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Today's Topics:
1. Re: New way to power your car (Tommey Reed) (lyle sloan)
2. Soot and Spin: Two Plug-in Paradoxes (Marc Geller)
3. Re: ForkenSwift on YouTube; net build cost (Bruce Weisenberger)
4. Re: ForkenSwift on YouTube; net build cost (Eduardo Kaftanski)
5. Re: syncing an AC and DC motor (Dan Frederiksen)
6. Re: syncing an AC and DC motor (Lee Hart)
7. Re: Electric Powered Boat (Rick Willoughby)
8. Notes from Manzanita (Rich Rudman)
9. Re: Electric Powered Boat (Rick Willoughby)
10. Re: Notes from Manzanita (David Roden (Akron OH USA))
11. Re: Electric Powered Boat (jerryd)
12. Re: choosing a vehicle question (David Dymaxion)
13. 1990 Rabbit convertible Glider in Bay area on Craigslist $395
(Bill & Nancy)
14. Re: Affordable AC Motor? (ampaynz1)
15. Re: syncing an AC and DC motor (Dan Frederiksen)
16. Re: Notes from Manzanita (Ryan Stotts)
17. The truth is i drop out of high school in 9th grade. (Tommey
Reed) ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
18. Oxygen & Valance team up in 2005. What happened?
(Lawrence Rhodes)
19. Re: Affordable AC Motor? (Zeke Yewdall)
20. S10ev problem ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
21. Re: Affordable AC Motor? (Jack Murray)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 12:29:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: lyle sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] New way to power your car (Tommey Reed)
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
check out http://www.greenenergytv.com/watchnow.html
on the aircar particularly the wankel style compressor
in the second part of the segment. In industrial
applications it is growing appeal whethetr wasteful or
not because air outlets are available throughout most
factories from one central electric compressor or many
small ones. I think that is all I will contribute to
this way offtopic thread.
--- Danny Miller wrote:
> Well Ford is supposed to make a "hydraulic hybrid"
> F150 which is
> actually compressed air storage. It doesn't
> compress the air with a
> compressor though, it has a highly pressurized tank
> which never gains or
> loses air. Instead they add hydraulic fluid and
> take it out (under
> thousands of PSI) to a hydraulic motor and to a low
> pressure reservoir.
>
> It is limited by the volume of hydraulic fluid
> capacity in both the tank
> and catch reservoir. Like most hybrids, the point
> is not primary
> storage but to allow a high efficiency engine with
> poor impulse or poor
> low-end power to be driveable.
>
> Danny
>
> Peter VanDerWal wrote:
>
> >I can't tell, are you joking or serious?
> >
> >If you're joking....good one!!
> >
> >If you're serious, have you bothered to check into
> how incredibly
> >inefficient it is to compress air?
> >
> >Adding the system you describe would indeed make a
> drastic change in an
> >EV. It would probably cut it's range in 1/2, if
> not more.
> >
> >Personallym I can think of dozens of cheaper and
> much simpler ways to
> >reduce an EV's range.
> >
> >
> >
> >>One thing is clear you can't use a ac/dc motor to
> run your car for a long
> >>time, because many factor are add to the power
> output on your batteries
> >>system.
> >>What can be done is design a air car with a ac/dc
> compressor on board for
> >>charging, this will change the electric car
> completely!
> >>Using my patent design engine that can runs on air
> would be one great goal
> >>for the electric car
> >>This new design will help the EV world, by having
> a system in place in a
> >>control loop like a air conditioner unit.
> >>With a high and low pressure that will store
> energy from the ac compressor
> >>to the tank and control the pressure going in to
> the Rotary engine, this
> >>would force the piston 350 degree to the exhaust
> port where the vacuum low
> >>side pulls it out for next firing cycle.
> >>This would have a high side of 400 psi and a low
> side, like a basic ac
> >>cooling system.
> >>If you have a 13" rotary motor that has a 1x1 inch
> piston at 400 psi? and
> >>a 1" crank and at?3600 rpms.
> >>1x(13/2)-1 x 400/12=200 foot pounds of torque at
> TDC
> >>at 3600 rpms = (200x3600)/5252= 137.09 hp
> >>
> >>The ac/dc motor is turning the compressor untill
> charging is done, at?high
> >>psi the?system?will turn off and at? low psi it
> runs at full power to
> >>recharge.
> >>This will always have the same output of power
> load,?there is no different
> >>of how you drive, if?it is up hill or down.
> >>Down hill could be use for a Jake Brake system for
> recharging air tank,
> >>when the brake is?on the drive shaft is turning
> the compressor for
> >>recharge.
> >>This system could really be how to use the ev to
> run your next car.
> >>The rotary compressor is great for this job,
> running from a?ac/dc motor
> >>will be like having a compressor at home.
> >>When? air tool?is use the compressor kicks in to
> recharge?your tank and
> >>then shut down.
> >>This is a better way to run your next
> EV................
> >>Tom
> >>
> >>
> >>?
>
>>________________________________________________________________________
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> storage and
> >>industry-leading spam and email virus protection.
