EV Digest 2441
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Greetings
by Gordon Niessen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Excess Solutions website
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: Other Rices' on List, from the Colonies
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: OT "What would Jesus Drive"
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Hybrid availability? was: Other Rices'
by Edward Ang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Greetings
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Greetings/ac controller
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Greetings/ac controller
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Help With Repairing Traction Motor
by "Michael A. Radtke" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Mitchell Oates
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Greetings/ac controller - another option
by "Rod Hower" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: My First 10000 miles in an EV (long)
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Greetings/ac controller
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: L6-30 or 50 receptacle
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Minivans (was: Other Rices' on List, from the Colonies)
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Blue Meanie, & Portland Cops!
by Michael Hoskinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) 250v 30 amp Twist connector almost DUH.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Car stereo current draw on Aux.
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Car stereo current draw on Aux.
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Not fully decided yet. Leaning toward an Etek, at 48 Volts.
At 03:17 PM 11/25/2002, Chad Peddy wrote:
Welcome;
What type of motor are you using?
Chad
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gordon Niessen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:15 PM
Subject: Greetings
> Hi All,
>
> Just wanted to say hello. I just joined the list and look forward to
> sharing my project. I live in Katy, TX (West Houston) and am converting a
> Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle to an EV. I will setup a web-site and post
> initial photos when they get developed (maybe by Thursday).
>
> Gordon
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Correction 250v 30 amp Twist. They also had four position 250v with a
center connector which to me would make it 5 connections. They also had an
assortment of 15,20 & other 30amp connectors.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 10:53 AM
Subject: Excess Solutions website
> http://www.excess-solutions.com/
>
> This is my favorite used and surplus electronic and electrical store. I
> just bought a ton of Molex connectors. They have a bunch of the 3
position
> midsize. Lots of the 4 connector one size smaller. Didn't see the pins
> for it but they have a lot of male and female pins. 10 cents per
connector.
> This is also where the 125v male twists are. I'm going down today to get
> them unless I have a problem. Lawrence Rhodes....
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Might I recommend the Colt Vista wagon and its later offshoots. They are
small and have 7 seats. My Sable station holds 8. Gets almost 30 mpg. It
might be a candidate for the electric treatment but it already weighs 3
thousand pounds. Lawrence Rhodes..
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 12:48 PM
Subject: OT: RE: Other Rices' on List, from the Colonies
> James Rice wrote:
>
> > - and someone really needs to explain to me why a parent who
> > has two children, needs a 7 seater MPV!
>
> As one who owns a small 5 passenger wagon, and whose family grew to two
> children this past week, allow me to attempt an explanation:
>
> two parents + two car seats = 4 seats consumed (minimum; 2 car seats can
> actually consume enough space to render the third seat on a bench
> useless).
>
> This means that when I have company (such as the children's
> grandparents), I can take only one passenger in addition to my family;
> not particularly convenient. Unfortunately, every recent station wagon
> I have seen has a pair of bucket seats in the front rather than a bench,
> reducing them to 5-passenger vehicles at best. It is possible that
> there is still a Volvo wagon with the rear-facing jump seat, but cost
> becomes prohibitive.
>
> Something like a Crown Vic might still accomodate the requisite 6
> passengers, however, my Lab-Husky cross wouldn't appreciate riding in
> the trunk, now would my passengers appreciate her 70+ lbs on their laps.
>
> Unfortunately, 7-passenger minivans seem to be the only option these
> days... I just hope I am able to hold out until Toyota makes its hybrid
> Estima minivan available in Canada.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was up Saturday night formatting the Evercell data for your website until
1 am Sunday morning.
I would not call that "just getting out of chruch."
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: OT "What would Jesus Drive"
> Joe Smalley wrote:
> >
> > Comments inserted...
>
> > I think he has something like a Star Trek transporter for getting
around. He
> > would not drive.
> >
>
>
> I think it's clear who just got out of Chruch????
>
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The RAV4 is an EV not a hybrid.
--- Chad Peddy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The Toyota is a RAV-4 not a CRV. Saw one in San
> Jose today.
>
> my model error
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Matthew Muelver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:58 PM
> Subject: Re: Hybrid availability? was: Other Rices'
>
>
> > On Monday, November 25, 2002, at 03:22 PM, Chad
> Peddy wrote:
> > > Eric et all
> > > Toyota's CRV hybrid is out.
