Re: Penrose and algorithms

2007-07-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
Le 06-juil.-07, à 14:53, LauLuna a écrit : But again, for any set of such 'physiological' axioms there is a corresponding equivalent set of 'conceptual' axioms. There is all the same a logical impossibility for us to know the second set is sound. No consistent (and strong enough) system S

Re: Penrose and algorithms

2007-07-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
Le 06-juil.-07, à 19:43, Brent Meeker a écrit : Bruno Marchal wrote: ... Now all (sufficiently rich) theories/machine can prove their own Godel's theorem. PA can prove that if PA is consistent then PA cannot prove its consitency. A somehow weak (compared to ZF) theory like PA can even

Re: Asifism revisited.

2007-07-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
Le 05-juil.-07, à 14:19, Torgny Tholerus wrote: David Nyman skrev: You have however drawn our attention to something very interesting and important IMO. This concerns the necessary entailment of 'existence'. 1. The relation 1+1=2 is always true. It is true in all universes. Even if a

Re: Penrose and algorithms

2007-07-07 Thread LauLuna
On Jul 7, 12:59 pm, Bruno Marchal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Le 06-juil.-07, à 14:53, LauLuna a écrit : But again, for any set of such 'physiological' axioms there is a corresponding equivalent set of 'conceptual' axioms. There is all the same a logical impossibility for us to know the

Re: Boltzmann brains

2007-07-07 Thread LauLuna
I have never been able to understand how a singularity can be highly ordered. Is there any room for order in such a tiny thing? Best On May 31, 1:51 pm, Russell Standish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I came across a reference to Boltzmann brains in a recent issue of New Scientist. The piece,

Re: Asifism revisited.

2007-07-07 Thread David Nyman
On 05/07/07, Torgny Tholerus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: For us humans are the universes that contain observers more interesting. But there is no qualitaive difference between universes with observers and universes without observers. They all exist in the same way. I still disagree, but I

Re: Boltzmann brains

2007-07-07 Thread Russell Standish
On Sat, Jul 07, 2007 at 07:56:57AM -0700, LauLuna wrote: I have never been able to understand how a singularity can be highly ordered. Is there any room for order in such a tiny thing? Best Highly ordered means small entropy. All you need is a small number of states, so small things