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 12:36:55 -0700
From: Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Soot and Spin: Two Plug-in Paradoxes
To: RAV4 list - rav4ev - condensed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, EV
Discussion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, PIA Listserve
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
Soot and Spin: Two Plug-in Paradoxes
http://www.plugsandcars.blogspot.com
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 13:07:58 -0700
From: "Bruce Weisenberger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] ForkenSwift on YouTube; net build cost
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Thanks for the Ride. Nicely done.
On 10/27/07, Darin at- forkenswift.com <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> For those following this project, a new YouTube video is up to mark the
> car's
> transition to legal EV status:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQWXyxSTyU
>
> The vid has small amount of fun at GM's expense (which Impact/EV1 fans may
> recognize), and then shows the car in action.
>
> FYI: some beer budget accounting:
>
> $672 - the net build cost, excluding taxes, registration & insurance
> (which
> total nearly the same amount again!). I included inspection fees in the
> build cost however.
>
> $1811 - this was the total cash outlay.
>
> $1139 - money recovered through: selling ICE parts (nothing was wasted -
> we
> actually made a little profit over the cost of the 2 donor cars!); scrap
> refunds (a few batteries; also the stripped forklift chassis netted a
> healthy $364 from the recycler - and that included them picking it up);
> and
> the sale of the forklift's traction motor.
>
> Of course this doesn't include the donated stuff (e.g. used batteries), or
> the year and a half of tinker time.
>
> $2500 - $3000 - is roughly what I figure it would cost someone to
> replicate
> this vehicle with new batteries, minus the blind luck scoring cheap parts
> &
> the generosity we encountered along the way. That includes the donor
> vehicle.
>
> It goes without saying that the car isn't finished yet. Still lots of
> detail work yet left to do, plus watching eBay for a 48-72v controller,
> etc...
>
> cheers-
> Darin
>
> http://forkenswift.com
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1146
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/ForkenSwift-on-YouTube--net-build-cost-tf4703333s25542.html#a13443873
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 17:19:52 -0300
From: Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] ForkenSwift on YouTube; net build cost
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Sat, Oct 27, 2007 at 07:51:12AM -0700, Darin at- forkenswift.com wrote:
>
> It goes without saying that the car isn't finished yet. Still lots of
> detail work yet left to do, plus watching eBay for a 48-72v controller,
> etc...
>
still... its very nice and works!
--
Eduardo K. | "The Stone Age did not end for a lack of stones,
http://www.carfun.cl | and the oil age will end not for a lack of oil."
http://ev.nn.cl | Sheik Yamani, Saudi oil minister, 1973
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 21:55:24 +0200
From: Dan Frederiksen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] syncing an AC and DC motor
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
you have looked into all of them?
the tesla roadster motor is also "built very lightly with poor cooling"
isn't it?
Dan
Lee Hart wrote:
> Dan Frederiksen wrote:
>
>> as I mentioned before I think it's worth looking into getting the motors
>> used in all the current hybrids. I think there is something like 5 SUV
>> hybrid models in USA right now which should have fairly powerful AC
>> motors that can't cost 15000$.
>>
>
> The existing hybrids have PM AC (a.k.a. brushless DC) motors of around
> 40 KW peak power capability. However, they are built very lightly with
> poor cooling, for very low duty cycle operation. They could be use, but
> you'd need to substantially improve their cooling systems.
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 16:56:53 -0500 (GMT-05:00)
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] syncing an AC and DC motor
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Lee Hart wrote:
>> The existing hybrids have PM AC (a.k.a. brushless DC) motors of around
>> 40 KW peak power capability. However, they are built very lightly with
>> poor cooling, for very low duty cycle operation. They could be use, but
>> you'd need to substantially improve their cooling systems.
From: Dan Frederiksen
> you have looked into all of them?
No; but I have the motors out of a Toyota Prius in my garage right now.
Compared to continuous-duty EV motors, they have comparatively small sized wire
in the windings, and relatively little cooling.
In comparison, the GM EV1 motor is twice the size of both Prius motors put
together, and has many times more cooling capacity.
> the tesla roadster motor is also "built very lightly with poor
> cooling" isn't it?
I don't know what kind of cooling they have for their motor.
--
"Excellence does not require perfection." -- Henry James
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart-at-earthlink.net
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 15:24:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rick Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Jerry
Your information is useful and supports some of my thoughts. I am thinking
that 4-quadrant drives would be useful on both props. This then gives me
backup propulsion with the air prop should I need it. I have been looking at
the Sevcon unit as well. If the air prop was large enough I could actually
sail faster than the wind downwind but it needs to be over 3m diameter for
this.
The stability is interesting because I much prefer the motion of a ballasted
monohull to a catamaran. The cat has to follow the surface so in beam seas
it rolls sharply. A ballasted monohull will bob more than roll. I intend
to have around 250kg of battaries sitting on the keel. The KMT for the hull
is .85m so it has a powerful righting moment. I have not looked at how the
air prop will behave with wind on the beam. It will contribute some healing
force depending on the rate of charge. It should dampen roll substantially
due to need to accelerate and decelerate with velocity change. There is
also a significant gyroscopic effect.