> > > Chad
> >
> > Chad,
> >
> > What exactly are you talking about? The "CR-V" is
> a Honda product (I
> > own one). From what I've heard, Honda is planning
> to make a hybrid
> > CR-V, but not for a few years yet.
> >
> > I've also heard rumors of a Toyota mini-van/SUV
> type hybrid vehicle,
> > but nothing has been released yet (that I can
> find) on that either.
> > And they've got nothing with a name even close to
> "CRV".
> >
> > So, how about a little more info on what you're
> talking about?
> >
> > Later,
> >
> > Matt
> > --
> > If you're reading this, chances are your either:
> > A. A Honda freak, just like me.
> > '01 M.C. Blue Insight 5 spd. #1898, 57.1 LMPG @
> 24,900 mi.
> > B. A Mac Addict, just like me.
> > Dual-1GHz PowerMac G4, iBook 800MHz 12.1"
> > or
> > C. An EV freak, just like me!
> > :-)
> >
>
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hello Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gordon Niessen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:15 PM
Subject: Greetings
> Hi All,
>
> Just wanted to say hello. I just joined the list and look forward to
> sharing my project.
It just so happens that I am doing a video program of people doing EV
conversions . So far I have not had a motorcycle conversion video'd.
Footage of your conversion would be mixed with other
EV projects into a 2 hour video . If you like you could sell copies of
these tape's
and raise money for your project . Kids will see your
project and realize they can do something new and exciting with that old
motorcycle . Would you conceder sending some video footage of your project
to EVTV ?
> live in Katy, TX (West Houston) and am converting a
> Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle to an EV. I will setup a web-site and post
> initial photos when they get developed (maybe by Thursday).
looking forward to it .
what kind if speed/range ( like ** mphs for ** miles) are you hoping for?
What kind of motor ?
Steve Clunn
1sclunn-at-msn.com
www.grassrootsev.com
> Gordon
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I got this also when I asked about his AC controller which will use a car
alternator for the motor. I to have dreamed of a little bike (100/250cc) to
convert to electric and for $200 for a controller with regen that's perfect
. I think this guy has hit on something as there are lots of car alternators
and people wanting to do EV stuff with bikes and cycles .
----- Original Message -----
From: "tts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:27 PM
Subject: RE: Greetings
> Hello Gordon
>
> I am also working on an EV motorcycle.
> I am not bolting or buying yet,
> Im still am looking for the right combination of equipment.
> The evercells are looking very good.
> 1978 Honda 125 or 250 frame I have both.
> I just got an email you may be intrested in :
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> -------
> The target spec's of the AC controller planned for production are:
> 150A 72V operation without braking, 60v with braking with cost about $200.
> (march 2003)
> Ives Meadors
> Crux Electronics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> --------
>
> An AC motor would be very intresting yes ?
>
>
> Trotman
> Va. Beach
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
> Behalf Of Gordon Niessen
> Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 4:16 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle List
> Subject: Greetings
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> Just wanted to say hello. I just joined the list and look forward to
> sharing my project. I live in Katy, TX (West Houston) and am converting a
> Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle to an EV. I will setup a web-site and post
> initial photos when they get developed (maybe by Thursday).
>
> Gordon
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
So if your selling your optima's then you are getting evercells? It sounds
like your old pack is still in good shape (85% on the week one) .I gess
driveing slower is not a opition for you (I can save 50% by doing this and
would hardly notice 15%). As a bat abuser to my delight I have found that
after I knock 1/2 the life out of them they still keep working and taking
them down to or below 10.5 v dosen't seem to hurt them as much as when there
new. When I get the " it's to bad they can't make a better battery remake"
form people I tell them I'd be OK if the one's I have only put out 1/2 what
them do . My glass is 1/2 full . Of course there is a high "fun" factor in
trying out new stuff .I'll be interested in how you do.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "EV List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:16 PM
Subject: 13 Optima YT's for sale - $1000
> Ok, since these can no longer quite do my commute, my pack is for sale.
> It consists of 13 Optima YT's that will deliver about 5KW before the
> voltage plummets precipitously. A weak one was recently tested as having
> 85% of original AH capacity.
>
> If you really want a 14th battery, I have another, but it probably has 70%
> of original capacity.
> Asking $1000 for the pack.
> Location: Whidbey Island (a bit north of Seattle, WA)
> --
> John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
> http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steve Clunn wrote:
> I got this also when I asked about his AC controller which will use
> a car alternator for the motor. I to have dreamed of a little bike
> (100/250cc) to convert to electric and for $200 for a controller
> with regen that's perfect. I think this guy has hit on something as
> there are lots of car alternators and people wanting to do EV stuff
> with bikes and cycles.
