to stoop over all day

Jay

On 05/29/2016 03:18 AM, Cor van de Water via EV wrote:
> Today I bought a 2011 Leaf battery pack and completely dis-assembled
it,
> to take it home in my Prius,
> the shell was too wide to fit in the car.
> Also I was by myself and had no help lifting, each module is over 8
lbs
> and there are 48 in a pack
> so about 400 lbs in cells alone, besides the compression plates,
> contactors, service disconnect,
> bus bars and hundreds of bolts. And of course the steel shell halves.
> So, I disassembled the pack in the parking lot of the recycler and
took
> several pics of the process.
> You can enjoy them here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/33178064@N05/
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Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Jay Summet via EV]

Phew! That's a full days work! At least that cart put it up at a nice 
working height so you didn't have to stoop over all day


Jay

On 05/29/2016 03:18 AM, Cor van de Water via EV wrote:

Today I bought a 2011 Leaf battery pack and completely dis-assembled it,
to take it home in my Prius,
the shell was too wide to fit in the car.
Also I was by myself and had no help lifting, each module is over 8 lbs
and there are 48 in a pack
so about 400 lbs in cells alone, besides the compression plates,
contactors, service disconnect,
bus bars and hundreds of bolts. And of course the steel shell halves.
So, I disassembled the pack in the parking lot of the recycler and took
several pics of the process.
You can enjoy them here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/33178064@N05/

___
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Re: [EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[brucedp5 via EV]

Thank you for sharing. I found it interesting to see the inside cells of he
pack, and the empty shell case.

How much do you think the empty case weighs, and what percentage of the
total pack weight would that be?

It looks like the case is heavy, and converters have an advantage over the
automakers in that converters can save on that case weight, and install the
li-ion cells without it.

If possible please consider grouping those images, and titling them. I am
thinking that effort will be found by the search engines and potential
converters around the world can see, learn, and improve on what you have
done.




For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: 
http://evdl.org/evln/


{brucedp.150m.com}

--
View this message in context: 
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/2011-Leaf-pack-disassembly-tp4682241p4682248.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at 
Nabble.com.
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[EVDL] 2011 Leaf pack disassembly

[Cor van de Water via EV]

Today I bought a 2011 Leaf battery pack and completely dis-assembled it,
to take it home in my Prius,
the shell was too wide to fit in the car.
Also I was by myself and had no help lifting, each module is over 8 lbs
and there are 48 in a pack
so about 400 lbs in cells alone, besides the compression plates,
contactors, service disconnect,
bus bars and hundreds of bolts. And of course the steel shell halves.
So, I disassembled the pack in the parking lot of the recycler and took
several pics of the process.
You can enjoy them here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/33178064@N05/

Cor van de Water 
Chief Scientist 
Proxim Wireless 
  
office +1 408 383 7626Skype: cor_van_de_water 
XoIP   +31 87 784 1130private: cvandewater.info 

http://www.proxim.com

This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and
proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation.  If you received
this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender.  Any
unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of
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