The monohull is optimised for 10kts with my target stability. I used
Michlet/Godzilla to generate the hull and it has proven accurate for smaller
boats. The speed for power are based on props I can make and available
motors. They are for calm conditions though. You are correct about the
props. I have not designed the prop yet but I expect the optimum water prop
will end up around 0.6m diameter with about a 50mm chord. I have not yet
made a reliable air prop/turbine so this is an area to work on.
Your comment on taxes is interesting. I am aware of the marina fees and
this might present an issue when I want to make a brief stop in a populated
harbour. However the target weight is 1 tonne and it will be broken down
for transport and storage. It ends up 7.4m long and 2.5m wide for
trailering.
I have included an image of a revised design that allows 6 panels and an
image showing arrangement of hull parts on a trailer. The wind turbine and
drive leg will be stored in the central hull for transport.
Rick W.
http://www.nabble.com/file/p13448061/1t_V2.jpg
http://www.nabble.com/file/p13448061/1t_Trailer.jpg
jerryd wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Rick and All,
>
> ----- Original Message Follows -----
> From: Rick Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
> subject: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
>
>
>
> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 16:36:56 -0700 (PDT)
>
>>I am seeking advice and experience on equipping an electric
>>boat. I have attached an image.
>>http://www.nabble.com/file/p13418241/1t_Solar.jpg
>
> Interesting boat design you have. Your EV numbers
> also are in the ballpark. The reservations I have are more
> seakeeping, tax problems than with the charging or EV drive.
> As a a boat designer, builder of all types I'd
> suggest you go to a Cat as your present version will
> probably roll very badly in any seaway whether underway or
> anchored.
> As for taxes most boats are taxed by length, both
> by governments and by marinas, boatyards, ect. 26' or it's
> equivilent in meters is a good place to be just under though
> everything you want can be done in 20'. Other choices are
> trimarrans or an outrigger.
>
>>
>>The preliminary specification - Length is 14.7m, overall
>>beam is 1.6m, WL beam 1.14m and displacement 1t.
>
> Rather narrow at that waterline at that length. Over
> 10=1 beam to length ratio the surface friction goes up too
> much vs wave making drag causing higher power level demands.
> A 14.7m boat would need at least a 1.5m waterline beam, WLB
> for lowest drag.
>>
>>It has a 1.2kW wind turbine and 5 X 200W solar panels.
>>There is 9600Wh of battery storage,
>
> These are peak readings though you have a lot of
> wind down there. be lucky if you get 1/2 that.
> Or course the best wind energy generator is a sail
> so one should have at least a small rig which in heavier
> winds could charge your batts from boat speed through your e
> motor set in regen.
>
>>
>>I am planning on a 48V system that will give peak output of
>>4.74kW. This will give maximum speed of 12.4kts.
>
> Probably a little higher power needed than that.
>
>
> Daytime
>>cruising using storage, wind and solar should be at 10kts
>>requiring 2.3kW. Overnight cruising using wind and solar
>>for running and charging through the day and batteries at
>>night requires 1.15kW to do 8kts.
>
> These rates probably need to be doubled due to skin
> friction which is your dominate drag.
> Also go for as large and slow prop as you can, about
> 3-.4 meter dia if possible for prop eff.
>
>
>>
>>There is enough accommodation for two people overnight and
>>will be roomy enough for four during day cruises.
>>
>>It seems a practical concept. Will take about AUD25k to
>>build it. The hull is in three pieces so this will make it
>>easy to transport and reduces the area needed to build it
>>in.
>>
>>I am seeking advice on solar panels, wind turbine,
>>batteries, motor and controls. I would like to locate
>>suppliers of good equipment and gain from others'
>>experience on combining these energy systems for an
>>electric vehicle.
>
> Those are going to be local most likely. A good PM
> motor if you can find one that high power along with a
> Sevcon PM 4 quad controller will give you forward, reverse
> along with charging under sail or anchored in a river or
> tidal stream.
> I'd go for more sail, windgen than solar as solar is
> very expensive, only available 5 peak hrs/day at best vs
> sails, windgen which will give you many times more range,
> power at less cost.
> So at least shorten it or better, switch to a
> multihull to get better performance, safety and comfort at
> less cost.
> Good luck,
> Jerry Dycus
>
>
>
>>Rick Willoughby
>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>--
>>View this message in context:
>>http://www.nabble.com/Electric-Powered-Boat-tf4694300s25542.html#a13418241
>>Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
>>archive at Nabble.com.
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>For subscription options, see
>>http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
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>
>
--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/Electric-Powered-Boat-tf4695205s25542.html#a13448061
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------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 13:14:41 -0700
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Notes from Manzanita
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
We have it down to about 4 hours.
We did a King County install about the 15th of September and we just
finsished up the City of Tacoma machine this week.
So two more Plug in Hybrids are out there.
Every time we do a install it gets easier and faster, So.. I can support
customers better and there is less hand buildt magic to come up with.
There are 7 Kits out there at the moment. I have kit 4 in my drive way.
Charging at the moment.
I have 60 Thunder Sky 40 amp hour cells slated to go into it in less than 4
weeks. Right now it's using 24 Power Sonic 18 amphour PbLa AGMs. With a full
set of Mark 3 Digi Regs programmed by Jake Oshins.. read more features...
more goodies.