He has his work cut out for him. Car alternators are fairly low
efficiency, and need to run at very high rpm to develop significant
amounts of horsepower. That's are two strikes against using them
effectively as motors.
I would think that the same $200 would go much farther towards a brushed
DC motor, which can use a far simpler controller.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bob,
Well, I'm not shy, so I called Warfield to follow up on my email. They
had already been researching the motor. They seemed quite interested in
doing business and I am awaiting a call back from them.
I also tried a bunch of local shops. Some said that they don't work on
anything so big, others said that they don't work on anything so small.
However, I finally found one that seemed to want my business. They too
are off researching.
I'll post again when I hear something.
Thanks for your advice.
Mike
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I would like to say how much I enjoy hearing about everyone's
project/experiences but don't comment on all of them (just read them and
enjoy them) . They have inspired me to try to do better work on my own
projects and given me a outlet to share some of my own experiences (family
and friends are wore out) . When I read something that somebody wrote and
don't see many replies I worry that maybe they think nobody care's and why
bother. I also don't really understand the "band with" problem , so if I'm
out of line please tell me .
Steve Clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:00 PM
Subject: Mitchell Oates
> It's ocurred to me that I haven't seen anthing posted here by
> Mitch for a long time. If you're reading this, Mitch, tell us a
> bit about what's going on with you and your EV and anything
> else you feel like telling us.
>
> Tom Shay
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steve,
I just repaired a control for a friend in Yuma, AZ.
In the process of looking for quick solutions I found the following;
http://members.tripod.com/~divelec/hbridge.html
$100 for a 33A continous, 55A peak 4 quadrant controller (forward/reverse,
regen for both).
This control has many cool features and is conformally coated.
I'm not affiliated with this guy in any way, I just thought it was an
awesome price
for a control that does more than the Curtis 1208.
Rod
www.qsl.net/w8rnh
I got this also when I asked about his AC controller which will use a car
alternator for the motor. I to have dreamed of a little bike (100/250cc)
to
convert to electric and for $200 for a controller with regen that's perfect
. I think this guy has hit on something as there are lots of car
alternators
and people wanting to do EV stuff with bikes and cycles .
----- Original Message -----
From: "tts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 1:27 PM
Subject: RE: Greetings
> Hello Gordon
>
> I am also working on an EV motorcycle.
> I am not bolting or buying yet,
> Im still am looking for the right combination of equipment.
> The evercells are looking very good.
> 1978 Honda 125 or 250 frame I have both.
> I just got an email you may be intrested in :
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> -------
> The target spec's of the AC controller planned for production are:
> 150A 72V operation without braking, 60v with braking with cost about
$200.
> (march 2003)
> Ives Meadors
> Crux Electronics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> --------
>
> An AC motor would be very intresting yes ?
>
>
> Trotman
> Va. Beach
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
> Behalf Of Gordon Niessen
> Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 4:16 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle List
> Subject: Greetings
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> Just wanted to say hello. I just joined the list and look forward to
> sharing my project. I live in Katy, TX (West Houston) and am converting
a
> Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle to an EV. I will setup a web-site and post
> initial photos when they get developed (maybe by Thursday).
>
> Gordon
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Like most others on the list I dream about new battery technology, my next
conversion, and 200 mile per charge cars. But >in reality, I am perfectly
happly with my little eCivic which meets the needs of my commute.
>
sound like your right a home with your EV . I often feel lucky that I get to
drive mine everyday (as you do ) . If somebody said they need to do 80 miles
a day and wanted an EV to do. I'd say It would take more dedication that
most have . good for you your walking the walk .
> I'll post another report when I get to 15,000 miles.
>
great
Steve Clunn
>
> Lynn Adams
> 92 converter Civic VX
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/379.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
John G. Lussmyer wrote:
> Since these can no longer quite do my commute, my pack is for sale.
> It consists of 13 Optima YT's that will deliver about 5KW before the
> voltage plummets precipitously. A weak one was recently tested as
> having 85% of original AH capacity.
It saddens me to hear about all the troubles you've been having with the
Sparrow. However, I'm still an optimist. It sounds like just another 10%
or so range and you would be able to make your commute. Are you sure we
haven't overlooked anything to add that 10%?
I know you added battery heaters. What temperature are the batteries at?
Any chance of boosting their temperature another 10 degrees?
