Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 1:52 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: I think that any debate that even considers word definitions to be real is a waste of time. If we're discussing cows but you understand by that word what most people understand by the word sheep shouldn't we get this

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 11:44 PM, Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net wrote: Umm, are you OK with anthropomorphication... ? Let me ask a different question: In your opinion, does the universe 'out there' have to have properties that match up one-to-one with some finite list of

Re: The duplicators and the restorers

2013-02-17 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Saturday, February 16, 2013 10:12:34 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Feb 16, 2013, at 5:27 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: On Saturday, February 16, 2013 3:22:36 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Sat, Feb 16, 2013 at 1:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comwrote:

Re: Chosen-ness

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 27 Jan 2013, at 23:35, freqflyer07281972 wrote: Hey everyone, I've been following this group a lot. I read it everyday and enjoy all of the wonderful stuff that comes up, even if some of it tends towards ad hominem, argument from authority, and petitio principi. Hey, we're humans,

Re: Chosen-ness

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 28 Jan 2013, at 04:06, meekerdb wrote: On 1/27/2013 2:35 PM, freqflyer07281972 wrote: Hey everyone, I've been following this group a lot. I read it everyday and enjoy all of the wonderful stuff that comes up, even if some of it tends towards ad hominem, argument from authority, and

Re: The Plant Teachers

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 09 Feb 2013, at 16:10, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote: And here I have to confirm Bruno's Salvia preference: to say DMT is merely some extension of mushrooms and not astonishing, is to confirm that one's method is not yet fully developed, or there is some physiological incompatibility.

Re: About the Infinite Repetition of Histories in Space

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Feb 2013, at 03:22, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/4/2013 11:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 01 Feb 2013, at 20:25, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/1/2013 5:20 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 11:38 PM, Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net wrote: On 1/31/2013 4:46 PM,

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 13 Feb 2013, at 04:29, socra...@bezeqint.net wrote: After proving Euler's identity during a lecture, Benjamin Peirce, a noted American 19th-century philosopher, mathematician, and professor at Harvard University, stated that it is absolutely paradoxical; we cannot understand it, and we

Re: The duplicators and the restorers

2013-02-17 Thread Jason Resch
On Sun, Feb 17, 2013 at 8:07 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote: On Saturday, February 16, 2013 10:12:34 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Feb 16, 2013, at 5:27 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com wrote: On Saturday, February 16, 2013 3:22:36 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Sat, Feb

Re: The duplicators and the restorers

2013-02-17 Thread Jason Resch
Thanks to everyone who replied to this post. So far Stathis and Bruno both answered that both cases are equivalent. Is there anyone willing to argue against either: 1. you don't experience torture when your memory of it is wiped, or 2. you don't experience torture when your perfect duplicate is

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread meekerdb
On 2/17/2013 4:17 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 11:44 PM, Stephen P. Kingstephe...@charter.net wrote: Umm, are you OK with anthropomorphication... ? Let me ask a different question: In your opinion, does the universe 'out there' have to have properties that match

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Feb 2013, at 22:14, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Thursday, February 14, 2013 11:20:12 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Feb 2013, at 23:37, Stephen P. King wrote, to Craig Weinberg Baudrillard is not talking about consciousness in particular, only the sum of whatever is in the

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 16 Feb 2013, at 01:01, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/15/2013 11:12 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 14 Feb 2013, at 22:00, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/14/2013 11:20 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Feb 2013, at 23:37, Stephen P. King wrote, to Craig Weinberg Baudrillard is not talking about

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-02-17 Thread meekerdb
On 2/17/2013 7:56 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 13 Feb 2013, at 04:29, socra...@bezeqint.net wrote: After proving Euler's identity during a lecture, Benjamin Peirce, a noted American 19th-century philosopher, mathematician, and professor at Harvard University, stated that it is absolutely

Re: Comp: Geometry Is A Zombie

2013-02-17 Thread John Clark
On Sat, Feb 16, 2013 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: With complex numbers you can make a one to one relationship between the way numbers add subtract multiply and divide and the way things move in a two dimensional plane. What more could you want arithmetic to do in support of

Re: The duplicators and the restorers

2013-02-17 Thread meekerdb
On 2/17/2013 9:09 AM, Jason Resch wrote: Thanks to everyone who replied to this post. So far Stathis and Bruno both answered that both cases are equivalent. Is there anyone willing to argue against either: 1. you don't experience torture when your memory of it is wiped, or 2. you don't

Re: Chosen-ness

2013-02-17 Thread John Mikes
Bruno - we, at least, having learned the English language, should 'dig' into the meaning of the words. Chosen is the result of a selection from more than one alternates. Who are the others, from which WE may be CHOSEN? the devils in hell, or the angels in heaven? or the other animals? This is why

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Stephen P. King
On 2/17/2013 7:17 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 11:44 PM, Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net wrote: Umm, are you OK with anthropomorphication... ? Let me ask a different question: In your opinion, does the universe 'out there' have to have properties that match

Re: About the Infinite Repetition of Histories in Space

2013-02-17 Thread Stephen P. King
On 2/17/2013 9:41 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 12 Feb 2013, at 03:22, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/4/2013 11:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 01 Feb 2013, at 20:25, Stephen P. King wrote: On 2/1/2013 5:20 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 11:38 PM, Stephen P. King

Re: Comp: Geometry Is A Zombie

2013-02-17 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, February 17, 2013 1:52:13 PM UTC-5, John Clark wrote: On Sat, Feb 16, 2013 Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com javascript:wrote: With complex numbers you can make a one to one relationship between the way numbers add subtract multiply and divide and the way things move in a two

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-02-17 Thread Stephen P. King
On 2/17/2013 10:56 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Yes. Euler identity is wonderful. It amazes me also that it makes the square of any complex number into a (non normalized) gaussian: (e^ix)^2 = e^(-x^2) I love also Euler even deeper identity relating the square of the integers and the prime

Re: Simulated Intelligence Mini-Manifesto

2013-02-17 Thread Stephen P. King
On 2/17/2013 1:10 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 2/17/2013 4:17 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 11:44 PM, Stephen P. Kingstephe...@charter.net wrote: Umm, are you OK with anthropomorphication... ? Let me ask a different question: In your opinion, does the universe 'out

Re: The duplicators and the restorers

2013-02-17 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, February 17, 2013 11:51:38 AM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Sun, Feb 17, 2013 at 8:07 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: On Saturday, February 16, 2013 10:12:34 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: On Feb 16, 2013, at 5:27 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com wrote:

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-02-17 Thread socra...@bezeqint.net
Klein Lachièze-Rey, THE QUEST FOR UNITY – The Adventure of Physics. =. Mathematics is an indispensable and powerful tool where it has been demonstrated that it applies to a real world experience. However, it is inappropriate and, as Dingle points out, potentially dangerous, to give

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-02-17 Thread socra...@bezeqint.net
Feynman about infinities and renormalization ==. So we really do not know exactly what it is that we are assuming that gives us the difficulty producing infinities. A nice problem ! However, it turns out that it is possible to sweep the infinities under the rug , by a certain crude skill , and