The TS cell have passed 900 cycles..and still make 29.5 to 30.5 amp hours.
We only want 28.... The data shows they are gaining right now... Er..this
shows that I turned the shop heat on.
At the moment .. the TS cells have delivered 8 times the cycle life the lead
did. The lead never made spec amphours under a 40 amp load. 12 amphours was
the best result when new.
Aproaching 1000 cycles and the TS are handing me more watts per cycle that
the lead did new.
The Lion Tamer level 4 are in PCB layout... aka on the PC under my left
hand... These will tame a single Li cell, Protects a over voltage, and under
voltage, and passes 5 amps durning a over voltage event.
They work stand alone and work with all our PFC chargers. We have ONE
living up to our Brag list at the moment. I am doing 12 this week, Then I
will see how many 1000s the world needs and wants after that. I am trying
to hold them to thru hole assembly rules... And $40 each.
And 3800 E-mails .. have kept me off this list for a couple of weeks.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro LLC.
Yup did that too this month.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Mohlere" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EVDL" <EV@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 7:51 PM
Subject: [EVDL] manzanita micro kits for toyota prius
> Has anyone installed subject kit? Would like to receive feedback on
> difficulty of installation (or ease, preferably!) and real world
> performance.
>
> --
> Michael Mohlere
> My EV: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/296.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 17:04:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rick Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Roy
I am basing my current design on an Etek motor. My intention is to mount
the motor with the shaft vertical down to a Mitrpak (or similar) right angle
drive mounted underwater and swinging a large diameter, high aspect prop. I
have used smaller gearboxes operating under water on my pedal boats like
this:
http://www.nabble.com/file/p13448744/Outboard_Leg.jpg
Rick W.
Roy LeMeur wrote:
>
>
> Take a good look at the offerings from ASMO Marine and the various
> installations. This stuff can easily be homebuilt with a Lynch/Lemco/Etek
> type motor. Or series-wound-
> http://www.asmomarine.com
> _________________________________________________________________
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> by today.
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View this message in context:
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------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:40:35 -0400
From: "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Notes from Manzanita
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
On 27 Oct 2007 at 13:14, Rich Rudman wrote:
> Aproaching 1000 cycles and the TS are handing me more watts per cycle that
> the lead did new.
Do you really mean "watts per cycle"? Are you suggesting that the batteries
can produce more peak power with every cycle? Or do you mean Watt-HOURS
per cycle - that is, more ENERGY with every cycle?
David Roden
EVDL Administrator
http://www.evdl.org/
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 20:25:16 -0500
From: "jerryd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi Rick and All,
----- Original Message Follows -----
From: Rick Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 15:24:53 -0700 (PDT)
>Jerry
>Your information is useful and supports some of my
>thoughts. I am thinking that 4-quadrant drives would be
>useful on both props. This then gives me backup propulsion
>with the air prop should I need it.
I think you'll have a problem with the air drive as
a windgen unless you can reverse the blades as they are the
opposite curve for driving and being driven. You can get by
underwater because water is so thick but in the air you must
use finesse so need both a rotor and a prop.
I have been looking at
>the Sevcon unit as well. If the air prop was large enough I
>could actually sail faster than the wind downwind but it
>needs to be over 3m diameter for this.
You my have problems with that as you blades would
probably stall out.
>
>The stability is interesting because I much prefer the
>motion of a ballasted monohull to a catamaran.
You are the first 1 I've met!! Once a woman gets on a
cat they never want to go back.
I also don't think you understand just how you boat
will behave under many conditions. In anything but calm
conditions, you will be rocking side to side quite a bit
making it uncomfortable and even throwing one out of the
cockpit which is much to high on too narrow a hull. You and
your crew need to be very low in this kind of boat.
The cat has
>to follow the surface so in beam seas it rolls sharply.
True there are a few sea states which are rough but
only if you stay abeam the rare short period steep wave
which by physics could only be when a strong wind was
against a current. But turning only 10-15deg off the sea,
the cat would be very comfortable. Having anchored in open
coasts in both cats, monos, went through hurricanes and
other more nasty weather I'll say flat out a well designed
cat is much more comfortable, safe than any monohull can be
while being more eff, roomy.
Now let's take your very narrow moderately ballasted
but with a lot of top hamper and high crew weight. In the
same seas as above you would roll 30deg one way then the
other slamming you around rather badly and would have to
turn 30-40 deg off the waves and still you'd be rolling
uncomfortably.
A flatter, wider hull of about 10-1 B-L ratio and
carrying the width aft to a transom with maybe a box keel
for the batteries with the crew sitting low would be a much
more comfortable, safe way if you don't want to go cat.
Also if say a 30 mph or more gust were to hit it
sideways, it would lay down on it's side and stay there
until it stopped. It won't roll over but it will be on it's
side too much.
A
>ballasted monohull will bob more than roll.
Bob and roll a lot!! Been there, done that, no
thanks!!
I intend to
>have around 250kg of battaries sitting on the keel. The
>KMT for the hull is .85m so it has a powerful righting
I agree but what's your righting moment at 5deg?,
15deg? What happens to the righting moment when you sit in
the cockpit, cabin? On one side?