Have you done any further investigations to see where your higher
rolling resistance came from after the last round of repairs?
Range is limited by the weakest battery. Do you have a system for
measuring individual battery voltages, so you can tell which one is the
weakest? Perhaps replacing it will help.
Or, can you add something like my Battery Balancer? By shuffing charge
between batteries, instead of being limited by the weakest battery, you
are limited by the average for the pack as a whole, which is 10-20%
more.
Are you sure there is absolutely no room for more batteries? 10% more
will give you at least 10% more range. For example, the cylindrical
cells of the Optima leaves a roughly 1" squarish by 6" high spaces
between cells. Twelve nicad "C" cells would fit within the Optima's
space outline (three each in the two center holes, plus three each in
the two spaces between batteries). "C" cells deliver up to 2.8 amphours;
156v worth is another 0.5kwh worth (about 10% more capacity). I could
imagine a set of 10 per Optima, with a little DC/DC converter/charger so
the nicads try to stay at the same state of charge as their parent
Optima.
There must be more idea. Sure, many of them are impractical, but there
may be one that works for you!
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
To bad as there sure are a lot of them .
wouldn't make much scence to have twice the bat's to make up for low
efficiency motor .
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 9:54 AM
Subject: Re: Greetings/ac controller
> Steve Clunn wrote:
> > I got this also when I asked about his AC controller which will use
> > a car alternator for the motor. I to have dreamed of a little bike
> > (100/250cc) to convert to electric and for $200 for a controller
> > with regen that's perfect. I think this guy has hit on something as
> > there are lots of car alternators and people wanting to do EV stuff
> > with bikes and cycles.
>
> He has his work cut out for him. Car alternators are fairly low
> efficiency, and need to run at very high rpm to develop significant
> amounts of horsepower. That's are two strikes against using them
> effectively as motors.
>
> I would think that the same $200 would go much farther towards a brushed
> DC motor, which can use a far simpler controller.
> --
> Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
> 814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
> Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
> leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 10:52 AM 11/26/2002 -0800, Lee Hart stated:
It saddens me to hear about all the troubles you've been having with the
Sparrow. However, I'm still an optimist. It sounds like just another 10%
or so range and you would be able to make your commute. Are you sure we
haven't overlooked anything to add that 10%?
As far as I can tell, the new bearings just take a hint more power to turn
than the old, rattle around loosely, completely shot, bearings.
I did also change the brake pads (disc brakes) to new ones that don't
squeek loudly. These may be causing a little more drag as well - though
it's really hard to tell.
I know you added battery heaters. What temperature are the batteries at?
Any chance of boosting their temperature another 10 degrees?
Batteries are being maintained in the mid-60's on cold days. I haven't
found any good way to get more heat out of the heating cable.
Range is limited by the weakest battery. Do you have a system for
measuring individual battery voltages, so you can tell which one is the
weakest? Perhaps replacing it will help.
I do have all batteries brought out to a header to make it easy to check
voltage. I had one weak one, that I replaced with a new (broken in by Joe
Smalley for me - thanks!) one. I now have a different battery suddenly
coming up weak. Replacing the whole pack one-by-one is a loosing proposition.
Or, can you add something like my Battery Balancer? By shuffing charge
between batteries, instead of being limited by the weakest battery, you
are limited by the average for the pack as a whole, which is 10-20%
more.
But I would still be running very near the limit every time, and the pack
wouldn't last long.
Are you sure there is absolutely no room for more batteries? 10% more
will give you at least 10% more range. For example, the cylindrical
There are several awkward, time consuming, and/or kludgy ways of adding
batteries. I don't really want a "rolling science experiment" as someone
else described some EV's.
I've put in reservations for a pack of Evercell MB80's. The Sparrow just
won't be used much/at all until I get them. (And a PFC-20, so I will be
selling my Zivan NG3 as well.)
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 10:52 AM 11/26/2002 -0800, Lee Hart stated:
Are you sure there is absolutely no room for more batteries? 10% more
will give you at least 10% more range. For example, the cylindrical
Heck, I still wonder about building an entire pack from those NiMh C cells
that are on sale.
The major problem would be that NiMh cells don't play nicely in
parallel. Now if someone would come up with a controller that could use N
separate packs, each one limited to about a 20A draw, that would be doable.
Each string would have it's own Power output stage, all controlled by a
single clock/control system.
Would a bunch of 20A FET's be cheaper than a few high power ones?
