Re: Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread Benjamin Udell
Sorry. Can't help myself : Is there any point in completing that term paper really? Actually, between the above remark made in fun, the subsequent discussion, there are things in common. Above, the joke is that, if one adopts nihilism the view that nothing is worth caring about, then what

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread Kory Heath
At 1/19/04, Stephen Paul King wrote: Were and when is the consideration of the physical resources required for the computation going to obtain? Is my question equivalent to the old first cause question? The view that Mathematical Existence == Physical Existence implies that physical resources

Re: Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread marulli
The last world is right. I think that if there were infinites universes like our own and if all possible thinks that could append realy append, talking about existential and ethical nihilism or moralism make no sense. Certainly there will be infinites observers who believe in existential and

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Tue, Jan 20, 2004 at 10:33:57PM -0800, CMR wrote: Yes! you've captured the gist and fleshed out the raw concept that hit me whilst reading your post on weightless computation; that's potentially the value of it as an avenue to explore, I think: that there is an

RE: Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
This sort of argument has been raised many times over the centuries, both by rationalists and by their opponents, but it is based the fundamental error of conflating science with ethics. Science deals with matters of fact; it does not comment on whether these facts are good or bad, beautiful or

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread Bruno Marchal
At 02:50 21/01/04 -0500, Kory Heath wrote: At 1/19/04, Stephen Paul King wrote: Were and when is the consideration of the physical resources required for the computation going to obtain? Is my question equivalent to the old first cause question? The view that Mathematical Existence == Physical

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread John M
I think, Hal, you still used your human (anthropocentric) imagination when you wanted to show a 'free' thinking: cince they were missing from your 'eliminated' concepts: do you take space and time for granted in the 'universes' of different (physical?) principles? How about 'our' logic? causality

Re: Determinism

2004-01-21 Thread Benjamin Udell
I agree with Norman too, particularly about boundaries the snapshot style. I would add that, the physical states events that can be detected should implicitly contain the things that we fear may be reduced away. Just because they would not be obvious when represented in physical mathematical

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread CMR
Greetings Eugen While it is not possible to infer physics of the metalayer, it is possible to infer the number of bits necessary to encode this universe. I'm familiar with the concept of a metalayer in software dev as a compatibility interface between apps etc.. So, in this case the meta-layer

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread Stephen Paul King
Dear Bruno and Kory, Interleaving. - Original Message - From: Bruno Marchal [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 9:21 AM Subject: Re: Is the universe computable At 02:50 21/01/04 -0500, Kory Heath wrote: At 1/19/04, Stephen Paul King wrote:

Re: Is the universe computable

2004-01-21 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Wed, Jan 21, 2004 at 09:34:50AM -0800, CMR wrote: I'm familiar with the concept of a metalayer in software dev as a compatibility interface between apps etc.. So, in this case the meta-layer being I assume the interface between the universes abstractly and between the simulation and the

Abstract

2004-01-21 Thread George Levy
ABSTRACT: Suggestion for keeping up with the volume of posts is to provide an abstract. CONTENT I share Sergio's problem. I just can't keep up. How about providing an abstract summarizing the post. Either that or keep your content less than half a page. George [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Extended Response on Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I mean not so sound supercilious, but I must admit that all counterarguments thus far received are points I have foreseen and chosen to omit in the paper for the sake of length and inherent stupidity of my evaluators. This is why I have come here for intelligent recluse, as it is, so far, the

Re: Extended Response on Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread Hal Finney
Here is an excerpt from a message I sent to the list last week, which argues that nihilism is not an appropriate response to multiverse physics. As far as the issue of human action and free will, here is how I look at it. There are really two issues. The first is that in some sense the

Re: Modern Physical theory as a basis for Ethical and Existential Nihilism

2004-01-21 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
The study of why societies have certain ethical beliefs is a subject for evolutionary psychology, or anthropology/sociology (moving down the reductionist hierarchy), and the study of what brain processes underlie ethical beliefs and behaviour is a subject for