>moment. I have not looked at how the air prop will behave
>with wind on the beam.
Not well. Better would be hook the air rotor directly
to the water prop and it should work well even going
directly to windward. It's been done in new Zealand and
worked well.
It will contribute some healing
>force depending on the rate of charge. It should dampen
>roll substantially due to need to accelerate and decelerate
>with velocity change. There is also a significant
>gyroscopic effect.
Depends on size. At about 746 watts, you'll probably
lean 20deg+. figure the force x's height x righting moment.
How much do you heel?
>
>The monohull is optimised for 10kts with my target
>stability. I used Michlet/Godzilla to generate the hull
>and it has proven accurate for smaller boats. The speed
>for power are based on props I can make and available
>motors. They are for calm conditions though. You are
>correct about the props. I have not designed the prop yet
>but I expect the optimum water prop will end up around 0.6m
>diameter with about a 50mm chord.
I'd go less dia, aspect ratio and put in some
leading edge curve to repel weeds, plastic, ect. It's not
aspect ratio as much as power loading underwater. You want
to keep your tip speeds down underwater. Also the low ratio
won't stall into a load like a wave like the thinner one
might.
I have not yet made a
>reliable air prop/turbine so this is an area to work on.
Unless you can reverse the prop into a rotor, it's
not going to work for both. You need opposite foil shapes.
>
>Your comment on taxes is interesting. I am aware of the
>marina fees and this might present an issue when I want to
>make a brief stop in a populated harbour. However the
>target weight is 1 tonne and it will be broken down for
>transport and storage. It ends up 7.4m long and 2.5m wide
>for trailering.
Since the center will work on it's own just register
that length.
Jerry Dycus
>
>I have included an image of a revised design that allows 6
>panels and an image showing arrangement of hull parts on a
>trailer. The wind turbine and drive leg will be stored in
>the central hull for transport. Rick W.
>http://www.nabble.com/file/p13448061/1t_V2.jpg
>http://www.nabble.com/file/p13448061/1t_Trailer.jpg
>
>
>jerryd wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Rick and All,
>>
>> ----- Original Message Follows -----
>> From: Rick Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
>> subject: [EVDL] Electric Powered Boat
>>
>>
>>
>> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 16:36:56 -0700 (PDT)
>>
>>>I am seeking advice and experience on equipping an
>>>electric boat. I have attached an image.
>>>http://www.nabble.com/file/p13418241/1t_Solar.jpg
>>
>> Interesting boat design you have. Your EV numbers
>> also are in the ballpark. The reservations I have are
>> more seakeeping, tax problems than with the charging or
>> EV drive. As a a boat designer, builder of all
>> types I'd suggest you go to a Cat as your present version
>> will probably roll very badly in any seaway whether
>> underway or anchored.
>> As for taxes most boats are taxed by length,
>> both by governments and by marinas, boatyards, ect. 26'
>> or it's equivilent in meters is a good place to be just
>> under though everything you want can be done in 20'.
>> Other choices are trimarrans or an outrigger.
>>
>>>
>>>The preliminary specification - Length is 14.7m, overall
>>>beam is 1.6m, WL beam 1.14m and displacement 1t.
>>
>> Rather narrow at that waterline at that length. Over
>> 10=1 beam to length ratio the surface friction goes up
>> too much vs wave making drag causing higher power level
>> demands. A 14.7m boat would need at least a 1.5m
>> waterline beam, WLB for lowest drag.
>>>
>>>It has a 1.2kW wind turbine and 5 X 200W solar panels.
>>>There is 9600Wh of battery storage,
>>
>> These are peak readings though you have a lot of
>> wind down there. be lucky if you get 1/2 that.
>> Or course the best wind energy generator is a
>> sail so one should have at least a small rig which in
>> heavier winds could charge your batts from boat speed
>> through your e motor set in regen.
>>
>>>
>>>I am planning on a 48V system that will give peak output
>>>of 4.74kW. This will give maximum speed of 12.4kts.
>>
>> Probably a little higher power needed than that.
>>
>>
>> Daytime
>>>cruising using storage, wind and solar should be at 10kts
>>>requiring 2.3kW. Overnight cruising using wind and
>>>solar for running and charging through the day and
>>>batteries at night requires 1.15kW to do 8kts.
>>
>> These rates probably need to be doubled due to
>> skin friction which is your dominate drag.
>> Also go for as large and slow prop as you can,
>> about 3-.4 meter dia if possible for prop eff.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>There is enough accommodation for two people overnight
>>>and will be roomy enough for four during day cruises.
>>>
>>>It seems a practical concept. Will take about AUD25k to
>>>build it. The hull is in three pieces so this will make
>>>it easy to transport and reduces the area needed to build
>>>it in.
>>>
>>>I am seeking advice on solar panels, wind turbine,
>>>batteries, motor and controls. I would like to locate
>>>suppliers of good equipment and gain from others'
>>>experience on combining these energy systems for an
>>>electric vehicle.
>>
>> Those are going to be local most likely. A good
>> PM motor if you can find one that high power along with a
>> Sevcon PM 4 quad controller will give you forward,
>> reverse along with charging under sail or anchored in a
>> river or tidal stream.