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 25 Nov 2002 at 21:50, Mike Chancey wrote:
> I feed the two hot
> circuits to the 220 VAC Zivan NG5 charger and one hot and the neutral to my
> home-built "Fair Radio" based 120 volt charger. The other hot feed the 120
> volt interior pre-heater and battery warmers. ...
> The second cord was equipped with a male dryer plug, and only supplied
> power to the Zivan, not the Fair Radio or heaters. (Two hots, no neutral, one
> ground)
>
If the Fair charger and heaters were on opposite legs of the 240v line as
you describe, in this scheme they would have been connected in series across
240 volts. Unless the heaters and charger used exactly the same current at
all times (impossible) something could be damaged -- unless at least one of
these items had its own power switch which you were SURE was always turned
off when using the 240v-only power cord.
This was a pretty risky setup. It could have been made safer by putting all
the 120v loads on one leg of the power line. Or, with some ingenuity, you
could probably have dreamed up a way of using power relays to control which
devices received power.
It's a moot point for you now that you're using an Avcon, but others should
be aware of the dangers in a setup such as this.
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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On 25 Nov 2002 at 21:47, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> Might I recommend the Colt Vista wagon and its later offshoots. They are
> small and have 7 seats.
There are also some similar mini-minivans sold in Asia and probably Europe.
They have lots of room for passengers without the immense bulk and weight of
most "minivans" (ha!) sold in the US. (Am I the only one who thinks that
today's minivans seem ^larger^ than a mid-60s full-size Econoline van?)
Daewoo used to make a pretty nice one; I know someone in Korea who has it
(fueled with LPG, BTW), but unfortunately I don't recall the model name. I
can't find Daewoo Motor's webpage any more either, maybe because they're in
the process of being purchased by GM. In any case, there are others.
Unfortunately, they're not sold in the US, land of everything-too-big. But
if you were really interested, you might be able to import one for your own
EV conversion and personal use.
Hmm, I wonder how practical it would be to direct-import an Estima "hybrid."
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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No disrespect intended, but I think John L. is convinced that the only way
to the range he needs is through advanced batteries. I don't speak for him,
but I've seen others get tired of trying tweaks. It's not unusual to long
for some magic bullet.
Usually, there are many routes to improved range. A few of them are blocked
off in this case because of the built-in limitations in the Sparrow design.
Others are still possible, but may require lots of imagination, time, and
effort. Very few of them are quick and easy.
Nickel-Zinc looks on the surface like a direct route, but I suspect that
there are some unknown bumps in the road. It would probably a good one for
a person with lots of EV experience, with plenty of automotive engineering
and electronics and electrical background. Right now, though, NiZn is far
from a plug-and-play solution. If it were me, I think I'd try a few more
tweaks before jumping into such uncharted territory.
OTOH, John's experience may well serve as a benchmark for others in a
similar situation. It'll be interesting to see how it works out!
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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So John, are you keeping track of how many people you have
influenced to do their own conversions? Speaking as one who has
spent a heap of money (partly) because of you.... It's like Blue
Meanie is some kind of contagious disease, multiplying in the
minds and hearts of its hapless victims. "Save us, save us from
the ICE MELTER!" "Help, I'm mel t i n g..."
Mike Hoskinson
John Wayland wrote:
...
The one officer was interested in EVs to the point where he took my name
and phone number
down, as well as made notes on how to get to the EV Photo Album and
such...seems he's
serious about doing a conversion of his own...cool! As I unplugged and
was about to
leave, they both thanked me for the tour and info, and as they told me
to 'drive
carefully', ...
Still having too much fun with my EV...
See Ya.......John Wayland
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Lee Hart stated:
>> Are you sure there is absolutely no room for more batteries?
John Lussmyer wrote:
> Heck, I still wonder about building an entire pack from those NiMh C
> cells that are on sale.
If I were in your shoes, I'd try really hard to get lead acids to work.
But once I was convinced that they just didn't have the range, then I
think I would go to used/surplus Nicads. They would increase range
perhaps 2:1, without the high cost of new nicads or the risks of a new
unproven battery.
Of course, if you don't mind the risk and want to experiment, the nizn
batteries certainly are interesting!
> The major problem would be that NiMh cells don't play nicely in
> parallel.
That just means you can't blindly slap them in parallel and ignore them,
like you can with lead-acid. It doesn't take much of a battery
management system to keep them out of trouble.
To me, the real problem is the extremely high cost for "EV rated"
(unobtainium) nimh batteries, or short life with "consumer" nimh
batteries.
