Re: [SPAM] Re: Asifism

2007-06-23 Thread Mark Peaty
Hi Brent, Brent: ' You seem to imply that the advent of the scientific method banished slavery and tyranny and racism. Would that it were so. Perhaps the scientific method can be applied to politics and perhaps it would have that effect, but historically the scientific method has been

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread David Nyman
Hi John JM: You may ask about prejudice, shame (about goofed situations), humor (does a computer laugh?) boredom or preferential topics (you push for an astronomical calculation and the computer says: I rather play some Bach music now) Sexual preference (even disinterestedness is slanted), or

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread Russell Standish
On Fri, Jun 22, 2007 at 02:06:14PM +0100, David Nyman wrote: RS: Terminology is terminology, it doesn't have a point of view. DN: This may be a nub of disagreement. I'd be interested if you could clarify. My characterisation of a narrative as '3-person' is when (ISTM) that it's an

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread David Nyman
On 23/06/07, Russell Standish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: RS: I don't think I ever really found myself in disagreement with you. Rather, what is happening is symptomatic of us trying to reach across the divide of JP Snow's two cultures. You are obviously comfortable with the world of literary

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread Brent Meeker
David Nyman wrote: On 23/06/07, *Brent Meeker* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BM: But he could also switch from an account in terms of the machine level causality to an account in terms of the computed 'world'. In fact he could switch back and forth. Causality in

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread David Nyman
On 23/06/07, Brent Meeker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BM: But he could also switch from an account in terms of the machine level causality to an account in terms of the computed 'world'. In fact he could switch back and forth. Causality in the computed 'world' would have it's corresponding

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread Brent Meeker
David Nyman wrote: Hi John JM: You may ask about prejudice, shame (about goofed situations), humor (does a computer laugh?) boredom or preferential topics (you push for an astronomical calculation and the computer says: I rather play some Bach music now) Sexual preference (even

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread David Nyman
On 23/06/07, Brent Meeker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BM: Changing the description would be analogous to changing the reference frame or the names on a map. DN: I agree. BM: The two processes would still be parallel, not orthogonal. DN: But the inference I draw from your points above is that

Re: How would a computer know if it were conscious?

2007-06-23 Thread Russell Standish
On Sat, Jun 23, 2007 at 03:58:39PM +0100, David Nyman wrote: On 23/06/07, Russell Standish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: RS: I don't think I ever really found myself in disagreement with you. Rather, what is happening is symptomatic of us trying to reach across the divide of JP Snow's two

The Principle of Natural Ontic Genesis

2007-06-23 Thread Colin Hales
Dear Everything List (and Psyche-B), Here is the promised 'fundamental principle of the Chalmers kind'. Note: there is no magical emergence here. There is no panpsychism here. There is no dualism here. If there is apparent logical circularity, it is of a kind far less problematic than alternate