>> I'd go for more sail, windgen than solar as solar
>> is very expensive, only available 5 peak hrs/day at best
>> vs sails, windgen which will give you many times more
>> range, power at less cost.
>> So at least shorten it or better, switch to a
>> multihull to get better performance, safety and comfort
>> at less cost.
>> Good luck,
>> Jerry Dycus
>>
>>
>>
>>>Rick Willoughby
>>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>--
>>>View this message in context:
>>>http://www.nabble.com/Electric-Powered-Boat-tf4694300s255
>>>42.html#a13418241 Sent from the Electric Vehicle
>>>Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>For subscription options, see
>>>http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>>
>
>--
>View this message in context:
>http://www.nabble.com/Electric-Powered-Boat-tf4695205s25542.html#a13448061
>Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
>archive at Nabble.com.
>
>_______________________________________________
>For subscription options, see
>http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 21:45:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] choosing a vehicle question
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Neat what he did! You could get most (maybe even all) of the same benefit by
chopping the top.
----- Original Message ----
From: ampaynz1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 5:59:25 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] choosing a vehicle question
... You probably think I am making fun and well yeah I am little, but check
out http://www.1989geometro.com/pictures.html and then you will see what is
possible. I'm sure you could modify this to your needs.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:01:39 -0700
From: Bill & Nancy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] 1990 Rabbit convertible Glider in Bay area on
Craigslist $395
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/461403052.html
Bill
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:30:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: ampaynz1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable AC Motor?
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Well here is a 200 amp brushless cotroller that will run your alternator.
You'll need a conversion manual to convert it first and run wire leads to
controller get rid of diodes. I have a brushless PMA neodymium alternator
that I would love to convert someday and bet it would be close to an
brushless ETEK in power. What would be idea is a 72V controller at 200amps.
I guess by using two controllers and two motors it should work.
Millipak PMAC
36-48 Volt 200 Amp AC controller with regen for Brushless Etek
$480
http://www.electricmotorsport.com/PARTS/parts.htm
I wish the link below was free as I'd like to know how for free.
http://www.alternatorconversions.com/
Jack Murray wrote:
>
> So it seems nothing has changed over the last two
> years, still no affordable powerful AC motors out
> there or controllers, at least the EVDL list knows
> about. A go-cart motor is cool, but isn't much help
> for a full-size car.
> Jack
>
> --- Travis Gintz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> Yeah, they're great guys. They're developing some
>> interesting stuff
>> there right now... I'm actually in the beginning
>> stages of converting
>> my VFR700F to AC with their help. Man Ives is one
>> smart guy, and Dave
>> is once of the nicest guys... They're gonna do well.
>>
>> On 10/24/07, Arak Leatham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > the Crux electronics/Synkromotive conversion noted
>> earlier costs $60 to convert at Crux, but they will
>> give you the directions for the conversion for free.
>> >
>> > Since the diodes are discarded (I believe) you can
>> easilly use otherwise dead alternators from junk
>> parts etc.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Arak Leatham - Web and Desktop Systems Developer
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Estimating, Point of Sale, Tracking, Reporting
>> Applications> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:53:50 +0200>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
>> ev@lists.sjsu.edu> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable AC
>> Motor?> > not sure if you can use it but the B&S
>> Etek brushless DC motor is small > yet potent for
>> its size and while one is probably too little for a
>> car, > 2 might do ok.> they cost something like 600$
>> and weigh 9kg (20lbs)> > Dan> > Jack Murray skrev:>
>> > I'm back in the hunt for an affordable powerful AC
>> motor. Doesn't look > > like anything has changed in
>> the last year or two.> > I looked at the AC55 once
>> again, at 300lbs it could or should put out > > big
>> power, but their specs are only 310vdc, 56KW peak,>
>> > the AC24 is too weak, not cheap either.> > The
>> Tesla boasts a 70lb motor that outputs 175KW ? > >
>> UQM's motors don't get near that with their biggest
>> motor, which looks > > great, but is unaffordable
>> anyway.> > What AC motors are they using in the
>> newer forklifts? Available?> > What about using AC
>> generators as motors? There are some 10KW
>> available.> >> > Has anyone tried or looked into
>> building a perm mag AC motor? > >> > Jack> >> >
>> _______________________________________________> >
>> For subscription options, see> >
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev> >> > > >
>> _______________________________________________> For
>> subscription options, see>
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>> >
>>
> _________________________________________________________________
>> > Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook
>> ? together at last. Get it now.
>> >
>>
> http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971033
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > For subscription options, see
>> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Travis Gintz
>> 1986 Honda VFR AC conversion
>> Http://blog.evfr.net/
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/Affordable-AC-Motor--tf4681416s25542.html#a13450175
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.
------------------------------
Message: 15
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 06:55:02 +0100
From: Dan Frederiksen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] syncing an AC and DC motor
To: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Electric Vehicle Discussion
List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Lee Hart wrote:
> No; but I have the motors out of a Toyota Prius in my garage right now.
> Compared to continuous-duty EV motors, they have comparatively small sized
> wire in the windings, and relatively little cooling.