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
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At 03:11 PM 11/26/2002 -0800, Lee Hart stated:
If I were in your shoes, I'd try really hard to get lead acids to work.
But once I was convinced that they just didn't have the range, then I
think I would go to used/surplus Nicads. They would increase range
perhaps 2:1, without the high cost of new nicads or the risks of a new
unproven battery.
The problem of course is that I have very specific physical constraints on
the battery dimensions. SAFT doesn't make anything that would work. Not
even with individual cells.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
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John Lussmyer wrote:
> The problem of course is that I have very specific physical
> constraints on the battery dimensions. SAFT doesn't make anything
> that would work. Not even with individual cells.
Well, there are lots of nicad sizes. Optimas are about 10"l x 6.8"w x
7.8"h. Let's see... The GE 11AC02 is a flooded nicad 1.2v 12ah (at the 1
hr rate) cell that is 2.4"l x 1.1"w x 6.9"h. This is an inch shorter in
height, and you can fit 24 of them in a 4x6 array of them in the same
footprint as an Optima. 24 of them could be configured in two groups of
12, for a 14.4v 24ah battery (equivalent to 28.8ah at 12v).
The 24 cells would weigh 38 lbs; 87% of the weight of the Optimas. But
Optima capacity at the 1-hour rate is about 40ah, so these nicads are
about 72% less capacity. If you crowd some extras in here and there to
get back to the same weight, you'd have about 33ah (equivalent), which
is 82% of an Optima's rated capacity.
Not an exact hit, but it shows there is some promise for the idea. Try
looking for surplus nicads and see what you can find.
--
LeeA. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
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Well I saw the bottom of the 250v Hubbel male twist for the filler as a spot
for dirt and water intrusion. It's in the wheel well. I taped it up with
black insulation tape. WRONG. I noticed that there isn't a seal around
bottom base and the plug assembly. Might this be for a water path. I
hadn't thought of that, but the little gap all around the plug got me
thinking. The filler bay has water going in everytime it rains or gets
washed. If i tape it up where will the water go? Down the cord of course.
Lawrence Rhodes...How are others handling this?????????? Drip loop???
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I always hook up my car stereos so that both memory
and hi current leads are tied together and constantly
on. That means I can turn on my stereos without the
key.
The ICE Civic I bought to drive while I'm
converting has a serious current draw. The battery
discharges entirely in 3 days.
Seeing as this was the first thing I changed when I
bought the car, I hooked up an ammeter to it, and
found out it's pulling 200+ mA. This seems really
excessive for just the clock and station presets. I
can pull that much on other stereos with the radio
actually ON!
Now the next question is whether that is the
problem in the car, or whether it's something else.
Obviously, now that I've disconnected it, the
experiment will tell.
But the other question is if I have the tiniest make
of 12V battery, what would its 20 hr. rate be, so that
I could actually calculate my discharge rate? I have
the cold cranking amps, but that means nothing.
Appreciatively,
__________________________________________________
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When I disconnect auxiliary 12V battery (before leaving parked ACRX),
I hear slight clicks in both doors. I believe, the safety belts
spools locks get de-energized so the belts are not operational.
This means when 12V is connected, the current flows through some
circuitry there.
I'm speculating on this because there is nothing else electrical
in the doors really, (at least in Hondas CRX) but actually I
didn't verify this. Will do when next opportunity to take
inner siding off will present itself. You may look at this,
may be pulling out fuses while 12V is on and hearing sounds
you can determine where the source of the current draw is.
Victor
Bob Bath wrote:
>
> I always hook up my car stereos so that both memory
> and hi current leads are tied together and constantly
> on. That means I can turn on my stereos without the
> key.
> The ICE Civic I bought to drive while I'm
> converting has a serious current draw. The battery
> discharges entirely in 3 days.
> Seeing as this was the first thing I changed when I
> bought the car, I hooked up an ammeter to it, and
> found out it's pulling 200+ mA. This seems really
> excessive for just the clock and station presets. I
> can pull that much on other stereos with the radio
> actually ON!
> Now the next question is whether that is the
> problem in the car, or whether it's something else.
> Obviously, now that I've disconnected it, the
> experiment will tell.
> But the other question is if I have the tiniest make
> of 12V battery, what would its 20 hr. rate be, so that
> I could actually calculate my discharge rate? I have
> the cold cranking amps, but that means nothing.
> Appreciatively,
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
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