Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread Terren Suydam
Bruno, > I think that comp might imply that simple virgin (non programmed) universal > (and immaterial) machine are already conscious. Perhaps even maximally > conscious. This sounds like a comp variant of panpsychism (platopsychism?)... in which consciousness is axiomatically proposed as a prope

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread John Mikes
Dear Brent, let me cut in with your last par: *"...There is a tendency to talk about "human-equivalent intelligence" or "human level intelligence" as an ultimate goal. Human intelligence evolved to enhance certain functions: cooperation, seduction, bargaining, deduction,... There's no reason to

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread benjayk
Hi Bruno, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > I think that comp might imply that simple virgin (non programmed) > universal (and immaterial) machine are already conscious. Perhaps even > maximally conscious. > What could "maximally conscious" mean? My intuition says quite strongly that consciousness

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread benjayk
Hi Bruno, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > We just cannot do artificial intelligence in a provable manner. We > need chance, or luck. Even if we get some intelligent machine, we will > not know-it-for sure (perhaps just believe it correctly). But this is a quite weak statement, isn't it? It just pr

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread meekerdb
On 6/15/2011 6:56 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Doesn't this objection only apply to attempts to construct an AI with human-equivalent intelligence? As a counter example I'm thinking here of Ben Goertzel's OpenCog, an attempt at artificial general intelligence (AGI), whose design is informed by a the

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 14 Jun 2011, at 21:19, Terren Suydam wrote: Thanks for the reply Bruno, comments below... On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 9:53 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: doesn't that imply the possibility of an artificial intelligence? In a weak sense of Artificial Intelligence, yes. In a strong sense, no.

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-15 Thread Russell Standish
Hi Colin, I'm having a read through your paper now, and have a few comments to keep the juices of debate flowing on this list. Firstly, I'd like to say well done - you have written a very clear paper in what is a very murky subject. I have two comments right now - but I haven't finished, so ther