>
when you haven't even looked at the SUV hybrid motors I talked about
then don't pretend you have by generalizing from a prius.
maybe visit a dealer and ask to have a look. might be the perfect motor
there. I don't think the 350HP SUV people will use a 10HP electric motor
Dan
------------------------------
Message: 16
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 02:09:04 -0500
From: "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Notes from Manzanita
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Rudman wrote:
> And $40 each.
How about the situation where we have 9,000 batteries?
------------------------------
Message: 17
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 11:09:30 -0400
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [EVDL] The truth is i drop out of high school in 9th grade.
(Tommey Reed)
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
For one man to be up front, All?we?can do is tell the truth!
School?is not for every body, I learn the hard way and sill learning today.
I do experiment every day with technology and mechanics, even my H2, ?I have
been getting better gas mileage to the gallon with my back ground?in mechanics.
I do believe that 30+ miles is very possible in a Hummer H2, even if its a
hybrid.
I work very hard? to get the most out of motors or engines.
My patent rotary piston engine is far more powerful then today piston engine.
I've been working on?building a prototype and?I am having problems with parts,
that's why?I brought a cnc , lathe/mill and more to get parts made.
I even help Tom Sines with some part he needed for his Evette.
I have design the Gatorcontroller and still want better amps, with low price
tag.
Even the IGBT are at a high price tag, so i use the mosfet instead.
My controllers are water cooled to prevent over heating on the mosfet, and it
works very well.
I have burn many of my controllers up to test the damage made in them.
Most basic controller are easy to make, but when adding more mosfets many
factor add up to burn out.
We, ?Tom Sines and I have been working together on this and more better ideas
for the next EV world.
I find the even my rotary engine could be turn in to a ac/dc motor, size and
weight is always a problem with today motors.
A magnet motor would be more? efficient then a ac/dc field?armature motor,
having permanent magnets around a rotor is one way to get better efficiency and
no heat around the rotor.
This would be a brush less ac or dc motor, using pulse on outer field with a
special controller.
Not only would this be a great idea, its also a generator too.
Sorry if my writing is bad,?I do my best and try to learn from your letters.
Tommey Reed
________________________________________________________________________
Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- Unlimited storage and industry-leading
spam and email virus protection.
------------------------------
Message: 18
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:32:39 -0800
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Oxygen & Valance team up in 2005. What happened?
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2005/sep/1188115.htm Looks like this didn't
happen for the retail customer. Lawrence Rhodes.....
------------------------------
Message: 19
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 11:03:52 -0600
From: "Zeke Yewdall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable AC Motor?
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252
Did you look at the siemens AC drive systems? Last time I looked, the
smaller ones were comparably priced with the ADC 9", and lighter --
though of course the controller is a bit more expensive.
Z
On 10/26/07, Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So it seems nothing has changed over the last two
> years, still no affordable powerful AC motors out
> there or controllers, at least the EVDL list knows
> about. A go-cart motor is cool, but isn't much help
> for a full-size car.
> Jack
>
> --- Travis Gintz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Yeah, they're great guys. They're developing some
> > interesting stuff
> > there right now... I'm actually in the beginning
> > stages of converting
> > my VFR700F to AC with their help. Man Ives is one
> > smart guy, and Dave
> > is once of the nicest guys... They're gonna do well.
> >
> > On 10/24/07, Arak Leatham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > the Crux electronics/Synkromotive conversion noted
> > earlier costs $60 to convert at Crux, but they will
> > give you the directions for the conversion for free.
> > >
> > > Since the diodes are discarded (I believe) you can
> > easilly use otherwise dead alternators from junk
> > parts etc.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Arak Leatham - Web and Desktop Systems Developer
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Estimating, Point of Sale, Tracking, Reporting
> > Applications> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:53:50 +0200>
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
> > ev@lists.sjsu.edu> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable AC
> > Motor?> > not sure if you can use it but the B&S
> > Etek brushless DC motor is small > yet potent for
> > its size and while one is probably too little for a
> > car, > 2 might do ok.> they cost something like 600$
> > and weigh 9kg (20lbs)> > Dan> > Jack Murray skrev:>
> > > I'm back in the hunt for an affordable powerful AC
> > motor. Doesn't look > > like anything has changed in
> > the last year or two.> > I looked at the AC55 once
> > again, at 300lbs it could or should put out > > big
> > power, but their specs are only 310vdc, 56KW peak,>
> > > the AC24 is too weak, not cheap either.> > The
> > Tesla boasts a 70lb motor that outputs 175KW ? > >
> > UQM's motors don't get near that with their biggest
> > motor, which looks > > great, but is unaffordable
> > anyway.> > What AC motors are they using in the
> > newer forklifts? Available?> > What about using AC
> > generators as motors? There are some 10KW
> > available.> >> > Has anyone tried or looked into
> > building a perm mag AC motor? > >> > Jack> >> >
> > _______________________________________________> >
> > For subscription options, see> >
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev> >> > > >
> > _______________________________________________> For
> > subscription options, see>
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> > >
> >
> _________________________________________________________________
> > > Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook
> > ? together at last. Get it now.
> > >
> >
> http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971033
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > For subscription options, see
> > > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Travis Gintz
> > 1986 Honda VFR AC conversion
> > Http://blog.evfr.net/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
------------------------------
Message: 20
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 13:05:39 -0400
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [EVDL] S10ev problem
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
? ?This EV is a 1994 S10 serial # 1GCCS1444R8232156 Hughes/US Electricar
conversion done for Virrginia Power of Richmond.
? ?We installed new batteries The voltages are 326 & 329.
? ?The truck has no motive power.
? ?We did use two same size, but different AH (40 & 42) batteries.
? ?The variuos signals and gauges are displaying, but the charge is only
indicating ~1/3 charge.We did push the reset buttons on the dash and under the
hood.
? ?We have been advised that a programming disc is needed.
? ?If anyone can help with this and/or otherwise, it would be very much
appreciated.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?Thanks,
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?Fran McCabe
------------------------------
Message: 21
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 10:08:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable AC Motor?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I have two of these motors (Mars Electric), one in my
jetski with a 48v-200amp controller I built, the 120v
version is still not working.
But that is still not powerful enough for a car, or at
least a fast normal car. I've considered ganging them
up, but that is a lot of work and expense, it my view
it would be more productive to just build my own
larger single motor from scratch or close to it.
Jack
--- ampaynz1 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Well here is a 200 amp brushless cotroller that will
> run your alternator.
> You'll need a conversion manual to convert it first
> and run wire leads to
> controller get rid of diodes. I have a brushless PMA
> neodymium alternator
> that I would love to convert someday and bet it
> would be close to an
> brushless ETEK in power. What would be idea is a 72V
> controller at 200amps.
> I guess by using two controllers and two motors it
> should work.
>
> Millipak PMAC
>
> 36-48 Volt 200 Amp AC controller with regen for
> Brushless Etek
> $480
>
> http://www.electricmotorsport.com/PARTS/parts.htm
>
> I wish the link below was free as I'd like to know
> how for free.
> http://www.alternatorconversions.com/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Jack Murray wrote:
> >
> > So it seems nothing has changed over the last two
> > years, still no affordable powerful AC motors out
> > there or controllers, at least the EVDL list knows
> > about. A go-cart motor is cool, but isn't much
> help
> > for a full-size car.
> > Jack
> >
> > --- Travis Gintz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >> Yeah, they're great guys. They're developing some
> >> interesting stuff
> >> there right now... I'm actually in the beginning
> >> stages of converting
> >> my VFR700F to AC with their help. Man Ives is one
> >> smart guy, and Dave
> >> is once of the nicest guys... They're gonna do
> well.
> >>
> >> On 10/24/07, Arak Leatham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > the Crux electronics/Synkromotive conversion
> noted
> >> earlier costs $60 to convert at Crux, but they
> will
> >> give you the directions for the conversion for
> free.
> >> >
> >> > Since the diodes are discarded (I believe) you
> can
> >> easilly use otherwise dead alternators from junk
> >> parts etc.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Arak Leatham - Web and Desktop Systems
> Developer
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Estimating, Point of Sale, Tracking, Reporting
> >> Applications> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:53:50
> +0200>
> >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To:
> >> ev@lists.sjsu.edu> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Affordable
> AC
> >> Motor?> > not sure if you can use it but the B&S
> >> Etek brushless DC motor is small > yet potent for
> >> its size and while one is probably too little for
> a
> >> car, > 2 might do ok.> they cost something like
> 600$
> >> and weigh 9kg (20lbs)> > Dan> > Jack Murray
> skrev:>
> >> > I'm back in the hunt for an affordable powerful
> AC
> >> motor. Doesn't look > > like anything has changed
> in
> >> the last year or two.> > I looked at the AC55
> once
> >> again, at 300lbs it could or should put out > >
> big
> >> power, but their specs are only 310vdc, 56KW
> peak,>
> >> > the AC24 is too weak, not cheap either.> > The
> >> Tesla boasts a 70lb motor that outputs 175KW ? >
> >
> >> UQM's motors don't get near that with their
> biggest
> >> motor, which looks > > great, but is unaffordable
> >> anyway.> > What AC motors are they using in the
> >> newer forklifts? Available?> > What about using
> AC
> >> generators as motors? There are some 10KW
> >> available.> >> > Has anyone tried or looked into
> >> building a perm mag AC motor? > >> > Jack> >> >
> >> _______________________________________________>
> >
> >> For subscription options, see> >
> >> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev> >> > >
> >
> >> _______________________________________________>
> For
> >> subscription options, see>
> >> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >> >
> >>
> >
>
_________________________________________________________________
> >> > Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office
> Outlook
> >> ? together at last. Get it now.
> >> >
> >>
> >
>
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971033
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > For subscription options, see
> >> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Travis Gintz
> >> 1986 Honda VFR AC conversion
> >> Http://blog.evfr.net/
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> For subscription options, see
> >> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
>
> --
> View this message in context:
>
http://www.nabble.com/Affordable-AC-Motor--tf4681416s25542.html#a13450175
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
>
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End of EV Digest, Vol 3, Issue 78
*********************************
